The problem I've had with many RP communities is that they just have too many rules. If you can't code it, don't promote it.
I'm not sure how to go about saying it, but a lot of Dark RP's issues could be easily solved with just introducing some form of player-based economies which don't revolve around an F2 Menu which gives static item prices.
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;35833345]The problem I've had with many RP communities is that they just have too many rules. If you can't code it, don't promote it.
I'm not sure how to go about saying it, but a lot of Dark RP's issues could be easily solved with just introducing some form of player-based economies which don't revolve around an F2 Menu which gives static item prices.[/QUOTE]
Agreed dependancy mutual or otherwise would help everyone work together instead of constantly raiding each other.
An entity with a long term sustainable gain for 1 class and a short term destructive gain for another would help the gameplay.
You can also use attachment to an item to manipulate gameplay. Someone who has an entity which is limited to 1 will have a greater attachment to an item which they can have many of. An example if a drugdealer who can buy plant pots from the shop keeper or a drug refiner from a mobboss. The plant pots arn't limited so the shop keeper is happy to work independently of the drug dealer. The drug dealer goes and buys the pots the shop keeper is happy for the custom and is happy to let the pots go due to no attachment.
The mobboss on the other hand is limited to 1 drug refiner so it is "his" and he is reluctant to let it go. The drug dealer generally has to work with the mobboss to have access to the refinery.
The limited item has changed the players interaction to be more dependant. The unlimited item plant pots still creates dependency but the drug dealer can go and operate by themself. So all drug dealers have at least 2 options on how they want to play both guided but both can also be roleplayed.
Another example is a hobo bin I made as a joke, each hobo is limited to 1 bin, when the bin was stolen the hobo would search for the bin. The fun aspect of it created an emotional attachment to what was a practically useless item.
One problem which arises is the above example of the drug dealer uses an npc which you then sell the coke and the weed to. Snpcs is something which seem to be not included in darkrp almost as a rule. A player based economy must get money from somewhere as a motivator.
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;35833345]The problem I've had with many RP communities is that they just have too many rules. If you can't code it, don't promote it.
I'm not sure how to go about saying it, but a lot of Dark RP's issues could be easily solved with just introducing some form of player-based economies which don't revolve around an F2 Menu which gives static item prices.[/QUOTE]
Good idea. Players will depend on the others, which is nice. But someone will find a new way to get guns, become a cock and ruin the economy. Also if not all the players work together, if just 1 player goes away the entire economy goes down.
And what can't be dealed with through an adequately armed police force?
Everything has a solution... Give fear, give promise, don't give goals/cannon.
FPtje, out of simple curiosity... what are you up to right now?
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;35843016]And what can't be dealed with through an adequately armed police force?
Everything has a solution... Give fear, give promise, don't give goals/cannon.[/QUOTE]
A larger adequately armed mafia can take it down. I've seen it happen.
Cops need more of an advantage over crime than just salary.
I use DarkRp as sandbox with a money system (I don't mean minging/Rdming, I just like to go to DarkRp servers, build something and sell it)
Sorry, but that's how I see it. It's a good script but it is ruined by it's community. For serious RP I go to Tiramisu servers
[QUOTE=Simski;35849704]FPtje, out of simple curiosity... what are you up to right now?[/QUOTE]
Last thursday and friday I made a private script (which can be seen on my youtube). On DarkRP I haven't done much. Sorry, but I lack time.
edit:
and I'm lazy.
[QUOTE=FPtje;35852503]Last thursday and friday I made a private script (which can be seen on my youtube). On DarkRP I haven't done much. Sorry, but I lack time.
edit:
and I'm lazy.[/QUOTE]
Fair enough :v:
[QUOTE=skullorz;35850333]A larger adequately armed mafia can take it down. I've seen it happen.
Cops need more of an advantage over crime than just salary.[/QUOTE]
I did say they need to be adequately armed didn't I? We can't expect them to take down a contrafort with little more then a spec of hope and a glock.
[QUOTE=Phoenixf129;35509444]Who care's if it's got to die or not? The thing is, this fellow took his time and effort to fix something up for GMod13, you should credit him for that at least.[/QUOTE]
Fuck you moron.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Flaming" - postal))[/highlight]
FPjte can you please show us your youtube channel cause I'm interested in this private script?
Okay, I want to discuss one of most serious DarkRP problems: prison is worse than death. I'm suggesting to make so when playerr are dead, he instantly loses all his stuff (doors, vehicles, props, spawned entities). It'll be organically combined with NLR.
[editline]7th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;35853540]I did say they need to be adequately armed didn't I? We can't expect them to take down a contrafort with little more then a spec of hope and a glock.[/QUOTE]
You can give to cops shotgun in addition for glock as spawn weapon, and give to mayor or chief ability to buy smg and ammo for his cops.
[QUOTE=kprokin;35859800]Okay, I want to discuss one of most serious DarkRP problems: prison is worse than death. I'm suggesting to make so when playerr are dead, he instantly loses all his stuff (doors, vehicles, props, spawned entities). It'll be organically combined with NLR.[/QUOTE]
Maybe we should do it the other way around and make the jail less terrible. Having to be idle for 120 seconds can be really annoying.
[editline]7th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=KatNotDinner;35858640]FPjte can you please show us your youtube channel cause I'm interested in this private script?[/QUOTE]
My youtube username is FPtje.
[QUOTE=FPtje;35859844]Maybe we should do it the other way around and make the jail less terrible. Having to be idle for 120 seconds can be really annoying.
Current punishment already too soft...
[QUOTE=FPtje;35859844]Maybe we should do it the other way around and make the jail less terrible. Having to be idle for 120 seconds can be really annoying.
Current punishment already too soft...[/QUOTE]
Well if your job as a gangster is to break the law, and you have to wait 120 seconds when you get caught doing your job, it can piss you right off.
While the arresting is often used as a tool to fight minges, it's not what it's meant for.
[QUOTE=FPtje;35860118]Well if your job as a gangster is to break the law, and you have to wait 120 seconds when you get caught doing your job, it can piss you right off.[/QUOTE]
Well if your job as a cop is to keep the law, and you have to arrest same player every 3 minutes, it can piss you right off.
I'm still more for the idea of making death more harsh than going to jail.
Yeah 2 minutes in jail can be tedious, but if it doesn't feel like a punishment then there's nothing to fear about going to jail.
However currently dieing is a lot more sparing than going to jail, you no longer become wanted by the civil protection and you can just return to doing whatever you want.
I know I'm really starting to sound like a nag now but, I think respawning as a hobo and being unable to choose another profession for 2 minutes would be enough to make death something players really want to avoid, while making jailtime something that is tedious but unlike being killed it still allows you to remain as your profession when you've served your time.
[QUOTE=FPtje;35860118]Well if your job as a gangster is to break the law, and you have to wait 120 seconds when you get caught doing your job, it can piss you right off.
While the arresting is often used as a tool to fight minges, it's not what it's meant for.[/QUOTE]
I think when people meant death is better than prison hes referring to the common scenario where a player will shoot the cops for a small crime like stealing or lockpicking.
Prehaps you could add a flag to players, when a player has killed a cop in the past 2 minutes they get the flag. If they are arrested with the flag they get the full 2 minutes. Otherwise you are arrested for petty crime and get a reduced sentence?
For a more interesting jail time give the criminals something to do, like breakings rocks, or for less serious crime some kind of parole after a short sentence.
[QUOTE=Simski;35860213]
I know I'm really starting to sound like a nag now but, I think respawning as a hobo and being unable to choose another profession for 2 minutes would be enough to make death something players really want to avoid, while making jailtime something that is tedious but unlike being killed it still allows you to remain as your profession when you've served your time.[/QUOTE]
It would take just one minge to turn everyone into a hobo. Minging in DarkRP would be way more fun if the victims were screwed over even more by the script.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;35860274]I think when people meant death is better than prison hes referring to the common scenario where a player will shoot the cops for a small crime like stealing or lockpicking.
Prehaps you could add a flag to players, when a player has killed a cop in the past 2 minutes they get the flag. If they are arrested with the flag they get the full 2 minutes. Otherwise you are arrested for petty crime and get a reduced sentence?
For a more interesting jail time give the criminals something to do, like breakings rocks, or for less serious crime some kind of parole after a short sentence.[/QUOTE]
Damn touchpad... I'm agree. Particulary.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;35860274]Prehaps you could add a flag to players, when a player has killed a cop in the past 2 minutes they get the flag. If they are arrested with the flag they get the full 2 minutes. Otherwise you are arrested for petty crime and get a reduced sentence? [/QUOTE]
I like the idea of a flag to be automatically put on players depending if they've killed people.
[sub](The flags would always be active, but civil protection would only be able to see the flags when they put a wanted level on the player)[/sub]
• [B]No flag:[/B] The suspect has not killed anyone. If an officer kills them rather than arrests, the game automatically puts up a vote for his demotion.
• [B]Flag 1:[/B] The suspect has killed a civilian. The officer is encouraged to let him surrender and serve jail time, but won't automatically be put up for demotion if the suspect is killed.
• [B]Flag 2:[/B] The suspect has killed an officer. Clearance to shoot suspect on sight and immunity to demotion for the killing of the suspect.
[editline]7th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=FPtje;35860317]It would take just one minge to turn everyone into a hobo. Minging in DarkRP would be way more fun if the victims were screwed over even more by the script.[/QUOTE]
So you would just have to make it harder for them to succeed. Firstly make the cops not effected by the hobo system so they won't fear dealing with criminals though. Since civil protection do a necessary but dangerous job and needs to be voted in, if they lost their profession when they got killed they would be too scared to deal with dangerous criminals. It would prevent the mingebags from killing people with weapons, it's sadly not a solution to propkilling although I'm sure there's other ways to fight that issue.
How about some kind of karma or flag system. The more a player kills, does crime or job abuses the lower karma he gets or he gets a variety of flags.
A gundealer who dies raiding would have kills for that life so when he dies he'd be treated differently from the gundealer who dies doing nothing wrong.
Also to stop rdm each player could have a variable which is reset everytime they die. max 100, min 0 spawn amount 50. This is the percentage of damage they do. Every minute (or time amount controlled by admin) the number goes up. Every kill it goes down. A cop killing a wanted criminal would have it not go down. A gangster killing a cop would not have it go down. So a citizen who joins the server and buys a pistol would soon find themselves useless if they go round killing people. At the same time a cop who has had to killing a few criminals won't be punished for doing his job.
You could also make it disabled when an admin is online so it only servers as an anti minge when admins are away.
Also could you modify the logging so by default if someone is killed by a prop it says "someone prop killed somebody else" to the admins.
And maybe have some kind of vote system by default.
If a cop kills an unwanted player without a "killed other player" flag the player gets a "forgive player" option screen. Prehaps with an auto vote demote.
likewise If a player is prop killed give them the option to forgive or punish the prop killing player.
[QUOTE=Simski;35860213]I know I'm really starting to sound like a nag now but, I think respawning as a hobo and being unable to choose another profession for 2 minutes would be enough to make death something players really want to avoid, while making jailtime something that is tedious but unlike being killed it still allows you to remain as your profession when you've served your time.[/QUOTE]
I'd like to add another complaint against this idea:
People die dozens of time even when they're not involved in shootings. They accidentally drop a prop on their heads while building, they get glitched in the wall so they'll have to kill themselves, a minge comes by, or whatever. I predict that rather than 'being careful', people will just give up and won't take a job. You'll have most of the people staying citizen (or hobo in your version).
You're raising the bar for getting (and keeping) a job. People who do get a job will need to lock themselves up securely in order not to die.
People won't be more careful, they'll go paranoid to lose their jobs, shoot innocent people more easily because of that paranoia. And when they keep losing their jobs, they'll just give up and stay citizen. Fuck the jobs if you can't have it for more than an average of 15 minutes.
How about this:
Wanted time doubles when you commit suicide while wanted.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;35860863]How about some kind of karma or flag system. The more a player kills, does crime or job abuses the lower karma he gets or he gets a variety of flags.
A gundealer who dies raiding would have kills for that life so when he dies he'd be treated differently from the gundealer who dies doing nothing wrong.
Also to stop rdm each player could have a variable which is reset everytime they die. max 100, min 0 spawn amount 50. This is the percentage of damage they do. Every minute (or time amount controlled by admin) the number goes up. Every kill it goes down. A cop killing a wanted criminal would have it not go down. A gangster killing a cop would not have it go down. So a citizen who joins the server and buys a pistol would soon find themselves useless if they go round killing people. At the same time a cop who has had to killing a few criminals won't be punished for doing his job.
You could also make it disabled when an admin is online so it only servers as an anti minge when admins are away.
Also could you modify the logging so by default if someone is killed by a prop it says "someone prop killed somebody else" to the admins.
And maybe have some kind of vote system by default.
If a cop kills an unwanted player without a "killed other player" flag the player gets a "forgive player" option screen. Prehaps with an auto vote demote.
likewise If a player is prop killed give them the option to forgive or punish the prop killing player.[/QUOTE]
Gundealers, medics and cooks need to protect themself from robbers. AND AGAIN, THERE IS NO RDM, all crime activity (of course without using props, wire bombs etc.) should be contained by rp police force! Problem in darkrp police force, it is low powered (idk how to say it properly) Making script restrictions is very exploitable and ruins rp!
How about introducing lives, a bit like how death works in GTA games.
If you're a politically powerful class like Mobboss/Mayor, you only have 1 life and if you are killed/assassinated you become hobo.
If you're any other classes, you get 2 lives. The first time you are killed, you respawn in the hospital as the same class. The second time, you respawn as hobo.
If you live with having died once and only having 1 life left for 15 minutes, you regain your additional life.
This system is basically the same thing as my previous suggestion, but it does allow players some occasional accidents.
[editline]7th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=FPtje;35861242]People won't be more careful, they'll go paranoid to lose their jobs, shoot innocent people more easily because of that paranoia. And when they keep losing their jobs, they'll just give up and stay citizen. Fuck the jobs if you can't have it for more than an average of 15 minutes.[/QUOTE]
If they start shooting random people, they will attract the civil protection... and if the civil protection don't lose their job when they die, attracting the civil protection is very risky. Also, randomly shooting innocent people is also a sure way to get yourself demoted.
I don't mind Mobbosses and Mayors being paranoid though. It fits their character to be paranoid and wanting to stay in power, and it gives Hitmen a real purpose.
The Mayor will still have to cater to the people though, go around randomly killing people and you won't stand any good chances of being re-elected and the chances of people sending Hitmen after you grows.
[QUOTE=FPtje;35861242]How about this:
Wanted time doubles when you commit suicide while wanted.[/QUOTE]
Could have very negative impact on the kind of servers that likes NLR, as it ignores NLR to punish the player.
The hobo idea might work because it forces the player to roleplay NLR without telling them how to behave, they start from scratch and has to work their way back up. Current NLR doesn't work well simply because it's nothing more than a rule that you can break whenever but don't because you could get kicked/banned.
[editline]7th May 2012[/editline]
[quote]You're raising the bar for getting (and keeping) a job. People who do get a job will need to lock themselves up securely in order not to die.[/quote]
I think it brings some sense of realism to the game. If you're living a criminal life, your life is much more at risk. If you run around shooting people, people are likely to want to see you dead. If you're a corrupted politician, people might order hits on you. If you're a mobboss, someone will always be thinking about taking your place. If you're a ordinary lawful citizen, you are more likely to stay out of harms way, but shit happens. People will be a lot less reckless with killing people, because they'll be scared that killing other people might make very unpopular.
You mention working you way up. Being a hobo then pressing f4 to become a gundealer or mobboss isn't really working your way up.
A work around might be to have a "hit" type thing for gangsters so the mobboss can /hit fulcrum 1 at a time. The tag will show up for gangsters so its a way to coordinating gangster strikes.
If a character dies under the /hit system or under the /wanted system they are demoted.
I still disagree however it would be a mere inconvenience at most to be turned into a hobo whenever you are killed for being in the middle of a gun fight or get caught in a printer explosion.
Being turned into a hobo and then being unable to change class for 2 minutes is what I was thinking of. So that other people will have time to take your place. That's what I meant with "working your way back up". If you die, you lose your profession, and someone else might take it.
So, is anything will be changed?
[QUOTE=kprokin;35938763]So, is anything will be changed?[/QUOTE]
I will implement good ideas, but I'm very picky with what I think are good ideas.
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