• Unpopular Opinions V5: "I still don't like Half Life 2."
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I think labels often look out of place on clothing. Most of the time it would look better without them.
[QUOTE=Alice3173;49711724]This doesn't really address what I said though. This would simply be a side effect of getting used to watching things subbed and is at best simply a neutral statement on the subject. It's definitely not an explanation of how watching things subbed is somehow better than watching things in a language you actually speak.[/QUOTE] Original artistic intent, most dubs are downright horrible in terms of quality.
[QUOTE=Alice3173;49711813]Edit: Also forgot a point about dubs not being great. I don't really follow on that to be honest. How can something you don't even understand be better than something you do? To me that would be a huge positive influence for dubs regardless of their quality.[/QUOTE] you don't need to understand the words to feel the emotions
[QUOTE=Alice3173;49711813] Edit: Also forgot a point about dubs not being great. I don't really follow on that to be honest. How can something you don't even understand be better than something you do? To me that would be a huge positive influence for dubs regardless of their quality.[/QUOTE] Well I mean, one of the worst things in regards to dubs that I saw was the American/English dub for Godzilla GMK. At one point these soldiers head out to fight the Big Man, and this guy says "You're all going to die!" in a hoakie, cartoony voice. Why is that an issue? Because in the original Japanese version, he says "Good luck" [I]in [B]Chinese[/B][/I] to Japanese soldiers. That's just spectacularly shitty to write that out.
[QUOTE=Novangel;49711935]Original artistic intent, most dubs are downright horrible in terms of quality.[/QUOTE] This really isn't a very good argument at all though. If that were valid there wouldn't ever be a dub of anything. [QUOTE=Hakita;49711950]you don't need to understand the words to feel the emotions[/QUOTE] Japanese isn't a very emotionally expressive language. Go watch the subbed version of Madoka Rebellion (specifically the last few scenes) then compare them to the English dub. The subbed version sounds almost identical to the rest of the movie while the changes are very obvious in the English version. [QUOTE=Zillamaster55;49712104]Well I mean, one of the worst things in regards to dubs that I saw was the American/English dub for Godzilla GMK. At one point these soldiers head out to fight the Big Man, and this guy says "You're all going to die!" in a hoakie, cartoony voice. Why is that an issue? Because in the original Japanese version, he says "Good luck" [I]in [B]Chinese[/B][/I] to Japanese soldiers. That's just spectacularly shitty to write that out.[/QUOTE] That one's just really dumb period. That'd be like taking X-Men: Days of Future Past (only movie that immediately came to mind that I know has non-English languages) and translating the Korean or French dialogue into the same language as the rest of the dub. Personally I'd still prefer that over a subbed version however since I'm going to actually understand the dialog. It's just background noise if you don't actually understand it. And for the record, if I haven't been clear, I'm not saying people should only watch dubs or anything like that. I just don't get why people insist they're better when only a minority of these people even speak the language and think it's really dumb of them to do so. If they prefer subs though then that's their thing and that's cool.
[QUOTE=Hakita;49711950]you don't need to understand the words to feel the emotions[/QUOTE] ... and you don't need to be able to see in order to enjoy a painting, I presume
[QUOTE=EliaMoroes;49712179]... and you don't need to be able to see in order to enjoy a painting, I presume[/QUOTE] I'd say subs are more akin to seeing a painting in black and white when it was originally in color.
[QUOTE=Novangel;49711935]Original artistic intent, most dubs are downright horrible in terms of quality.[/QUOTE] Tomo pointed out something kinda interesting with this argument. Judging by what I saw on MAL you read manga. As far as I know you don't speak Japanese so you're likely reading translated versions. (If you're not then that seems kinda counterproductive to be honest.) How does that respect original artistic intent any more than a dub does? How do subs accomplish the same?
You know it is impossible to cipher emotion from just words, the tone is what makes it remotely possible and as any animals body language and facial expressions play big part when it comes any form of communication. Of course you shits are talking about weeb shit so I dunno, it depends on how good it is drawn. [editline]10th February 2016[/editline] This is also why everything is always(or mostly at least) described in books with detail.
[QUOTE=Alice3173;49712206]Tomo pointed out something kinda interesting with this argument. Judging by what I saw on MAL you read manga. As far as I know you don't speak Japanese so you're likely reading translated versions. (If you're not then that seems kinda counterproductive to be honest.) How does that respect original artistic intent any more than a dub does? How do subs accomplish the same?[/QUOTE] It might not, I'd never know since I'm not fluent in Japanese to read original manga so I don't really have a choice.
Also let me add that a bad dub can kill the "emotion/feels" by having really horrible monotone voice acting.
[QUOTE=Alice3173;49712126]Japanese isn't a very emotionally expressive language. Go watch the subbed version of Madoka Rebellion (specifically the last few scenes) then compare them to the English dub. The subbed version sounds almost identical to the rest of the movie while the changes are very obvious in the English version.[/QUOTE] don't know what you're talking about, japanese is just as expressive as any other language in the world i haven't watched the movie but there are many reasons for why that can be but i assure you none of them are because japanese is "less expressive" [QUOTE=EliaMoroes;49712179]... and you don't need to be able to see in order to enjoy a painting, I presume[/QUOTE] the subtitles are there for understanding the words, the voice acting is there for feeling the emotions your zinger doesn't even make any sense
So undubbed is only better since you can't understand the language and therefore judge the quality of the voice acting.
[QUOTE=Hakita;49712321] the subtitles are there for understanding the words, the voice acting is there for feeling the emotions your zinger doesn't even make any sense[/QUOTE] Your previous post seemed to imply that one can watch something in a language he/she doesn't understand and get the intented emotions out of it, while I think that getting the meaning of what a character is saying is far more important for pathos than its delivery
[QUOTE=Sharker;49712524]So undubbed is only better since you can't understand the language and therefore judge the quality of the voice acting.[/QUOTE] you don't need to know japanese to be able to tell if someone is a bad voice actor, monotone and overacting are a universal language [QUOTE=EliaMoroes;49712542]Your previous post seemed to imply that one can watch something in a language he/she doesn't understand and get the intented emotions out of it, while I think that getting the meaning of what a character is saying is far more important for pathos than its delivery[/QUOTE] well that's not what i meant, of course i still watch foreign shows with subtitles to understand what the characters are saying
I can see how dubs can be atrocious, but there's one particular case that baffles me [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0ou96-hYKA[/media] People shit so much on this dub and I don't understand why, maybe I'm just dumb or deaf or both or something. It's extra bizarre in this case, the animation is about the best thing I have ever witnessed happen before me, even if they had Adam Sandler dubbing every single character I'd prefer it over moving my eyeballs from the action for even a single frame.
Aside from some rather unusual changes to minor areas of the script and Frisbee's voice (I can see what they were going for; it doesn't fit) the Redline dub is fairly faithful (I've watched it in both languages multiple times), so presumably the only reason someone can actually shit on it is sub elitism. Dub or sub, you're going to get deliberately over the top acting and delivery. It's not a deep film. It's a balls to the walls, pedal to the metal thrillride that manages to be both fresh and incredibly cheesy at the same time. If you're looking for emotional depth in a film where a man has a ducktail hairdo the size of a small dog and drives a muscle car from the bygone years against such other racing vehicles as a car [I]that is also a[/I] [I]mech[/I], a [I]jet powered hovercraft[/I], and [I]A LITERAL FUCKING TANK[/I] while pissing off a [I]cyborg nazi society who have no qualms with wiping the racers off the face of the planet[/I] perhaps you should consider not looking at Redline.
There's only two dubs that are equal or better than the sub that comes to mind, hellsing ultimate and black lagoon. Because the first one has a lovely insane irish person ranting about god, and the second one I don't think I could watch the parts where they "speak" english, worst fucking engrish I've ever heard, and I used to raid with a japanese guild. Also Balalaikas english VA is amazing.
[QUOTE=Taggart;49712619]Aside from some rather unusual changes to minor areas of the script and Frisbee's voice (I can see what they were going for; it doesn't fit) the Redline dub is fairly faithful (I've watched it in both languages multiple times), so presumably the only reason someone can actually shit on it is sub elitism. Dub or sub, you're going to get deliberately over the top acting and delivery. It's not a deep film. It's a balls to the walls, pedal to the metal thrillride that manages to be both fresh and incredibly cheesy at the same time. If you're looking for emotional depth in a film where a man has a ducktail hairdo the size of a small dog and drives a muscle car from the bygone years against such other racing vehicles as a car [I]that is also a[/I] [I]mech[/I], a [I]jet powered hovercraft[/I], and [I]A LITERAL FUCKING TANK[/I] while pissing off a [I]cyborg nazi society who have no qualms with wiping the racers off the face of the planet[/I] perhaps you should consider not looking at Redline.[/QUOTE] it's not just about emotional depth though. bad voice acting can turn a badass speech into an awkward mess, ruin a joke with cringey delivery, or yknow, just sound plain [I]awful[/I] because hammy and cheesy doesn't necessarily mean it needs bad acting plus the obvious problem with dubs is that you have very little allocated time and need to worry about lip syncing, if only a little, whereas subtitles let you take your time and get a more accurate translation
I think which language is spoken can affect the feel of a film, even if it's one you don't understand. For instance if the setting is grounded in reality, the original language can make it feel more authentic. Also when we're talking about live action I think you lose some of the performance by not having the actor's actual voice.
[QUOTE=Crimor;49712758]There's only two dubs that are equal or better than the sub that comes to mind, hellsing ultimate and black lagoon. Because the first one has a lovely insane irish person ranting about god, and the second one I don't think I could watch the parts where they "speak" english, worst fucking engrish I've ever heard, and I used to raid with a japanese guild. Also Balalaikas english VA is amazing.[/QUOTE] Space Dandy's dub was better than the sub imo
[QUOTE=Alice3173;49711724]This doesn't really address what I said though. This would simply be a side effect of getting used to watching things subbed and is at best simply a neutral statement on the subject. It's definitely not an explanation of how watching things subbed is somehow better than watching things in a language you actually speak.[/QUOTE] If they hire a good team for the dub sure, Baccano, for example has excellent english voice acting. However they usually don't hire a good team. Also, there's artistic integrity an the importance of having the people of that region of the world tell their own story. I've watched french films, Chinese films and even an Armenian film. English dubbings would have never worked in conveying any of the stories told.
[QUOTE=Svinnik;49713040]Space Dandy's dub was better than the sub imo[/QUOTE] space dandy's dub is fine, but that musical episode in season 2 was pretty terrible with the dub
Cowboy bebop dub is superior version.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49713108]If they hire a good team for the dub sure, Baccano, for example has excellent english voice acting. However they usually don't hire a good team. Also, there's artistic integrity an the importance of having the people of that region of the world tell their own story. I've watched french films, Chinese films and even an Armenian film. English dubbings would have never worked in conveying any of the stories told.[/QUOTE] I'd disagree with you on them being better that way but I can at least see where you're coming from.
We all know Cromartie is the only dub that matters [video=youtube;oWiL-DKmD7Q]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWiL-DKmD7Q[/video]
Ghost Stories best dub
Bob Dylan is okay. Hayao Miyazaki/Studio Ghibli is okay.
David Bowie's music is 2deep4me [editline]10th February 2016[/editline] always was, dead or no
[QUOTE=TheFilmSlacker;49713675]Maybe it's just for around here, but I fucking love Bob Dylan. The older I get, the better his music becomes and I legitimately like the sound of his voice. Whenever I bring him up around anyone, they almost always immediately mock his voice.[/QUOTE] Dylan Bob (as one of my counter-culture teachers would say as a joke) is great. One of the defining voices of that generation. Sucks to hear that not a lot of people around you appreciate him :c [editline]10th February 2016[/editline] It's weird seeing all these figures we talked about in that class pass away though. Like we talked about Lou Reed/Velvet Underground, and a few months later Lou Reed passed away, and now Bowie died too. it's kinda surreal I guess
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