Unpopular Opinions V6 You know maybe fascism wasn't all that it was cracked up to be
5,009 replies, posted
[QUOTE=RichyZ;50997379]New zelda doesnt look good, its looking like every other open world game now[/QUOTE]
I feel it's going to go the way of games such as Skyrim. A big open, empty world with not a whole lot to do in it to make it last.
[QUOTE=Sector 7;50997421]are we still talking about death row prisoners? because nobody who rapes and then tortures families to death deserves to be alive. If anything, the society that produces such people has a responsibility to end them.[/QUOTE]
Yeah but why decide the fate of people based on what people think they deserve, that's what we're doing now and it hasn't been working out so great.
I believe that flat earthers will end up having enough political power to ban competing points of view. They will get legislation in their favor. It will happen.
[QUOTE=MaximLaHaxim;50997514]Fueling this was another fact:
I'm mentally ill, and at some points of my life I've been extremely worried that I may commit rape as an adult due to inability to control my actions. Would I want to be executed? Would my family want me to be executed? Hell, my brother (who has a history of mental problems) might even [i]kill himself[/i]/have his depression return if I was executed. I've promised myself to commit suicide if I'm ever imprisoned/convicted of a crime due to how unforgiving society would be to me, and until people begin feeling sympathy and understanding these poor people I'm going to retain that promise.[/QUOTE]
Are the victims not poor people? Are the criminals ever as poor as the victims? There's often nothing poor about them, they choose to do what they did. The victims did not. Stop worrying about yourself doing bad stuff, just don't become a person who would do such things. If you know it's wrong and you control what you do, you will never do them.
[QUOTE=Sector 7;50997085]the presence of "quests" makes every video game worse[/QUOTE]
Runescape exists
[QUOTE=RB33;50999392]Are the victims not poor people? Are the criminals ever as poor as the victims? There's often nothing poor about them, they choose to do what they did. The victims did not. Stop worrying about yourself doing bad stuff, just don't become a person who would do such things. If you know it's wrong and you control what you do, you will never do them.[/QUOTE]
This sense of morals that keeps you guys saying basically "just don't be a bad person" isn't inborn, it's taught and trained. Add will add the fact that this 'us vs them' ideology which so many people in this thread have combined with a similar 'X people are sub human' (just like a lot of people in this thread) is what can create people like this and events like this. Not to mention other psychological and medical traumas and conditions.
Nah, they're just bad guys :goodjob:
On the topic of Zelda, I'm glad it's changing dramatically. The fact that the series clings to it's revolutionary [I]1998 formula[/I] is one of the reasons the series has been going downhill to the point of the gutter. (see Skyward Sword)
[QUOTE=Linkuya;50999484]On the topic of Zelda, I'm glad it's changing dramatically. The fact that the series clings to it's revolutionary [I]1998 formula[/I] is one of the reasons the series has been going downhill to the point of the gutter. (see Skyward Sword)[/QUOTE]
Tbh i agree, using the same formula over and over and still expecting it to be revolutionary is pretty retarded
[QUOTE=SIRIUS;50999457]This sense of morals that keeps you guys saying basically "just don't be a bad person" isn't inborn, it's taught and trained. Add will add the fact that this 'us vs them' ideology which so many people in this thread have combined with a similar 'X people are sub human' (just like a lot of people in this thread) is what can create people like this and events like this. Not to mention other psychological and medical traumas and conditions.
Nah, they're just bad guys :goodjob:[/QUOTE]
People go do deranged crimes because they weren't taught morals? No, even people without being taught morals don't go do this stuff without a cause. They have mental problems that have gone untreated.
[QUOTE]Pacifism is all very well and good, laudable even as an ideal, but reality being what it is, sometimes violence is the only option for people who only understand violence as a means of responding. [/QUOTE]
I once knew a blind girl in high school. As in it was very obvious. The other kids began making up lies that she was faking it. Once they bought into their lies, they began to torment her.
Take a look at the worlds popular ideas and religions. They give excuses to forgive or justification for this innate cruelty. This is why they became popular in the first place.
[QUOTE=SIRIUS;50999488]Tbh i agree, using the same formula over and over and still expecting it to be revolutionary is pretty retarded[/QUOTE]
It's just that times change. That old formula just isn't really impressive in a world with games like the Elder Scrolls and the Witcher - games that carry the torch that Zelda had in those late nineties when games like Ocarina of Time really pushed boundaries.
Skyward Sword was just unimpressive and way too formulaic for it's own good. I commend Nintendo for taking the franchise in a new direction.
[QUOTE=Guriosity;50999162]I believe that flat earthers will end up having enough political power to ban competing points of view. They will get legislation in their favor. It will happen.[/QUOTE]
Why do you think that? I don't think there are many flat earthers with that kind of power
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[QUOTE=RB33;50999491]People go do deranged crimes because they weren't taught morals? No, even people without being taught morals don't go do this stuff without a cause. They have mental problems that have gone untreated.[/QUOTE]
Point is that there are no "good" or "bad" people, or atleast if there are it's not as simple as some people seem to think
[QUOTE=MrJazzy;50999827]Point is that there are no "good" or "bad" people, or atleast if there are it's not as simple as some people seem to think[/QUOTE]
Well, I haven't claimed there was either, so I don't disagree.
[QUOTE=RB33;50999491]People go do deranged crimes because they weren't taught morals? No, even people without being taught morals don't go do this stuff without a cause. They have mental problems that have gone untreated.[/QUOTE]
That's exactly my point actually, there's always a cause. What I'm also saying is that the ideas that we base or decisions on are taught through experiences, and some people depending on the situation are taught ideas and morals that can contribute to things like murder etc
[QUOTE=MaximLaHaxim;50997514]
Fueling this was another fact:
I'm mentally ill, and at some points of my life I've been extremely worried that I may commit rape as an adult due to inability to control my actions. Would I want to be executed? Would my family want me to be executed? Hell, my brother (who has a history of mental problems) might even [i]kill himself[/i]/have his depression return if I was executed. I've promised myself to commit suicide if I'm ever imprisoned/convicted of a crime due to how unforgiving society would be to me, and until people begin feeling sympathy and understanding these poor people I'm going to retain that promise.[/QUOTE]
Whoa I didn't notice this before. You need to chill, you're not going to go and rape someone on accident nor is a foreign power going to assume control of your body and make you do shit. With professional help you can function like anyone else. Also no one in the western world to my knowledge is executed for rape. That's a penalty reserved for particularly heinous examples of first-degree murder.
[QUOTE=Zephyrs;50998801]I legitimately believe that the failure to understand the tradeoff costs between personal freedom and safety (or tradeoffs between regulation in one area vs another) is a real burden upon society.[B] People focus on one or two facets of a problem, stop listening, and then don't understand the root causes, which in turn leads to many of their attempts to fix things merely superficially treating the symptoms instead of the underlying issues.[/B] There is a staggering level of interconnectedness between so many diverse topics, and society as a whole seems content to ignore this. Alternatively, they are incapable of understanding it. I don't know which idea I find more depressing.
In either case, this hole in reasoning can be linked to extremism on all sides of the political spectrum. It's not happenstance that the turbo SJW crazies are mirror images of the authoritarian right. Neither one steps back to analyze the big picture. The truly extreme ones are sincerely terrified of even the [I]idea[/I] that someone could think differently, let alone actually does, and are absolutely determined to reject anything that doesn't fit their particular doctrine at all costs. To that end, they resort to abhorrent tactics to ridicule, dehumanize, and ostracize anything that doesn't align.[/QUOTE]
A lot of people are actually anti-intellectual. It's why you get people like those ones who popped up during the Brexit crap who were "tired of experts". It's also why I grew up surrounded by a completely ridiculous amount of people who were inexplicably [I]proud[/I] of the fact they were stupid. Far too many people (even a lot of my friends) seem to think that putting thought into anything is just too much effort. I'm pretty sure it's why we've got this idiotic view that's becoming retardedly common where people should be praised for being mediocre. Where you get participation prizes and other such bullshit.
[QUOTE=Alice3173;51000832]A lot of people are actually anti-intellectual. It's why you get people like those ones who popped up during the Brexit crap who were "tired of experts". It's also why I grew up surrounded by a completely ridiculous amount of people who were inexplicably [I]proud[/I] of the fact they were stupid. Far too many people (even a lot of my friends) seem to think that putting thought into anything is just too much effort. I'm pretty sure it's why we've got this idiotic view that's becoming retardedly common where people should be praised for being mediocre. Where you get participation prizes and other such bullshit.[/QUOTE]
If only we could accomodate both people it'd be fine, but we now are faced with anti-intellectuals saying their way is the way and we've had intellectuals going on and on about how only they are correct, it's become a pain
[QUOTE=Blazedol;50999547]Why do you think that? I don't think there are many flat earthers with that kind of power[/QUOTE]
Lets take your argument. Not alot eh? The anti vaxxers began that way. Now their views are gaining clout to the point some politicians to gain favor with the public have to say they are skeptics of vaccines to ensure public appeal.
Human history was never in the favor wise, smart, honest, grounded or caring. Such people were always in the minority and humanity has had the habit of killing those people off.
I call it the Hemlock Theory. In honor of Socrates. You know the guy who kept asking people if their positions were good ideas and valid and was declared the wisest man of his time? Yeah they put him on trial because of it and it led him to suicide.
TL DR
In short, never bet against stupid. Stupid always wins.
But anti-vaxxers are losing power and becoming increasingly irrelevant, with vaccines becoming more and more mandatory. They may have a voice, but it's dying, and honestly barely effected anything at all. Maybe it delayed the inevitable by a bit, but not much, not in the long run at least.
[QUOTE=Blazedol;51002509]But anti-vaxxers are losing power and becoming increasingly irrelevant, with vaccines becoming more and more mandatory. They may have a voice, but it's dying, and honestly barely effected anything at all. Maybe it delayed the inevitable by a bit, but not much, not in the long run at least.[/QUOTE]
Like I said, my view can be summed up in the phrase don't bet against stupid. If its stupid, dishonest, delusional, illogical, crazy (or makes people crazy) and invalid, it will become a permanent feature in the human psyche. Any other ideas that don't adhere to this rule end up getting weeded out.
Also you are pointing out another aspect of Hemlock Theory. The only way to keep idiots from being idiots is create a government. Before the anti vax movement, there was no or barely any government interference concerning the matter.
Now there is.
Conclusion? Idiots are the reason the state exists.
I'm just gunna jump in here with a new opinion if that's okay...
I don't like New York
It gets this rep as the greatest city in the world buts it's overcrowded, loud, dirty, grey and rammed with shit people. The class divide is disgustingly apparent, the streets are filled with people trying to find a way into your pockets (literally and metaphorically) the tourists are rampant and the views are okay at best. Drivers are a whole other ball game, roads are shit and the tourist attractions are moderately okay. The 9/11 memorial and the occasional independent restaurant in Spanish Harlem are the only things I can say I genuinely enjoyed, everything else was an "okay" experience. Maybe I'm spoiled from travelling, maybe I just don't like large cities or maybe I'm just tired but New York was an overpriced boring grey shithole I don't ever want the experience of revisiting any time soon unless you buy me Hamilton tickets.
I no doubt believe there are some absolutely lovely people in New York and I commend them for managing to do it in a city which feeds into volatile self-centered attitudes and the need to climb above, rather than climb together, in order to succeed.
[QUOTE=Blazedol;51002509]But anti-vaxxers are losing power and becoming increasingly irrelevant, with vaccines becoming more and more mandatory. They may have a voice, but it's dying, and honestly barely effected anything at all. Maybe it delayed the inevitable by a bit, but not much, not in the long run at least.[/QUOTE]
It's the death throws of a movement. Saner minds are prevailing, but crazy has a real tendency to lash out viciously before the end.
[QUOTE=ZombieDawgs;51002563]I'm just gunna jump in here with a new opinion if that's okay...
I don't like New York
It gets this rep as the greatest city in the world buts it's overcrowded, loud, dirty, grey and rammed with shit people. The class divide is disgustingly apparent, the streets are filled with people trying to find a way into your pockets (literally and metaphorically) the tourists are rampant and the views are okay at best. Drivers are a whole other ball game, roads are shit and the tourist attractions are moderately okay. The 9/11 memorial and the occasional independent restaurant in Spanish Harlem are the only things I can say I genuinely enjoyed, everything else was an "okay" experience. Maybe I'm spoiled from travelling, maybe I just don't like large cities or maybe I'm just tired but New York was an overpriced boring grey shithole I don't ever want the experience of revisiting any time soon unless you buy me Hamilton tickets.
I no doubt believe there are some absolutely lovely people in New York and I commend them for managing to do it in a city which feeds into volatile self-centered attitudes and the need to climb above, rather than climb together, in order to succeed.[/QUOTE]
New York is a beautiful example of what an overabundance of regulation does to a city. I'm not saying it wouldn't still be a shithole, but it's not a coincidence that the areas with the worst rent control are slums.
[QUOTE]It's the death throws of a movement. Saner minds are prevailing, but crazy has a real tendency to lash out viciously before the end.
[/QUOTE]
Not really. Im using them as an example of a historic pattern. I am not trolling. Right now I am trying to come up with an idea to counter all the stupidity that happening in society right before it comes to a head. So im just posting what comes to mind and bounce it off others. Im trying to shit post for the greater good.
In short according to hemlock theory, every sane, decent, intelligent and wise person gets killed off and weeded out of the gene pool by the mob. The only people left are intelligent predators and crazy, deluded, stupid people who obey said predators.
The predators create ideas that make the stupid, insane and deluded people more insane, deluded and stupid in order to gain more control over said mob. Which intensifies inequality, destroys liberty, increase intolerance, state power and creates an oppressive society. This intensifies the cycle. Which weeds out more people who are sane intelligent and decent people. Which makes more intelligent predators and stupid crazy deluded people who follow them, So on and so on.
Which then creates a false conscious of the memebers of that society unable to realize they are being harmed and exploited at their expense and more prone to kill off any person or ideas which run counter to the ideas they hold true.
Societies which this pattern is prevalent or have been are Saudi Arabia, ISIS, North Korea, Venezuelan, Nazi Germany.
So in short every idea you know of or hold dear, is a result of this process. Thus it is false. Which is why you disagree with me.
[QUOTE=Guriosity;51002764]So in short every idea you know of or hold dear, is a result of this process. Thus it is false. Which is why you disagree with me.[/QUOTE]
The fact that you think a tautology like this is valid explains a lot about the rest of your paranoid ramblings.
Some of the things you are saying are true, or at least closely related to the truth. Keenly intelligent sociopathic individuals do rise to positions of power, especially in the corporate world, but society can only tolerate their negative influence for so long before imploding because they very frequently cause widespread destruction. Many companies have gone bankrupt because sociopaths pushed things too far, and did not properly anticipate the backlash from their actions. The same is true of countries that have totalitarian regimes. They either modernize and westernize, or eventually collapse under their own stagnation. Venezuela is doing exactly that right now.
Kind of curious who's alt you are. There are several phrasing similarities to other people who have spouted related rhetoric in the past, complete with self created "theories" that have no substance behind them. Maybe coincidence, but considering the behavioral profiles of said people, it really wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
[QUOTE]paranoid ramblings.[/QUOTE]
If it seems paranoid, its designed that way on purpose so to appeal to a certain type of people.
[QUOTE]Keenly intelligent sociopathic individuals do rise to positions of power, especially in the corporate world, but society can only tolerate their negative influence for so long before imploding because they very frequently cause widespread destruction.[/QUOTE]
Doesnt mean the ideas they make to influence populations do not leave their mark. How socipaths gain control is create ideas designed to mess up their marks. Ever heard of the cosmopolitan effect?
Comos a woman's mag often glorifies unobtainable standards of beauty. This makes the reader insecure. They then try to achieve that standard (which they can't.) So they feel bad. Which sets them up to try even harder to achieve it. What happens is they end up starving themselves and causing themselves eating disorders. The sicker they make themselves trying to achieve this impossible standard, the more the person intensifies their efforts to adhere to set goal.
The Christians accomplish this by saying sex is sinful. So what happens is the adherent tries to suppress every part of their sexuality. Which is impossible. This makes them sick and imbalanced. Which makes them intensify their efforts to adhere to the ideal even more. Which opens them up even more to the influences and willing to submit to the authority of a sociopathic leader and more likely to be aggressive to outsiders of the groups and those who dare criticize their beliefs.
With leftist thought, this is done by instilling warped logic into the believer. Ever read 1984? Yeah the newspeak Orwell mentioned is real. I spoke online to some Marxists online They literally do have the contradiction in their speech. It been a few years so I cannot point out any examples.
It has been mentioned in this post by Trilby Harlow
[url]https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1532098&p=50956339&viewfull=1#post50956339[/url]
How their logic is. The whole system is designed to make you think up is down, left is right and vice versa by giving a good line of logical bull to make that non sense, sensible. The thing is, the contradictions are designed to make a person who buys into it unable to function. The more warped the thinking becomes, the more dysfunctional they become, the more willing they are to submit to the will of a toxic leader. Also makes them more aggressive to anyone who points out how messed up their veiws are making them
In islam, same thing happens. Give a bunch of rules they cannot follow, to go against their human nature which generates illness. They also tell the followers to believe in stuff that flies in the fae of good sense. There is a jinn in every corner and every door knob. There is a big sky daddy who will burn you if you dont obey these rules. If you question these rules, the doctrine subscribes extreme force to ensure the person doesnt crime think. So they are ensured keep holding dear to the ideas which are making them sick and more open to the influence of socio paths.
Who as you mentioned end up creating great destruction.
The goal to make things better is figure out which ideas are designed to be toxic on purpose and eliminate them.
As for substance? Does it really matter? As mentioned in this post by JoeSkylynx [url]https://facepunch.com/member.php?u=179892[/url]
[QUOTE]
JoeSkylynx's Avatar
October 2008
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I have been watching political movements around the world, and it seems that everyday, atleast in the Western world, groups are becoming far more radicalized, whether or not they are left or right. It worries me to think that it may only be a matter of time before we see more Greensboros across my own country. People are just getting way to violent with politics.
[/QUOTE]
I have to agree. I feel the world is heading for dark times. I am not a powerful politician. I am not a rich businessman. I am not someone high in the food chain. The most I can do is try to change the discussion and maybe try to generate a new view on current problems. Maybe once we begin to see the problems in a new light, we can find solutions we have not thought of before and thus maybe, maybe end up preventing things from turning to complete shit.
I see nothing wrong in this. I see as a good thing. You are free to disagree.
[QUOTE=Guriosity;51003030]If it seems paranoid, its designed that way on purpose so to appeal to a certain type of people.[/QUOTE]
If by that you mean it's illogical and delusional, OK. Suit yourself.
Your premises rely on your conclusions, instead of standing on their own. It's pseudo intellectualism that boils down to "because I say so." There is no fundamental difference in the abstract logical structure between what you are preaching and other self referential nonsense like creationism. You are literally doing the exact same thing you accuse some of these other groups of doing, and you cannot see it. Yes, some of them are guilty of what you are accusing them of, but that doesn't validate your reasoning.
You can use circular logic to "prove" anything, even things that directly contradict each other. That invalidates it. It's fundamentally flawed at the most basic level, and the fact that you are just handwaving that critical error away and persisting with this delusional garbage means you are entrenched in the idea. Thus there is nothing to be gained in further discussion with you. Until you can grasp that concept, this will remain the case.
I don't know whether to feel sorry for you, or annoyed. I would like to ask why you are using an alt instead of having the balls to post on your main, but I don't expect you to have a good answer for that.
[QUOTE=Sector 7;50997492]I don't crush women's skulls and then rape them, and I'm assuming you don't either. That makes us different from him. Being a biological human is not a meaningful qualifier, because the real measure of humanity has nothing to do with birth. You pull up weeds when you're trying to nurture a garden, and you pull up psychopathic murderers when you're trying to nurture a society.[/QUOTE]
He's banned for this, but I do want to add my two cents since I seem to be in between both of your standpoints:
I [I]do[/I] feel bad for people like Jeffery Dahmer and others. I totally feel bad when people become deranged whether it's something that is in their control or isn't. The catch is that "feeling bad" is not a good enough reason to detract from other people's lives by allowing them to roam free, nor do I really feel bad if they lose their lives. Regardless of what one has to say about the ethics of taking another life, what I think most people would agree on is that they're not really going to be able to survive in our society both mentally and very potentially physically. (Vigilante justice can be crazy.)
Sometimes the only merciful decision is to take someone who is a danger to themselves and others is killing them. That's a depressing thought, but we're not advanced enough to really "fix" people, and furthermore ensure that they won't revert to killing and raping. And this goes without saying that there's definitely killers out there that legitimately do not care and are sociopathic - some have no remorse and have no interest in developing a remorseful attitude. How do you fix someone who doesn't want to be fixed? You can't want people to change more than they want to. It's sad that they are who they are, but feeling sad doesn't do anyone any better. Feeling sad won't change them.
I've said it before, but the best way to ensure serial killers and rapists don't commit their heinous crimes is prevention. In the United States, mental healthcare is really bad, and mental illness is seen as a personal failure. If someone collapses because of bone cancer, people are quick to help them and feel sorry. However, a person who doesn't realize they're talking to themselves or are hearing voices is seen as "crazy" in a super negative light. It's still sickness. I have friends that deal with it. [I]I[/I] have personally dealt with a disassociative mental breakdown. It's hard to overcome the societal stigmas to get help and not a lot of people could get help even if they wanted to, what with insurance and the cost of medications or therapy. And what happens as a result is many people live life without treatment, struggling to survive because it hinders their ability to stay employed and often puts them in a desperate position to commit crimes. They might be pushed away from society towards the darkness where no one wants to look save for the occasional dirty glance, which I would personally think could push a person to snapping in a couple directions: hating themselves and becoming suicidal, or hating society and wanting revenge.
This isn't the only pathway a person can lead (other paths include becoming crazy cult leaders like Charles Manson), but it's an example of how trying to take care of a person after they've snapped is far too late in the process. Our energy should be focused on taking care of ourselves and better understanding mental illnesses so we aren't so cruel to people who have those issues and they're more comfortable asking for help. I still feel bad for the people who become monsters, but I personally feel more motivated to focus on prevention and not trying to preserve those monsters in any way. They can't be helped, but we can help each other in society.
And furthermore, I agree with Sector 7 in that life should be evaluated from a qualitative standpoint, not quantitative. Trying to preserve all of human life no matter what devalues life, because we are not the same. Your mother is not equal to Adolf Hitler, and Adolf Hitler isn't equal to Martin Luther King, Jr. We're all different. We're all worth different amounts in different circumstances. I don't think people who don't contribute to society are considered "bad" or "worthless", but I do think murderers are legitimately detracting from society - they're the ones with negative value. They are taking away from others. That's what draws the line in terms of quality - whether or not you're wrongly killing others.
With that said, I generally fear believe in the death penalty just because I think it could be abused by corrupt powers.
[QUOTE=wauterboi;51003246]How do you fix someone who doesn't want to be fixed? You can't want people to change more than they want to. It's sad that they are who they are, but feeling sad doesn't do anyone any better. Feeling sad won't change them.[/QUOTE]
This is one of those really interesting moral questions that will become something that society needs to find an answer to eventually. The technology is coming, whether you want it to or not, that will allow you to directly alter the psyche. It's not here yet. It probably won't be here soon. But it [i]is[/i] going to happen. Changing someone who wants to change is pretty straight forward. Particularly if it can be tweaked/reversed at a later date. Changing someone who doesn't want to be changed is the problem. Many mentally ill people don't want to change. Can we as a society justify forcing them to change something so fundamental as their sense of self?
The ramifications for doing so are far reaching, and that's before you factor in abusive overreaching indoctrination policies. What qualifies as mentally ill? What qualifies as undesirable? Some of the greatest artistic works have come from some of the most deranged and unhinged minds in the history of mankind. The prospect of 'curing' these people out of some misguided sense of helping them, and losing the two faced coin of madness and creativity is not a pleasant one.
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