[QUOTE=BenJammin';42566787]I don't want to hear throwback bands, I want to hear new shit that has as much thought and talent put into rock bands that I love from the 70's.
Death Grips comes to mind. So much creativity. energy, and talent is put into their sound, you can tell they really really care about putting out the best stuff as they possibly can.
When I look towards my favorite genres which is hard rock or progressive rock I can't find a lot of new music that has that emotional and creative edge to it. For example when I listen to a lot of new prog and lot of it is just bands trying to show off and do really complex time signatures which isn't really what I even liked about Prog Rock.
I dunno, I guess I am cursed with really specific tastes for bands, they have to really click for me in order for me to listen to them many times and that is rare. I can't even really explain what I am looking for other than "more talent" which is kind of a dumb thing to say but it's true nonetheless.[/QUOTE]
You do know that prog rock and hard rock aren't really special when it comes to music genres, right?
A couple of bands in the late 60's and early 70's made a new sound for rock and then there was a decade of people just copying that sound and trying to cash in on it.
Hard rock especially has and has had this problem.
And that showing off thing you mentioned with new prog? The exact same problem was there for old prog too.
If you want to listen to new and creative music, then you're going to have to search for it.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42566787]I don't want to hear throwback bands, I want to hear new shit that has as much thought and talent put into rock bands that I love from the 70's.
Death Grips comes to mind. So much creativity. energy, and talent is put into their sound, you can tell they really really care about putting out the best stuff as they possibly can.
When I look towards my favorite genres which is hard rock or progressive rock I can't find a lot of new music that has that emotional and creative edge to it. For example when I listen to a lot of new prog and lot of it is just bands trying to show off and do really complex time signatures which isn't really what I even liked about Prog Rock.
I dunno, I guess I am cursed with really specific tastes for bands, they have to really click for me in order for me to listen to them many times and that is rare. I can't even really explain what I am looking for other than "more talent" which is kind of a dumb thing to say but it's true nonetheless.
I have a hard time explaining myself I guess. I guess I want bands to make music that I can really look up to and consider them almost holy in a sense. Music is one of the most important things in my life, and I have really high standards for it. It has to move me.[/QUOTE]
Try some new genres.
Submotion Orchestra are a recent group with a fusion of jazz/soul/dub and they're amazing.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42566787]I don't want to hear throwback bands, I want to hear new shit that has as much thought and talent put into rock bands that I love from the 70's.
Death Grips comes to mind. So much creativity. energy, and talent is put into their sound, you can tell they really really care about putting out the best stuff as they possibly can.
When I look towards my favorite genres which is hard rock or progressive rock I can't find a lot of new music that has that emotional and creative edge to it. For example when I listen to a lot of new prog and lot of it is just bands trying to show off and do really complex time signatures which isn't really what I even liked about Prog Rock.
I dunno, I guess I am cursed with really specific tastes for bands, they have to really click for me in order for me to listen to them many times and that is rare. I can't even really explain what I am looking for other than "more talent" which is kind of a dumb thing to say but it's true nonetheless.
I have a hard time explaining myself I guess. I guess I want bands to make music that I can really look up to and consider them almost holy in a sense. Music is one of the most important things in my life, and I have really high standards for it. It has to move me.[/QUOTE]
Maybe you should look in the post rock category then, a lot of bands inside there take a lot of things from prog and classic rock and add electronics alongside. Of course a lot of people berate it for just being a floaty and such. Its also fucking wide open.
Everybody is whining about how bad music is these days, but all they hear is the bad mainstream music
[QUOTE=Swilly;42566877]Maybe you should look in the post rock category then, a lot of bands inside there take a lot of things from prog and classic rock and add electronics alongside. Of course a lot of people berate it for just being a floaty and such.[/QUOTE]
I don't know what kind of Post-rock you've been listening to, but I don't think that Post-rock sounds anything like that.
In fact, if I remember correctly, Post-rock is an umberella term for music that uses rock instruments for non-rocky purposes, such as putting more emphasis on atmosphere and texture of sound rather than riffs and melodies.
Post-rock started being called a genre when everyone started trying to copy Godspeed You! Black Emperor.
It's gotten a lot better and more varied since then, but I really can't say that I've heard a Post-rock band that sounds like a combination of progrock, classic rock and electronic.
Hell, if such a band exists, I doubt that it should really be called Post-rock.
[sp]sorry for going on these pointless rants[/sp]
[QUOTE=Hakita;42566917]I don't know what kind of Post-rock you've been listening to, but I don't think that Post-rock sounds anything like that.
In fact, if I remember correctly, Post-rock is an umberella term for music that uses rock instruments for non-rocky purposes, such as putting more emphasis on atmosphere and texture of sound rather than riffs and melodies.
Post-rock started being called a genre when everyone started trying to copy Godspeed You! Black Emperor.
It's gotten a lot better and more varied since then, but I really can't say that I've heard a Post-rock band that sounds like a combination of progrock, classic rock and electronic.
Hell, if such a band exists, I doubt that it should really be called Post-rock.
[sp]sorry for going on these pointless rants[/sp][/QUOTE]
Its fine. I just recently found a bunch of bands who fit themselves within post-rock so I could be completely off the mark.
I also found most of it through either Last.fm or Spotify so it could be completely wrong.
Like this group [URL="http://www.last.fm/music/Meniscus"]Meniscus[/URL] is post rock, post metal and prog rock. :wtc:
[QUOTE=Swilly;42566961]Its fine. I just recently found a bunch of bands who fit themselves within post-rock so I could be completely off the mark.
I also found most of it through either Last.fm or Spotify so it could be completely wrong.[/QUOTE]
Last.FM has user-made tags, so it can often be wrong.
I don't know about Spotify though, since I don't use it.
Would you like to give examples of these bands?
[QUOTE=Swilly;42566961]Like this group [URL="http://www.last.fm/music/Meniscus"]Meniscus[/URL] is post rock, post metal and prog rock. :wtc:[/QUOTE]
Meniscus are Post-rock definitely, and progressive rock, but not progrock.
It's another one of those confusing labels that have been given in the musical community.
Meniscus are progressive rock in the sense that they're progressing rock, they're experimenting with new stuff.
They are, however, not progressive rock as in the genre that was popularised in the 70's.
That's confusing as fuck man. Fuck labels.
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567023]That's confusing as fuck man.[/QUOTE]
Names given to music usually are.
Just like how djent is a guitar playing style, but recently djent is also a subgenre of progressive death metal.
It's all so very silly, but try to understand.
Before editing that post, you linked to Long Distance Calling. Correct me if I'm wrong, since I haven't had much exposure to them, but they don't sound like Post-rock at all to me.
They're just pure Progressive Metal from what I can hear.
[QUOTE=Hakita;42566848]You do know that prog rock and hard rock aren't really special when it comes to music genres, right?
A couple of bands in the late 60's and early 70's made a new sound for rock and then there was a decade of people just copying that sound and trying to cash in on it.
Hard rock especially has and has had this problem.
And that showing off thing you mentioned with new prog? The exact same problem was there for old prog too.
If you want to listen to new and creative music, then you're going to have to search for it.[/QUOTE]
Yeah but that was when prog rock was a thing and there were a lot more bands doing it and it was just some time period in which rock music was becoming fucking awesome and more outside the box in England and Europe. It wasn't necessarily bands copying each other, it was bands like King Crimson raising the bar to a massive height and then bands trying to push themselves harder to reach that bar, because doing that stuff wasn't an easy task.
I wish there was some kind of movement like that right now. I try looking for new bands all the time and all I get is just blandness that I wouldn't mind to listening to it casually as I do something, but other than that I don't feel impressed.
Godspeed You Black Emperor! is a band that I found about a year ago that gave me that feeling that the music being made just felt inspired and that they really cared about the art that went into it. Although they aren't really new anymore.
And don't get me wrong, I still find stuff that I really like from time to time, I just haven't been impressed with most of the music coming out now for the genres I am interested in. Which is why I stay in my little hole of 70's albums all comfy. And I am always finding new shit from the 70's that nobody has ever heard of that just blows my fucking mind, which I why I keep digging that hole looking for more gold.
They're...weird to be honest.
You can [I]hear[/I] the metal sort of pedigree in songs like [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co452wJ-3Lg"]Black Paper Planes[/URL].
And then they do songs like [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EO00DK5H7JA"]Ductus[/URL] and [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icfhVkAXXXs"]Nucleus[/URL].
They like to be quiet and loud in the same song, its really weird. I don't know the halmarks of genres to be honest, I just find music that I like the sound to and go, "MINE."
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42567063]Yeah but that was when prog rock was a thing and there were a lot more bands doing it and it was just some time period in which rock music was becoming fucking awesome and more outside the box in England and Europe. It wasn't necessarily bands copying each other, it was bands like King Crimson raising the bar to a massive height and then bands trying to push themselves harder to reach that bar, because doing that stuff wasn't an easy task.
I wish there was some kind of movement like that right now. I try looking for new bands all the time and all I get is just blandness that I wouldn't mind to listening to it casually as I do something, but other than that I don't feel impressed.
Godspeed You Black Emperor! is a band that I found about a year ago that gave me that feeling that the music being made just felt inspired and that they really cared about the art that went into it. Although they aren't really new anymore.[/QUOTE]
I'm afraid you're just not looking hard enough, then.
There are no major musical movements nowadays, at least as major, because now music is so much wider and more open.
Back then people had to do similar things to other bands in order to get on the radio, which is how almost everyone found new music then.
KC got super popular by raising the bar of rock music by adding elements of jazz and improvisation to it, so other rock bands, wanting to get that popularity as well, started fusing rock with other things, including other bands' styles.
There are still musical movements definitely, such as the nu-jazz/math rock movement from Japan in the last decade or so, or the new breed of Neo-classical that combines it with Post-rock and IDM.
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567088]They're...weird to be honest.
You can [I]hear[/I] the metal sort of pedigree in songs like [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co452wJ-3Lg"]Black Paper Planes[/URL].
And then they do songs like [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EO00DK5H7JA"]Ductus[/URL] and [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icfhVkAXXXs"]Nucleus[/URL].
They like to be quiet and loud in the same song, its really weird. I don't know the halmarks of genres to be honest, I just find music that I like the sound to and go, "MINE."[/QUOTE]
Not knowing much about genres and labeling music is fine.
You should enjoy music as you enjoy it, genres are just there to help you find similar music to what you like.
I don't quite understand how you find the use of dynamics in a song weird, though.
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567088]They're...weird to be honest.
You can [I]hear[/I] the metal sort of pedigree in songs like [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co452wJ-3Lg"]Black Paper Planes[/URL].
And then they do songs like [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EO00DK5H7JA"]Ductus[/URL] and [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icfhVkAXXXs"]Nucleus[/URL].
They like to be quiet and loud in the same song, its really weird. I don't know the halmarks of genres to be honest, I just find music that I like the sound to and go, "MINE."[/QUOTE]
Holy shit I likey, thanks man. It's pretty cool.
[QUOTE=Hakita;42567114]
Not knowing much about genres and labeling music is fine.
You should enjoy music as you enjoy it, genres are just there to help you find similar music to what you like.
I don't quite understand how you find the use of dynamics in a song weird, though.[/QUOTE]
I'm not using the word weird as bad, I really like the dynamics in it. I grew up on Progrock, my mom was a big Floyd fan so a lot of stuff in the 60's and 70's I can pick up easily. I just recently got into post-rock/metal. So all this stuff is somewhat new to me.
So weird just means different to me, like I can hear the heavy metal, but then they do things that I don't formally tie TO heavy metal.
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567153]I'm not using the word weird as bad, I really like the dynamics in it. I grew up on Progrock, my mom was a big Floyd fan so a lot of stuff in the 60's and 70's I can pick up easily. I just recently got into post-rock/metal. So all this stuff is somewhat new to me.[/QUOTE]
Don't misunderstand me, I meant that I don't understand you finding dynamics weird, because they've been around since the dawn of music and are used in most songs.
Then again, I might be biased because of my love for progressive metal, so it might just be me not noticing that most songs don't have dynamics, but I'm pretty sure they do.
[QUOTE=Hakita;42567189]Don't misunderstand me, I meant that I don't understand you finding dynamics weird, because they've been around since the dawn of music and are used in most songs.
Then again, I might be biased because of my love for progressive metal, so it might just be me not noticing that most songs don't have dynamics, but I'm pretty sure they do.[/QUOTE]
You're also talking to someone whose rather uneducated when it comes to music so I could be completely wrong.
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567203]You're also talking to someone whose rather uneducated when it comes to music so I could be completely wrong.[/QUOTE]
If you've gotten most of your previous exposure to music from mainstream or "radio" bands, then it's completely understandable, since most songs that try to go for mainstream appeal are very simple and don't use dynamics much.
[QUOTE=Hakita;42567225]If you've gotten most of your previous exposure to music from mainstream or "radio" bands, then it's completely understandable, since most songs that try to go for mainstream appeal are very simple and don't use dynamics much.[/QUOTE]
I grew up in a limbo place, I grew up with radio music such as Linkin Park and the like, but then my mom showed me Pink Floyd and I started gobbling that up. Then I ran out of Pink Floyd and I found all these different bands and suddenly
[img]http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/mind_blown.gif[/img]
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567248]I grew up in a limbo place, I grew up with radio music such as Linkin Park and the like, but then my mom showed me Pink Floyd and I started gobbling that up. Then I ran out of Pink Floyd and I found all these different bands and suddenly
[img]http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/mind_blown.gif[/img][/QUOTE]
Pink Floyd are an interesting band, since they're kind of in the middle of being radio and being progressive.
I suppose that's what makes them a good gateway band to progressive music.
[QUOTE=Hakita;42567114]I'm afraid you're just not looking hard enough, then.
There are no major musical movements nowadays, at least as major, because now music is so much wider and more open.
Back then people had to do similar things to other bands in order to get on the radio, which is how almost everyone found new music then.
KC got super popular by raising the bar of rock music by adding elements of jazz and improvisation to it, so other rock bands, wanting to get that popularity as well, started fusing rock with other things, including other bands' styles.
There are still musical movements definitely, such as the nu-jazz/math rock movement from Japan in the last decade or so, or the new breed of Neo-classical that combines it with Post-rock and IDM.[/QUOTE]
I don't know it's just something about 70s style of instruments, ballsyness, composition, theory, and skill put into the music that I can't find anywhere else in rock. Whether it be hard blues or jazz fusion or prog rock.
Its cool that other bands are setting a high example for quality in different areas though.
One of the best rock albums I have ever heard came out last year though, which gives me a lot of hope [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45uZcuMawTA[/media]
[QUOTE=Hakita;42567261]Pink Floyd are an interesting band, since they're kind of in the middle of being radio and being progressive.
I suppose that's what makes them a good gateway band to progressive music.[/QUOTE]
I think what it did was open a door to both music that's pushing it to the edge and also the radio music because I still enjoy both.
I have groups like the Clash and Modest Mouse next to obscure bands like Infinity Shred and Menisucs.
(I'm using obscure as a general case of how well know they're to the general populace, not to those who actively look for it.)
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567313]I think what it did was open a door to both music that's pushing it to the edge and also the radio music because I still enjoy both.
I have groups like the Clash and Modest Mouse next to obscure bands like Infinity Shred and Menisucs.
(I'm using obscure as a general case of how well know they're to the general populace, not to those who actively look for it.)[/QUOTE]
We should have a thread for a lot of good 70s bands like Pink Floyd so then I can actually talk about music I really like and open people up to a lot good unheard shit from the 70s.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42567373]We should have a thread for a lot of good 70s bands like Pink Floyd so then I can actually talk about music I really like and open people up to a lot good unheard shit from the 70s.[/QUOTE]
There is a thread like that in the music section, the Pink Floyd thread reguarly talks about other gems. The stuff I'm talking about is being made now though.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42567266]I don't know it's just something about 70s style of instruments, ballsyness, composition, theory, and skill put into the music that I can't find anywhere else in rock. Whether it be hard blues or jazz fusion or prog rock.
Its cool that other bands are setting a high example for quality in different areas though.[/QUOTE]
Well of course you can't find the 70's style anywhere else in rock if you dislike throwback rock.
It's kind of hard to do and old style without... well, imitating an old style.
As for the overall evolution of rock music, I can't really say much, since I've always been more of a metal man myself.
If you're looking for ballsyness and weirdness in rock however, you might like Swans' most recent album, The Seer.
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4mQxGXxU2M]Example[/url]
[QUOTE=Swilly;42567313]I think what it did was open a door to both music that's pushing it to the edge and also the radio music because I still enjoy both.
I have groups like the Clash and Modest Mouse next to obscure bands like Infinity Shred and Menisucs.
(I'm using obscure as a general case of how well know they're to the general populace, not to those who actively look for it.)[/QUOTE]
I had the same happen to me more or less a couple of years back.
I found Pink Floyd and King Crimson, went on a huge 70's prog rock pinch, but then I started growing into other genres and I've been finding new stuff ever since.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42567373]One of the best rock albums I have ever heard came out last year though, which gives me a lot of hope [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45uZcuMawTA[/media][/QUOTE]
Now hold up a second here. First you tell me that you don't like throwback prog, but now you link one and say that its one of the best rock albums you've ever heard?
Hell, it's even got mellotrons in it!
Welcome to the wonderful world of, "I LIKE MUSIC BUT I DUNNO WHY".
[QUOTE=Hakita;42567408]Well of course you can't find the 70's style anywhere else in rock if you dislike throwback rock.
It's kind of hard to do and old style without... well, imitating an old style.
As for the overall evolution of rock music, I can't really say much, since I've always been more of a metal man myself.
If you're looking for ballsyness and weirdness in rock however, you might like Swans' most recent album, The Seer.
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4mQxGXxU2M]Example[/url]
I had the same happen to me more or less a couple of years back.
I found Pink Floyd and King Crimson, went on a huge 70's prog rock pinch, but then I started growing into other genres and I've been finding new stuff ever since.[/QUOTE]
Swans is interesting, there isn't anything going on though in the songs and it gets really boring.
Also I have kind of gone the opposite way. I was introduced to 70s rock like 6 years ago through Rush and King Crimson and I have never gone back and just kept on digging and finding more and more interesting albums than any of the stuff I heard from modern bands.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42567480]Swans is interesting, there isn't anything going on though in the songs and it gets really boring.[/QUOTE]
I can understand not liking drone and other minimalistic rock genres, but saying that there isn't anything going on is downright insulting.
Swans songs are about atmosphere and they build it fantastically.
Whenever I hear Mother of the World I just completely drown in that song.
[QUOTE=Hakita;42567408]Well of course you can't find the 70's style anywhere else in rock if you dislike throwback rock.
It's kind of hard to do and old style without... well, imitating an old style.
As for the overall evolution of rock music, I can't really say much, since I've always been more of a metal man myself.
If you're looking for ballsyness and weirdness in rock however, you might like Swans' most recent album, The Seer.
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4mQxGXxU2M]Example[/url]
I had the same happen to me more or less a couple of years back.
I found Pink Floyd and King Crimson, went on a huge 70's prog rock pinch, but then I started growing into other genres and I've been finding new stuff ever since.
Now hold up a second here. First you tell me that you don't like throwback prog, but now you link one and say that its one of the best rock albums you've ever heard?
Hell, it's even got mellotrons in it![/QUOTE]
Eh. I have listened to too much prog to the point where it doesn't sound throwback at all. Mellotrons doesn't mean it's prog, that is just an instrument. It's symphonic prog yes, but it's not like Steve Wilson where you can tell he has spent his life studying bands like Yes and KC and stuff and tries to copy what they do instead of reaching something from within himself rather than other bands and their styles.
[QUOTE=BenJammin';42567566]Eh. I have listened to too much prog to the point where it doesn't sound throwback at all. Mellotrons doesn't mean it's prog, that is just an instrument. It's symphonic prog yes, but it's not like Steve Wilson where you can tell he has spent his life studying bands like Yes and KC and stuff and tries to copy what they do instead of reaching something from within himself rather than other bands.[/QUOTE]
The only modern bands that really use mellotrons anymore ARE throwback bands.
And I don't understand how listening to a lot of prog makes you not notice when a modern band is trying to sound like old prog.
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