Forum Discussion V. "Where's the Forum Discussion thread"
999 replies, posted
I am the forum's conduit to garry. If there's an issue, I make him aware and he tries to fix it. I triage the issues on the forum and prioritise them. This has always been the case; it was the case with the subforum drama, the rules drama and more recently the backend breaking.
I'm not "a mod with a title" and what you've said is rather ignorant. I'm a paid employee of Facepunch that is in charge of the forums. I set the rules, manage the mod team and organise the forums. I would fix bugs if I could, but that isn't within my skill set.
So yes, contacting me about problems does solve stuff. I can use the information I receive to inform garry of any pressing issues that need to be fixed. The CSS / backend thing would probably be fixed by now if somebody had mentioned it to me when it first happened. It took me getting on my rest days from my other job, fixing my computer and logging back onto the forums to identify the issues. Within minutes I had told garry and he's told me he's working on a fix. Same with the Google authentication issue that was troubling some users, this is now fixed.
A lot is going on behind the scenes but unfortunately nobody can see this. It's garry's decision to not have a change log and I doubt I'm going to convince him otherwise any time soon.
The problem Hezzy with the aggression and you just proved that is because since everyone is so used to the old forums just fucking working even with its security issues and the old ways, the new ways or lack of new ways and missing features make it so agonising to use and accept.
Revenge isn’t wrong but he isn’t right either. It’s no joke that projects get abandoned and this feels abandoned like the several other lab punches before this.
I also don’t believe that you are contactable 24/7. I’ve asked a serious question in a Discord DM and you haven’t replied or given me any resolution.
Havent really given me a chance to properly explain myself either.
I hate that this post turned out to be a call out again but it’s necessary evil just to get the right attention.
Well, obviously not whilst I'm asleep. If I'm at work I'll let people know I've seen their message and then get back to them on my break or when I'm at home.
I haven't replied to what you've said because "No" is my final answer to your initial question and there would be no positive outcome from any further discussion about the matter.
i like the maximum effort being applied when you’ve barely tried
Would the forums being so broken that the "forum's conduit to garry" can't even use them on mobile not be considered something worth triaging?
I've been primarily browsing on iOS since custom CSS broke and I'm still managing to do it, this just seems like excuses. Unless your phone for some reason doesn't even have a web browser at all (yet somehow still works fine with Discord), you should have been able to at least park it on this thread and do your job. You are paid to do this!
WHY DIDN'T GARRY, OR YOU, OR ANYONE WITH ANY AUTHORITY NOTICE THAT IT WAS BROKEN?
Does Garry even USE the forums? (I mean, as far as anyone can tell, no he doesn't.) Everyone has been complaining about this, and it's clear Garry has locked himself in his hermit tower and doesn't use any of the threads here that are specifically for telling him about issues with the forum. You've said in the past that he reads feedback here, but this conclusively proves that false.
Having only one person as the "forum's conduit to garry" could work, if that person was reliable. Throughout this newpunch debacle you have been an on again off again dad who is sometimes gone for days and days at a time when critical issues are happening. If you are the only person who is going to be in touch with Garry, and Garry is the only developer, and Garry does NOT want to use the forums, there needs to be a way to get ahold of you ON THE FORUMS! It is NOT acceptable to only be able to reach you on a third party application!
Also:
Threatening people to not complain or Garry will be a big angry baby and delete the forums is also a really shitty look. That just reads as trying to bully people into not being vocally frustrated with the calamitous issues we are going through with almost zero feedback. All we have is you assuring us that things are happening, and no proof for us. Something like, oh, I dunno, a changelog would fix that, or at least help heavily.
You're his messenger. He doesn't interact with the forums, so he needs someone to inform him and speak on his behalf, that is you. Quite frankly, this role could be filled without you. A GitHub issues section, Trello cards, or Traq/similar does the same thing.
But you are, whether you are a paid employee or not. You don't set the rules. garry sets the rules, you relay them to us, and maybe make minor adjustments that don't alter the actual intent of the rule. We went over this during the whole rules thing and why you told us that we can't make changes, because it's what garry wants.
You manage the mod team. That, aside from being garry's filter, is really your only special function outside of a standard mod.
But no, it doesn't. Nor should it, honestly. Look at everything that is still broken. Look at everything you have/should have reported that still isn't fixed. Leaving garry a voicemail with you doesn't fix the things we need fixed, and it hasn't. You keep bringing up all of these outside commitments for why you are unable to keep up or perform to your best. Just a few lines prior, you tell us you are a paid employee of Facepunch. Why should we accept these excuses from you when it is literally your job. If you tried that with any other job, they would show you the door.
To expand on what was said above about you being open 24/7. No, you aren't. @a dumb sheep is right. You, on many occasions, have told us you're here to listen and relay our concerns. Then we now get our 5th "Forum Discussion" thread, until that thread is locked because you don't want to talk about it anymore. Then after more community anger, you cave in and open a new thread, post a new apology, making the same promises, and we repeat.
I don't want to sound like I am beating on you, and I am happy that something you told garry got fixed. But there are so, so many more things that have been waiting with no progress. We can improve on communication, and we need to improve on development. You could be the best communicator in the entire world, but until we see results, unfortunately, you are the one who is going to get the brunt of it.
But, that's your job.
im pretty sure plenty of people said it was broken in this thread when it broke, and theres been a thread for nearly two weeks now that pinged both of them. i know hezzy said he hadnt had much access to the forums but you would think the actual person that fucks around with the site would check the actual site every now and then to check that he broke shit or people reporting things :thinking:
It's easy to blame them when people spent quite a bit of time trying to get their attention over it. The only reason it took so long is because they're inexplicably expecting people to go somewhere completely off-forum to discuss the forums.
Garry ain't a common user. Hezzy ain't a common user. Both of them were pinged multiple times in both this thread and the thread saying custom CSS was broken. There is no excuse.
Lots of people used dark theme and mobile bandaid. I used mobile bandaid myself.
I only use mobile bandaid since it's packaged into fp droid.
ios users are fucked
Wait Hezzy you're actually paid for this? lmao, I thought you were volunteering and that explained why you're so passive. I can't believe you come around every 2 weeks to type "we're working on it" and tell some random to shut up over forum issues (in the thread for forum issues), and get a paycheck for it
He's been on the FP team for quite a while
Adam Heslop
But remember, this isn't hezzy's only job,
He's a train cop by trade 🚅🔫👀💢
It's not like it was a secret. Hell go on over to the facepunch staff page and you'll see him there, its been up for months. It's not like he's a full time guy working on this though. While he's been reconfigured by Garry for his VERY long time effort and contributions with the forum he still has an other full time job and a life to deal with.
Most of us are here because of our dedication to the community. Whenever you come out as a very public member of the community people are going to scrutinize what you do down to a T. Of course there were mistakes made, and of course we're not going to do everything right. We're trying to work with what we got, and sometimes we make bad decisions. Thats part of being human, and if you can't take that in stride I'd recommend taking a break.
I don't think the points people are bringing up here are "scrutinizing what you do down to a T"
Here for instance. It doesn't take an obsessive amount of scrutiny to point out where this is wrong. We're just members dude, he's being paid for the express purpose of managing the community, it's pretty obvious where most of the responsibility lies. Like I said before, it's Hezzy's job to deal with the people, it shouldn't be us worrying about how to deal with him.
And if he can't do anything to speed up development, then look towards what isn't beyond his power, and organize shit there. Relaying the info about CSS being broken was some real basic shit under his responsibility, why slip on something so simple, why double down on the excuses and create a whole situation over it? Why is Science, with its grand total of 44 posts, still a subforum, as well as so many other dead sections that could cater to communities that actually exist here? I know this shit is a side gig but this isn't even side gig effort
Why is Hezzy, after chewing me out for being "hostile" to Garry, proceeding to double and triple down on implying Garry is childish enough to delete the forums because some people said bad things?
Garry, the guy known for ignoring bad/dumb feedback from idiots and actively mocking it all the time on changelogs for all his projects? The guy known for his laissez-faire admin style where he just does whatever and posts whenever?
Nah. If he deleted the forums, it'd be for the reason of "lol felt like it brah, I think it's the right decision to make and it saves on hosting costs", and not the reason "well some mean guy said bad things about me on a forum I run".
Garry "cum in a vag until it happens" Newman is not going to delete the forums over bad posts, because Garry "cum in a vag until it happens" Newman is not a child.
Not to make any accusations here, but it really doesn't give me confidence that Hezzy really is talking to him, at all. If anything, I find it very unlikely that someone like Garry would have an intermediary to begin with.
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/108619/2c969be9-b2eb-47ff-a736-a22b7860f216/There is no help.png
Send help
no one's around to help
then you have zero excuses for why you couldn't even bother making a quick appereance to say "hey, my pc is busted and it's tough to get on, just so you know we're working on it!". Or having those new rules drafted ("this weekend" was like a month ago now), or continuously disappearing, making empty promises, and apologizing for the empty promise, and then making another one.
this but unironically
I dont think Hezzy admitting that he's paid for this went exactly the way he was hoping.
even if hezzy can't post on the forums from mobile (because iphone and shitty mobile site), the least that could be done is ask a message to be forwarded on his behalf via the other moderators
The links in emails sent when there's an alert paste "https://forum.facepunch.com" in front of the actual link, so it ends up being something like "https://forum.facepunch.comhttps://forum.facepunch.com/f/meta/btlgw/Forum-Discussion-V-Where-s-the-Forum-Discussion-thread/30/".
Also, it's really annoying how links get auto-formatted with no easy way to just plainly paste the text.
Why do we need a thread for discussions?
user protection denied
https://horobox.co.uk/u/ee8yaQ.png
It's literally the second reply in this thread, but thanks lol
Hezzy is only following the old last true golden rule of facepunch. "34. Blindly defend Facepunch, even when you know you're wrong."
Forum Discussion V. "Where's the Forum Discussion thread"
