[QUOTE=Zuimzado;40225289]Hooo booy.
Where have you been for the last decade or so of terrorism?[/QUOTE]
What the fuck does that even mean? Are you seriously suggesting that [I]EVERY[/I] Muslim person is a rabid anti-whoever terrorist? No, they're fucking not you idiot.
There is absolutely NO way for ANY city or organization or religion or group EVER to exist with 100% of the citizens agreeing on a single fucking cause. There is no way in hell an entire army and police force could all go "SURE LET'S ALL SACRIFICE OUR LIVES TO TRY TO KILL THIS SINGLE MURDERER."
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;40225455]What the fuck does that even mean? Are you seriously suggesting that [I]EVERY[/I] Muslim person is a rabid anti-whoever terrorist? No, they're fucking not you idiot.
There is absolutely NO way for ANY city or organization or religion or group EVER to exist with 100% of the citizens agreeing on a single fucking cause. There is no way in hell an entire army and police force could all go "SURE LET'S ALL SACRIFICE OUR LIVES TO TRY TO KILL THIS SINGLE MURDERER."[/QUOTE]
It's funny, cause I said terrorism, and you immediately associated it with Muslims. So, yeah, your words, not mine.
But the guys who attacked you weren't 100% of the people of Columbia. They were the police officers, the soldiers, the ones who believed so much in Comstock that they were willing to say "I will take care of this city for the Prophet, even going as far as losing my life to protect it against the Vox Populi." But this isn't the Vox Populi. You're the False Shepard. For these people, you're essentially Satan. No, wait, you're worse than Satan, you're Triple Satan.
These people have been told, ever since they were little kids, that the False Shepard is a backstabbing son of a bitch. And they were told that over and over and over and over again. They were told the False Shepard is so evil, so evil, that the Devil goes "woah dude you're taking it too far" when he sees you. What else they were told? Oh, yeah. Protect our Lamb from the False Shepard. He will try to lead the Lamb astray! Protect her! Protect her!
For the police officers, this is like their chance to do it. If they get the False Shepard, this demon, this unholy mess of a person, Comstock will be happy with them. The person closest to God, the person they were taught to see as the greatest person in the whole wide freaking universe will go and say "you did well my son" because they killed the Devil and saved the most prized possession of Columbia, the Lamb.
It's like if you were born in a city of squares and were told that circles are evil. You've never seen one, but every bad thing is associated with a circle. Circles are the devil. You grow up believing every single word of that, and every day the main square tells you "protect our city from the circles! protect our city from the circles!" And then, one day, a lone circle appears. One single circle. It's your chance. You'll be beloved by your entire city because you killed the circle, the one responsible for all the evil in the world.
[QUOTE=Zuimzado;40225617]It's funny, cause I said terrorism, and you immediately associated it with Muslims. So, yeah, your words, not mine.
But the guys who attacked you weren't 100% of the people of Columbia. They were the police officers, the soldiers, the ones who believed so much in Comstock that they were willing to say "I will take care of this city for the Prophet, even going as far as losing my life to protect it against the Vox Populi." But this isn't the Vox Populi. You're the False Shepard. For these people, you're essentially Satan. No, wait, you're worse than Satan, you're Triple Satan.
These people have been told, ever since they were little kids, that the False Shepard is a backstabbing son of a bitch. And they were told that over and over and over and over again. They were told the False Shepard is so evil, so evil, that the Devil goes "woah dude you're taking it too far" when he sees you. What else they were told? Oh, yeah. Protect our Lamb from the False Shepard. He will try to lead the Lamb astray! Protect her! Protect her!
For the police officers, this is like their chance to do it. If they get the False Shepard, this demon, this unholy mess of a person, Comstock will be happy with them. The person closest to God, the person they were taught to see as the greatest person in the whole wide freaking universe will go and say "you did well my son" because they killed the Devil and saved the most prized possession of Columbia, the Lamb.
It's like if you were born in a city of squares and were told that circles are evil. You've never seen one, but every bad thing is associated with a circle. Circles are the devil. You grow up believing every single word of that, and every day the main square tells you "protect our city from the circles! protect our city from the circles!" And then, one day, a lone circle appears. One single circle. It's your chance. You'll be beloved by your entire city because you killed the circle, the one responsible for all the evil in the world.[/QUOTE]
Catching me with a loaded question then laughing when I fall for it. Nice way to start an argument.
Just because the people of Columbia have been told that the False Prophet is a big bad meanie and they'd be gods for killing them doesn't mean that every single fucking person believes that. Sure, there's the Vox, but there's no way in fucking hell that ever single one of the thousands of police officers ALL are brainwashed enough to believe the same thing. Look at North Korea. Is EVERYONE there absolutely fucking mad? No, people have escaped and fled to better lives.
Why don't we see any police officers running away or trying to escape with the civilians? Aside from the occasional "ow im damaged" animation, there's none of that at all.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;40225703]Catching me with a loaded question then laughing when I fall for it. Nice way to start an argument.[/QUOTE]
You're the one who, in your words, "fell for it". Also, nowhere did I see any indication that I laughed, only that I pointed out how humorous your answer was. I won't be blamed for your associations.
[QUOTE]but there's no way in fucking hell that ever single one of the thousands of police officers ALL are brainwashed enough to believe the same thing. Look at North Korea. [B]Is EVERYONE there absolutely fucking mad?[/B] No, people have escaped and fled to better lives.[/QUOTE]
No, but the generals and the military and the police officers are. And who are the people you're fighting? Ooooh. The generals and the military and the police officers!
If you want to get into a position of power in an extremist nation, you have to prove you're the more extreme person of all of them. They don't get the guys who would shiver and have second thoughts. They get the guys who would run into the field, shooting anything in they see and yelling that it's all in the name of the Prophet.
[QUOTE]Why don't we see any police officers running away or trying to escape with the civilians? Aside from the occasional "ow im damaged" animation, there's none of that at all.[/QUOTE]
Maybe we do, maybe we don't. But the fact that they suddenly stop and start praying to the Prophet means they care more about his approval than the fact they can be killed in cold blood by the False Shepard, who was standing right next to them.
[QUOTE=Zuimzado;40225731]You're the one who, in your words, "fell for it". Also, nowhere did I see any indication that I laughed, only that I pointed out how humorous your answer was. I won't be blamed for your associations.[/QUOTE]
Well, what the fuck else ethnic group has been the big enemy in the "last decade of terrorism?"
Why were you surprised that I said that?
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;40225929]Well, what the fuck else ethnic group has been the big enemy in the "last decade of terrorism?"
Why were you surprised that I said that?[/QUOTE]
There have been terrorists of various ethnicities. The point of that question was to note how many of the most recent terrorist crimes have been committed due to religious beliefs. You're right, the major ethnic group known as "the big enemy" have been the Muslim extremities.
But your answer was humorous because you were quick to point out how I was wrong because my question was somehow implying all Muslims were terrorists. Which was, in fact, an association you made that had no relation to my question.
[QUOTE=Zuimzado;40225965]There have been terrorists of various ethnicities. The point of that question was to note how many of the most recent terrorist crimes have been committed due to religious beliefs. You're right, the major ethnic group known as "the big enemy" have been the Muslim extremities.
But your answer was humorous because you were quick to point out how I was wrong because my question was somehow implying all Muslims were terrorists. Which was, in fact, an association you made that had no relation to my question.[/QUOTE]
[quote]There is absolutely NO way for ANY city or organization or religion or group EVER to exist with 100% of the citizens agreeing on a single fucking cause.[/quote]
[quote]Where have you been for the last decade or so of terrorism?[/quote]
Terrorist organizations =/= enormous cities or religious groups with thousands of members.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;40225991]Terrorist organizations =/= enormous cities or religious groups with thousands of members.[/QUOTE]
But my point was that the enemies in the game were like a terrorist organization, guided by blind extremist faith in this figure, and [I]not[/I] the entire population of Columbia like this quote
[QUOTE]There is absolutely NO way for ANY city or organization or religion or group EVER to exist with 100% of the citizens agreeing on a single fucking cause[/QUOTE]
seems to be implying. Of course 100% don't agree. We see people that don't agree with Comstock. The people that are segregated thanks to their color, and the guys that hold secret meetings in order to find ways to protect them.
But those aren't your enemies. Your enemies are the cream of the crop of extremist faith. They'd still believe in Comstock even if there was scientific proof that he's a liar. That's why they, in your words, "unanimously agree to try to murder a single person, based on philosophy and philosophy alone".
My problem is that I don't see how, if the common police officers are all absolutely indocrinated mindless bible jerking "I would throw my entire family off a cliff if comstock frowned at them" zealots, you can also have normal people just sort of milling around talking about how Comstock should close down the local boot black.
It's just weird. It's like the moment guns come out the entire setting, all of the characters, and your state of mind and motivation just pull a 180. The worst offense being [sp]when the vox turn on you when mere seconds earlier they were treating you like their fucking lord and savior[/sp]
I mean I know that people rabble rabble mythology rabble rabble mob mentality whatever, but usually it takes more than a couple of minutes for thousands of people to completely change their stance on something.
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;40226107]My problem is that I don't see how, if the common police officers are all absolutely indocrinated mindless bible jerking "I would throw my entire family off a cliff if comstock frowned at them" zealots, you can also have normal people just sort of milling around talking about how Comstock should close down the local boot black.
It's just weird. It's like the moment guns come out the entire setting, all of the characters, and your state of mind and motivation just pull a 180. The worst offense being [sp]when the vox turn on you when mere seconds earlier they were treating you like their fucking lord and savior[/sp]
[/QUOTE]
Again, there are religious zealots (the people), and then there are extreme religious zealots (the police officers).
The Comstock soldiers don't do a complete change of state of mind, they want to kill you since the first moment they find out you're the False Shepard. Also, I do agree with you, [sp]the Vox's state of mind was rushed. I understand the people in the same area as Daisy immediately wanting to kill you, because, like Comstock, they believe every word she says, and when she says you're an impostor, you're a devil who's trying to impersonate their lord and savior. It would have been so much better if they heard it by radio after they started helping you, and then would slowly turn against you.[/sp]
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;40226107]My problem is that I don't see how, if the common police officers are all absolutely indocrinated mindless bible jerking "I would throw my entire family off a cliff if comstock frowned at them" zealots, you can also have normal people just sort of milling around talking about how Comstock should close down the local boot black.
It's just weird. It's like the moment guns come out the entire setting, all of the characters, and your state of mind and motivation just pull a 180. The worst offense being [sp]when the vox turn on you when mere seconds earlier they were treating you like their fucking lord and savior[/sp]
I mean I know that people rabble rabble mythology rabble rabble mob mentality whatever, but usually it takes more than a couple of minutes for thousands of people to completely change their stance on something.[/QUOTE]
I really hated how you never really saw actual people aside from the start before you begin shooting, and the brief 3 minutes or so when you're on the beach and in that little games room.
It's a goddamn city, you barely see anybody and it feels like the architechs designed Columbia to be perfect for fighting guys.
[editline]9th April 2013[/editline]
also i think this plot summary, despite being made as a joke, does a surprisingly good job at pointing out a lot of dumb shit in infinite
PLOT SUMMARY, BIOSHOCK INFINITE
[sp]A gruff male with the pleasantly old-timey name of Booker DeWitt travels by rocket chair to Columbia, a flying city where people make 20 second recordings of their deepest secrets and leave them lying around in cupboards. He has been sent to retrieve a woman named Elizabeth, who has the magical ability to summon a box full of first aid kits from an alternate dimension.
Booker wanders around in awe, observing the racist population as they throw machine gun ammunition in the trash and stare silently at nothing. But his sightseeing is cut short when a policeman tries to grab him and he's forced to explode 1000 heads with a giant rotating hook in self-defence.
After exploding enough heads, Booker is taken to an alternate reality where the underclass of Columbia has risen up in rebellion. "These revolutionaries are as bad as their racist oppressors," says the deadliest serial killer in the history of human civilization, "because they are violent." Fortunately, the entire setting is erased from existence and nothing of consequence ever happens. Metacritic rating 95 (94 on Xbox).
—8 April 2013 (back) [/sp]
contrarianism is hip now
The game getting overly positive reviews isn't good but neither is what this guy is doing. Perhaps the most healthy thing someone could do is give it an actual, healthy review where they're not nitpicking every slight thing they perceive as an error or licking the boots of Ken himself. I'm sure reviews like that exist out there but currently the divide seems to exist between people who say it's the best game ever and people who want to prove those people wrong.
[editline]9th April 2013[/editline]
Its broken down into a childish game of back and forth.
[QUOTE=Winters;40227296]The game getting overly positive reviews isn't good but neither is what this guy is doing. Perhaps the most healthy thing someone could do is give it an actual, healthy review where they're not nitpicking every slight thing they perceive as an error or licking the boots of Ken himself. I'm sure reviews like that exist out there but currently the divide seems to exist between people who say it's the best game ever and people who want to prove those people wrong.
[editline]9th April 2013[/editline]
Its broken down into a childish game of back and forth.[/QUOTE]
neither side will care about one another, so what's the point? at least one person will whine and say "ugh its too harsh on the game" or "wow its too forgiving"
except the people being too harsh are factually wrong.
[QUOTE=Rusty100;40228100]except the people being too harsh are factually wrong.[/QUOTE]
Glad you haven't changed Rusty.
[QUOTE=OZPruduction;40217792]Most of what he says here is "change is bad". I didn't watch the whole review since it was just really boring and incredibly subjective. I really dislike the fact that people, regarding the incredibly positive reviews BSI gets, are just digging through the game looking for the bad stuff, when there's just so much good to regard aswell.
I still didn't see one objective and helpful review (the best IMO was Adam Sessler's, just because of it's enthusiasm), but I don't need one since I played the game and absolutely loved it (including the gameplay).[/QUOTE]
The people who are saying it changed stuff from bioshock therefore it is bad are really stupid, that said, not all people who dislike the game are 'digging' for negatives. I played the game before actually looking at any reviews and I found it to be quite good based on art, music and story alone. Unfortunately I found the gameplay to be boring and tedious except for when they occassionally put a skyrail in, it actually felt like a chore I had to put up with.
[QUOTE=Rusty100;40217790]the best games always get criticized the hardest. it's so stupid.[/QUOTE]
It's hardly being criticised. Anyone who gives it criticism is said to just be seeking attention.
[QUOTE=Rusty100;40228100]except the people being too harsh are factually wrong.[/QUOTE]
Uhh no.
Bioshock Infinite doesn't have fun gameplay IMO and I definitely would not have liked it at all if the story and art were mediocre.
[QUOTE=Rusty100;40217790]the best games always get criticized the hardest. it's so stupid.[/QUOTE]
with that logic big rigs and the war z are the best games ever because they get so much criticism
orrrr you think that the game is getting a lot of criticism because your high opinion of it makes you very confrontational when you find people with differing opinions?
I can agree that the change to the health system was a bit unnecessary as the one that Bioshock was entirely useable and unique to the brand, but I can't for the life of me see this offensively bad combat that Youtube video game critics seem to be latching on to. We lost a few plasmids but is the "same four enemies" really a big change from shooting the same 4 Splicers? He doesn't even mention the skyrail, which is a ridiculously fun component and almost perfectly implemented, with my only criticism being that it's not seen enough.
[QUOTE=Swebonny;40217910]Is this a review or just criticism. He praises it for it looks for about 30 seconds. 6 minutes in and he's still rambling about how artificial and hollow everything is, how it is not Bioshock and how there's no point in shooting thing because they're just "padding".
To be frank, this guy seems to be criticizing just because he can. Totalbiscuit and that other dude that got posted in here did a better job.[/QUOTE]
It's loads easier to go on about a game's negative points than it is to go on about positive points, really.
I've gone on rants about games I've played and enjoyed for long stretches of time- the sort that'd make you think the game developers killed my dog.
Just personal experience.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;40227892]neither side will care about one another, so what's the point? at least one person will whine and say "ugh its too harsh on the game" or "wow its too forgiving"[/QUOTE]
There is no point I agree, it's chilish and baseless.
It'll take a few months before any of you reach a fair opinion on the game weighing the bad and the good properly the only time you see it weighted completely correctly is when the game is so obviously bad like Aliens Colonial Marines.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;40229470]with that logic big rigs and the war z are the best games ever because they get so much criticism
orrrr you think that the game is getting a lot of criticism because your high opinion of it makes you very confrontational when you find people with differing opinions?[/QUOTE]
no, the best and worst games get the most criticism. that's why big rigs and war z get it. and i don't think anyone could even say bio shock infinite is among the worst of games. it's getting it because the first one set a high bar and people are finding stupid and inane reasons to dislike infinite because they are bad people who can't accept something great when it comes along and have to find reasons to think it's not so great, even though every argument against bs:i so far has been completely non sensical and just flat out wrong.
i can hear the dude's beard in his voice. nitpick all you want, it won't change a thing
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;40232290]i can hear the dude's beard in his voice. nitpick all you want, it won't change a thing[/QUOTE]
It changes the next game... That's the point of criticism
[QUOTE=Rusty100;40232221]no, the best and worst games get the most criticism. that's why big rigs and war z get it. and i don't think anyone could even say bio shock infinite is among the worst of games. it's getting it because the first one set a high bar and people are finding stupid and inane reasons to dislike infinite because they are bad people who can't accept something great when it comes along and have to find reasons to think it's not so great, even though every argument against bs:i so far has been completely non sensical and just flat out wrong.[/QUOTE]
Bioshock didn't set a high bar imo. Infinite suffers from the same problem, an interesting secondary world and tedious gameplay. Are you really suggesting that the only reason people have problems with this game is because you think the first one was good?
Also, I find it funny that you say that people who hold diffent opinions to you in regards to games are bad people, it just shows how much of an arrogant person you are.
[QUOTE=Hobo4President;40233593]Bioshock didn't set a high bar imo. Infinite suffers from the same problem, an interesting secondary world and tedious gameplay. Are you really suggesting that the only reason people have problems with this game is because you think the first one was good?
Also, I find it funny that you say that people who hold diffent opinions to you in regards to games are bad people, it just shows how much of an arrogant person you are.[/QUOTE]
But Infinite's gameplay is far from tedious. If you don't like first person shooters then whatever, but as far as first person shooters go, Infinite is far from tedious.
[QUOTE=DigitalySane;40233428]It changes the next game... That's the point of criticism[/QUOTE]
yeah im sure the whole staff is huddled around watching this shitty youtube video and they aren't self aware enough to realize their game isnt perfect
[QUOTE=simkas;40233617]But Infinite's gameplay is far from tedious. If you don't like first person shooters then whatever, but as far as first person shooters go, Infinite is far from tedious.[/QUOTE]
Infinite has better FPS combat than the vast majority of shooters IMO, so who the fuck cares if its' literally not -the literal best and pinnicle of FPS combat ever done-
[QUOTE=simkas;40233617]But Infinite's gameplay is far from tedious. If you don't like first person shooters then whatever, but as far as first person shooters go, Infinite is far from tedious.[/QUOTE]
I like first person shooters. counter-strike, quake, unreal tournament, turok rage wars, perfect dark, team fortress 2 are all games with enjoyable gunplay that feel both skill-based and rewarding, Bioshock Infinite does not.
It suffers from holding too strongly onto the RPG roots which leads to detrimental gameplay by making the difficulty curve dependant on upgrading of items rather than honing of skills. The game throws enemies at you as you progress that have artificially inflated health to make it seem more challenging. Holding left click and just aiming at a guy for a while is not fun, sure you can aim at his weak spot but even then he takes a while to go down unless you have weapons that are geared for such a fight (which you can't possibly forsee). Luckily though, most of the grunts in this game could be taken out with a headshot from the single fire guns so there was still a bit of skill based play. This boring grind to kill enemies is the same reason I hated the gunplay in Farcry 2. It wasn't as much a problem in Bioshock becasue from what I remember there was much less combat.
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