Fallout New Vegas Roleplay v2: "There was never a man like my Johnny" Edition

[opti2000]

[QUOTE=sants1;43013630]The maps looking really good! You definitely do such great work in a short amount of time.[/QUOTE]

Only quality for the community.

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=opti2000;43013860]Only quality for the community.[/QUOTE]

What community? [URL="http://lemonpunch.net/threads/wip-fallout-nv-map-for-gmod.9733/"]LemonPunch?[/URL]

[Mr.Pilot]

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;43014431]What community? [URL="http://lemonpunch.net/threads/wip-fallout-nv-map-for-gmod.9733/"]LemonPunch?[/URL][/QUOTE]

Woah, what!?

[opti2000]

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;43014431]What community? [URL="http://lemonpunch.net/threads/wip-fallout-nv-map-for-gmod.9733/"]LemonPunch?[/URL][/QUOTE]

The community director asked me if i could show some stuff on their forum.

Edit: why is everyone shocked about this? I was just friendly. (Or i tried to be friendly)

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=opti2000;43014465]The community director asked me if i could show some stuff on their forum.[/QUOTE]

Well, there goes the exclusivity of having a map for our server. If LemonPunch opens with this map, I'm just going to drag the gamemode into the recycle bin, post a gif and then post a banme.

[opti2000]

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;43014475]Well, there goes the exclusivity of having a map for our server. If LemonPunch opens with this map, I'm just going to drag the gamemode into the recycle bin, post a gif and then post a banme.[/QUOTE]

You give up too fast.

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=opti2000;43014488]You give up too fast.[/QUOTE]

Then don't hand the map over to another community.

[opti2000]

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;43014489]Then don't hand the map over to another community.[/QUOTE]

Dude i just showed some pics of the map?

Calm down.

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=opti2000;43014503]Dude i just showed some pics of the map?

Calm down.[/QUOTE]

And why would they ask you to show pictures of the map?

[opti2000]

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;43014515]And why would they ask you to show pictures of the map?[/QUOTE]

We talk about this later private.

I dont think i need to self-exculpate me.

[Sants]

Holy shit, out of all the communities, you choose LEMONPUNCH? BAHAHAHA.

[Hotpocket321]

[QUOTE=sants1;43014592]Holy shit, out of all the communities, you choose LEMONPUNCH? BAHAHAHA.[/QUOTE]

Holy shit, out of all the communities, you chose HEROZ? BAHAHAHAHA.

Am I funny yet?

[Sants]

[QUOTE=Hotpocket321;43014621]Holy shit, out of all the communities, you chose HEROZ? BAHAHAHAHA.

Am I funny yet?[/QUOTE]

yea

[FlamingBlizza]

nice map, i love the shadows. It looks way better than fallout new vegas ever was.

[Fulcrum]

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;43014489]Then don't hand the map over to another community.[/QUOTE]

You can't make a map private.

Its not possible or ethical.

You can put scripts in the map to stop it working but people will easily remove those scripts, it would probably give them a reason to rename it as their own version aswell.

As soon as u host that map on a server people will download it and use it for themselves then there is nothing you can do but embrace it and enjoy the fact that you have made something popular.

[editline]29th November 2013[/editline]

You could make your game script place most of the networked entities like prop_dynamic. But then people will just do the same and have the map look slightly different.

[meanwhile]

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;43015510]You can't make a map private.

Its not possible or ethical.

You can put scripts in the map to stop it working but people will easily remove those scripts, it would probably give them a reason to rename it as their own version aswell.

As soon as u host that map on a server people will download it and use it for themselves then there is nothing you can do but embrace it and enjoy the fact that you have made something popular.

[editline]29th November 2013[/editline]

You could make your game script place most of the networked entities like prop_dynamic. But then people will just do the same and have the map look slightly different.[/QUOTE]

Actually, there are ways. Some maps do some magical trickery to make your game crash instantly unless you're playing on a certain server.

[Mr.Pilot]

You could always protect it from being edited.

[URL="Obfuscator"]https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Map_Obfuscator[/URL]

Or how I like to call it.

Ob-Fuck-Sick-Cator

Cause it screws shit up when you try to decompile the map.

[Purge]

Get ready for a wall of text

[QUOTE=Dmaster;42972390]If it tears you up inside seeing the map and the project in general, why do you feel the need to follow it so dilligently? This has already been explained to you before, yet you just have to keep bringing it up. Just let it go, man.[/QUOTE]

It hasn't been explained it has been more of, hey don't mention that its a wip! The author hasn't stated any idea on how to fix it or method.

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;42973738]except for the fact that it is going to be replaced, if you are going to continually criticize something especially when it has been recognized and something is going to be done about it then why are you still posting?[/QUOTE]

Something? That's not very descriptive. It would make sense for him to stop posting about it if that problem is at least being addressed, which it is not its being ignored.

[QUOTE=opti2000;42976941][t]http://abload.de/img/sizebtdf4.png[/t]

Edit: Mb size around 600-700mb all in all[/QUOTE]

That's nothing to be proud about. The overview and the filesize.

You shown that about 100 or more models are prop_dynamic and will chew performance, entdata to be specific. Seriously recompile them with the $staticprop flag and move them to prop_static for the ones that don't do anything.

You also shown that the only brushes on that map are the displacements (if you call them anything) and some odd shaped boundaries for the sky.

Now to address a quote on lemonpunch, eugh that shithole.

[QUOTE]Why dont you think it will not work? The entire map finish-compiles in 10-15 minutes and thats pretty good for the size of this map. [/QUOTE]

This means utterly nothing, because vbsp/vvis/vrad are the three processes hammer uses to compile maps into fully functioning bsp's.

Vbsp puts props and models into locations, it takes about five seconds to do.
Vvis makes visual checks on the map and tells the engine what position the player cant see x thing. This is most likely taking most of your time as it struggles with maps that are just a big fucking field. The reason why it considers this map a field is because it does not use models to block visibility.
Vrad calculates and places light maps across the map. This may also take some of your time due to the displacements and it being again a big fucking field. But nothing even close to what would happen if you used brushes for your map as you should of. Sounds like good thing right? No. It does take models into consideration when doing its process but it only affects brushes. Even then it only calculates prop_static's.

So your 15 minute compile means nothing.

Now im not saying the map isn't possible to do. You could release it in the state it is in and it may function fine on the rp server. Saying people can render the whole map, or have enough video card memory to do so effectively. Your only way out is to use fog, which eh its a cheap way as it takes away visibility but I guess that is a option. One that you will have to take if you haven't done it already.

[QUOTE=pilot;43017829]You could always protect it from being edited.

[URL="Obfuscator"]https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Map_Obfuscator[/URL]

Or how I like to call it.

Ob-Fuck-Sick-Cator

Cause it screws shit up when you try to decompile the map.[/QUOTE]

This will only affect maps that have point_entities that don't need a specific spot.
Little to none on this map.

Now lets talk about possible solutions to your lighting issue.

A) You use a env_projectedtexture for the dynamic lighting which instantly solves your light issues- See the bottom post for more info.
B) You leave it as is and use a 24/7 Rp nightscript
See the second bottom post for more info.
C) You bake the lighting on the map and merge it with the lightmaps.
See the bottomest post for more info.

A would not work out because literally no one would have more than 15 fps playing the game. For gmod that is. Plus there's the problem with projected textures leaking into other places where it shouldn't.

B would work fine but would still leave god awful effects for the lighting.

C would work the best if you are up for it. Since your map is made 90% out of models you can bake texture based lighting onto every model on the fucking map. The result is shadows that look better than in gmod. A shitload of lighting errors solved. However there are some downsigns to this. You cannot have a 24/7 lighting system you also have to bake every single static world model. Plus you need to know how to do it and have some experience in 3dsmax.

[Khutor]

[QUOTE=Purge;43020393]Get ready for a wall of text

It hasn't been explained it has been more of, hey don't mention that its a wip! The author hasn't stated any idea on how to fix it or method.

Something? That's not very descriptive. It would make sense for him to stop posting about it if that problem is at least being addressed, which it is not its being ignored.

That's nothing to be proud about. The overview and the filesize.

You shown that about 100 or more models are prop_dynamic and will chew performance, entdata to be specific. Seriously recompile them with the $staticprop flag and move them to prop_static for the ones that don't do anything.

You also shown that the only brushes on that map are the displacements (if you call them anything) and some odd shaped boundaries for the sky.

Now to address a quote on lemonpunch, eugh that shithole.

This means utterly nothing, because vbsp/vvis/vrad are the three processes hammer uses to compile maps into fully functioning bsp's.

Vbsp puts props and models into locations, it takes about five seconds to do.
Vvis makes visual checks on the map and tells the engine what position the player cant see x thing. This is most likely taking most of your time as it struggles with maps that are just a big fucking field. The reason why it considers this map a field is because it does not use models to block visibility.
Vrad calculates and places light maps across the map. This may also take some of your time due to the displacements and it being again a big fucking field. But nothing even close to what would happen if you used brushes for your map as you should of. Sounds like good thing right? No. It does take models into consideration when doing its process but it only affects brushes. Even then it only calculates prop_static's.

So your 15 minute compile means nothing.

Now im not saying the map isn't possible to do. You could release it in the state it is in and it may function fine on the rp server. Saying people can render the whole map, or have enough video card memory to do so effectively. Your only way out is to use fog, which eh its a cheap way as it takes away visibility but I guess that is a option. One that you will have to take if you haven't done it already.

This will only affect maps that have point_entities that don't need a specific spot.
Little to none on this map.

Now lets talk about possible solutions to your lighting issue.

A) You use a env_projectedtexture for the dynamic lighting which instantly solves your light issues- See the bottom post for more info.
B) You leave it as is and use a 24/7 Rp nightscript
See the second bottom post for more info.
C) You bake the lighting on the map and merge it with the lightmaps.
See the bottomest post for more info.

A would not work out because literally no one would have more than 15 fps playing the game. For gmod that is. Plus there's the problem with projected textures leaking into other places where it shouldn't.

B would work fine but would still leave god awful effects for the lighting.

C would work the best if you are up for it. Since your map is made 90% out of models you can bake texture based lighting onto every model on the fucking map. The result is shadows that look better than in gmod. A shitload of lighting errors solved. However there are some downsigns to this. You cannot have a 24/7 lighting system you also have to bake every single static world model. Plus you need to know how to do it and have some experience in 3dsmax.[/QUOTE]

10/10 first post. Half the stuff you replied to is 4 days old.

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=Purge;43020393]Get ready for a wall of text

It hasn't been explained it has been more of, hey don't mention that its a wip! The author hasn't stated any idea on how to fix it or method.

Something? That's not very descriptive. It would make sense for him to stop posting about it if that problem is at least being addressed, which it is not its being ignored.

That's nothing to be proud about. The overview and the filesize.

You shown that about 100 or more models are prop_dynamic and will chew performance, entdata to be specific. Seriously recompile them with the $staticprop flag and move them to prop_static for the ones that don't do anything.

You also shown that the only brushes on that map are the displacements (if you call them anything) and some odd shaped boundaries for the sky.

Now to address a quote on lemonpunch, eugh that shithole.

This means utterly nothing, because vbsp/vvis/vrad are the three processes hammer uses to compile maps into fully functioning bsp's.

Vbsp puts props and models into locations, it takes about five seconds to do.
Vvis makes visual checks on the map and tells the engine what position the player cant see x thing. This is most likely taking most of your time as it struggles with maps that are just a big fucking field. The reason why it considers this map a field is because it does not use models to block visibility.
Vrad calculates and places light maps across the map. This may also take some of your time due to the displacements and it being again a big fucking field. But nothing even close to what would happen if you used brushes for your map as you should of. Sounds like good thing right? No. It does take models into consideration when doing its process but it only affects brushes. Even then it only calculates prop_static's.

So your 15 minute compile means nothing.

Now im not saying the map isn't possible to do. You could release it in the state it is in and it may function fine on the rp server. Saying people can render the whole map, or have enough video card memory to do so effectively. Your only way out is to use fog, which eh its a cheap way as it takes away visibility but I guess that is a option. One that you will have to take if you haven't done it already.

This will only affect maps that have point_entities that don't need a specific spot.
Little to none on this map.

Now lets talk about possible solutions to your lighting issue.

A) You use a env_projectedtexture for the dynamic lighting which instantly solves your light issues- See the bottom post for more info.
B) You leave it as is and use a 24/7 Rp nightscript
See the second bottom post for more info.
C) You bake the lighting on the map and merge it with the lightmaps.
See the bottomest post for more info.

A would not work out because literally no one would have more than 15 fps playing the game. For gmod that is. Plus there's the problem with projected textures leaking into other places where it shouldn't.

B would work fine but would still leave god awful effects for the lighting.

C would work the best if you are up for it. Since your map is made 90% out of models you can bake texture based lighting onto every model on the fucking map. The result is shadows that look better than in gmod. A shitload of lighting errors solved. However there are some downsigns to this. You cannot have a 24/7 lighting system you also have to bake every single static world model. Plus you need to know how to do it and have some experience in 3dsmax.[/QUOTE]

Have you even read the thread at all?

Compilling as a static prop would not do us any good because we plan on installing a day/night cycle onto the map using the new sky shader, you need to use dynamic models in order to achieve this properly because you can't update the lighting on static props. env_projected texture is also a not so good idea for the entire maps lighting is because it projects both ways. Also the 'god awful' lighting effects don't even seem to be much of an issue anymore in the more recent posts however the lighting is still rather bland but it still doesn't matter because it's going to be replaced.

We also aren't going to bake shadows because that's such a stupid idea, we already have the map running at a good fps and it's completely prepped for the original goal which is a day/night cycle.

[GTbrawlers]

I'm not going to be really quick to judge but who made Purge a professional, valve employee of the month, masters degree in hammer map editor?

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=GTbrawlers;43021343]I'm not going to be really quick to judge but who made Purge a professional, valve employee of the month, masters degree in hammer map editor?[/QUOTE]

He's not wrong on a lot of the topics he has stated.

[LemonPunch]

[QUOTE=opti2000;43014465]The community director asked me if i could show some stuff on their forum.

Edit: why is everyone shocked about this? I was just friendly. (Or i tried to be friendly)[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I never expected any map exclusivity for LemonPunch. It's as you said when we spoke, you want to release the map to the public and LemonPunch just happens to be one community considering using the map quite heavily. Then you were kind enough to make that thread which I appreciate.

Johnny Guitar should perhaps not expect you to hand over this massive map achievement relying of endless effort, work and time, just so he can use it privately without giving you anything in return?

I hate to cause any drama and I really don't want to derail this thread. Just felt that many people were pointing fingers at you opti2000, so I thought I could perhaps help you clear things up.

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=LemonPunch;43024634]Yeah, I never expected any map exclusivity for LemonPunch. It's as you said when we spoke, you want to release the map to the public and LemonPunch just happens to be one community considering using the map quite heavily. Then you were kind enough to make that thread which I appreciate.

Johnny Guitar should perhaps not expect you to hand over this massive map achievement relying of endless effort, work and time, just so he can use it privately without giving you anything in return?

I hate to cause any drama and I really don't want to derail this thread. Just felt that many people were pointing fingers at you opti2000, so I thought I could perhaps help you clear things up.[/QUOTE]

It'll be publicly released once the server has ended it's lifecycle. (6 months)

[c👌de_g🎷]

I think if you're going to work hard on a map, or anything for that matter, than you have the choice of what to do with it. It's a personal decision to release it or not, and that decision should be respected.

[Johnny Guitar]

[QUOTE=code_gs;43024760]I think if you're going to work hard on a map, or anything for that matter, than you have the choice of what to do with it. It's a personal decision to release it or not, and that decision should be respected.[/QUOTE]

opti did say it was for our release, and it will remain that way.

[Johnny Guitar]

[t]http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/470920896581040525/CE1575A1DE351E632A6FCFA5268271B50EC97DB1/[/t]

[t]http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/470920896581033588/E5CED49DDE0CC5B2A79C24386B855D87842C3377/[/t]

Getting the map prepped for the daynight cycle, unfortunately the map only compiles.... without the strip.

[Mr.Pilot]

Remember to keep that Mojave sky feel.

[IMG]http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3520/3457659202_dc6bdd18ff_z.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://chrispzero.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/070411-mojave-preserve-desert-milky-way-night-1477-795-2.jpg[/IMG]

[LemonPunch]

[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;43024774]opti did say it was for our release, and it will remain that way.[/QUOTE]

He gave LemonPunch full permission to use it, if his words still matter.

[GTbrawlers]

Well then you have a conflicting agreement. I'd just like to lay some things on the table here.

1) If Opti agreed to Johnny Guitars terms first then surely it would be wrong of him to give another community his word.

2) It is Opti's work and therefore it is his choice what he does but it will obviously reflect badly if he "breaks his word".

3) At the end of the day, once the map is on the workshop it can easily be extracted by anyone and used on any server regardless of who was meant to use it and there's nothing you can do about it. (Unless you're going to be a bitch and DDoS like LP did to me ;) )