Liberal or Conservative? Why? - General

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43064345]the funnier thing is that behind all this rhetoric and idealism, the american liberal is actually a moderate conservative and an american conservative is a borderline nationalist. no, conservatism in america is not about limited government. republicans are just fine spending money on bullets, bombs, and tanks. they are fine spending money enacting moral laws and hiring the police, judges, and lawyers necessary to enforce those laws. they are not for individual freedom when they actively campaign against gay marriage or try to close borders. they are fine giving out huge subsidies to oil companies. and the democrats don't endorse government control of everything. the aca was gutted of any provision that gave it a resemblance to a single-payer system. democrats are mostly against gun regulations. they aren't a party of anti-war except when it is politically convenient. as an actual leftist, looking at american politics is both funny and depressing. neither party really serves the interests of the people who vote them in. they are superficial parties that hide behind fancy rhetoric.[/QUOTE] Conservatives are different than Republicans and Liberals are different than Democrats. Anyone who has power on the hill is automatically worse than their ideological comrades, if that makes sense.

[QUOTE=Secrios;43064945]I'm libertarian. Freedom for everyone! But seriously, freedom doesn't mean free stuff.[/QUOTE] freedom does mean the freedom to take others' freedoms if you don't keep the rich in check.

The use of the term "liberal" to describe progressives in the U.S. is confusing and misleading. Anyone with a historical understanding would place that title on the Republicans, who are mostly conservative.

[QUOTE=Kartoffel;43066127]Conservatives are different than Republicans and Liberals are different than Democrats. Anyone who has power on the hill is automatically worse than their ideological comrades, if that makes sense.[/QUOTE] the republican party is considered the "conservative" party, and the democrats are considered the "liberal" party. if you consider yourself a conservative you will probably vote republican and if you vote democrat you probably consider yourself liberal. but you're right.

Libertarian Socialist. Try to figure that one out.

[QUOTE=Swilly;43069637]Libertarian Socialist. Try to figure that one out.[/QUOTE] anarchist or minarchist?

Socially, I lean to the left. I feel everyone should get married, etc. But when it comes to government, I'm very conservative. I lost the best job I've ever had because it was taxed to death.

I am a conservative. I grew up in a liberal household and was strongly liberal up until a few years ago. I don't agree with everything conservatives say or do, but that's okay. Most people don't completely agree with everything that the party does. For example, I don't consider myself a republican. I feel as if both conservatives and liberals are very misunderstood, and both sides try to paint eachother by their stereotypes. For example, I'd like to help clear some things up about conservatives. While the following might be true for some conservatives, it isn't for most (in my experience): -Conservatives aren't anti-gay, just anti-gay marriage. (Not something I agree with, I'm pro gay-marriage) -Conservatives aren't anti-minority. The reason people believe this is because most minorities are left leaning. Hell, Herman Cain (who is black) would have made a good president, and is a solid conservative. -Conservatives aren't anti-women. No one wants to take away abortion or birth control. The supreme court has ruled many times over the last 50 years that it would be unconstitutional to do so. -Conservatives aren't anti-government. We're anti [I]big and bloated[/I] government. -Most conservatives aren't climate change deniers. Most conservatives simply believe that greenhouse gasses aren't the cause of global warming. Water vapor isn't a "greenhouse gas" and to suggest that clouds contribute to global warming is stupid. -The tea party didn't exist in the 1990s, 1980s, or any time before that. It was created at the end of the Bush era to be a voice to speak out against Bush's tyrannical and stupid policies. All of that having been said, that's what I've found with my experience in conservatism. Obviously there are going to be conservatives that go against what I've just said. It is important to know that people like Mitch McConnell, Karl Rove, the Bush family, and people of similar mind set are republicans and not conservatives, even though they claim to be. They call themselves conservatives, but most of what they spew is spin and horse shit. Karl Rove has won like 1% of the races he supported since the 1980s. All of that having been said, I wish conservatives and liberals could set their differences aside and work together to vote these old school, pro-establishment, GOP bums out of office. These are the same guys who, under Bush 43, helped run the country into the ground. Now they're trying to play the good guy? Come on guys, let's kick their asses.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43061273]also it seems like everybody these days is "socially liberal, fiscally conservative". is this a fad or has it always been like this?[/QUOTE] libertarians I don't know why everyone sees it as the answer, unregulated corporations are already a problem with government holding back the chains made of paper.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43061273]also it seems like everybody these days is "socially liberal, fiscally conservative". is this a fad or has it always been like this?[/QUOTE] It isn't a fad, because there was a point Facepunch was slightly more conservative. Honestly for me, I developed my views because of school. Colleges and some schools tend to be liberal.

Libertarian/Conservative mix mostly: I support strongly socially libertarian polices: complete drug legalization, gay marriage, pretty much anything else. I agree with libertarians on economic and fiscal issues pretty much completely. When it comes to nations defense I have more conservative. Strong security, strong army, "carry a big stick" kinda policy.

[QUOTE=UziXxX;43084113]I am a conservative. I grew up in a liberal household and was strongly liberal up until a few years ago. I don't agree with everything conservatives say or do, but that's okay. Most people don't completely agree with everything that the party does. For example, I don't consider myself a republican. I feel as if both conservatives and liberals are very misunderstood, and both sides try to paint eachother by their stereotypes. For example, I'd like to help clear some things up about conservatives. While the following might be true for some conservatives, it isn't for most (in my experience): -Conservatives aren't really anti-gay, but more anti-gay marriage. (Not something I agree with, I'm pro gay-marriage) -Conservatives aren't anti-minority. The reason people believe this is because most minorities are left leaning. Hell, Herman Cain (who is black) would have made a good president, and is a solid conservative. -Conservatives aren't anti-women. No one wants to take away abortion or birth control. The supreme court has ruled many times over the last 50 years that it would be unconstitutional to do so. -Conservatives aren't anti-government. We're anti [I]big and bloated[/I] government. -Most conservatives don't think global warming is a hoax. Most conservatives simply believe that greenhouse gasses aren't the cause of global warming. Water vapor isn't a "greenhouse gas" and to suggest that clouds contribute to global warming is stupid. -The tea party didn't exist in the 1980s, 1990s, or any time before that. It was created at the end of the Bush era to be a voice to rise up against Bush's tyrannical and stupid policies. All of that having been said, that's what I've found with my experience in conservatism. Obviously there are going to be conservatives that go against what I've just said. It is important to know that people like Mitch McConnell, Karl Rove, the Bush family, and people of similar mind set are republicans and not conservatives, even though they claim to be. They call themselves conservatives, but most of what they spew is spin and horse shit. Karl Rove has won like 1% of the races he supported since the 1980s. All of that having been said, I wish conservatives and liberals could set their differences aside and work together to vote these old school, pro-establishment, GOP bums out of office. These are the same guys who, under Bush 43, helped run the country into the ground. Now they're trying to play the good guy? Come on guys, let's kick their asses.[/QUOTE] As a fellow conservative I have to say that many conservatives [I]are[/I] against abortion, as am I, not so much birth control (it depends).

[QUOTE=maximizer39v2;43084313]As a fellow conservative I have to say that many conservatives [I]are[/I] against abortion, as am I, not so much birth control (it depends).[/QUOTE] I think there will always be differences of opinion. I'm certainly not for abortion, but it depends on the circumstances. I don't think it should be subsidized by the public, and I think there should be a cut off for being able to get an abortion. For example, there shouldn't be an abortion after the fetus is x weeks old.

Power to the people *puts on dark shades* [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Shitposting" - Craptasket))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=UziXxX;43084400]I think there will always be differences of opinion. I'm certainly not for abortion, but it depends on the circumstances. I don't think it should be subsidized by the public, and I think there should be a cut off for being able to get an abortion. For example, there shouldn't be an abortion after the fetus is x weeks old.[/QUOTE] Despite my other positions, I agree with you on that. Abortion should be a procedure done as a last resort to prevent a pregnancy you couldn't handle. If you can't think clearly enough to do that in the first 2 thirds of a pregnancy, you shouldn't be able to (extenuating circumstances aside), be able to later. At that point it becomes immoral anyway.

socially progressive libertarian. society does not function when you sit on your hands and pretend that the social structures of yesterday are perfect and will work forever, especially when a lot of them are predicated on some form of religious belief that has historically allowed for (or even encouraged) discriminatory behavior. economic centrist. some facets of society's functioning (such as utilities like water/electricity & essential services like police/fire department/healthcare) are best left to the government to handle. private businesses, however, make the best developmental & innovative strides when they're put in an equal environment for competition. the government's regulatory role in that instance, then, is to preserve the rights of the individuals involved, to keep as level a playing field as possible, and to help prevent/recover from instances of economic disaster. the problem with regulations is that some work to a good end and others simply prop up monopolies, regardless of good intentions, which makes matters worse. incentive-based regulation is ultimately the best form of regulation, because it gets things done without creating barriers to entry (and thus limiting competition and thus opening the door for dickfuckery by Lods Of Emone at Dewey, Screwum, and Hao Inc.) just a distinction: you can be on the economic right and still believe in regulations, as long as you still believe in a capitalist economy.

[QUOTE=joes33431;43100297]just a distinction: you can be on the economic right and still believe in regulations, as long as you still believe in a capitalist economy.[/QUOTE] I have to agree here. While there are times and places where regulation on industry can be harmful, there are just as many if not more times and places where lack of regulations can be just as harmful.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43071852]anarchist or minarchist?[/QUOTE] Minarchist, there are plenty of government agencies in the US that do their job right. There are plenty that are bloated as fuck. Government should have a strong central role, but it should work with the people and buisness, not against it.

I'm a moderate. I chose to be so after realizing I've been on both sides of the spectrum, and realized neither of them fit me. I'm somewhere inbetween, as balanced as I can manage to be.

One might describe me as being "third position." While I don't identify myself as a fascist, I have a lot of sympathy for them and many of their ideas (in fact, my girlfriend is a fascist). I generally refuse to label my political position as anything other than "socialist" because I haven't found a particular label which reflects all of my beliefs. A mixture of left-wing and right-wing social policies (generally anti-immigration, though I don't believe it particularly matters in the case of the US - I'm more concerned about Europe; liberal on things like drug policy, transgender issues, etc) and left-wing economics ("highly interventionist capitalism" with strong welfare systems a la Finland, Switzerland) place me somewhere in between libertarian socialists and socially moderate fascists. [url=politicaltest.net]Politicaltest.net[/url] describes me as a "national democratic socialist," and I don't think that's too far off the mark.

A bit of both, really. It makes it hard come voting season because both parties have things I agree with and things I disagree with. I tend to agree more on economical stuff with Conservatives and social policy with Liberals.

Conservative, I believe those who do not help themselves do not deserve the help of others, excluding people who cant help themselves thats somthing diffrent entirely. My religous views are a little right wing as well so that kinda adds to it

I'm split between a lot of both sides ideas. I agree with, and disagree with both sides.

I am an Independent, Liberal on some social policies and fiscally conservative. And, as I am probably older than the average poster on these forums, let me give you my perspective on some things. First, a comment was made that conservatives are anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage, not all but a lot yes but it has to do with a lot of conservatives are those with strong Judeo Christian believes and believe it goes against their religious beliefs to do either. As far as me, I am more open minded but do believe an abortion should only be a last resort and only early in the pregnancy, my son was born at 23 weeks, one week short of what is acceptable to have an abortion he was only 1lb 11oz at birth and believe me that was life and it started much earlier than that, to have aborted would have been nothing less than murder to me. He is in his 20s today and games. Second, The Tea party “Movement” had nothing to do with Bush’s policies! The Tea Party Movement, mostly older members of society was created to stem the out-of-control government spending. Third, Show me just one true Socialist Society that actually works. Anyway, I have no problem with taking care of those that can’t take care of themselves but disagree with taking care of those that choose to not take care of themselves. I have no problem with social programs but you need to be able to pay for them first and closing the border is an economic and security issue and has nothing to do with prejudice. As far as government goes, I agree with the forefathers, the states should have most the control and the federal government should be limited. The beliefs and opinions from one state to the next varies as much as from one person to the next In closing, I think one of the best political quotes for me at least is “If you're not liberal when you're young, you have no heart. If you're not conservative when you're older, you have no brain.”

[QUOTE=Swilly;43114009]Government should have a strong central role, but it should work with the people and buisness, not against it.[/QUOTE] When government works with business (which it inevitably always does), it can never work for the people. Authoritarian structures are a sad mistake in human evolution.

I've always maintained that I'm an independent moderate, so hopping between the two political factions whose rhetoric has been moving further from the center has been tough. The thing that makes me want to vote Conservative is that they've already lost most of the battles that made me reluctant to vote for them and I agree strongly with most of their fiscal and domestic policies. I will wait until the elections roll around and educate myself on each candidate, regardless of their political affiliation.

The party I think is right, so nonpartisan or independent.

I'm neither. I don't identify with [i]any[/i] political party. Why, you ask? Well, it's simple. On some issues I swing pretty far to the left. Nationalized healthcare, for one, and I would quite happily see a restriction in who's legally allowed to own a gun. LBGT rights? Yes please. They're people they deserve them. Want an abortion? Do what you want, it's not my place to tell you yes or no. On others I swing wildly to the right. I don't give a shit about the environment, I'd abolish federal fuel economy requirements, I'd build NPPs everywhere, I'd loosen restrictions on the types of guns Americans could legally own(Want to own a functional Panzershreck? Prove to us you're sane enough to keep it responsibly, fire it safely, store it securely, and you're welcome to have one), and I love fighter jets and battleships too much to gut the military. And on still other issues I'm completely in the middle/DGAF about. Fiscal policies, for one. I pull a bit from both sides. I loathe the idea of raising taxes, especially on the poor and middle class who can barely afford them as it is, but I also loathe the idea of not spending money on things like social nets and NASA. I'm also pretty fond of regulating certain industries that have proven themselves unable to self-regulate, yet at the same time, I'm also fond of letting them fail if they fuck up, and I'm all-for a minimum wage hike. Identifying under a single party is doing myself a disservice. So instead I don't identify under any of them. I have no political affiliation.

Since there is only two options I would pick Conservative. I do not like how Liberals do things, I prefer the way Conservatives do.I consider myself a Libertarian, I took one of those political quiz things at an event and out of like 50 people who had taken it I was the farthest libertarian who had taken the quiz. It was a booth for the Libertarian party too. I just do not think that the government should be involved in everyone's life they way it is now.

Whoever can solve debt has my vote, it just so happens that the conservatives are doing a good job here in the UK.