Wasn't that ship the biggest one they had? Like the one from the closing shot of The Empire Strikes Back?
You guys do know that in the [sp]lightspeed suicide scene[/sp] they purposely showed a scene where the fleet commander goes "Ignore that Bullshit" and then they switched to "Destroy it" the moment they actually caught on to whats actually happening.
That tactic would definitely not work under any other circumstances, they probably would've just shot it down.
[QUOTE=Matrix374;53067815]You guys do know that in the [sp]lightspeed suicide scene[/sp] they purposely showed a scene where the fleet commander goes "Ignore that Bullshit" and then they switched to "Destroy it" the moment they actually caught on to whats happening.
That tactic would definitely not work under any other circumstances[/QUOTE]
[sp]yeah, and there are gravity well projectors in star wars that can stop ships from jumping to hyperspace, so if it were to become a "common tactic" the first order could build and deploy ships like the interdictor-class star destroyers to stop it
Although I do find it kind of pedantic since star wars is chock-full of "if they just do X they could have won so easily." It's a space world-war 2 technology universe that does things based on how cool they are. I'd give credit for reigning that stuff back but the ship sailed in ep 4.[/sp]
The way I thought it would work was that the shields would dissipate as the ship charges hyperdrive or something, meaning the ship attempting the tactic would get ruined if they didn't have a distraction.
I'm much more interested in what people think of this film in 5 years than what they do now, once the trilogy is complete and people have had some time with it all.
With the OT opinions changed over time quite a bit.
warp drive theorycrafting
[sp]You obviously couldn't just buy a junker to use as an improvised kamikaze weapon, I'm sure standard shields would protect against that kind of projectile the same as any missile, but a massive cruiser/destroyer? Obviously enough to overwhelm basically any shield. I'm sure however that makes it prohibitively expensive.[/sp]
I'm sick of this mindset that it's okay to dismiss criticism of something and continue to give money to an industry that actively discourages competition so that they can shove their big budget franchises down your throat every year.
[QUOTE=space1;53068056]I'm sick of this mindset that it's okay to dismiss criticism of something and continue to give money to an industry that actively discourages competition so that they can shove their big budget franchises down your throat every year.[/QUOTE]
Sure, now point to a post where this is the case.
[QUOTE=TheFilmSlacker;53068000]My thoughts on the whole "why didn't she just tell Poe" discourse
[sp] He got their entire fucking bombing fleet killed by being reckless and by the end of the film, the resistance has been brought down into a small enough group of people that they can't even fill up that hanger they took over at the end of the of the film on that anime-ass planet. Leia is the most respected general in the resistance and her last orders were to demote Poe because of how many people he got killed. We don't know much about Leia's relation to Laura Dern's character, but we know enough that they're friends and that she respects Leia very much. Yeah, we wouldn't have had Canto Bight or whatever, but it didn't last any longer than 15 minutes of screentime and I think people overblow how bad it is, despite a few lines making me kinda wince. [/sp]
Despite its flaws, I really enjoy The Last Jedi. It's some of the most fun I had at the theater all year and even though I understand some of the gripes people have with it, I think they're entirely overblown.
The movie has a fucking 49% on Rotten Tomatoes for the audience score right now, that's nuts to me.[/QUOTE]
My problem with that explanation is it replaces one question with another. We know why Poe was locked out of the loop, and it makes sense. But now the question is why was Poe still given free reign to do what he wants? Why wasn't the known hothead who just disobeyed orders, lost the Resistance their entire bombing wing, at least as many X-wings and the lives of at least 20 pilots thrown in the brig or something, not just as punishment for how badly he fucked up, but also to prevent him from potentially fucking things up even more by going off half-cocked?
You could even have the rest of the movie play out the same way, just add something with Finn busting him out before they enact their plan.
I really like The Last Jedi.
To be honest, I think most people who consider themselves Star Wars fans but have hated every single movie since Return of the Jedi ought to just give up. Because so many people hold Star Wars movies to this ludicrously high standard among movies.
It's just not enough for Star Wars to be a good movie. Or a great movie. It has to be the [I]best[/I] movie or it's just terrible. It has to be as good as the original trilogy or it's just terrible.
Nothing will ever be as good as the original trilogy to most fans of Star Wars. I'm sorry, that's just how it is. Nostalgia is a powerful thing and if you're a fan of Star Wars chances are you have tons of it for the originals.
The original Star Wars movies aren't perfect by any means, either. In fact, the fact that there will never be a 'as good as the original trilogy' Star Wars ever again has nothing to do with the original trilogy being a godlike set of flawless movies. It is a 'you' problem. Nostalgia is a powerful force and to so many people these movies have transcended movies in an unhealthy way. Star Wars is not just a set of movies, it's a [I]legend,[/I] it's a [I]fable,[/I] it's not just a movie franchise, it's [I]the[/I] movie franchise. It is so, fucking important to people who credit the movies as shaping their whole childhoods if not their whole lives.
Nobody treats any other movie franchise the way they treat Star Wars. Nobody had to see Get Out or John Wick 2 three fucking times just to form an opinion. Never in my life have I even seen a movie where I felt "Oh, gee, I'm gonna need to see that 2 or 3 more times to really form my thoughts".
In a sense the actual quality of The Last Jedi is irrelevant when anything less than perfect will see it burned at the stake by angry fanboys. And in a couple years time when Star Wars Episode IX comes out, fans will froth at the mouth at what a travesty it was compared to The Last Jedi. The same way, when The Force Awakens came out, people hated it and called it A New Hope rip-off. Then, when The Last Jedi came out, they re-wrote history to claim that The Force Awakens was this competent resurrection of the original trilogy as a means of justifying their irrational levels of hatred for The Last Jedi.
Fuck me, people even want to pretend that [I]the Prequels[/I] 'weren't that bad' or were even good movies just to justify their hatred for the new hotness. Like we didn't spend two decades hating on them. Like we didn't watch the Plinkett reviews in the [I]millions.[/I] Like we haven't made fun of 'the worst love story ever told' and how much we all hate sand for decades. Those weren't that bad because now there's this new thing I have to build up to be the worst travesty ever.
In the end I feel that The Last Jedi's flaws have little to do with the real hatred for this movie. I think IX is going to get a similar reception. I think X is. And XI, and XII, and every Star Wars movie going forward. Disney has inherited one of the most toxic franchises to create for, because it doesn't matter who directs, it doesn't matter who stars, it doesn't matter the budget, it doesn't matter the script, because the standards are so insanely high for Star Wars that nobody could truly please the world's most unpleasable fanbase. A fanbase that expects a perfect movie so good that it practically has magical qualities the way the originals supposedly do.
For younger audiences this is not a problem and fortunately one day this will pass when all of us who grew up on the originals fucking die already, but in the meantime, Star Wars was not 'doomed' or ruined by the prequels. Or the disney buy-out. Or The Force Awakens. Or The Last Jedi.
The moment Star Wars was 'ruined', or 'doomed', was 1983 or 1986 depending on how you want to count it. In 1977 Star Wars was released. In 1980 Empire Strikes Back was released. In 1983 Return of the Jedi was released. And in 1986 there was no Star Wars film, marking the start of a 16 year break before Phantom Menace. That helped fester a perception of the original trilogy as a flawless, timeless, nostalgic masterpiece, that let imaginations run wild, how could you build on [I]that.[/I] At the time they were just movies, hell, Empire wasn't even received that well. But time, imagination, and nostalgia have concocted a franchise that is fucking impossible to create movies for.
Of course some people don't like The Last Jedi for legitimate reasons. But it's that vocal die-hard fanbase that bothers the fuck out of me. The fanbase that wants to hate the newest Star Wars for any reason they can muster. That is so desperate to paint Mark Hamill as being on their side. That sends piles of hate to Rian Johnson. That tries to rewrite history to make the new thing the worst thing ever and everything they complained about prior wasn't all that bad compared to THIS new thing.
If you can't accept the Star Wars films as just fucking movies like most younger people can, if you cannot look at these movies with a rational eye, then just stop. Stop watching these fucking movies anymore. You almost certainly will not like any movies they make, anything they do will be an insult to your childhood, so just stop fucking going. You don't [I]have[/I] to see it. You don't [I]have[/I] to be there for everything Star Wars. Star Wars doesn't [I]have[/I] to be the most important thing in the world to you.
[QUOTE=Dirty_Ape;53067623]Even though Star Wars has always been about spectacle more than realistic space combat, this bugged me more than anything else in the movie. I wasn't bothered by bombers in space seemingly relying on gravity to deliver bombs but being able to [sp]lightspeed kamakaze[/sp] a target doesn't make any sense in the context of the universe. If that works, why not just do that all the time? It's the most overpowered tactic ever if a ship that small can destroy a ship that big. Like why not do the same thing to the Death Star?[/QUOTE]
You can say that about pretty much every sci-fi setting. Among countless other things that would ruin the setting if you really thought about.
[editline]21st January 2018[/editline]
Like, I don't even want to think about how everything bigger than a shuttlecraft in the Star Trek universe crashing into a planet probably has enough antimatter in it wipe out most of the life on it.
[QUOTE=maddogsamurai;53067637]And two, [sp]It's essentially turning your ship into a hyperspace bullet. No one is willing to commit that level of sacrifice except for the general in The Last Jedi.[/sp][/QUOTE]
It's wildly untrue that people in Star Wars are not willing to sacrifice their lives. If you've seen the space battles in literally any Star Wars movie, the good guys usually fight suicidal battles where they nearly all die.
The Box Office is more telling. 700 million drop from the Force Awakens. 49 audience scores on rotten tomatoes, highest 2nd week drop of all Star wars film. Fucking Jumanji of all things having much better legs. People hate the new Last Jedi movie, including me.
[QUOTE=Dirty_Ape;53078824]It's wildly untrue that people in Star Wars are not willing to sacrifice their lives. If you've seen the space battles in literally any Star Wars movie, the good guys usually fight suicidal battles where they nearly all die.[/QUOTE]
In Episode VI an A-Wing pilot puts his critically damaged ship on a collision course with the bridge of a Super Star Destroyer to cripple it.
[QUOTE=Corndog Ninja;53092399]In Episode VI an A-Wing pilot puts his critically damaged ship on a collision course with the bridge of a Super Star Destroyer to cripple it.[/QUOTE]
I always assumed he was shot down and that's just where his ship ended up crashing - not that he had any control whatsoever.
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