• Any other Vegetarians here?
    317 replies, posted
[QUOTE=professional;18918336]Well shit lucky for me I fucking hate beer then isnt it? Be a sarcastic prick all you want, fact of the matter is, the excessive amount of soy products most vegetarians consume in place of meat is not good for them.[/QUOTE] Obviously if you consume something in excess, it won't be good for you. Fortunately for vegetarians, their diet does not require them to consume a lot of soy. They can replace meat with a lot of things, such as beans, cheese, eggs, rice, chickpeas, various nuts and seeds, and a whole lot of weird foreign food. (india ftw.) As for soy's supposed feminizing effect, it is not well documented. However critics of soy point to the phytoestrogen content, but forget that beer also contains phytoestrogens (from the hops,) and it's the third most popular beverage on the planet.
[QUOTE=TheMar;18918532] As for soy's supposed feminizing effect, it is not well documented. However critics of soy point to the phytoestrogen content, but forget that beer also contains phytoestrogens (from the hops,) and it's the third most popular beverage on the planet.[/QUOTE] Soy protein's toxins, goitrogens and effects on testosterone production are [B]very well[/B] documented. Hence why I have a paranoia about the fucker. And the comparison with beer is a horrible one. It's well known alcohol is a poison and the effects of regular alcohol consumption, very few people know about soy on the other hand. Not to mention, unless you're a full blown alcoholic, you aren't consuming beer as a regular part of your daily diet.
[QUOTE=professional;18918733]Soy protein's toxins, goitrogens and effects on testosterone production are [B]very well[/B] documented. Hence why I have a paranoia about the fucker. And the comparison with beer is a horrible one. It's well known alcohol is a poison and the effects of regular alcohol consumption, very few people know about soy on the other hand. Not to mention, unless you're a full blown alcoholic, you aren't consuming beer as a regular part of your daily diet.[/QUOTE] Tell me more about what makes Soy different from other foods. What kind of toxins are you talking about? And a simple Wikipedia search on goitrogen produces a list of other foods that are [b]lightly[/b] goitrogenic. Such as: Strawberries, Pears, peanuts, Spinach, cabbage, broccoli, and much more. Check out the list at [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goitrogen[/url], I'm sure most people consume many of those things on a regular basis. The comparison with beer was to bring some evidence to the debate of whether Phytoestrogens can seriously fuck up your hormones. If beer and soy contain similar amounts of Phytoestrogens, then why does soy get such a bad rep for hormonal effects but beer does not?
[QUOTE=TheMar;18919357]Tell me more about what makes Soy different from other foods. What kind of toxins are you talking about? And a simple Wikipedia search on goitrogen produces a list of other foods that are lightly goitrogenic. Such as: Strawberries, Pears, peanuts, soy, cabbage, broccoli, and much more. Check out the list at [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goitrogen[/url], I'm sure most people consume many of those things on a regular basis. The comparison with beer was to bring some evidence to the debate of whether Phytoestrogens can seriously fuck up your hormones. If beer and soy contain similar amounts of Phytoestrogens, then why does soy get such a bad rep for hormonal effects but beer does not?[/QUOTE] — Toxicity: Soy increases your toxic load. It's one of the most sprayed crops. Their high content of pesticides increases your ever-increasing toxic load. In addition, aluminum content skyrockets in processing. — Potential hypothyroidism: Soy contains goitragens, which are compounds that lead to hypothyroidism. — Blocking mineral absorption: Soy has a high content of phytates, which are known to inhibit the absorption of both macro-minerals (i.e. calcium) and trace minerals (i.e. zinc). The good news is that meat consumption blocks phytates. If you're going to eat tofu, make sure to eat some meat (ironically) during the same meal. — Link to Attention Deficit Disorder: Soy-based infant formulas are linked to ADD. They contain 80 times more manganese than breast milk. Too much manganese content is linked to neurotoxicity. — Increased cardiovascular load: Hemaglutinin is found in soybeans. This compound is known to make red blood cells aggregate, therefore increasing your cardiovascular load. Also, soy protein has an inhibitor in it that inhibits the absorption of protein, essentially making it redundant to eat for protein intake, lol. And yes, you are correct, there are fruits that contain goitrogens, but the difference is how it breaks down in the body. In most fruits, many of these goitrogens do not absorb. However in soy products like Tofu, it does. Most fruits also contain Phytoestrogens, but once again, how it breaks down in the body is just as important. As for the beer, what are you talking about mang? Beer does get a bad rap for estrogenous effects. There's a reason men who consume excessive amounts have pot bellies and excessive breast fat/tissue, not to mention inhibited sex drives, low productivity, low desire and drive, unstable emotional status, etc etc.
[QUOTE=professional;18920470]— Toxicity: Soy increases your toxic load. It's one of the most sprayed crops. Their high content of pesticides increases your ever-increasing toxic load. In addition, aluminum content skyrockets in processing. [/QUOTE] Got any evidence of that? Why would soy need more pesticides than any other crop? And does this happen in a place with food quality standards? Assuming it's true, is the increase in the toxic load significant? Do the advantages of soy outweigh the risks? (it has numerous health benefits.) Also what makes meat any better? They're fed crops grown with pesticides and it gets biomagnified, and they add growth hormones and all kinds of stuff to the animals to hurry it's growth. Obviously it's not poisoning you but it can't be better than what they put in soy products. [QUOTE=professional;18920470] — Potential hypothyroidism: Soy contains goitragens, which are compounds that lead to hypothyroidism. [/QUOTE] That's still exaggerating it. Emphasis on the potential. Soy contains a small amount of goitragens which could [b]potentially[/b] lead to hypothyroidism. Also your argument could be used against Pine nuts, Peanuts, Strawberries, Pears, Peaches, Spinach, Sweet Potatoes, Broccoli, Brussels sprouts, Cabbage, Canola, Cauliflower, Horseradish, and Turnips. Since all of them contain goitragens as well. Also caffeine has a goitragenic effect. If you regularly eat the above raw with an Iodine deficiency, or you have a pre-existing thyroid condition, then you should worry about hypothyroidism. [QUOTE=professional;18920470] — Blocking mineral absorption: Soy has a high content of phytates, which are known to inhibit the absorption of both macro-minerals (i.e. calcium) and trace minerals (i.e. zinc). The good news is that meat consumption blocks phytates. If you're going to eat tofu, make sure to eat some meat (ironically) during the same meal. [/QUOTE] So just what are Phytates? It's also called Phytic acid. It's basically the stuff in plant fiber that allows plants to hold on to phosphorous. It is often found in cereal (stop eating cereal.) and nuts and whole grain and stuff. It was once considered an anti-nutrient because it binds to useful nutrients in the intestines. Turns out it's potential for binding to things is also helpful for removing heavy metals and other pollutants from the body. It also has an antioxidant effect, helping against cancer and osteoporosis. (despite supposedly robbing the body of it's calcium.) The fact remains that it can still bind to useful nutrients, but it still has a number of health benefits to be considered. It is not a bad thing. links: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytate[/url] [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19053869[/url] [url]http://www.repsol.com/es_en/casa_y_hogar/cocina/reportajes/trucos/fitatos.aspx[/url] And please explain how meat blocks the absorption of phytic acid. I'm sure there are different foods that do the same thing. [QUOTE=professional;18920470] — Link to Attention Deficit Disorder: Soy-based infant formulas are linked to ADD. They contain 80 times more manganese than breast milk. Too much manganese content is linked to neurotoxicity. [/QUOTE] Oh god, baby formula. I don't care what is used to make it, it still falls very short compared to breastmilk. Blaming soy for the shitty effects of using artificial breastmilk is just unfair. [QUOTE=professional;18920470] — Increased cardiovascular load: Hemaglutinin is found in soybeans. This compound is known to make red blood cells aggregate, therefore increasing your cardiovascular load. [/QUOTE] Please elaborate. Is the amount found in soybeans significant? Is it produced by the soybeans? Is it worse on the heart than the more-than-3-servings-of-red-meat-a-week diet? [QUOTE=professional;18920470] Also, soy protein has an inhibitor in it that inhibits the absorption of protein, essentially making it redundant to eat for protein intake, lol. [/QUOTE] [B][citation needed][/B] I could say the same goes for meat as well. Either it has a lot of proteins that the human body synthesizes on it's own, or it cannot readily be absorbed, or it has too much protein (which is a bad thing,) or it's just not worth it. What is the better source of protein? [QUOTE=professional;18920470] And yes, you are correct, there are fruits that contain goitrogens, but the difference is how it breaks down in the body. In most fruits, many of these goitrogens do not absorb. However in soy products like Tofu, it does. Most fruits also contain Phytoestrogens, but once again, how it breaks down in the body is just as important. [/QUOTE] I dunno about any of you guys, but I always cook my tofu (which I don't eat regularly.) Which almost negates goitrogens. As for your argument that the goitrogen content of the other fruits don't absorb, please explain why. [QUOTE=professional;18920470] As for the beer, what are you talking about mang? Beer does get a bad rap for estrogenous effects. There's a reason men who consume excessive amounts have pot bellies and excessive breast fat/tissue, not to mention inhibited sex drives, low productivity, low desire and drive, unstable emotional status, etc etc.[/QUOTE] True dat, it was on a manswers episode. However I'd call those people alcoholics or competitive beer drinkers. It seems beer is widely consumed everywhere with the average Joe not experiencing many feminizing effects. When people think beer, they think of a very enjoyable drink, when they think of soy, they think "estrogen." Yet beer still has phytoestrogens. And it's fucking hard to find reliable information. I'd find studies saying it's nothing at all, while others would say "DANGER HORMONES!$#@WTF." (ok I got that kind of info from a really bad one) I'd like to know if there is a feminizing effect in people who drink two beers a day. I looked up the per-capita beer consumption and it turns out that the average American drinks 230 mL a day, which isn't very useful.
Vegetarians don't get the clue that when they argue false facts they're only adding to the stereotype. They really need to learn to shut the fuck up, how come you [b]never see meat-eaters walking around holding signs that say "Plants are bad, eat only meat?"[/b]
[QUOTE=thisispain;18842136]stop posting morbid images of meat all i imagine is like a fat naked dude jerking off in a giant pot of hamburger helper[/QUOTE] oh jesus, what
[QUOTE=FFStudios;18922237]Vegetarians don't get the clue that when they argue false facts they're only adding to the stereotype. They really need to learn to shut the fuck up, how come you [b]never see meat-eaters walking around holding signs that say "Plants are bad, eat only meat?"[/b][/QUOTE] It is a well-known fact that vegetarians who preach are assholes, but the same applies to anyone being a dick about someone else's diet. However in this thread it is justified. Anybody clicking on this thread should be expecting a discussion on the presence of meat in one's diet, and if you really don't give a fuck or don't want to hear a discussion about dietary changes, then you're in the wrong thread mate. Edit: also I gotta go, but I'll be back in an hour
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;18841850]I get my protein from sucking dicks... Jk[/QUOTE] Being a vegetarian is bullshit. Enjoy your bowel cancer. [editline]10:12PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Relys;18900451]I was raised vegetarian... I see no reason to start eating meat. I'm as healthy as a horse. I'm not some PETAfag either, although I do live kitties. ^.^[/QUOTE] You're not as healthy as a horse. You don't eat meat, you will NEVER be healthy.
[QUOTE=TheMar;18922117]Got any evidence of that? Why would soy need more pesticides than any other crop? And does this happen in a place with food quality standards? Assuming it's true, is the increase in the toxic load significant? Do the advantages of soy outweigh the risks? (it has numerous health benefits.) Also what makes meat any better? They're fed crops grown with pesticides and it gets biomagnified, and they add growth hormones and all kinds of stuff to the animals to hurry it's growth. Obviously it's not poisoning you but it can't be better than what they put in soy products. [/quote] Do I really need to link a source here? I thought it was common knowledge by now that soy is by far the most sprayed crop in existance. There are [B]zero[/B] regulations on the level of pesticides for use on Soy. Blame the always silly FDA. The same soy that will be used to bind carboard boxes will come from the same soy batch that will go into your food products. As for what makes meat better, well for starters, Soy, even moreso than Wheat, has only become a part of our diets very recently in the big scheme. Meat on the other hand, we've been eating for long ass time, as evidenced by our canines, some scientists even theorized our current evolutionary status is from the process of cooking meat, rather then digesting it raw. Also, at what point did all cattle get fed crops? Personally most of my red meat comes from grass fed cows. If you're afraid of growth hormones in the source animal, there's plenty of other animals to eat. [quote] That's still exaggerating it. Emphasis on the potential. Soy contains a small amount of goitragens which could [b]potentially[/b] lead to hypothyroidism. Also your argument could be used against Pine nuts, Peanuts, Strawberries, Pears, Peaches, Spinach, Sweet Potatoes, Broccoli, Brussels sprouts, Cabbage, Canola, Cauliflower, Horseradish, and Turnips. Since all of them contain goitragens as well. Also caffeine has a goitragenic effect. [/quote] It may be, but the effects are only well documented in tofu consumption, and the effects of the goitrogens in stuff like strawberries seems to be ineffective. [quote] Please elaborate. Is the amount found in soybeans significant? Is it produced by the soybeans? Is it worse on the heart than the more-than-3-servings-of-red-meat-a-week diet? [/quote] Refer to the study I'll post at the bottom. Also, if you're implying the stereotype that red meat consumption is the cause of many heart problems, that's wrong and is information that is about 40-50 years old. I'm not going to expand here, because we'd be opening up an entirely new and rather large can of worms, especially on the subject of Dietary Cholesterol and Fats. [Quote] [B][citation needed][/B] I could say the same goes for meat as well. Either it has a lot of proteins that the human body synthesizes on it's own, or it cannot readily be absorbed, or it has too much protein (which is a bad thing,) or it's just not worth it. What is the better source of protein? [/quote] "Trypsin inhibitors and haemagglutinin are growth inhibitors" - again, refer to link at bottom. As for the better source of protein, red meat is with out a doubt superior providing you don't have digestive problems regarding meat (which admittedly is present in some people, albeit very very rare). Also, I laughed. Too much protein? Really, are you one of [B]those[/B] people? And no, it's not a bad thing, unless you can somehow manage to find a way to stuff yourself with over 300gs of protein in sitting, which I challenge anyone to do with any macronutrient without puking. There's a reason red meat is considered a staple for muscle building in strength sports. No other source of protein is absorbed as much as red meat (with the exception of the Whey fractions of Cow's milk, which is the most bioavailable protein you can get naturally). Example, with egg protein, it's been found one can only absorb around 20g of egg protein in a single sitting. No such limitation has been found with beef or venison or kangaroo. [quote] I dunno about any of you guys, but I always cook my tofu (which I don't eat regularly.) Which almost negates goitrogens. As for your argument that the goitrogen content of the other fruits don't absorb, please explain why. [/quote] I'm not sure. But if you wish to track down the exact study, feel free. I won't put in the effort sorry. [quote] True dat, it was on a manswers episode. However I'd call those people alcoholics or competitive beer drinkers. It seems beer is widely consumed everywhere with the average Joe not experiencing many feminizing effects. When people think beer, they think of a very enjoyable drink, when they think of soy, they think "estrogen." Yet beer still has phytoestrogens. And it's fucking hard to find reliable information. I'd find studies saying it's nothing at all, while others would say "DANGER HORMONES!$#@WTF." (ok I got that kind of info from a really bad one) I'd like to know if there is a feminizing effect in people who drink two beers a day. I looked up the per-capita beer consumption and it turns out that the average American drinks 230 mL a day, which isn't very useful.[/QUOTE] Femizing effects is abritarily defined. It's not to say if a man consumes a large amount of beer he will become feminine and grow breasts and start having maternal instincts.... However, the effects of [B]lower[/B] testosterone are noticeable in men who consume large amounts of beer on a day to day basis. Unfortunately, it's now, more then ever, very hard to pinpoint these effects in a study, because believe it or not, in the general public, testosterone is across the board lower than it was an estimated 30 years ago. - The referred study : [url]http://www.mercola.com/article/soy/avoid_soy.htm[/url] You are correct that there are plenty of other options for vegetarians to get a decent protein intake (Decent is twice the "recommended" daily intake provided by the FDA - who are the village idiots), but soy is something I will adamantly state anyone, veggie, carnivore or omnivore, should avoid like the plague.
Animals don't eat other animals, only humans do! [img]http://theinfosphere.org/images/c/cb/Free_Waterfall,_Jr..jpg[/img] We taught a lion to eat tofu! [img]http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h256/sausagemit/vlcsnap-664401.png[/img]
[QUOTE=pie_is_good;18841984]This man is right. I have been eating meat for the past 15 years and I have had tons of heart attacks and I can't get an erection all because I ate the recommended serving of meat each day by the USDA's food pyramid. I can't be a vegetarian for the meat has taken control of my mind, and my life. When I don't eat meat, I sweat and fear flows through my body. I have an addiction. Damn you meat! I've always wondered what would happen if you fried fried chicken.[/QUOTE] Fried...Fried chicken? [img]http://www.buddytv.com/articles/king-of-the-hill/images/bill-dauterive-1.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=Swimbound;18924487]Fried...Fried chicken?[/QUOTE] Double fried chicken. Now I'm hungry :argh:
Hell naw, meat for the win. [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f2/Steak_4_bg_083103.jpg/800px-Steak_4_bg_083103.jpg[/img]
I eat nothing but fake meat. I have a thing for seeing imaginary cows getting slaughtered. It's the best of both worlds. I get to have a sick appetite for blood-soaked animal flesh, AND not get sufficient amounts of protein*, at the same time!! *I think the whole "vegetarians don't get enough protein" argument is complete bollocks. I'm happy with my body, and have no troubles with, say, muscle growth. I may not be a beefcake (yet ;D), but I'm far from being a stick <: *I'm also fine with meat-eaters. We grew up eating animals, as a species. Nowt wrong with that. I just refrain from eating meat as a personal choice. It's generally easier to home-grow veg than to rear chickens, too, so I've discovered.
[QUOTE=professional;18923464]Do I really need to link a source here? I thought it was common knowledge by now that soy is by far the most sprayed crop in existance. There are [B]zero[/B] regulations on the level of pesticides for use on Soy. Blame the always silly FDA. The same soy that will be used to bind carboard boxes will come from the same soy batch that will go into your food products. [/QUOTE] Well shit. Since the FDA is shit and soy regulations vary across the world, it's hard to find reliable information (as is the nature of the internet.) I hope it's better up here in Canada. [QUOTE=professional;18923464] As for what makes meat better, well for starters, Soy, even moreso than Wheat, has only become a part of our diets very recently in the big scheme. Meat on the other hand, we've been eating for long ass time, as evidenced by our canines, some scientists even theorized our current evolutionary status is from the process of cooking meat, rather then digesting it raw. Also, at what point did all cattle get fed crops? Personally most of my red meat comes from grass fed cows. If you're afraid of growth hormones in the source animal, there's plenty of other animals to eat. [/QUOTE] "The old ways are best" argument is pretty weak in modern society. I personally think that we ate meat on necessity. Back then food was hard to come by and a chunk of animal had a ton of nutrients. Meat had unhealthy effects but who cares when you've got nothing else to eat. Therefore, meat is obsolete, but people still like it because they have the "meat = tasty" circuit in their brain. You've got a point that we've evolved towards a carnivorous diet and thus we are omnivores, but we're still a lot closer to herbivore than carnivore. And cattle are usually fed crops unless you eat free-range meat. Also white meat is a lot healthier than red meat. [QUOTE=professional;18923464] It may be, but the effects are only well documented in tofu consumption, and the effects of the goitrogens in stuff like strawberries seems to be ineffective. Refer to the study I'll post at the bottom. [/QUOTE] Ah yes I've seen that study. It seems internet research will provide pro-soy and anti-soy studies from various sources. I'd like to see a controlled test on the effects of regular soy consumption in front of me, but I haven't the money for that. Maybe I'll drink tons of it for a week and see if I grow breasts. [QUOTE=professional;18923464] Also, if you're implying the stereotype that red meat consumption is the cause of many heart problems, that's wrong and is information that is about 40-50 years old. I'm not going to expand here, because we'd be opening up an entirely new and rather large can of worms, especially on the subject of Dietary Cholesterol and Fats. [/QUOTE] Very well, but left right and center people (and doctors) are saying that Americans eat way too much red meat. What are your comments on that? [QUOTE=professional;18923464] "Trypsin inhibitors and haemagglutinin are growth inhibitors" - again, refer to link at bottom. As for the better source of protein, red meat is with out a doubt superior providing you don't have digestive problems regarding meat (which admittedly is present in some people, albeit very very rare). Also, I laughed. Too much protein? Really, are you one of [B]those[/B] people? And no, it's not a bad thing, unless you can somehow manage to find a way to stuff yourself with over 300gs of protein in sitting, which I challenge anyone to do with any macronutrient without puking. [/QUOTE] What about beans then? They're easy and quick to grow, and easily digestible. They're also cheap. Mix them with rice and you've got a complete protein. Environmentally, they blow meat out of the water. As for the excess protein, it's not as serious as it's made out to be but it can cause some health complications if you've got a calcium/carbohydrate -deficient diet or kidney problems. Nothing big, but something to consider if you've got health problems or a heavily regulated diet. [QUOTE=professional;18923464] There's a reason red meat is considered a staple for muscle building in strength sports. No other source of protein is absorbed as much as red meat (with the exception of the Whey fractions of Cow's milk, which is the most bioavailable protein you can get naturally). Example, with egg protein, it's been found one can only absorb around 20g of egg protein in a single sitting. No such limitation has been found with beef or venison or kangaroo. [/QUOTE] Maybe it's the traditional thing, or the vegetarian stereotypes. Just some food for thought. But what makes red meat protein so special? And even if it is so, is it the protein you require? (What if it's just protein that the body can synthesize on it's own? Only a fraction of the human proteins need to be in the diet.) I'm not asking you to track down the study or back it with statistics, just give a basic explanation of what makes it so different. [QUOTE=professional;18923464] You are correct that there are plenty of other options for vegetarians to get a decent protein intake (Decent is twice the "recommended" daily intake provided by the FDA - who are the village idiots), but soy is something I will adamantly state anyone, veggie, carnivore or omnivore, should avoid like the plague.[/QUOTE] Well I'm glad you're an open-minded reasonable person instead of a "OMGWTFBBQ we need to eat meat to survive"-douchebag. As for the soy, I think I'll take it in extreme moderation now.
[QUOTE=G12-A5;18841786]Vegetarian here for 5 years so far. Honestly I dont really want to eat meat again. I look at it and it makes me sick. Enjoy your Erectile Disfunction, Heart Problems, Blood Clots, and Hyper Tension (For all you Meat addicts).[/QUOTE] Enjoy your malnutrition, pale skin, weak immune system, and vitamin, zinc and iron deficiency. [editline]02:45AM[/editline] [QUOTE=NeoDement;18842165] Don't call it rabbit food or you're a prick, I don't see anyone making up stupid terms for meat. [/QUOTE] um, murder?
[QUOTE=TheMar;18926787] And cattle are usually fed crops unless you eat free-range meat. Also white meat is a lot healthier than red meat. [/quote] That's very circumstancial. Red meat has gotten a bad wrap because of repeated misinformation for the past 30-50 years. They're just now finding that red meat is actually extremely healthy and the previously bad effects attributed to it were actually from the over-consumption of carbohydrates (and especially, carbohydrates cooked in trans-fats) in conjunction with high red meat intake. Also, the lack of exercise, which I'll talk about below in relation to red meat intake. [quote] Very well, but left right and center people (and doctors) are saying that Americans eat way too much red meat. What are your comments on that? [/quote] This will go against popular thought, but I'm going to pipe up and say majority of medical doctors don't actually know dick about nurtrition. After all if they did, we wouldn't pay nutritionists to get their own PhDs and do their own research. However, they are in a way, correct. I don't, and this a view shared by much of the strength athlete community, believe red meat should be consumed in large amounts by sedentary individuals. The fact of the matter is, most red meat is very calorie dense, combine this with a high carbohydrate (I'm trying to avoid opening the can of worms on the evils of carbohydrates lol) intake and junk food once or twice a week (thats the lower end of the figures I believe) and bammo, you're asking for health problems, let alone obesity. [quote] What about beans then? They're easy and quick to grow, and easily digestible. They're also cheap. Mix them with rice and you've got a complete protein. Environmentally, they blow meat out of the water. [/quote] Beans are good for the most part, and yes they are cheap which is a major boon. But they lack red meat's bioavailabilty of the protein and the creatine offered by red meat. But if you can't digest meat, it's a fairly good substitute. [quote] As for the excess protein, it's not as serious as it's made out to be but it can cause some health complications if you've got a calcium/carbohydrate -deficient diet or kidney problems. Nothing big, but something to consider if you've got health problems or a heavily regulated diet. [/quote] Proteins and fats are actually handled better by the body in a extreme low carb diet (Check the "Anabolic diet" - interesting stuff regarding consumption of high fat in the absence of carbohydrates). [quote] Maybe it's the traditional thing, or the vegetarian stereotypes. Just some food for thought. And even if it is so, is it the protein you require? (What if it's just protein that the body can synthesize on it's own? Only a fraction of the human proteins need to be in the diet.) [/quote] It's more to do with both the A) Creatine in red meat and B) the Bioavailability of red meat protein. We've been eating it for so long the uptake and usage of proteins in red meat is greater than almost any other source (With the exception of Whey protein from cow's milk. Which is the most bioavailable protein, hence why it's become so hugely popular as a protein supplement in the fitness world). Well it depends. If you want to be tiny 120lbs all your life or maybe you want to dedicate yourself to endurance running, you won't need that much protein. Building and maintanence of muscle tissue however requires alot more protein than the "norm" however. Regardless though, endurance athlete, sedentary person, or a powerlifter, everyone can benefit from a higher protein consumption. High Protein intake is just now being linked with stronger, denser bones, just as much as calcium is. [Quote] Well I'm glad you're an open-minded reasonable person instead of a "OMGWTFBBQ we need to eat meat to survive"-douchebag. [/Quote] Technically the only thing we need to survive are proteins and fats. But yeah, I've never had a problem with Vegetarians who have done it because they simply cannot eat meat, or have digestive problems, but It's always made me facepalm when people say they did for [B]improved[/B] health. It doesn't get any healthier than a [B]clean[/B] Omnivorous diet.
4pages late snip
I've been a flexitarian since January. I usually don't eat meat, but when there's nothing else around and I'm hungry, oh well. I don't like the taste of meat anymore and I don't even feel tempted by bacon so I think I'll try to stop eating meat completely in a couple of months. Btw, Dennis Rodman and a lot of other people who play sports regularly are vegetarian, that protein argument is kinda ridiculous, you just need to have a balanced diet. Besides, I have a chance with Natalie Portman, [url=http://selebriti.mentalmasturbasyon.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/alicia-silverstone-naked-peta-01.jpg]Alicia Silverstone[/url], Carmen Electra, Katy Perry and Anne Hathaway and you don't lol. [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pwe0vuejR14[/url]
I eat meat and I like it. This is how it's done. Animals eat animals and since I don't think much of the human race other than we being natures most cocky animals, go figure. I think it is right to be as animalistic as possible, because thats what we are (and that would be the only right way to save any of our nature) Now for the animals in the slaughterhouses, I don't feel any pitty for them. they live to die. What does it matter, if you live in comfort and wealth or being sick in your own filth if you just live to feed and then die. And there is no way to tread our any race of animal well, if they have to be enough to feed all of us. If you feel sorry for any animal that dies in no matter what way an getting eaten, I cant understand you at all. Living things live of other living things. Thats natural. I was also raised very down-to-earth. My Dad taught me how to catch a duck, break its neck, gut it and prepare it over a self-made campfire. I killed my own goat and it tasted perfect. If I had a farm I would mostly live of my own animals but since I don't I have no problem with taking someone else's meat. If you like to try to safe animals by not eating it, go ahead and let them get killed in vain. Or make the world a better place and... look at animals, uselessly running around. Maybe hug them ot take pictures of them. If they aren't busy eating each other, that is. Just don't get in my face and tell me what to eat and what not to.
[QUOTE=The Crow;18940514]I've been a flexitarian since January. I usually don't eat meat, but when there's nothing else around and I'm hungry, oh well. I don't like the taste of meat anymore and I don't even feel tempted by bacon so I think I'll try to stop eating meat completely in a couple of months. Btw, Dennis Rodman and a lot of other people who play sports regularly are vegetarian, that protein argument is kinda ridiculous, you just need to have a balanced diet. Besides, I have a chance with Natalie Portman, [url=http://selebriti.mentalmasturbasyon.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/alicia-silverstone-naked-peta-01.jpg]Alicia Silverstone[/url], Carmen Electra, Katy Perry and Anne Hathaway and you don't lol. [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pwe0vuejR14[/url][/QUOTE] celebrities r vegetarians SO IT MUST BE GOOD way to be nonconformist, bro
I find it rather irritating when the minority of vegetarians claim they are better than others because they don't eat animals. Other than that, it's all up to personal preference.
[QUOTE=The Crow;18940514] Btw, Dennis Rodman and a lot of other people who play sports regularly are vegetarian, that protein argument is kinda ridiculous, you just need to have a balanced diet. Besides, I have a chance with Natalie Portman, [url=http://selebriti.mentalmasturbasyon.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/alicia-silverstone-naked-peta-01.jpg]Alicia Silverstone[/url], Carmen Electra, Katy Perry and Anne Hathaway and you don't lol. [/QUOTE] Haha you dropkick, rodman consumed milk and eggs. There's your protein. Show me an athlete who needs to sustain even a moderate level of muscle mass that's on a low protein intake. And don't give me crap about "balanced diet". Half of you wouldn't know what a balanced diet was if it hit you in the face. Proteins and Fats are the only macronutrients we need to survive and function well. Yes, believe it or not, carbohydrates are non-essential. You completely eliminate carbohydrates from your diet and you'll be fine and healthy. You completely eliminate Proteins or Fats, and you will die.
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;18841573]I've been a vegetarian for 10 years now, I really feel that eating meat is wrong. Whenever I think about all the harm that the animals go through, I feel sick to my stomach. So anyway post your vegetarian stories here, and talk about how you're able to maintain this lifestyle.[/QUOTE] I'm a vegetarian, and have been for like 11 years, but I don't fucking shit myself when I see someone eating a chicken nugget. Its natural for people to eat meat. I hate it when people jump on their high horse and make people who don't actually like meat look like complete douches. I mean, someone actually had a go at me for not eating meat; she said that I 'didn't have a proper reason, so why do I even bother?' FUUUUUUUUUUUUU-
[QUOTE=Trotsky;18942726]celebrities r vegetarians SO IT MUST BE GOOD way to be nonconformist, bro[/QUOTE] Oh God, you don't give a fuck about Hollywood, you must be so cool and smart... Anyway, I have two close vegetarian friends. Do you know them? No. So it's a bit silly to talk about them. But since you're so intelligent maybe you will like more if I say that Kafka, Tolstoy, Newton, Wagner or Da Vinci were vegetarian too. Oh, right, and Hitler. [QUOTE=professional;18943501]Haha you dropkick, rodman consumed milk and eggs. There's your protein. Show me an athlete who needs to sustain even a moderate level of muscle mass that's on a low protein intake. And don't give me crap about "balanced diet". Half of you wouldn't know what a balanced diet was if it hit you in the face. Proteins and Fats are the only macronutrients we need to survive and function well. Yes, believe it or not, carbohydrates are non-essential. You completely eliminate carbohydrates from your diet and you'll be fine and healthy. You completely eliminate Proteins or Fats, and you will die.[/QUOTE] Carl Lewis is vegan. Not vegetarian, vegan. [url]http://www.earthsave.org/lifestyle/carllewis.htm:[/url] "In fact, my best year of track competition was the first year I ate a vegan diet." Is the Sportsman of the Century enough for you? And yeah, most people are stupid and just eat garbage, but vegetarians tend to think a bit more about what they eat so I do think vegetarians in general have healthier diets. I know I do.
Relevant: [IMG]http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll10/HeadH/animalcrackers.gif[/IMG]
[QUOTE=The Crow;18944578]Oh God, you don't give a fuck about Hollywood, you must be so cool and smart...[/quote] This is so stupid, I can't even warrant a response... I'm pretentious because I do not care for the opinion of celebrities? What about Jenny McCarthy's view on vaccines, do you agree with them? Anyway, I have two close vegetarian friends. Do you know them? No. So it's a bit silly to talk about them. But since you're so intelligent maybe you will like more if I say that Kafka, Tolstoy, Newton, Wagner or Da Vinci were vegetarian too. Oh, right, and Hitler.[/quote] What the fuck are you talking about? What is this? What does this mean? [quote]Carl Lewis is vegan. Not vegetarian, vegan. [url]http://www.earthsave.org/lifestyle/carllewis.htm:[/url] "In fact, my best year of track competition was the first year I ate a vegan diet." Is the Sportsman of the Century enough for you?[/quote] Yeah, he also takes steroids you fucking tool. [quote]And yeah, most people are stupid and just eat garbage, but vegetarians tend to think a bit more about what they eat so I do think vegetarians in general have healthier diets. I know I do.[/QUOTE] That is absolute bullshit. Not only is this jaded and biased, it's completely generalized. Without meat you are missing vital proteins, iron, zinc, vitamin B12, Calcium and "weight loss, diarrhea, loss of lean body mass, muscle weakness, depigmented hair and skin, pressure sores, and depressed immune function" - Northwest university.
:aaaaa: where do you get protein when you're a vege?
[QUOTE=Trotsky;18947102]Yeah, he also takes steroids you fucking tool.[/QUOTE] That was Ben Johnson, but whatever. [QUOTE=Trotsky;18947102]That is absolute bullshit. Not only is this jaded and biased, it's completely generalized.[/QUOTE] Thank God what I was replying to is not: [QUOTE=professional;18943501]And don't give me crap about "balanced diet". Half of you wouldn't know what a balanced diet was if it hit you in the face.[/QUOTE] What I was trying to say is that when someone turns vegetarian they usually try to get some information and learn a bit more about how to get into an healthier diet. That's what I did. That's what my veg friends did. My other friends normally don't give a fuck about what they are eating. If yours do, good for you and good for them. [QUOTE=Trotsky;18947102]Without meat you are missing vital proteins, iron, zinc, vitamin B12, Calcium and "weight loss, diarrhea, loss of lean body mass, muscle weakness, depigmented hair and skin, pressure sores, and depressed immune function" - Northwest university.[/QUOTE] Since this is a vegetarian and not a vegan thread: Protein - milk, eggs, nuts, almonds and soy Iron - Beans, peas, soy and lentils Zinc - Beans, nuts and almonds B12 - Milk and eggs Calcium - Milk, eggs, broccoli, soy and cauliflower Btw, I don't really understand why you lose your time trying to change our views. We know we are right and you think you are right so if you are not here to learn about the benefits of it, don't you have something more interesting to do? Just asking though, keep replying if you feel like it.
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