[QUOTE=count23;35959284]For free work done by people in their spare time. Yes, I find them fine. If this were professional work done for a newer game (or even hobby work for a newer game) I'd find them woefully inadequate. But the source engine requires some quality sacrifice (or perceived sacrifice) to maintain performance. Even newer source games like L4D2 and Portal still have an unusually low polycount and texture quality for models compared to it's counterparts. It's simply a matter of perception.
Now when you say problems with textures, I see nothing wrong with them except UVs are a little displaced on some edges, not following edge loops on others, some obvious seams, and most of them appear to be 512x512 rather then a higher resolution. But from what I can tell, that appears to be normal for source smds and vtfs. whether that's changing in Gmod13 and higher resolution textures and larger polycounts can be handled, I dont know.
To answer your second question, I get burned out with things very easy, last time I checked out gmod was in December when CAP had no progress being made and AlexALX had gates with groups as an independant addon, if you requested help in the last 6 months, I doubt I ever saw it. Not to mention I was working on a number of short film projects that required assets to be built and couldnt divert my time.
I suppose the only real question is, if I were to help (assuming I dont get other paying work in the interrim), what kind of polycount is the max per model you'd want and what texture resolution do you expect? (still 512x512 or 1024x1024 or higher?)[/QUOTE]
Ah yes than I see your point of view! Alright fair enough sorry for my outrageous opinion there!
The texture's meh they suck they aren't really decent made and put allot of work in to them they require more attention and imo just more detail this is where Baked Normals come in with the help of baked normals and baked AO's it could be really really much easier and way better texture's just with a simple help of a decent model and Baked Normal. Currently most of them are in 1024² resolution though source can handle up to 4096².
Ah yea that could be true our job requests have been going around from the start of cap but could always gone lost in the many posts every day on both this thread and the forum!
If I'm right it can handle upon 50k poly's though its never recommended to go this high the puddle jumper Iziraider/Zsolt made is around 22K if I'm correct, but depending on the quality that requires to be modeled in to it I assume something around 7-12-15K is a decent poly count!
For example the gates are currently "18k" though imo they are way to low poly on some parts and than other parts just way to much detail so a good example of bad optimizing! Though the rings and ring cover are quite optimized and are around 2K still think they should be redone model and texture side!
Texture resolution depends on how you work if it is or in 1 single uv-map packed lets say for the gate than it could be a 2048² texture though if you do it like it is currently with separating parts they could be each 512 or 1024 depending on how you do the uv's and how the bake looks like. Will you'e doing the texture's your self or are you asking this for the bake's ?
Either way if you're still interested we currently are in need of the very basics of Stargate Models and those are:
- The Stargate
- DHD
- The Rings, Ring Cover "ground plate" and Ring Panel
Those are mainly the things we should focus on for first and than we could see what we do with everything! Thanks for your interest.
[QUOTE=Boba Fett;35959565]Ah yes than I see your point of view! Alright fair enough sorry for my outrageous opinion there!
The texture's meh they suck they aren't really decent made and put allot of work in to them they require more attention and imo just more detail this is where Baked Normals come in with the help of baked normals and baked AO's it could be really really much easier and way better texture's just with a simple help of a decent model and Baked Normal. Currently most of them are in 1024² resolution though source can handle up to 4096².
Ah yea that could be true our job requests have been going around from the start of cap but could always gone lost in the many posts every day on both this thread and the forum!
If I'm right it can handle upon 50k poly's though its never recommended to go this high the puddle jumper Iziraider/Zsolt made is around 22K if I'm correct, but depending on the quality that requires to be modeled in to it I assume something around 7-12-15K is a decent poly count!
For example the gates are currently "18k" though imo they are way to low poly on some parts and than other parts just way to much detail so a good example of bad optimizing! Though the rings and ring cover are quite optimized and are around 2K still think they should be redone model and texture side!
Texture resolution depends on how you work if it is or in 1 single uv-map packed lets say for the gate than it could be a 2048² texture though if you do it like it is currently with separating parts they could be each 512 or 1024 depending on how you do the uv's and how the bake looks like. Will you'e doing the texture's your self or are you asking this for the bake's ?
Either way if you're still interested we currently are in need of the very basics of Stargate Models and those are:
- The Stargate
- DHD
- The Rings, Ring Cover "ground plate" and Ring Panel
Those are mainly the things we should focus on for first and than we could see what we do with everything! Thanks for your interest.[/QUOTE]
That makes more sense. :) Seems like we both had different opinions of what acceptable was for the models. do you really want the gates rescaled in size in gmod? The "real" gates were 15feet in diameter (Still checking if that transit space or total diameter), that comes out to 180 source units in diameter. It may be a bit too big for the varous environments?
I think the simplest solution here would be to build some hi-def gates and scale them down for the 3 or 5 LODs you want while using the hi-def version for normal mapping and AO passes. Then theoretically if you can hammer out all the physical detail into a normal map you'd really only need a simple metallic texture that can be repeated over the 9 segments at 2048x2048.
I'll take a crack and do some simple tests between Maya and source over the next few days, if I can pull off results I like, I'll take a crack at a hi-def SG1 gate and send you the results. (I'd also love to rebuild the Gate Glider and Destiny shuttle down the line. 50k is a good amount of polys to play with :P )
I still wanna build a proper Icarus and SGC gate ramp tho, the ones in the current pack are the wrong scale (Icarus should be twice as long as SGC according to the stage 5 plans I have for both base layouts).
[b]Rev 258 changes:
Added:[/b]
- New wire input "Smoke" on animated SGC ramp, usage: 1 enable smoke, -1 disable smoke, 0 - default mode (when gate active - enable smoke).
- Now wire input "Activation Alarm" on SGC ramp have also second mode (with value 2) - activate alarm sound when gate not activated.
[b]Fixed:[/b]
- SGC alarm sound, wrong sound path.
- Asgard transported not spawning in multiplayer by non-admins (happens on some servers).
Hey, didnt you guys say that in the legacy addon system for 13 doesn't work for menus or fonts?
i was messing around in 13 and decided to add cap on again and see what happned...
Pressing E on sg/rings wont do anything but i was able to use kino remote divice for dialing... the menu it brought up was a bit glitchy but the fonts were working EDIT!: This bug is only on gatespawnergates
Pic
[IMG]http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/7325/newbitmapimageaa.png[/IMG]
I had to resize it because the file was too big for my image uploading site, anyone know a better one?
[QUOTE=Woogoo;35960279]Hey, didnt you guys say that in the legacy addon system for 13 doesn't work for menus or fonts?
i was messing around in 13 and decided to add cap on again and see what happned...
Pressing E on sg/rings wont do anything but i was able to use kino remote divice for dialing... the menu it brought up was a bit glitchy but the fonts were working
Pic
[IMG]http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/7325/newbitmapimageaa.png[/IMG]
I had to resize it because the file was too big for my image uploading site, anyone know a better one?[/QUOTE]
they did at first but i thing alexalx fixed a few things to make cap work with gmod 13 altho there are some things that are broken like the sheild core but they will get fixed eventualy just dont post asking for them to get fixed as the devs alreadly know whats broken
Stargate pack will work as workshop addon so fonts will work too! Also, there are problems with spawnlist and legacy system - spawnlist don't get copied by game, u need to do it manually.
Boba, really DHD IS AWESOME. Even don't try to changing a model!
I would say that rings are also good, they just need complete reuvmapping and LOD models, maybe some baking. Seriusly, do u want to go to 4096x4096 textures? It will make pack extremly huge. I was thinking about using 512x512 in most cases + very, but very wise uvmaps with much repeating parts.
So guys, no one had idea about new rings vgui?
[QUOTE=Madman07;35963567]
So guys, no one had idea about new rings vgui?[/QUOTE]
if you want an idea for a new ring vgui why not one like on the stargate when innsted of just entering your desination you see a list of all rings
[QUOTE=ryan260193;35592283]I no you guys are aware of the Destiny Cannon bug but is the Tollan cannon ment to fire like this [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1Vox8yrbkE[/url][/QUOTE]
This was a neuroplanes problem, deleting it fixed the tollan cannon and all the destiny weapons as well
EDIT: I know this was a while ago but I never actually said what the problem was when I found it :P
[B]@Madman07[/B] Right now fonts still balcklisted in workshop addons >_< Also in workshop we can't upload txt/ini files... So should use cap cap_resources + workshop addon at same time in future... (if fonts will be in white list)
[B]@count23[/B]I had read you message about resize stargate models - i do not thing this is good idea, because:
1. If resize stargates, then also should be resized all ramps.
2. Much maps use current stargate size and if you will make it higher, then it can not fit in rooms etc.
3. Same with icarus ramp, right now maps using current size for place in rooms etc, if resize it - mappers should redo rooms... And thats bad.
[B]Woogoo[/B] Maybe you have disabled dial menu in stargate convars? Because it seems like that. Also abotu fonts, if you have installed it in windows/fonts folder, it will work.
But they can be placed in main gmod folder. So if entire addon will be stored in root folder, then problem solved.
Resizing stargate - we were refering to gmod 13. Still, mappers can tweak their maps. And if boba is bored and he wanna redo ramps then why not? :D
[QUOTE=Madman07;35964307]But they can be placed in main gmod folder. So if entire addon will be stored in root folder, then problem solved.[/QUOTE]But how then we will update it? And i do not want have all material models etc in main gmod folder... Because this will creates a lot of garbage. + no normal updating... So this is bad idea, better use addons folder and just copy fonts to main dir if fonts will be not whitelisted in workshop addons...
[QUOTE=AlexALX;35964253]
[B]Woogoo[/B] Maybe you have disabled dial menu in stargate convars? Because it seems like that. Also abotu fonts, if you have installed it in windows/fonts folder, it will work.[/QUOTE]
No, it only does that for gatespawner gates also dhd keys are unuseable and everything is noclollided.
About the fonts I did install them into windows for some reason... mabey you could make a script that does that for the user? so you dont need to do extra stuff
Fuck that shit. I already placed all stargate content in main gmod folder and it's fine ;]
[QUOTE=Woogoo;35964397]No, it only does that for gatespawner gates also dhd keys are unuseable and everything is noclollided.
About the fonts I did install them into windows for some reason... mabey you could make a script that does that for the user? so you dont need to do extra stuff[/QUOTE]Hmmm, idk what wrong on your pc, but this bug can happens only if you have case-sensetive file system (for example i see that bug on linux), so idk whats wrong, probably something in your side, because for me and most users its work fine.
As for script - no. Gmod do not allow do anything outside garrysmod/data folder.
[editline]15th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Madman07;35964414]Fuck that shit. I already placed all stargate content in main gmod folder and it's fine ;][/QUOTE]And when you will go to some server what have custom models materials sounds etc, it will download it and place in gmod main folder, and when you will try to upload some update to svn it will show too much garbage... Thats bad idea to placing addon in main folder. Can be also some conflict with other addons etc.
[QUOTE=AlexALX;35964419]Hmmm, idk what wrong on your pc, but this bug can happens only if you have case-sensetive file system (for example i see that bug on linux), so idk whats wrong, probably something in your side, because for me and most users its work fine.
[/QUOTE]
I dont know im on windows 7 and it works in gmod 12, just glitched in 13
[QUOTE=AlexALX;35964345]But how then we will update it? And i do not want have all material models etc in main gmod folder... Because this will creates a lot of garbage. + no normal updating... So this is bad idea, better use addons folder and just copy fonts to main dir if fonts will be not whitelisted in workshop addons...[/QUOTE]
Added Player:ShowProfile()
Added player:VoiceVolume()
If sv_alltalk is 2 then voice chat will be heard spatially
Added util.TableToJSON( tbl )
Fixed menu buttons colliding at 1024x768
Fixed options option being hidden unless ingame
Fixed file.Exists in DImage
Default resolution is now same as desktop, windowed, noborder
If windowed and desktop resolution - will automatically noborder
Fixed voice notification
gm_load works properly
Fixed blank loading URL
[B]Added ttf to addon whitelist[/B]
Published demo/saves now have an icon on the bottom left of the preview image
Can now play demos and saves from the workshop
Shows [OREC] when recording a demo
Bolded what you want to see
[QUOTE=Woogoo;35964450]Bolded what you want to see[/QUOTE]You thing i don't see that? Its still blacklisted in workshop (idk where garry added it to whitelist, but right now i can't upload addon with ttf files into workshop). I'm not so stupid for not see that.
[QUOTE=AlexALX;35964458]You thing i don't see that? Its still blacklisted in workshop (idk where garry added it to whitelist, but right now i can't upload addon with ttf files into workshop). I'm not so stupid for not see that.[/QUOTE]
sorry, i thought that was just posted
:suicide:
[editline]15th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Woogoo;35964397]No, it only does that for gatespawner gates also dhd keys are unuseable and everything is noclollided.
[/QUOTE]
pressing c and useing dhd works
[QUOTE=AlexALX;35964419]And when you will go to some server what have custom models materials sounds etc, it will download it and place in gmod main folder, and when you will try to upload some update to svn it will show too much garbage... Thats bad idea to placing addon in main folder. Can be also some conflict with other addons etc.[/QUOTE]
I didn't said u have to do that. I'm doing it right now in Stargate Pack.
And you have an svn for that, don't you? It's not just simple upload/download stuff, it's advanced version control system.
[QUOTE=count23;35959684]That makes more sense. :) Seems like we both had different opinions of what acceptable was for the models. do you really want the gates rescaled in size in gmod? The "real" gates were 15feet in diameter (Still checking if that transit space or total diameter), that comes out to 180 source units in diameter. It may be a bit too big for the varous environments?
I think the simplest solution here would be to build some hi-def gates and scale them down for the 3 or 5 LODs you want while using the hi-def version for normal mapping and AO passes. Then theoretically if you can hammer out all the physical detail into a normal map you'd really only need a simple metallic texture that can be repeated over the 9 segments at 2048x2048.
I'll take a crack and do some simple tests between Maya and source over the next few days, if I can pull off results I like, I'll take a crack at a hi-def SG1 gate and send you the results. (I'd also love to rebuild the Gate Glider and Destiny shuttle down the line. 50k is a good amount of polys to play with :P )
I still wanna build a proper Icarus and SGC gate ramp tho, the ones in the current pack are the wrong scale (Icarus should be twice as long as SGC according to the stage 5 plans I have for both base layouts).[/QUOTE]
Defiantly not the same size it currently has of the gates as that scale is way off! We just proceeded using that scale as it was easier!
Though in the new pack We'd prefer to get the real size out for the gate 15 feet (4.6 m) depending how this looks in game of course! I can ask around but I though SGMOD had a proper scale of it!
Scaling can always be done afterwards so that's no big deal as you can start already if you need some good references we could start up a thread on the forum where people could provide references!
Thanks in advance, the CAP Team
For direct messaging you can always add me on steam: [url]http://steamcommunity.com/id/Rafael_De_Jongh[/url]
[editline]15th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Madman07;35963567]Stargate pack will work as workshop addon so fonts will work too! Also, there are problems with spawnlist and legacy system - spawnlist don't get copied by game, u need to do it manually.
Boba, really DHD IS AWESOME. Even don't try to changing a model!
I would say that rings are also good, they just need complete reuvmapping and LOD models, maybe some baking. Seriusly, do u want to go to 4096x4096 textures? It will make pack extremly huge. I was thinking about using 512x512 in most cases + very, but very wise uvmaps with much repeating parts.
So guys, no one had idea about new rings vgui?[/QUOTE]
Well than still needs better uv-mapping and bottom remodeling to my statement than a whole big optimizing on the top part and imo just redoing it would be better!
Ring models are quite okey though they need a better seem uv-map and better texture's if this than could also be baked would be better! and No I never go in to 4096² but count23 asked how big source could handle it! My preferences depending on the packing of details is mostly 1024²
About the VGUI I was thinking of something like getting the panel up your self like a 2D Image where you can could enter a code with the digits available on the buttons. So mostly a 2D representation of the panel you've got and there you can set and dial it!
[editline]15th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=AlexALX;35964253]
[B]@count23[/B]I had read you message about resize stargate models - i do not thing this is good idea, because:
1. If resize stargates, then also should be resized all ramps.
2. Much maps use current stargate size and if you will make it higher, then it can not fit in rooms etc.
3. Same with icarus ramp, right now maps using current size for place in rooms etc, if resize it - mappers should redo rooms... And thats bad.
[/QUOTE]
This is the seperated addon my and madman are going for it has barley anything to do with CAP other than it is stargate related and it will just be called Stargate Addon having only the main needed items more or less the updated lite version of CAP!
[editline]15th May 2012[/editline]
Rev 259
Fixed:
- Tollona Chevron not lightning up in unlit area's
- Other VMT problems
What about an convar for big/small gates in GMod 13 for old map compatibility. Check the convar for old models, uncheck convar for new models? Of course no need for the old models to be in the new pack, more like and addon for the addon if you get what i mean.
[QUOTE=cartman300;35965206]What about an convar for big/small gates in GMod 13 for old map compatibility. Check the convar for old models, uncheck convar for new models? Of course no need for the old models to be in the new pack, more like and addon for the addon if you get what i mean.[/QUOTE]
Totally not! I don't think you see the point in this new pack...
[QUOTE=Boba Fett;35966626]Totally not! I don't think you see the point in this new pack...[/QUOTE]
I see the point. It's just an idea.
EDIT:
Thank you for rating dumb my bad explanation -.-
@count23
Here's a ref thread for the gate:
[url]http://sg-carterpack.com/index.php?topic=164.msg2013#new[/url]
Thanks folks.
I haven't started yet and the launch of Diablo 3 may interrupt my model making. :) hopefully it wont slow things down too much.
On the reference side of things, I'd really suggest physical models only, the CG ones are horribly inaccurate! (Dimensions included). Personal recommendations for the SG-1 style gate references, If i can get some 720ps from the Universe pilot (Do not use the gate from the Mckay crossover ep, it's CG and got 56 chevrons!!). I do have the eps in 720p, so I've probably got those covered. And I do have hte blu rays of atlantis so the Atlantis gate should be covered (Although i can't remember any eps apart from "Suspicion" which feature close ups of the back of Atlantis gate that weren't CG). For high quality refs, The gates I'd really need to get details for would be the Orlins, Tollans, SG-Movie... and to be honest, I dont think I'd even bother with the infinity ones... does anyone even use them?!
In regards to dimensions, I've checked and a 2nd source indicates 22 feet (264su), and I'm happy to scale up the "good ramps" :P I wont bother with textureless ones or those really low poly ones. I suppose the older ramps can be kept for legacy maps to address AlexALX concerns.
Now in regards to texturing, chances are the first edition ones I make for source, I'll probably stick wtih 1024 or 2048 textures for the gates themselves because as previously indicated the gates are 1 segment repeated 9 times. So more can be allocated to the same segment.
Normal maps, I may go as high as 4096, we'll see what the results are (assuming I can transfer hi def details to a close-range LOD without too many problems).
Hopefully if nothing goes horribly horribly wrong or I dont end up sleepless due to 5 days of diablo playing, I should have an untextured SG-1 gate with basic detailling in a couple of days. :)
EDIT: Could someone on the coding side of things PM me with specifics on how exactly the gates need to be prepped/split so that they can be animated (what pieces does the SG-1 gate need? pieces Atlantis needs, etc...)
EDIT2: Also, if I can get a list of the glyphs that need to be on the gate rings, that'd be super. The SG1 gate has 38 symbols, the Atlantis/Universe ones have 36. So a little clarification (do i have 38 on all of em? 36 on all of em? etc...)
@count23
i use infinity gates...... plus i'm pretty sure they want this to have actual stargate stuff for the various fans, so infinity gates should stay
I agree with kibbols the infinity gate should stay
[QUOTE=count23;35972152]
Now in regards to texturing, chances are the first edition ones I make for source, I'll probably stick wtih 1024 or 2048 textures for the gates themselves because as previously indicated the gates are 1 segment repeated 9 times. So more can be allocated to the same segment.
[/QUOTE]
I said that source could handle up to 4096² though you should never do this and max of a map for gmod at least should be 2048² so I think you're better off with going for texture depending on how uv's you're making to 1024² and normals depending on the uv-map packing also to 1024² or 2048² really depending on the bake packing.
[editline]16th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=kibbols;35974389]@count23
i use infinity gates...... plus i'm pretty sure they want this to have actual stargate stuff for the various fans, so infinity gates should stay[/QUOTE]
This isn't cap we are talking about! Currently we don't really care about gates from sga and sgu the main things should be focused around sg1 and their main parts! sga can be easily edited after wards and sgu can be dealt with later, we ain't making a second CAP here just saying.
count23, if you are planning to use exactly same model for further gates, like SGA, infinity then:
- one chevron model with animation + skins for different textures (one gate, one skin),
- sg-1/infinity ring (2 skins)
- sga ring
- base model (without rings, chevrons)
As for sga ring, if you will decide to make it - it can be made like in old gates. There were main ring model + 38 (or 39) small models with separate glyphs on them. But it can also be made much easier - main ring model + one glyph model with 38 (or 39) skins and glyphs positioning (and skin switching) would be done via code.
Sgu, sgu, anyone asked Sniper, is he willing to enlarge his awesome model?
[QUOTE=Madman07;35976203]count23, if you are planning to use exactly same model for further gates, like SGA, infinity then:
- one chevron model with animation + skins for different textures (one gate, one skin),
- sg-1/infinity ring (2 skins)
- sga ring
- base model (without rings, chevrons)
As for sga ring, if you will decide to make it - it can be made like in old gates. There were main ring model + 38 (or 39) small models with separate glyphs on them. But it can also be made much easier - main ring model + one glyph model with 38 (or 39) skins and glyphs positioning (and skin switching) would be done via code.
Sgu, sgu, anyone asked Sniper, is he willing to enlarge his awesome model?[/QUOTE]Or like on the SGU gate where the glyphs are transparent and there's a white model that can be put just behind the ring surface and rotated to fit the glyph?
dije, it mean that glyphs would have to be modeled. Making one glyph, and rotating,skinning it it's the best sollution.
Wow, it's so hard to get any response here, when I'm asking for new features during coding. Instead, we always get spammed to add features, when coding job is finished.
Does rings should have custom name and address? Option for making them private / disabling them both via gui and wire? Some options that rings will not be activated by using Dial Nearest? (usefull for ships).
Or maybe completly other adressing system, that rings does not have adress, instead we are entering a range, to look for rings (they automatically find rings with specified range)? As really, I don't believe rings system ever had any adresses. If yes, then it would be impossible for Daniel to call Ori rings on Mothership from Koroliev.
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