I won't argue with you about semantics, if you think fundametalist is the better word, all right.
The point of the post is that they are using the same dumb no true scitsman bullshit that the extremists use to verify their hatred.
If following the holy document of your religion to the letter often leads you to murder anyone not believing in your religion, what does that say about your religion? My preference would not be that people read the entire bible and then become extremists for Christianity, it would be that people read the entire bible and realize that if they did everything the bible said, they HAVE to become extremists, and then realize the whole thing is a load of shit
this is litterally the same as saying you can't be a feminist if you are Christian because some Christian majority countries practice FGM and parts of the Bible can be interpreted as restricting women's rights
yeah that's what I'm saying, except for the GFM part
religious texts have constantly been changed over the years, just look at how many different versions of each religious text for whatever religion there are. people are still making interpretations on them now
You can interpret things however you want but parts of the bible pretty much explicitly says that women are men's property. It's not about interpretation it's about whether or not you want to follow the document or want to choose the parts that are convenient for you
This invalidates the religion itself, not the criticism of its teachings.
There's a lot of interpretation even in the bible. Remember it wasn't originally written in English and translated multiple times through different languages. So even today there are still arguments about how to interpret things.
How can you claim to be a follower of a religion if you admit you don't even have any idea what your religion says?
Because people are human and they're controlled by emotions. They're not completely reasonable machines, everyone does something self contradictory. Not to mention for the longest time, regular people couldn't read the bible. So due to being widespread in an age where people were much less critical, leading to it becoming tradition and people take it very personally, so people still associate with it today.
What kind of weird argument are you trying to make here?
No religion consists of "the letter" alone so the weird and simplistic train of thought you have here just illustrates even more how far from actual reality you and your weird fundamentalist opinion are.
I hate to break it to ya, but with or without religion some men would and will always try to oppress females. Some people are just hateful, both males and females.
Go ahead an keep misrepresenting me as a "fundamentalist", as if I'm not arguing the total opposite
I think muslims would be the same as christians now if you fast forward time, I think it just has a lot to do with these middle eastern countries not being as socially "advanced" and still hold older societal values and it scews the impression of muslims as a whole.
Whereas you have muslims who live in western society that have adapted their views or been brought up with "western" values. These values push more into feminism and equal rights and treatment towards everyone, and religious people tend to focus less on the direct preachings of their books and hold more modern values.
The bible says a lot of terrible shit but not every christian is a gay hating asshole. Same with muslims, and its just going to keep mellowing out when people integrate more and common values are shared.
How is
"If following the holy document of your religion to the letter often leads you to murder anyone not believing in your religion, what does that say about your religion? "
not being fundamentalistic?
Well from what Ive seen here in Australia is that a lot more muslims are strict about their faith and follow it more "to the letter" than christians do, and if you follow the quran to the letter quite literally, it would be considered fundamentalist in modern society.
I think this is more proboardslol's angle, I see a lot of moderate muslims here, but there is definitely a greater portion of hardline and literal interpretists than any other abrahamic religion here in Australia. But that being said, followers that live here are becoming a lot more moderate due to changes in society I think, which is great.
During the Islamic Golden age many Engineers and scholars doubted god and were agnostic and soon the state made everyone mandatorily agnostic because it was working so well for the first couple centuries until it didn't and if that kind of behavior can be tolerated by islam I don't see why feminism can't be as well.
How can you claim to be a follower of a certain nation that you live in - IF you don't believe in all of the laws and constitution? Why even live in a nation where you don't 100% agree with the law and the government's decisions? Why not just move to a nation where you 100% agree with its laws, customs and societal norms? There is no such country? Oh, well can't you just make one yourself then?
Those were rhetorical questions, by the way.
Because nobody, no prophet, no leader, no internet user or anybody else can tell You with absolute certainty as to how the society should be. One can merely give their own cute subjective opinion on how they think society should be like, where their view falls down to the same level in inherent value as everyone else's, even if they insist that their view of the world or society is somehow more valuable than someone else's, but it's really not.
There is no certainty as to how we should act in this Earthly existence at all, yet we find ourselves force to act. In fact, only faith can give you certainty, that your actions indeed have very much value in them like sharing these religious pamphlets downtown next Saturday thank you.
I'd say we are truly equal in our views, without certainty about the true value of our views&actions over someone else's, and in relation to the totality of existence, and the seemingly "meaningless" nature of the Universe where we 1) find ourselves existing and 2) find ourselves dying with no end in sight to this cycle of what we call life.
Which school of the Quran?
I can just direct you to this interesting article - Maybe you should read some of the statistics provided.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_in_Islam
do you still consider yourself an american despite our history of brutality and genocide and slavery? do you still consider yourself american despite our current government committing atrocities? how about despite that some of your fellow americans would literally kill you for your beliefs?
you are making identity black and white when it is literally the greyest area of all grey areas. contradictions within identity is 100% human nature. if some people want to believe in God and also think women are autonomous and equal then they will, and they do, no matter how much you want to argue they can't.
Being American is a legal thing, not an ideology. Being American isn't a choice, but being religious is.
It is absolutely a choice. I could move to England if I want, renounce my American citizenship and be English. It would be very painful and long, and it would throw away the social connections I've built up over decades, and I will never fully fit in because I'm just a different person with different views... or I could stay and try to fix one bad part of a system I already call home.
Religion, like nationality, is above all else a type of community and communities are not static, they change as the people in them change. That's why even though the Constitution says that certain people count for 3/5ths of a person, we collectively decided to tack on an edit that says "pay no attention to this part". The people who lived before that amendment were no less American for believing in the Constitution except for those bits they didn't like.
Now how would you make an edit to the Quran? Islam is not structured in a way that would allow the people to tack on extra pages to their book, and even if they could not everyone would agree. If you love your family and your friends, and you love your mosque, and you are connected to your faith, and they are all everyday parts of your life, but you disagree about a few of the specifics, do you abandon everything or make changes to an imperfect system?
This is not how religion works and I am starting to believe that you have very little contact the actual world outside.
People are brought up and raised in religions.
Throwing away concepts, believes, culture, rules and identities you have been raised in is not the easy yes/no choice that you would like to paint here for your own argumentative convenience.
I think it is not depends from religion. It is depends from persons opinion
Except that religions are based upon molding people and forming fundamental values for them to follow.
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