[QUOTE=UnkN;50351021]"Ё" is default bind for console on keyboards, that contains Russian characters. When you try write ~, you console was close automatically, so how I can rebind console if I newbie in gmod for example? And how servers will rebind console key for clients? RunConsoleCommand will block "bind"...[/QUOTE]
Just press ESCAPE, go to settings and find open developer console or something like that?
[QUOTE=UnkN;50351021]And how servers will rebind console key for clients?[/QUOTE]
They [B][U]shouldn't[/U][/B].
[QUOTE=FPtje;50351405]They [B][U]shouldn't[/U][/B].[/QUOTE]
IIrc it is possible to hide the whole escape ui with some functions, and some annoying as fuck escape screens do just that - since those functions were added by a gmod dev ( prolly garry ) they don't use exploits nor binds.
edit:
[url]https://wiki.garrysmod.com/page/gui/HideGameUI[/url]
I think it was this shit
Might also wanna add, no possibility around it without cheating. If a server user uses it and it annoys you - you can only leave the server, if he doesn't prevent you from leaving using it that is.
[QUOTE=Leystryku;50351420]IIrc it is possible to hide the whole escape ui with some functions, and some annoying as fuck escape screens do just that - since those functions were added by a gmod dev ( prolly garry ) they don't use exploits nor binds.
edit:
[url]https://wiki.garrysmod.com/page/gui/HideGameUI[/url]
I think it was this shit
Might also wanna add, no possibility around it without cheating. If a server user uses it and it annoys you - you can only leave the server, if he doesn't prevent you from leaving using it that is.[/QUOTE]
dude are you being serious did you read 0 of the posts in the last 2 pages
1) we already know, this is what we are discussing right now
2) it was possible before those functions, 5 years ago.
[url]https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1112817&p=31983567&viewfull=1#post31983567[/url]
[url]https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1152853[/url]
thanks for reading the thread
[QUOTE=jackool;50351520]dude are you being serious did you read 0 of the posts in the last 2 pages
1) we already know, this is what we are discussing right now
2) it was possible before those functions, 5 years ago.
[url]https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1112817&p=31983567&viewfull=1#post31983567[/url]
[url]https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1152853[/url]
thanks for reading the thread[/QUOTE]
dude are you being serious did you understand my post at all?
I did read posts in the last 2 pages, but thanks for being rude.
My intention was simply explaining that there's no exploit involved - nothing more, because people ( e.g. fptje and you ) keep on refering to it as an "exploit".
thanks for reading my post
[QUOTE=Leystryku;50351561]dude are you being serious did you understand my post at all?
I did read posts in the last 2 pages, but thanks for being rude.
My intention was simply explaining that there's no exploit involved - nothing more, because people ( e.g. fptje and you ) keep on refering to it as an "exploit".
thanks for reading my post[/QUOTE]
you pointed out something that we've already all stated multiple times.
and no I did [b]not[/b] call it an exploit.
I made an entire essay on how there is a difference between exploits and functionality at the top of this page
and now you just proved my point that even if you did read it, you didn't understand it
please, show me where I called it an exploit. fptje is the one calling it an "exploit" not me.
[QUOTE=jackool;50351594]you pointed out something that we've already all stated multiple times.
and no I did [b]not[/b] call it an exploit.
I made an entire essay on how there is a difference between exploits and functionality at the top of this page
and now you just proved my point that even if you did read it, you didn't understand it
please, show me where I called it an exploit. fptje is the one calling it an "exploit" not me.[/QUOTE]
You didn't write "it is an exploit", but you did compare it to an exploit, even indirectly saying it's one.
I skipped to your tl;dr after the half of your post.
[QUOTE=jackool;50351594]Using something not as intended (or doing something in a "hacky way") can result in awesome things that may not be possible otherwise.[/QUOTE]
Using things differently from their original intention is how most exploits work ( most because, a new developer might not recognize vulnerabilities ).
Let me give you a few examples:
As I found the net exploit to crash all gmod servers instantly - instead of using the net system to send files I made it create a infinite loop. As I found an exploit to read files everywhere, it was intended for reading files only in the gmod directionary - not anywhere else. Or as I found a bug in the joining order, allowing me to make the server allocate memory & use up a extra player slot for nobody - essentially allowing me to make the server unjoinable.
I can give plenty of examples for my thesis.
[QUOTE=Leystryku;50351657]You didn't write "it is an exploit", but you did compare it to an exploit, even indirectly saying it's one.
I skipped to your tl;dr after the half of your post.
Using things differently from their original intention is how most exploits work ( most because, a new developer might not recognize vulnerabilities ).
Let me give you a few examples:
As I found the net exploit to crash all gmod servers instantly - instead of using the net system to send files I made it create a infinite loop. As I found an exploit to read files everywhere, it was intended for reading files only in the gmod directionary - not anywhere else. Or as I found a bug in the joining order, allowing me to make the server allocate memory & use up a extra player slot for nobody - essentially allowing me to make the server unjoinable.
I can give plenty of examples for my thesis.[/QUOTE]
nah dude, I see an exploit as something like Valve's terrible spray system being used to upload/download files maliciously. the term exploit to me means something bad. what you just explained is an exploit to me, yes.
however, people using a function to close the menu isn't an exploit. like I stated, it's someone using it not the way it was intended. I don't see that as an exploit whatsoever.
and if I came off as rude, sorry. but I went over pretty much every aspect and point of view already regarding this so I am a bit heated on the subject. I'm not trying to be a dick here so I'm sorry
the only thing I haven't went over is there are a bunch of ways you can block the console so it's kind of just a losing battle anyway. if they remove those functions and block those console commands, you could still use HUDShouldDraw to block/break the console. you could pop up panels when they hit the console key and block their view from the console. there's probably a bunch of ways you can block people from using the console. I just don't see it being worth the time to prevent it.
and in regards to the escape menu, from a quick search I found these 4 scriptfodder scripts...
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/690/custom-escape-menu[/url]
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/1659/3d-escape-menu[/url]
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/1872/jarvin-the-dashboard-escape-menu[/url]
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/2223/iceescape-a-clean-animated-escape-menu-replacement[/url]
... and these are people making profit off it - there are probably a bunch of people utilizing the functionality already. maybe for other purposes too, not just custom escape menus.
why do we want to remove something that has already been in use for awhile? just because some facepunch users find it annoying?
[b]Edit:[/b] this is my definition of an exploit, when functionality is used in a malicious way:
[img]http://devup.me/up/mg3AspMr.png[/img]
Quick question. This thread has surprisingly frequent arguments about what should be added/removed/blocked/changed. Most notably the server browser. Has any of these arguments ever ended up in the game?
[QUOTE=NeatNit;50351712]Quick question. This thread has surprisingly frequent arguments about what should be added/removed/blocked/changed. Most notably the server browser. Has any of these arguments ever ended up in the game?[/QUOTE]
probably not, me and my friends were actually joking about this earlier.
I see these arguments all the time in this thread that usually go nowhere and I just decided to join in. debate is fun!
especially when it's debate over a game that I've played for like 10 years. whether or not my opinion is wrong or right, I decided to start chiming in here.
[QUOTE=NeatNit;50351712]Quick question. This thread has surprisingly frequent arguments about what should be added/removed/blocked/changed. Most notably the server browser. Has any of these arguments ever ended up in the game?[/QUOTE]
Most of the arguments about the server browser in the past due to garry not wanting it to be changed - and it's his game. IIrc Willox wanted to try to solve the geoip issue and I gave him some suggestion, but as far as I know the only thing which has been "changed" is that p2p servers were added and they probably appear on there.
[QUOTE=jackool;50351696]nah dude, I see an exploit as something like Valve's terrible spray system being used to upload/download files maliciously. the term exploit to me means something bad. what you just explained is an exploit to me, yes.
however, people using a function to close the menu isn't an exploit. like I stated, it's someone using it not the way it was intended. I don't see that as an exploit whatsoever.
and if I came off as rude, sorry. but I went over pretty much every aspect and point of view already regarding this so I am a bit heated on the subject. I'm not trying to be a dick here so I'm sorry
the only thing I haven't went over is there are a bunch of ways you can block the console so it's kind of just a losing battle anyway. if they remove those functions and block those console commands, you could still use HUDShouldDraw to block/break the console. you could pop up panels when they hit the console key and block their view from the console. there's probably a bunch of ways you can block people from using the console. I just don't see it being worth the time to prevent it.
and in regards to the escape menu, from a quick search I found these 4 scriptfodder scripts...
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/690/custom-escape-menu[/url]
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/1659/3d-escape-menu[/url]
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/1872/jarvin-the-dashboard-escape-menu[/url]
[url]https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/2223/iceescape-a-clean-animated-escape-menu-replacement[/url]
... and these are people making profit off it - there are probably a bunch of people utilizing the functionality already. maybe for other purposes too, not just custom escape menus.
why do we want to remove something that has already been in use for awhile? just because some facepunch users find it annoying?
[b]Edit:[/b] this is my definition of an exploit, when functionality is used in a malicious way:
[img]http://devup.me/up/mg3AspMr.png[/img][/QUOTE]
First of about your edit, that definition "exploit" states that if functionality can be used maliciously it's an exploit - which fits to this, also would fit to every client crash exploit and even file.Write because it can be used to fill up hdds with junk.
This is also why I wrote most exploits and mentioned new developers who are unable to recognize vulnerabilities :v. Lets say a function was added on the web which allows site owners to disable you from closing your browser until you shut down your pc.
It's the same, but at a way greater scale.
It would be profitizable too and you can bet that lots of website owners would pay money to have that ability (in regards to the scriptfodder example).
There might be people using it to create "website escape menus" and others who sell those - but there would also be people who would use it to force users to stay on their websites.
Therefore - the positives and the negatives have to be compared.
If the positives outweigh the negatives, the function would have to be removed.
The positive things might be:
People make money using it
It could be used to make websites more immersive
The negatives:
Lots of confused users
Lots of different ways of leaving websites - not intuitive at all.
Bad website owners could force users to stay on their sites, forcing them to shut down their pcs.
There might be other ways microsoft hasn't noticed yet which allow websites to do the same, even if they remove it.
by that argumentation, the function should be removed.
The positive and negatives can be outweighted for stuff while loops too, even though it's obvious that while loops have more positives.
[QUOTE=Leystryku;50351817]Most of the arguments about the server browser in the past due to garry not wanting it to be changed - and it's his game. IIrc Willox wanted to try to solve the geoip issue and I gave him some suggestion, but as far as I know the only thing which has been "changed" is that p2p servers were added and they probably appear on there.[/quote]
I really hate that Garry's opinion means anything now. This a community based game - we'd be nowhere without the community. Garry's opinion shouldn't really matter, but it sadly does.
[QUOTE=Leystryku;50351817]
First of about your edit, that definition "exploit" fits to this and also would fit to every client crash exploit and even file.Write because it can be used to fill up hdds with junk - because the functionality can still be used in a malicious way.
[/quote]
Yes that's what I see as an exploit. That's just my way of viewing the term exploit though.
I never said we should be blocking every exploit possible or adding failsafes for them.
That just goes with the "waste of the devs time" statement I made.
I guess what you're saying is there's a difference between using an exploit maliciously and not. I get it, I just don't view the word in that sense.
[QUOTE=Leystryku;50351817]
This is also why I wrote most exploits and mentioned new developers who are unable to recognize vulnerabilities :v. Lets say a function was added on the web which allows site owners to disable you from closing your browser until you shut down your pc.
It's the same, but at a way greater scale.
It would be profitizable too and you can bet that lots of website owners would pay money to have that ability (in regards to the scriptfodder example).
[/quote]
I'm aware of this too. Exploits can be profitable. [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_V7xucQLbo]Serenity was a prime example on the malicious side.[/url]
Now how bad the exploit is comes into play. An exploit like the one used in Serenity affects any and all servers.
Using file.Write to spam a client's folder only affects the server they join. So yeah, I understand that.
Escape menu and console overrides also only take place in the server they join as well.
[QUOTE=Leystryku;50351817]
There might be people using it to create "website escape menus" and others who sell those - but there would also be people who would use it to force users to stay on their websites.
Therefore - the positives and the negatives have to be compared.
If the positives outweigh the negatives, the function would have to be removed.
The positive things might be:
People make money using it
It could be used to make websites more immersive
The negatives:
Lots of confused users, lots of different ways of leaving websites - not intuitive at all.
Bad website owners could force users to stay on their sites, forcing them to shut down their pcs.
There might be other ways microsoft hasn't noticed yet which allow websites to do the same, even if they remove it.
by that argumentation, the function should be removed.[/QUOTE]
I agree with the whole "positives outweigh the negatives" situation.
That's what we're debating here, whether the positives actually do outweigh the negatives or not.
Sorry if my first reply to you was harsh. It just seemed like you read two posts and made a reply. I was wrong, sorry.
Again, I'm not trying to wave my dick around in everyone's face and say "FUK U ESCAPE MENU CONSOLE OVERRIDE MASTER RACE!!1" or something.
I'm just putting in my opinion instead of staying quiet like I have for the past 10 years of being a member. Tired of lurking. Isn't that kinda the point of this thread?
[url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1160575&p=36411924&viewfull=1#post36411924]I used to be a complete retard.[/url] I used to help Seth. I used to abuse exploits and go load up hacks and blah blah. So I view things from both the bad and good side.
I've changed, learned a lot, and grew up since then and even own some top ranked websites on Google. [url=https://www.reddit.com/r/playark/comments/3fj2k5/psa_arkserversnet_will_remove_any_negative/ctp80ny]I learned how to listen to community majority.[/url]
[url=http://devolved.us/about/]I created a Valve-esque economy in GMod where people traded hundreds of dollars worth of crap for pixels.[/url] I've done a lot of things since then.
So I'm just here spewing various opinions. They might be shitty opinions, but I can't adjust/change my shitty opinion without putting it somewhere for people to fight it.
I do now think they probably should be removed from the "average GMod user" point of view, just not my own. But by no means are these functions "an exploit". They are functions built into the game for modders to utilize.
I need to stop on this escape menu subject now though. There's really nothing more to be said other than "It's being removed" or "It isn't" anyway (or nothing, like usual). So this is the last time I'll be posting about it.
creating a server convar with FCVAR_REPLICATED in a shared file will work fine (value gets synced between server and client)
HOWEVER
When the value changes while the client is disconnected, it's not synced when the client joins and instead they get the default value.
The convar doesn't seem to exist before it gets created on the client (which means I can't get the data from it) but when I create the convar on the client it will use the default value. When does the server send the convar data? Does it even get sent?
Is this a bug that might get fixed in future or am I doing something wrong?
[QUOTE=Arizard;50356129]creating a server convar with FCVAR_REPLICATED in a shared file will work fine (value gets synced between server and client)
HOWEVER
When the value changes while the client is disconnected, it's not synced when the client joins and instead they get the default value.
The convar doesn't seem to exist before it gets created on the client (which means I can't get the data from it) but when I create the convar on the client it will use the default value. When does the server send the convar data? Does it even get sent?
Is this a bug that might get fixed in future or am I doing something wrong?[/QUOTE]
Should already be fixed on the dev branch.
Does anyone know why RENDERGROUP_BOTH makes ENT:Draw call twice per frame and can it be optimized?
Do we have any official word on what was changed with mcore over the past week or so? (What the facepunch bot was reporting)
[QUOTE=thegrb93;50366806]Does anyone know why RENDERGROUP_BOTH makes ENT:Draw call twice per frame and can it be optimized?[/QUOTE]
It's quite obvious, RENDERGROUP_BOTH includes both render groups, OPAQUE and TRANSLUCENT.
If render group is set to opaque, ENT:Draw will be called.
If it is set to translucent, ENT:DrawTranslucent will be called instead.
If it is set to both, both will be called.
Now, the default action for ENT:DrawTranslucent is to call ENT:Draw:
[url]https://github.com/garrynewman/garrysmod/blob/97ee4db09c7e8b503e038567601df76b87a3774a/garrysmod/gamemodes/base/entities/entities/base_anim.lua#L45-L52[/url]
There's nothing to "optimize", this is how it should be.
So I need to move code I don't want running twice per frame to DrawTranslucent. okay thx.
[editline]21st May 2016[/editline]
I added that to the wiki
[QUOTE=thegrb93;50366806]Does anyone know why RENDERGROUP_BOTH makes ENT:Draw call twice per frame and can it be optimized?[/QUOTE]
This reminds of the rendering bug that never got fixed after GMod 13.
Here I made a little video to show it:
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6SDPGyA-KI[/media]
[QUOTE=vrej;50368813]This reminds of the rendering bug that never got fixed after GMod 13.
Here I made a little video to show it:
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6SDPGyA-KI[/media][/QUOTE]
You should try this on the dev branch. There were a few changes to how IK is handled.
[thumb]http://scrnsht.me/u/fJb/raw[/thumb]
I can run with this ridiculous amount of NPCs and hit 30fps (~60 with queued rendering and cl_threaded_bone_setup enabled.)
[QUOTE=Willox;50368848]You should try this on the dev branch. There were a few changes to how IK is handled.
[thumb]http://scrnsht.me/u/fJb/raw[/thumb]
I can run with this ridiculous amount of NPCs and hit 30fps (~60 with queued rendering and cl_threaded_bone_setup enabled.)[/QUOTE]
I have noticed default HL2 NPCs perform a lot better then SNPCs, so it really isn't a big surprise that you can spawn a lot more of them without lag. But I will try and see how it's in the dev branch. Also forgot to mention, in the video each pile of soldiers is 20 and I spawn 100 in total
EDIT: Lag is still there
[QUOTE=Willox;50368848]You should try this on the dev branch. There were a few changes to how IK is handled.
[thumb]http://scrnsht.me/u/fJb/raw[/thumb]
I can run with this ridiculous amount of NPCs and hit 30fps (~60 with queued rendering and cl_threaded_bone_setup enabled.)[/QUOTE]
So does cl_threaded_bone_setup no longer crash the game when enabled? I recall that being the main issue with mcore. Also has AA been fixed with mcore?
[QUOTE=vrej;50368888]I have noticed default HL2 NPCs perform a lot better then SNPCs, so it really isn't a big surprise that you can spawn a lot more of them without lag. But I will try and see how it's in the dev branch. Also forgot to mention, in the video each pile of soldiers is 20 and I spawn 100 in total
EDIT: Lag is still there[/QUOTE]
You'll need to provide a proper way to reproduce the issue.
[QUOTE=AJ10017;50369794]So does cl_threaded_bone_setup no longer crash the game when enabled? I recall that being the main issue with mcore. Also has AA been fixed with mcore?[/QUOTE]
None of those changes are live on any Steam branch. Can't say I ever noticed an issue with AA.
[editline]23rd May 2016[/editline]
Do you mean render.PushFilterMag?
[QUOTE=Willox;50375820]You'll need to provide a proper way to reproduce the issue.
None of those changes are live on any Steam branch. Can't say I ever noticed an issue with AA.
[editline]23rd May 2016[/editline]
Do you mean render.PushFilterMag?[/QUOTE]
hard to notice in the video but its like stuff drawn in lua cant decide if it wants AA enabled or disabled. this also happens in derma menus, especially the spawn menu
[video=youtube;VdOr0FuKpwA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdOr0FuKpwA[/video]
[QUOTE=AJ10017;50376686]hard to notice in the video but its like stuff drawn in lua cant decide if it wants AA enabled or disabled. this also happens in derma menus, especially the spawn menu
[video=youtube;VdOr0FuKpwA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdOr0FuKpwA[/video][/QUOTE]
I think I've already fixed this on my local copy of gmod. Now's probably a good time for anybody else who thinks they know of any issues with multicore rendering to mention them.
[QUOTE=Willox;50376688]I think I've already fixed this on my local copy of gmod. Now's probably a good time for anybody else who thinks they know of any issues with multicore rendering to mention them.[/QUOTE]
haven't tried it on the dev branch, but doing some [img]http://wiki.garrysmod.com/favicon.ico[/img] [url=http://wiki.garrysmod.com/page/render/RenderView]render.RenderView[/url] outside of the pure screen realm crashes it
[QUOTE=Willox;50376688]I think I've already fixed this on my local copy of gmod. Now's probably a good time for anybody else who thinks they know of any issues with multicore rendering to mention them.[/QUOTE]
thats amazing willox, you think it will be on the dev branch soon?
[QUOTE=Giraffen93;50376714]haven't tried it on the dev branch, but doing some [img]http://wiki.garrysmod.com/favicon.ico[/img] [url=http://wiki.garrysmod.com/page/render/RenderView]render.RenderView[/url] outside of the pure screen realm crashes it[/QUOTE]
I don't know what you mean by 'pure screen realm', but render.RenderView has had a bunch of changes and should actually see performance improvements when mcore is on now rather than the opposite + the occasional crash.
[QUOTE=AJ10017;50376718]thats amazing willox, you think it will be on the dev branch soon?[/QUOTE]
When I'm happy with it.
[QUOTE=Willox;50376724]I don't know what you mean by 'pure screen realm', but render.RenderView has had a bunch of changes and should actually see performance improvements when mcore is on now rather than the opposite + the occasional crash.[/QUOTE]
yeah i figured
doing it in render targets / draw hooks, and on panels are the ones that crashes for me
[QUOTE=Giraffen93;50376755]yeah i figured
doing it in render targets / draw hooks, and on panels are the ones that crashes for me[/QUOTE]
It used to crash when rendering a font glyph for the first time. Probably that.
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