Renegade Cut makes a video on Gamergate (and Ready Player One) - General

how are you this dense. I was asking for an explanation of the other perspective about GG i know exists after having given my own perspective which i know isnt shared by many people. im not looking for a fucking history lesson

Well she's literally a con artist.

The people that should be pissed off about her failing to meet deadlines and her subpar work are the people who funded her kickstarters, and those by and large aren't the people she's receiving harassment from.

She's harassed plenty people herself, knowingly defended two pedophiles and their conduct because of their political affiliations and made a complete ass of herself in public on at least four occasions.

I don't think work being late or below your standards means she's a con artist. Sure, it's not professional, but that doesn't mean she was conning people. She said she'd make videos -> people paid her way more than she asked for -> she made videos with the same quality as if she had been paid what she asked for, and on a pretty slow schedule There's no real scam there. A con artist would be "buy my snake oil, it'll cure cancer!" And maybe there isn't even any snake oil. Anita's more "buy my snake oil, it makes a great sauce", then a mob of people obsess over snake oil sauce like they're Rick and Morty fans, and it takes her a month to ship it.

Except she was literally involved with a marketing scam. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaPbgNVuaEI

Let's list a few shall we? Ethan Ralph, The Internet Aristocrat/Mister Metokur, Lizzy Finnegan, Fred Brennan, Matt Rappard, and "Open Gaming Society" are all known and named gamergate figures who doxxed people, and this is before we get to the half dozen of anonymous members who did the same. Meanwhile on the anti-GG side there's Rebecca Watson who doxxed Eliza Sutton and that's it.

Not all marketing is a scam. I searched for that dude's name and as far as I can tell from a google search, he's not scamming people. and anyway, that looks like a good 10 years before Feminist Frequency even started.

I like how 2 of the people you mentioned as "gamergate doxxers," Lizzy Finnegan and Matt Rappard, didn't dox anyone and in fact were themselves doxxed by anti-GG

GG has no figurehead.

(Note from after writing this: Holy moly this got a whole lot longer it probably should have but it was absolutely necessary to shoot down any holes that leaving out information would cause. I am not writing to support harassment against Anita. I view it as a situation similar to Trump & his youngest son. Trump's a cockhead, but that doesn't mean his son deserves death threats. There's a tasteful way to expose and criticize someone for who they really are and I hope that I managed to stay as close to that line. Grab your favorite drink, snacks, and pack in cause it's a long one and I could probably keep going on. Lemme know if you wanna see a part two or a similar post debunking the moral credibility that other infamous Anti-ggs had) Forced Controversy She puts herself on a platform of being for social change so she can deflect any real criticism about her or any of her projects as "toxic masculinity". She beats the war-drum for video games to be more progressive and inclusive only to shit on them when they actually do that. Most of the things that anita has built her career on are so minuscule problems that even if the companies behind it actually made the solution she wants verbatim then she will still throw a fit about it because if she doesn't then she doesn't get any attention. *cough* Linkle *cough* https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/1303/6e422d6a-7a8e-4dd8-8c0f-3a040ee6f7cd/image.png Not completing the original roadmap for the Women vs Tropes in Video Gaming https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/1303/97643feb-60d9-4888-8573-ea1ec29676d5/image.png Twelve videos going into how some cliches in gaming can really hurt women? Sounds good right... Until you realize that they have only done 11 videos to be classified under the project. Even then episode one is broken up into 3 parts, episode five was broken up into two parts, and one of the videos is a one minute "concept video" so all in all the people who donated money to Anita Sarkeesian only received 5 promised videos out of 12. Note that she promised that they would be 20 minuteish episodes and from a momentary glance it appears as she didn't even touch or rewrote some of the episode ideas. Which is okay because reforming an idea to be more or less broad happens all the time in research. Anita is a Sockpuppet Anita is just a sockpuppet for Jonathon Mcintosh's rants and raves about how masculinity is the worst thing to happen to gaming. Sure some games can use so many stereotypes that it is physically painful. Does it mean that all gamers are sexist shitheads? No. It's important to note that one of the "defenses" that anti-gg people had during the whole debacle was that anyone who disagree with them was just a sockpuppet account that was signed up by a crusty 4channer staying in their parent's basement. Its sad that #NotYourShield didn't have as much staying power as it should have. Because it's crazy that anti-gg people who will one minute say that "We need more X group in Gaming! But the portrayal in Y game is absolutely disgusting!" will change their tone to "You aren't real or you are just looking for attention how dare you think that Y game wasn't that controversal as I want it to seem like." It's absolutely okay to have different opinions on anything and everything. It's just really fucking greasy when you demonize anyone who thinks differently as you as a second-rate human https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/1303/60337368-12a0-432f-b634-f25fcc8cbd39/image.png https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/1303/0ba778f1-d8b9-41cf-8f52-7b34d90ef399/image.png United Nations (of Fighting this week's sexism) It was an absolute shitshow that Zoe Quinn and Anita were invited to speak at the UN. Not to mention that the report that was released along the event was essentially on par with a sixth graders attempt at a research paper. https://www.thecut.com/2015/09/uns-cyberharassment-report-is-really-bad.html https://medium.com/@Doomskander/many-of-you-are-no-doubt-aware-that-recently-anita-sarkeesian-and-zoe-quinn-went-to-the-un-to-de74275535a9 Anita tries it: To Catch Harbor a Predator As mentioned earlier in the thread one of Anita's twitch moderators was found out to be on the sex offender list. Of course you could defend anita by just suggesting that most channels on twitch just throw mod at random people and that's that. Until you look into the fact some of the sourcing of gameplay footage used in the Tropes vs. Women series actually came from said sex offender. Why would a feminist organization that seeks to bring change to the gaming world work with a sex offender who actually oppresses women more than video games as a whole will? https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/1303/3adcfe1d-650d-4647-9045-57bce914af08/image.png https://youtu.be/0EMQqDXG218?list=PLqDk-2bKWQ3so90RxA35mnSkYw7i5t-i6

I do not believe that is true. Not only was there a study from tweets stating that threats were an extreme minority, but I would not consider calling out people on their bald-faced lies as threat making. When third-parties got wise of aGG whining, the term sea-lioning got popular. I did. I was on KiA, 4chan, and 8chan. At every moment possible everyone was reminded to not touch the shit, and everyone suggesting, or actually doing so was told to fuck off. Milo did have a big part after breaking GJP and doing his expose on Harper. However Baldwin's involvement is near nil besides naming the movement. After that he fizzled out. This thing went on for 3+ years. You're gonna have to put in some work before someone does a good job consolidating it She received the main amount of shit she always got, mainly just being called out for being a straight-up liar. You know I'm surprised you didn't try to pin /baph/ on GG too.

lmao Liz Finnegan what she got doxxed you stupid raisin balls jabroni

She was involved in doxxing the owner of the website magnotron, and then was herself doxxed by baphomet, 8chan's gamergate board. The majority of times gamergate figures were doxxed it was by other gamergate figures, in Finnegan, and many others' cases this prompted some to become disillusioned with the group.

And here it fucking is. Baphomet was a third-party board that went after anyone they seemed worthy, like kiwifarms. Also, googling liz finnegan magnotron dox (and the variation) yields no results. Mind posting a source?

I agree with what he says about Ready Player One's conclusion. They try to pass it off like the point is that we need to interact with other humans in the real world more but the only reason the protagonist won everything was because of his obsessive delving into the game and the trivia surrounding it's creator. Then when he has everything he could ask for he shuts down the game twice a week. The whole ending seemed disjointed to me. The action was cool though and I can appreciate the work that went into making some of the special effects.

I used to be very pro GG and annoyed by SJWs and the often boneheaded journalists that populated Gawker and Polygon et al., but the more I look back on it and the more I learn about the undeniable sociological influences at play (no matter why it started, it certainly evolved into a shitflinging culture war, and culture wars need to be viewed through a lense of cultural theory and sociology to really understand what motivates them) the less I sympathize with the movement and anyone who still thinks it was in good faith. It's really hard to take anyone who puts ironic quotation marks around phrases like "toxic masculinity" and "micro-aggressions" and sincerely believes there's a feminist agenda that's set out to ruin games, and that accounts for a lot of pro-GGers, even the ones who really do primarily care about the ethics-in-journalism part of GG. I want to talk about GG with people on both sides of the table but it's really tough when one side still rolls their eyes whenever they see a female main character or reads "inclusiveness" and "diversity" as dirty words. I'd love to be proven wrong, I'd love to meet someone who manages to be pro GG while also being a feminist. Surely that person must exist if GG's core really is about ethics.

Hello hi yes im all for helping women/people of color/LGBTQ. There is a ton of shit that society do to these groups. I don't see female main characters or any inclusive attempts as dirty things. I probably made it sound otherwise in my original post, but I do believe toxic masculinity is a real thing. It affects everyone. It's just weird seeing the same horse beat over and over again with no real tangible solution being brought to the table. It's like saying you'll have your report done by tommorrow and three years later you are still just saying "yeah sure thing tommorow for sure." Really the main issue I had with the anti side was painting a wide brush as even the bystanders of anything that happens in the gaming marketplace is our fault. Also never forget when Gawker kept up images of companies that were sponsering them but in reality the companies ended their contract with gawker years ago and gawker was doing a naughty. Anecdotal time: but yeah i'm bisexual and obviously it's tough that the representation in all forms of media is light. It's changing slowly. But ouch it doesn't help the cultural idea that bisexuals are just going through a phase or selfish.

read the threads.

The solution is offered nearly every time harassment, misogyny and gatekeeping are brought up, the solution is to stop doing it and stop enabling people who do. The only reason it seems like they're beating a dead horse is because people aren't listening. Cultural change takes a lot of time and effort and repetition and signal-boosting, simply bringing these issues to light and informing people on why they're issues is the solution being put into action. Really the main issue I had with the anti side was painting a wide brush as even the bystanders of anything that happens in the gaming marketplace is our fault. That's the really tricky thing here, is that GG is not a nation or a club or even a unified group, it's just a banner that you can choose to assign to yourself if you agree with the movement at large. When websites and journalists talk about those classic toxic misogynist gate-keepin' gamers, they are talking about just that, toxic misogynist gate-keepin' gamers. When they are talking about harassers, they are talking about harassers. If you as an individual are not a toxic misogynist gate-keeper then you have no reason to be afraid because they are simply not talking about you. You don't need to be a gamer or a gamergater or any kind of label, you can so easily just enjoy video games and be concerned for ethics and not have to call yourself anything; the label didn't choose you, you chose it. By assuming these labels and picking these teams you are then forced to associate with anyone and everyone who uses that label, and the connotations that the label carries with it are defined by its most vocal proponents. GG's most vocal proponents were unfortunately the swarm of anonymous fuckwads that used it as a free ticket to abuse women on the internet and spread misinformation, thus you can't call yourself a gamergater without assuming those connotations every time you wave the banner. It's the price of forming a completely anonymous group with no accountability, leader or public face (except Vivian James, which is its own can of worms), it can only be judged by its outward actions. There is no "true" gamergate or "purist" gamergaters who decide the actual ideals and guidelines, I've been in enough 4chan-8chan inter-arguments to know that firsthand. And thus everyone's idea of that central core truth of GG is completely subjective and different, all that is solid about GG is in the harassment, doxxed nudes and memes it left behind. If you didn't harass or doxx anyone or do anything misogynistic, why call yourself a GamerGater? Why lump yourself in with that group and feel personally attacked when journalists describe people who don't actually represent you?

Of course. I'm mostly speaking on what I took away from it four years ago. It was a different landscape back then. At the time I guess I was pro GG? but at the same time I probably was isolated enough that I didn't really get to experience the other sides arguments that much. At least not as much I do with similar situations now. Honestly yeah I agree with you totally. It's sorta like how some people from gamerghazi go off the deep end about random stuff that make any sense. But just the same I imagine GG or what remnants of those people are the same way. I feel the thing that hurt GG the most is that like you said it's leaderless so it really didn't have a motive. Like some people did do some ethical investigations into these journalists. Some did charity/nice things to try and put a positive light on the gamer name. and of course the people that got brushed under the rug when they did something that didn't fall into the first two. An movement idea that has had a better time imo is the stoner cleanup initiative which stoners are actively fighting back against the stereotype that they just are lazy and messy by going to their smoke spots and really anywhere and cleaning up the trash that was left there. Getting back to the original topic like other people have said it's just overall a weird situation. No one won from this. The people who were trying to be dicks basically let the internet know hey yeah im a dick and not trustworthy. The people who tried to steer it in positive light essentially just delayed the inveitable of it being taken over and destroying whatever the original motive was.

I feel like when some people read GamerGate, they grab a nailgun and punch a few nine inch long rods of tempered steel through their temples, because otherwise I really can't understand how they always seem to fuck up the part where GamerGate was about corruption in videogame journalism and had jack shit to do with women in gaming. Toxic masculinity and women in gaming is a different issue entirely and something journalists/SJWs used to deflect the attention away from the fact that journalists were literally collaborating and conspiring to push an agenda.

I said it once and I'll say it again: the rift over GamerGate will never heal. I don't know why people even continue to bring it up, because it's clear neither side is ever going to extinguish the other. Without that end goal ever being achievable, all this arguing is just wasted effort on both sides. Each will just dig their heels in further and further until the end of time. ... Then again, maybe that's for the best.

Not just that. A number of the more prominent profiles... The faces of anti-GG sort of behaved erratically, unhinged. If people remember Jessica Price recently flying off the handle over nothing, it was very much like that. Except they would respond to actual doxxing, often perpetrated by themselves on alt-accounts and the reaction would be to set up narratives about being in hiding and people throwing shit at their houses. Only to be busted in not only NOT leaving their house, but also on making said accounts and even one instance of self-harassment with their main account. That's the difference with GG and anti-GG. Anti-gg DOES have faces for its movement and nearly all of them are mentally disturbed. I don't mean being Trans. I mean Bipolar, Paranoia, Borderline, Anxiety... and obviously a bit of sociopathy here and there for extra manipulation. I'm not gonna write off that they definitely DID receive shit for their behavior and they shouldn't have been harassed. But these people faked enough of it for people to outright question it and if nothing else, it did as much for their credibility as Brett Kavanaugh's lies about drinking and his fit of rage. As if that wasn't enough, they started Doxxing people shamelessly and openly and when people weren't having any of it, they threw the whole fit over again from the top. The reality is that the average joe isn't anti-gg, he might not be taking sides. But anyone who values the integrity of the press and critical evaluation of facts is by nature Pro-GG. People think anti-GG is the majority, but they aren't. They still aren't. We can see it on the recent coverage of Jessica Price's firing. There WERE outlets trying to frame a narrative that she was in the right. even outlets who didn't participate in the anti-gamer narrative in 14. Eurogamer posted theirs and the comments just weren't having any of it. The article is essentially a disingenuous shitpost. Two days ago, they made that writer a permanent part of the team and listed their other work. It's good work. What makes otherwise good writers deliberately write a shit, unresearched article and omit facts? Why are this little club of gaming journalists writing articles again and again when they should realize by now that the demographic for said article is comprised of only their peers and tumblr feminists. I think the comment section speaks for itself. Complete with a bit of "progressive" sexism and racism at the bottom.

lol at this important point Pizzagate hashtag is created.

Dude... I'm probably the most anti-Gamergate person on this thread, but fuuuuck RationalWiki For every single thing they get right, they get 100 things wrong lol

I didn't like Ready Player One bu I think I wasn't at the right age to be within one of their two target audiences. The way I saw the film was banking hard on nostalgia (I'd seen a couple of the films referenced by the movie but not as a kid) or VR fans (which I honestly think I'm a little too old/too poor to get on board with). I didn't hate watching it but I would never go back and watch it again like I do with some movies. I will say that Steven Spielberg is quite possibly the only person that could have made this movie. He's the only person that these corporations would have trusted with their brand, much like Who Framed Roger Rabbit

All this hypocrisy. Whining for 5 years about diversity in games and out comes AC Odyssey with actual representation in the form of actual Greek actors playing the roles, Only for it to be dismissed as "lazy accents", "Russian NPC's" and "jarring portrayals". Same thing happened with Origins. These people can fuck right off. They can't even spot authentic representation when it's right in their faces. They just want their own clique to get all the jobs. Otherwise, it's not "real" diversity.

You know, when GG first started, I suspected it would end up just drawing a bunch of short-sighted idiots to the right, achieving little besides increasing the net total of scumbags. I was telling people not to trust scumbags like Milo before it was cool. But I read the GG thread every day for a reason even simpler than games journalism: awful people getting away with being awful people because they were on the right side and knew the right people. AGG claiming GG led to Trump is doubly ironic, not only because GG would have never happened if they weren't such myopic, self-serving, hypocrites, but because they gave everyone used to the idea of of truth being controlled by egocentric, id-fueled divas.

its that timeof the year already?