[QUOTE=code_gs;46839672]1. Donations are an unreliable income, [B]*therefore*[/B], someone who has worked hard on a gamemode or addon for months may not even see a cent for it.[/QUOTE]
Just to put this into perspective, I created the [URL="http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=118824086"]Cinema gamemode[/URL] on workshop and I'm pretty sure I've only received maybe $2 in donations over 2 years or so. However, I don't really advertise a donation link besides on the [URL="http://cinema.pixeltailgames.com/"]Cinema official webpage[/URL].
From my experience with donations, people really only donate if there is some sort of incentive for them to do so. Which makes whether it's actually a donation questionable.
[QUOTE=code_gs;46839672]1. Donations are an unreliable income, [B]*therefore*[/B], someone who has worked hard on a gamemode or addon for months may not even see a cent for it.
[/QUOTE]
Since when do you have to get payed after you make a big addon?
Does CAP ring a bell?
[QUOTE=logan2611;46846556]Since when do you have to get payed after you make a big addon?
Does CAP ring a bell?[/QUOTE]
You should be thankful that people make big addons for free like that; people who spend months - and in CAP's case, years - deserve to have the right like anyone else to choose for a free or commercial release. They don't "have" to do anything, it's a capitalistic choice, and as a consumer, you choose to buy it or not. Complaining about it doesn't contribute to anything but stripping the rights of a producer and consumer.
A lot of people have that opinion, but you'll have to live with it, that's just business. Also Garrysmod would be very dull without these services IMO.
Well, Scriptfodder and Coderhire, these websites obviousely has different sides on this.
On one side, it's great. People get to put their addons online for a cost and get money out of it. Besides, the buyer of the addon can't get scammed as it is all automated. Also, developers can now put effort in their work and put it online so they can get theirselves something nice. I have never seen something like VCMod, and Freeman put alot of work in it. I don't think he'd ever just give it away to everyone. Without CH or SF there would be no "Trustable" way to buy VCMod.
On the other hand it is very, very bad. New players to Garry's Mod think: "er meh gewd money $_$" and learn Lua to create a [B]SHIT[/B] addon, put it on Scriptfodder with screenshots that show mostly other addons, or the best parts of their addons, and [B]still manage to get fucking money.[/B] This is something that really pisses [B]me[/B] of. New people can just learn LUA, put a shit addon online for $3 and it is actually being bought. There are addons with >100 sales that are full of grammatical issues, security exploits, all those things.
One of these addons caused a whole economy reset at the server I was, because it had an exploit where everyone could get >2b per hour. Good game people with 1 months online time.
Yes, the whole purpose of the old-school vanilla servers have been ruined. That is true, and that is too bad.
Coderhire/Scriptfodder are the least of GMod's problems, the problem right now is that there's no incentive to make a new server with a gamemode outside of either roleplay ( in general ), TTT / Murder ( let's face it, they're the same thing ) or sandbox ( yeah GMod has this gamemode ).
Gamemode / Server discoverability is the huge issue at the moment, and the really fucking toxic community.
If you create a server with a new gamemode, no one ever will ever find it, because it'll be pushed deep down the gamemode list.
Even if your gamemode can somehow be seen by anyone, they won't be able to see your server because Valve added a retarded region check that can't be removed easily.
Let's just say you manage to make it trough all that shit, your server is the first ( or popular ) one with the gamemode, enjoy getting ddossed to shit just because someone had nothing else to do in their spare time.
So what do people resort to? Make yet another fucking roleplay server with a bunch of shitty popular addons on it, add "donations" and call it a day.
[editline]3rd January 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=Techdaan;46846906]On the other hand it is very, very bad. New players to Garry's Mod think: "er meh gewd money $_$" and learn Lua to create a [B]SHIT[/B] addon, put it on Scriptfodder with screenshots that show mostly other addons, or the best parts of their addons, and [B]still manage to get fucking money.[/B] This is something that really pisses [B]me[/B] of. New people can just learn LUA, put a shit addon online for $3 and it is actually being bought. There are addons with >100 sales that are full of grammatical issues, security exploits, all those things.
[/QUOTE]
The problem there is that these sites have a low entry barrier, so almost anything goes, you should see the drama in the official threads when a shitty coder gets their stuff refused because it's not up to standards.
And so the standards get lower and lower.
These things want to make me make a Hello World script and get $500 with it by selling it for $50. Players get "Hello World" printed in their console if they join :D
Would be pretty cool.
[QUOTE=Jvs;46846969]Coderhire/Scriptfodder are the least of GMod's problems, the problem right now is that there's no incentive to make a new server with a gamemode outside of either roleplay ( in general ), TTT / Murder ( let's face it, they're the same thing ) or sandbox ( yeah GMod has this gamemode ).
Gamemode / Server discoverability is the huge issue at the moment, and the really fucking toxic community.
If you create a server with a new gamemode, no one ever will ever find it, because it'll be pushed deep down the gamemode list.
Even if your gamemode can somehow be seen by anyone, they won't be able to see your server because Valve added a retarded region check that can't be removed easily.
Let's just say you manage to make it trough all that shit, your server is the first ( or popular ) one with the gamemode, enjoy getting ddossed to shit just because someone had nothing else to do in their spare time.
So what do people resort to? Make yet another fucking roleplay server with a bunch of shitty popular addons on it, add "donations" and call it a day.
[editline]3rd January 2015[/editline]
The problem there is that these sites have a low entry barrier, so almost anything goes, you should see the drama in the official threads when a shitty coder gets their stuff refused because it's not up to standards.
And so the standards get lower and lower.[/QUOTE]
ily Jvs, you've completely hit the nail on the head here
I'll be honest, I feel myself slowly drifting away from the gmod community, which is fucking super disheartening, because of the lack of new gamemodes and RP just completely dominating the server browser
[QUOTE=NiandraLades;46847126]ily Jvs, you've completely hit the nail on the head here
I'll be honest, I feel myself slowly drifting away from the gmod community, which is fucking super disheartening, because of the lack of new gamemodes and RP just completely dominating the server browser[/QUOTE]
Make a gamemode Niandra. Make it popular.
An addon you purchase from scriptfodder is only for supplemental purposes for your server. None of them are necessary to run a server.
I think alot of scripts are underpriced actually, I see alot of good stuff literally get chewed down to nothing because people feel entitled to ridiculously low prices and the developers accept to it.
You don't NEED an addon from scriptfodder, you use it in hope to improve your server I get that, but you have to spend money to make money ACCEPT THAT.
Also the lower prices only contribute more to those 10 minute addons, because why would anyone want to spend a week making an awesome addon if it's going to be chewed down to $3.99?
Like stated above, you're going to pay for skill that's not common. Becoming fluent in LUA doesn't come easy, it takes lots of practice. I would say it's undervalued,
but that's just my two cents.
[QUOTE=NiandraLades;46847126]ily Jvs, you've completely hit the nail on the head here
I'll be honest, I feel myself slowly drifting away from the gmod community, which is fucking super disheartening, because of the lack of new gamemodes and RP just completely dominating the server browser[/QUOTE]
Thats why I really don't enjoy playing Gmod, I love coding for it thoguh.
I tend to think of scripts on scriptfodder as DLC. I think that is all I have to say about my opinion :p.
EDIT: Sure you don't have to have DLC, but your/your server's potential could be increased by it.
RayChamp, I, myself am a developer, and if I see things on ScriptFodder I am like: This could have easily been better, why not spend 5 minutes time on improving your damned addon?
Its fun to go through scriptfodder and remake the 5 minute 3 dollar sweps
also just looking through the pages of addons and saying "Wtf someone is charging 7 dollars for this piece of shit?"
If anything, Scriptfodder is benefiting the game. It's not like you absolutely need to get scriptfodder addons for your gmod to work. It's meant to be there for server owners who want to add more to their server.
I can't tell you how many people use scriptfodder and how well it actually works.
[QUOTE=VictorianCrow;46859616]If anything, Scriptfodder is benefiting the game. It's not like you absolutely need to get scriptfodder addons for your gmod to work. It's meant to be there for server owners who want to add more to their server.
I can't tell you how many people use scriptfodder and how well it actually works.[/QUOTE]
except that's not what happens
EVERY SINGLE rp server I'll join will have a good 13 script fodder addons
as someone who has worked on a few gmod addons, albeit not coding but 3d modelling/animating/general model compiling what is the problem with seeking payment for your work? sure people are charging for quick lua jobs but if people are buying it then it obviously has met it's value for that buyer. '
[QUOTE=nettsam;46859719]except that's not what happens
EVERY SINGLE rp server I'll join will have a good 13 script fodder addons[/QUOTE]
There's still a few out there that don't.
[QUOTE=nettsam;46859719]except that's not what happens
EVERY SINGLE rp server I'll join will have a good 13 script fodder addons[/QUOTE]
Not my from-scratch gamemode (RP)
[QUOTE=Techdaan;46870294]Not my from-scratch gamemode (RP)[/QUOTE]
I swear everyone and their mother who makes an RP gamemode says the exact same thing :v:
[QUOTE=NiandraLades;46870312]I swear everyone and their mother who makes an RP gamemode says the exact same thing :v:[/QUOTE]
With the lack of creativity going on, it ends up as most people trying to replicate a popular community. I will even admin i've done this before.
If people could give decent, producable ideas i would be happy to give it a go at making something new.
Most servers are now;
A) A copy of a popular community ( KDG -> ZARP )
B) DarkRP Renamed, Slapped with a few addons
C) "JOHNS DARKRP| CUSTOM | 50+ VIP JOBS | 2 NON VIP JOBS | CUSTOM SCRIPTZ | CARS | M9K | FAS2 | TDMCARS | LWCARS | SGMCARS | MORE CUSTOM | FASTDL" - You get the picture
GMod needs something new!
10000's of rp gamemodes.
I'm really not to creative when coming to making new things.
[QUOTE=AIX-Who;46871004]With the lack of creativity going on, it ends up as most people trying to replicate a popular community. I will even admin i've done this before.
If people could give decent, producable ideas i would be happy to give it a go at making something new.
Most servers are now;
A) A copy of a popular community ( KDG -> ZARP )
B) DarkRP Renamed, Slapped with a few addons
C) "JOHNS DARKRP| CUSTOM | 50+ VIP JOBS | 2 NON VIP JOBS | CUSTOM SCRIPTZ | CARS | M9K | FAS2 | TDMCARS | LWCARS | SGMCARS | MORE CUSTOM | FASTDL" - You get the picture
GMod needs something new!
10000's of rp gamemodes.
I'm really not to creative when coming to making new things.[/QUOTE]
I try to keep my server as creative as possible, but that is hard if people don't want that kind of stuff.
[QUOTE=NiandraLades;46870312]I swear everyone and their mother who makes an RP gamemode says the exact same thing :v:[/QUOTE]
Yeah...So you say that I create a gamemode by myself, spending hundreds of hours non-stop development to fuck it up with a low-end scriptfucker addon? Go screw yourself mate.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Flaming" - Big Dumb American))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Techdaan;46889531]Yeah...So you say that I create a gamemode by myself, spending hundreds of hours non-stop development to fuck it up with a low-end scriptfucker addon? Go screw yourself mate.[/QUOTE]
I doubt you have the brain cells to develop a gamemode with an attitude like that.
You probably have a hissy fit when you wonder where to put init.lua
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Flaming" - Big Dumb American))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Phoenixf129;46890799]I doubt you have the brain cells to develop a gamemode with an attitude like that.
You probably have a hissy fit when you wonder where to put init.lua[/QUOTE]
Sorry? I do know where to put what, and I do know how to program in Lua and in some other programming languages too. I might not be the best, nor I am the worst. I am saying that if you make something, that you can't just mess it up with some cheap addons that give your server and your work a bad reputation. Also, please shut up about me, as you barely know me. One post doesn't determine what a person is like.
[QUOTE=Jvs;46846969]If you create a server with a new gamemode, no one ever will ever find it, because it'll be pushed deep down the gamemode list.
Even if your gamemode can somehow be seen by anyone, they won't be able to see your server because Valve added a retarded region check that can't be removed easily.
Let's just say you manage to make it trough all that shit, your server is the first ( or popular ) one with the gamemode, enjoy getting ddossed to shit just because someone had nothing else to do in their spare time.[/QUOTE] Yeah it sucks how new gamemodes are often attacked by ddossers because they're easy targets since there aren't hundreds of other servers already, like there is with TTT or RP.
The only communities ScriptFodder affects is DarkRP and TTT.
Don't make DarkRP and TTT servers and you're fine.
[QUOTE=Karp;46896147]The only communities ScriptFodder affects is DarkRP and TTT.
Don't make DarkRP and TTT servers and you're fine.[/QUOTE]
You forgot, Murder/Prophunt
Scriptfodder is not ruining garry's mod.
The people who don't mind scriptfodder addons aren't affected by their widespread use and it makes no difference to them. In fact, many players enjoy this because each server has something familiar and it's easier for them to get started (DeagleLogs, rPhone, VCMod, Pointshop Stuff).
Then there are players who despise scriptfodder addons and complain about servers that use them, yet aren't skilled enough or motivated enough to produce their own content and change the community for the better.
Then there are developers and server owners who despise scriptfodder, and DO possess the skill to produce their own unique content, but continue to tarnish their community's reputation with an elitist attitude (see: Techdaan).
Scriptfodder, Coderflow, GenericScriptSellingWebsite23, etc etc are simply tools used by developers to earn money from the hard work they do. Simply owning servers or communities is an unreliable source of income due to the sporadic nature of donations. If they produce 5-minute scripts and earn $2 for every sale, why should it matter to you?
If you really care about the gmod community you'd do something about it - like learning to code, teaching others how to code, producing open-source addons, or even hosting a server in order to increase the number of niche servers out there which are currently overwhelmed by the big scriptfodder communities. If you're just here to complain about the state of things, what's the point of being here at all?
I understand where OP is coming from, but I don't agree with him on the standards of 'What I am saying is that I shouldn't have to pay at all.'
If a script is half decent, and they haven't spent 5 minutes on it and are asking for like $20, then yeah, they deserve the money that is coming from them. But they way I see it is, you can't go onto a server now without seeing the same stuff from Script Fodder installed... Constantly. It's pretty amazing the first time you see it, and you are like 'Damn, that's a pretty neat script, makes me want to play on this server.' And then you join another server, and then another and you realise that either half the servers have a leaked copy installed, or half the servers have bought it, and we all know what one is most likely here when you have 12 year olds running servers.
Either way, ScriptFodder doesn't really bother me, more the server owners who take no care in setting up their servers and just chuck the scripts into their server folder on default settings and expect their server to become super popular.
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