[QUOTE=Killuah;52887066]Sure sure but stating this is really no response to which ironically is at the same time the reason that you are getting defensive without adressing the real point[/QUOTE]
Don't really know what point you want me to address? I enjoy the videos, some points CinemaSins make are valid, some points are nitpicking. If I enjoy a movie without reading reviews, then read negative reviews, it doesn't mean I automatically stop liking the movie
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887030]It's not supposed to be taken seriously,[/QUOTE]
"GUIZ IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY!!!!!1!"
The fucking video covers that:
A. He clearly does take it seriously when he's "right"
and
B. Intent doesn't matter if moronic viewers are taking it seriously and avoiding perfectly good movies because of made-up "Sins".
But I bet nothing we say can possibly change your mind because for some reason this is the war that idiots on the internet want to die defending.
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52886937]I mean if you've not got half a brain missing, it's clear to see that some of the nitpicking that CinemaSins does is just for a joke (which based on your humor, you may or may not find funny). I really enjoy CinemaSins videos, some of their criticism is completely valid, some is obviously nitpicking done just to provide extra comedic value. They're not here to "review" films, it's just a bit of fun. Either you like it or you don't[/QUOTE]
the video explains why all of what you said is incredibly flawed. perhaps you should watch it?
[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;52887073]CRITICIZING CINEMA SINS IS LIKE WHITE SUPREMACY
YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST FOLKS[/QUOTE]
Yes that's definitely what I was saying :v:
sorry, everyone already told you to watch it, oops.
anyway bobvids owns, it is good he finally spelled out all the reasons cinemasins is awful but it sucks that he had to do it when it should be painfully obvious to everyone.
the satire defence has always been absurd and the onion analogy sums it up perfectly
it doesn't even make sense anyway, why would anyone want to watch a whiny asshole being consistently wrong about everything? what does that satirise and how is it funny? it would work for a one-off video parodying nitpicking, but not an entire series...
people watch this shit so they can have a smug chuckle about one-upping the people who made the movie or think they're learning some interesting trivia and are too stupid to see the factual errors and jumps of logic or simply don't care - it's a poster child for intellectual dishonesty
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887047]We weren't really going to get a meaningful discussion when there are no other CinemaSins fans here to back me up. Just people who were either on the fence or didn't like CinemaSins anyway so obviously they agree[/QUOTE]
having ur hugbox w/you to shout along a meaningful discussion doesn't make
u get one of those by, again, critically thinking, not shitposting, or by not having [QUOTE=djjkxbox;52886937]half a brain missing[/QUOTE]
fyi watching the video wont kill u or even make u change your mind on cinemasins so if you want to walk ur talk maybe just watch the video, in full?
dont say its too long and u dont have enough time uve been posting here for longer than the runtime
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887047]there are no other CinemaSins fans here to back me up.[/QUOTE]
He's right guys, it's not fair that there's no one else here to argue in favor of eating paint chips.
[QUOTE=krail9;52887094]the satire defence has always been absurd and the onion analogy sums it up perfectly
it doesn't even make sense anyway, why would anyone want to watch a whiny asshole being consistently wrong about everything? what does that satirise and how is it funny? it would work for a one-off video parodying nitpicking, but not an entire series...
people watch this shit so they can have a smug chuckle about one-upping the people who made the movie or think they're learning some interesting trivia and are too stupid to see the factual errors and jumps of logic or simply don't care - it's a poster child for intellectual dishonesty[/QUOTE]
Everyone has a different sense of humor, and if CinemaSins has a large number of people that like it, then they all share that same humor. There's things I don't find funny that loads of other people do, and then I find this funny but many other people don't. Humor is just one of those things, it's different for each person
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887047]We weren't really going to get a meaningful discussion when there are no other CinemaSins fans here to back me up. Just people who were either on the fence or didn't like CinemaSins anyway so obviously they agree[/QUOTE]
I mean, the thing is you didn't watch the video so you don't really get to blame others for failing to have a discussion about the video.
Great now I'm joining in.
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887077]Don't really know what point you want me to address? I enjoy the videos, some points CinemaSins make are valid, some points are nitpicking. If I enjoy a movie without reading reviews, then read negative reviews, it doesn't mean I automatically stop liking the movie[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Killuah;52887045]No you just don't like that someone shows that something that you like is dumb and you don't like yourself liking dumb stuff.
[/QUOTE]
this one. Just say "well yeah I am a bit butthurt" and it'll be ok
or say "I am not butthurt at all" and explain your first posts that got all defensive without even watching the video
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887103]Everyone has a different sense of humor, and if CinemaSins has a large number of people that like it, then they all share that same humor. There's things I don't find funny that loads of other people do, and then I find this funny but many other people don't. Humor is just one of those things, it's different for each person[/QUOTE]
it
is
misinformation
pretending
to be humour. it's blatantly incorrect and poor critisism, mixed in with """"jokes"""", misleading the millions of viewers abut a movie that cinemasins didn't understand at all. watch the video!!!
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887030]It's not supposed to be taken seriously, of course these two videos apparently prove that as false (I don't see how, maybe that makes me stupid), but you know, I don't take it seriously. They're videos on the internet. It sucks if people are taking it seriously, but I don't think that's CinemaSins's fault[/QUOTE]
I think the video demonstrated how it is CinemaSin's fault by
1) mixing valid criticisms with invalid ones
2) sometimes pushing the image that CinemaSins is critique and sometimes that it's just comedy/satire
3) having a business background that would suggest that this is intended and not a coincidence or blind recklessness.
This video was about arguing how CinemaSins is bad for film criticism, for YouTube, and for critical thinking. If you can enjoy it despite those things, fine, but I think people in this thread are taking issue with you playing off the negatives like appending something with "it's just a prank, bro" makes it harmless.
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887050]Maybe it's dumb, but it's funny. There's a lot of things like that[/QUOTE]
Oh so you refuse to think about that any further because "it's dumb"?
Fuck dude
djjkxbox, just watch this video from 30:07, and maybe you'll understand why everyone's criticizing CinemaSins. Here bobvids actually takes the time to sum up his problems with CinemaSins, and will spare you the 30 minutes of your time with a condensed block of all the arguments people are trying to make. It'll take 3 minutes of your time, and will make the actual discussion of CinemaCins more fruitful than I has been so far.
[video]https://youtu.be/W6Z95LdlKGM?t=30m07s[/video]
Or just ignore it, up to you.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52887129]Oh so you refuse to think about that any further because "it's dumb"?
Fuck dude[/QUOTE]
What else do you want me to say? Sure some of the things they're doing are ingenuine, some of the points they make aren't correct, possibly on purpose. But I enjoyed the videos before I found this out, and I still do. I'm not refusing to think about it any further, I just enjoy the videos dude, I don't get what's hard to understand about that. I can see why people don't like them, and obviously for the points made in the video. But people watch the videos because they like them, and they don't have to find reason to validate that
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887084]Yes that's definitely what I was saying :v:[/QUOTE]
I'm just taking the piss, but...
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887047]We weren't really going to get a meaningful discussion when there are no other CinemaSins fans here to back me up. Just people who were either on the fence or didn't like CinemaSins anyway so obviously they agree[/QUOTE]
You don't need fans to back you up. Honestly, if you like them? That's fine. I genuinely don't care that you watch it, you can watch whatever the fuck you like.
But you're dismissing legit critique by just dismissing it by saying "Yeah, well, I like it, and you're stupid if you take CinemaSins seriously," without being willing to engage in a good-faith discussion. You're correct in that there won't be a meaningful discussion, but it's not because you're outnumbered; It's because you're the one not interested in having a meaningful discussion.
Now if you went through the dude's video and deconstructed points he made and made actual rebuttals or enlightened us with new information, that would be another matter entirely. I challenge you to do this. But you already expressed that you have not watched the video and that you refuse to watch the video. This is like going to a book club to discuss the book of the week, and then loudly exclaiming "I didn't read the book, but it was wrong," and then getting defensive when people asked you why.
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887138]What else do you want me to say? Sure some of the things they're doing are ingenuine, some of the points they make aren't correct, possibly on purpose. But I enjoyed the videos before I found this out, and I still do. I'm not refusing to think about it any further, I just enjoy the videos dude, I don't get what's hard to understand about that. I can see why people don't like them, and obviously for the points made in the video. But people watch the videos because they like them, and they don't have to find reason to validate that[/QUOTE]
We want you to say "I'm going to watch the video in full now" and not lie about refusing to think about it any further.
[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;52887141]Now if you went through the dude's video and deconstructed points he made and made actual rebuttals or enlightened us with new information, that would be another matter entirely. I challenge you to do this.[/QUOTE]
It'd help the discussion maybe, but what I don't think you understand is I haven't made a list in my head as to why I like CinemaSins, I just [I]do[/I]. Maybe that's shallow, but you know there's some things on tv that you don't know why you enjoy the show, you just do. I can fully understand why some people don't like it, and I probably can't deconstruct all the points, but really I don't need to do that for myself. I just think to say that CinemaSins is "terrible" is a hyperbole, it might be bad, and the idea behind it worse, but people enjoy it, and I don't see people finding happiness in something as bad. They're not going to turn into assholes watching these videos, they're going to watch them, close them down and get on with their life
I had IRL friends that said they didn't want to see Pacific Rim because of CinemaSins.
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887103]Everyone has a different sense of humor, and if CinemaSins has a large number of people that like it, then they all share that same humor. There's things I don't find funny that loads of other people do, and then I find this funny but many other people don't. Humor is just one of those things, it's different for each person[/QUOTE]
nobody is denying that people enjoy this content... the fact that people enjoy it is the entire problem, you might notice that if you, ya know, watch the fucking video???
[QUOTE=Destroyox;52887164]I had IRL friends that said they didn't want to see Pacific Rim because of CinemaSins.[/QUOTE]
And there's people that run people over because they played GTA. If that's not a good comparison then let me know why, and we'll discuss it
[editline]13th November 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=krail9;52887166]nobody is denying that people enjoy this content... the fact that people enjoy it is the entire problem, you might notice that if you, ya know, watch the fucking video???[/QUOTE]
Why is it a problem to enjoy something? Unless it's obviously something truly horrible, but is this really what this is?
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887154]It'd help the discussion maybe, but what I don't think you understand is I haven't made a list in my head as to why I like CinemaSins, I just [I]do[/I]. Maybe that's shallow, but you know there's some things on tv that you don't know why you enjoy the show, you just do. I can fully understand why some people don't like it, and I probably can't deconstruct all the points, but really I don't need to do that for myself. I just think to say that CinemaSins is "terrible" is a hyperbole, it might be bad, and the idea behind it worse, but people enjoy it, and I don't see people finding happiness in something as bad. They're not going to turn into assholes watching these videos, they're going to watch them, close them down and get on with their life[/QUOTE]
Then try to think about it, try to articulate it. It can sometimes be hard to express abstract emotions, I know, but it will be a good exercise and start an actual discussion. Maybe you'll persuade us, maybe we'll persuade you. You shouldn't be afraid of that, though.
Liking something that is objectively bad doesn't make you any less of a person if that's your concern djj
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887171]And there's people that run people over because they played GTA. If that's not a good comparison then let me know why, and we'll discuss it[/QUOTE]
Someone not wanting to see a movie based on a YouTube video is the result of successful marketing on the part of the video producer, and perhaps ignorance on the part of the viewer, but not always. There may be a lack of critical thinking in just taking things at face value but the video may still nevertheless present a persuasive, cogent argument.
Somebody running over people after playing GTA is mental sickness, through and through. It is not "because" of the video game, it's in spite of it; they possessed a deranged mind to begin with and decided to go out and murder people. Maybe they already had violent tendencies. Maybe they're disconnected from reality. It could be a multitude of reasons. But no sane person who views a piece of fiction gets the urge to commit violence because of that media.
These two concepts are not even remotely comparable.
[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;52887187]Someone not wanting to see a movie based on a YouTube video is the result of successful marketing on the part of the video producer, and perhaps ignorance on the part of the viewer, but not always. There may be a lack of critical thinking in just taking things at face value but the video may still nevertheless present a persuasive, cogent argument.
Somebody running over people after playing GTA is mental sickness, through and through. It is not "because" of the video game, it's in spite of it; they possessed a deranged mind to begin with and decided to go out and murder people.
These two concepts are not even remotely comparable.[/QUOTE]
Well someone could play a video game which dissuades them from doing something, not intentionally, but it can happen. I can't think of a good example at the moment, but there are plenty out there. It's not unknown that all forms of media can affect people's views on things, and often not intentionally. It's possible that CinemaSins is actually intentionally trying to make people think movies are bad, and I agree completely that would be wrong.
I've always fundamentally disliked CS cuz it's like taking this 1h-2h long piece of content and in 10m going [I]dingd ing ding[/I] it fucking [B]SUCKS[/B] i [B]HATE[/B] this MOVIE [U]LIFE IS TORTURE[/U] without any kind of explanation or immersion into any of the points whatsoever. This'd work if the channel was a satire channel, but it obviously isn't, and just shitting on movies in a monotonous voice isn't even that funny to begin with.
Like, ralphthemoviemaker's channel also has this "movie sucks!" idea, down to the title of his videos and everything, but his videos are long enough to allow for substance and actually take the time to detail each point with skits & shit thrown in for legit comedic value.
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52886937]I mean if you've not got half a brain missing, it's clear to see that some of the nitpicking that CinemaSins does is just for a joke (which based on your humor, you may or may not find funny). I really enjoy CinemaSins videos, some of their criticism is completely valid, some is obviously nitpicking done just to provide extra comedic value. They're not here to "review" films, it's just a bit of fun. Either you like it or you don't[/QUOTE]
At this point, posts like this and the ensuing shitfest are a tradition on Facepunch
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887194]Well someone could play a video game which dissuades them from doing something, not intentionally, but it can happen. I can't think of a good example at the moment, but there is plenty out there. It's not unknown that all forms of media can affect people's views on things, and often not intentionally. It's possible that CinemaSins is actually intentionally trying to make people think movies are bad, and I agree completely that would be wrong.[/QUOTE]
Media can do a lot, media can be powerful. Media can make people reconsider worldviews, educate them on important matters, or inspire creativity. It can make us laugh or cry, or feel the whole emotional epxtrum. The idea that media can impact a person's life is nearly irrefutable. The central argument is that CinemaSins even influences people in subtle ways that actually harm the movie industry.
But the jump from "plays a video game" to "domestic terrorism" is a HUGE leap in logic. Again, sane people don't go out and randomly murder, and if they did they needed to have had something fundamentally wrong in order to even begin considering the thought.
The argument of the video, however, is that CinemaSins' intention is immaterial. Honestly, I don't personally believe they're trying to intentionally make movies look bad for the sake of ruining movies, or that they have sinister ulterior motives. I think the reason is much simpler; I think they just wanna make a load of money, and they're very good at doing it. The problem is that the [I]consequence[/I] of these actions is that people take this seriously and give them a misinformed picture of a movie. He presents several examples as to how CinemaSins' criticisms can be inaccurate at best and downright falsehoods at worst. The example the video presented about Get Out missed the point to such a degree that it struck me as borderline racist. The intent is irrelevant.
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887154]It'd help the discussion maybe, but what I don't think you understand is I haven't made a list in my head as to why I like CinemaSins, I just [I]do[/I]. Maybe that's shallow, but you know there's some things on tv that you don't know why you enjoy the show, you just do. I can fully understand why some people don't like it, and I probably can't deconstruct all the points, but really I don't need to do that for myself. I just think to say that CinemaSins is "terrible" is a hyperbole, it might be bad, and the idea behind it worse, but people enjoy it, and I don't see people finding happiness in something as bad. They're not going to turn into assholes watching these videos, they're going to watch them, close them down and get on with their life[/QUOTE]
People finding happiness in being misinformed leads to the world being a stupider and less happy place.
I expect people to spend 5 seconds asking questions. You don't. That's fine. But don't act like there's nothing wrong with it because you haven't thought about it as you've stated.
[editline]13th November 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=djjkxbox;52887194]Well someone could play a video game which dissuades them from doing something, not intentionally, but it can happen. I can't think of a good example at the moment, but there are plenty out there. It's not unknown that all forms of media can affect people's views on things, and often not intentionally. It's possible that CinemaSins is actually intentionally trying to make people think movies are bad, and I agree completely that would be wrong.[/QUOTE]
"Nebulous other thing could also prevent you so this direct criticism and schlock isn't responsible in any way"
Literally whataboutism.
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