• Windows 8
    8,715 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Elements;36996159]He may be worried about the MS store cutting into STEAM. Blizzard's CEO complained about Win8 as well.[/QUOTE] I just don't see Gabe Newell complaining about the app store - I think it'll have [I]zero[/I] impact on Valve's business, and if anything it's a way for small developers to be seen on Windows 8 crowded marketplace - and they can still release it on the internet all the same.
[QUOTE=fruxodaily;37000453]While it is sad, I don't think jailbreaking your computer will be difficult, windows isn't as locked in as people are making it to be.[/QUOTE] and even if windows would be locked down, you could boot into a linux live CD, mount the windows partition, and apply the changed that are needed. A desktop OS isn't meant to be locked down. Hell even OSX isn't really locked down. (You still have access to the root user in the terminal) [QUOTE=GoDong-DK;37000837]I just don't see Gabe Newell complaining about the app store - I think it'll have [I]zero[/I] impact on Valve's business, and if anything it's a way for small developers to be seen on Windows 8 crowded marketplace - and they can still release it on the internet all the same.[/QUOTE] Games like Call of Duty, Counterstrike or Battlefield would never be in the app store, because the app Store is currently intended for metro apps, and apps that work on all three Plattforms (tablet, desktop, phone).
[QUOTE=ShaunOfTheLive;36998610]Gabe Newell was only talking about the Metro/Windows Store portion of Windows 8, not the desktop portion. He's just saying that the Windows Store will lock developers into paying MS, like how Apple locks developers into paying them to get on the App Store. You can't install "third-party" Metro apps like you can with Android.[/QUOTE] While this is true, Steam is doing pretty much the same - they almost have a monopoly on the desktop computer games, and developers can pretty much decide to either release it on Steam or lose profit. Sure, I'd rather see Valve get money, but Steam is pretty much the same business model as Windows Store's, other than that they probably take a smaller cut, and the fact that they aren't exclusively selling RT apps. I really don't see this hurting neither the developers, nor Steam. Still, I'm no business man - Gabe Newell might be right, but I can't really see why.
This is a slightly more esoteric question, seeing as Metro on PCs isn't out yet, but has their been any info on the development future for Windows RT/Metro apps? Microsoft has always been so conscious of backwards compatibility, but since this effectively is offering Microsoft a clean slate, will they be more aggressive about dropping features and pushing the platform forward? iOS (and OS X) are on annual cycles, Android is roughly on an annual cycle, although at the current rate it takes about a year and a half for those updates to actually get to most of the users. It's going to be hard to sell Windows RT tablets if it follows the same lengthy(comparatively) dev cycle Windows currently does [editline]30th July 2012[/editline] Actually I've just thought, the iPad seems to be on a 2.5 year support cycle, and given they're the leaders in this space, would Microsoft even bother making a Windows 9 for any tablet? Maybe whatever version you get with a tablet is the only version you ever really get
I should hope that you upgrade to Windows 9 or whatever with your current tablet, heck you can still put jellybean on some of the earliest android phones
RTM is going to be given to the OEM's on August 1st, let's hope one of them will leak it.
[QUOTE=kaukassus;37000864]and even if windows would be locked down, you could boot into a linux live CD, mount the windows partition, and apply the changed that are needed. A desktop OS isn't meant to be locked down. Hell even OSX isn't really locked down. (You still have access to the root user in the terminal) Games like Call of Duty, Counterstrike or Battlefield would never be in the app store, because the app Store is currently intended for metro apps, and apps that work on all three Plattforms (tablet, desktop, phone).[/QUOTE] OS X is becoming more locked down just as Windows is. It's appstore along with Gate Keeper seems to be really annoying in that area.
[QUOTE=Panda X;37002406]OS X is becoming more locked down just as Windows is. It's appstore along with Gate Keeper seems to be really annoying in that area.[/QUOTE] True. Every operating system, or mobile operating system made for the consumer is getting more locked down. OS X and Windows 8 are some good examples. Corporations do this to "protect" the general consumers from being dumb and messing with the system, and aswell "protect" them from malicious programs. Apple, google and Microsoft want to put the consumer in their own safe eco-system, where nothing can go wrong. Basically they want to make their operating systems Idiot-proof. This however can be a bad thing. For example: hiding/removing advanced options from the settings menu, and only show simple stuff, just to be more userfriendly.
[QUOTE=Panda X;37002406]OS X is becoming more locked down just as Windows is. It's appstore along with Gate Keeper seems to be really annoying in that area.[/QUOTE] To be fair, Gatekeeper can be turned off (and overridden on default settings with right click then open), though I agree about the App Store. Apple is using iCloud and now Notification centre as incentives to get devs into their controlled store.
Isn't Gatekeeper pretty much UAC? From what I've read in reviews, it seems like it's as nagging as the UAC in Vista. Can someone confirm this?
[QUOTE=kaukassus;37000864] Games like Call of Duty, Counterstrike or Battlefield would never be in the app store, because the app Store is currently intended for metro apps, and apps that work on all three Plattforms (tablet, desktop, phone).[/QUOTE] Pretty sure you are wrong. They are selling desktop programs through the windows store, such as Office. I just read an article the other day that said Office would be the first non-metro program available in the app store.
[QUOTE=kaukassus;37002502]Basically they want to make their operating systems Idiot-proof.[/QUOTE] Actually, they mostly want control over you. If Microsoft really cared about protecting their users, we wouldn't have as many rampant viruses and exploits, no matter how many people want to attack it. You don't really need to lock down an OS to have a walled garden, unless you make it very easy for your users to use their superpowers to install malicious apps. Android is "locked down" until you type one command to unlock its bootloader, or tick one box to be able to install non-market applications. You get a warning and it's very clear. Windows, WP, RIM OSes, OS X and iOS should aim towards that kind of openness, but most corporations just don't want you to have it. Hence the whole safeboot on ARM deal, etc.
[QUOTE=gparent;37003546]Actually, they mostly want control over you. If Microsoft really cared about protecting their users, we wouldn't have as many rampant viruses and exploits, no matter how many people want to attack it. You don't really need to lock down an OS to have a walled garden, unless you make it very easy for your users to use their superpowers to install malicious apps. Android is "locked down" until you type one command to unlock its bootloader, or tick one box to be able to install non-market applications. You get a warning and it's very clear. Windows, WP, RIM OSes, OS X and iOS should aim towards that kind of openness, but most corporations just don't want you to have it. Hence the whole safeboot on ARM deal, etc.[/QUOTE] There's a lot of internal push here to focus on protecting our customers. We do care, and I can guarantee that its the reason on why the Store checks for shitty apps. Everyone complains about apps crashing, stealing data, slowing down your computer etc. Android does a horrible job with this. I have used tons of apps that outright crash, run slowly, snoop in my text messages, drain my battery, etc. The whole point of WinRT/Store is to have trustworthy apps that you know won't screw up and steal your data or slowdown or eat battery. "unlocked" apps won't be able to provide anything special or any new functionality. You can't escape out of the WinRT sandbox and touch OS stuff. If we wanted to control you, we would never let you code your own apps, or make traditional applications. [editline]30th July 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=danielmm8888;37001934]RTM is going to be given to the OEM's on August 1st, let's hope one of them will leak it.[/QUOTE] That will require a retail key... just a fyi.
[QUOTE=gparent;37003546]Actually, they mostly want control over you. If Microsoft really cared about protecting their users, we wouldn't have as many rampant viruses and exploits, no matter how many people want to attack it. You don't really need to lock down an OS to have a walled garden, unless you make it very easy for your users to use their superpowers to install malicious apps. Android is "locked down" until you type one command to unlock its bootloader, or tick one box to be able to install non-market applications. You get a warning and it's very clear. Windows, WP, RIM OSes, OS X and iOS should aim towards that kind of openness, but most corporations just don't want you to have it. Hence the whole safeboot on ARM deal, etc.[/QUOTE] There is no way to fully protect the user from exploits and viruses. Microsoft puts great efforts into protecting the operating system and its users from viruses.But since Windows has the highest market share from all the Operatin systems, it has far more viruses built for it. No operating system is safe. Not even OSX and Linux. Because of OSX's growth in popularity, far more viruses for OSX have been developped. Thats how it goes. As for the Control part, it was kind expected for Microsoft to lock down its Operating System. Microsoft sees the general consumer as the main target audience, Thats why they lock down Windows, to protect them, so they don't fuck up the system. But Microsoft still leaves prenty of room for the poweruser. Just look at the powershell2.0, or the ability to use Hyper-V on a non-server version of windows. IMO Windows 8 isn't really locked down. You still have the same freedom you had with windows 7, but Windows 8 brings lots of new features to the table that makes it worth using, despite getting the start menu replaced by a metro screen, wich isn't really a bad thing, it just need some time to get used to it.
[QUOTE=Foda;37004477]If we wanted to control you, we would never let you code your own apps, or make traditional applications.[/QUOTE] Sorry to blow it to you, but you don't need to do any of what I mentioned to "protect the user". It's control, pure and simple. You still let users write applications? Most impressive. [QUOTE=kaukassus;37005277]There is no way to fully protect the user from exploits and viruses. Microsoft puts great efforts into protecting the operating system and its users from viruses.[/QUOTE] They've started taking basic security measures in Vista which is good, but they need to keep going. They're doing an okay effort. When we stop hearing stories of vulnerabilities being kept in the dark for months or years, then I'll change my mind. [QUOTE=kaukassus;37005277]But since Windows has the highest market share from all the Operatin systems, it has far more viruses built for it.[/QUOTE] Come on, that argument gets old and anyone a bit technical in IT knows it's bullshit. The number of viruses has nothing to do with the number of vulnerabilities in Windows. Further more, Linux runs far more stuff and is a lot more important to the world than Windows and gets scrutinized plenty as well. [QUOTE=kaukassus;37005277]No operating system is safe. Not even OSX and Linux. Because of OSX's growth in popularity, far more viruses for OSX have been developped. Thats how it goes.[/QUOTE] Hackers took advantage of OS X because it was weak. Look up how long it took Apple to implement ASLR. I never said any OS was perfect, anyway. [QUOTE=kaukassus;37005277]As for the Control part, it was kind expected for Microsoft to lock down its Operating System.[/QUOTE] Well yeah, capitalism being what it is, I'm not saying I'm surprised. [QUOTE=kaukassus;37005277]Microsoft sees the general consumer as the main target audience, Thats why they lock down Windows, to protect them, so they don't fuck up the system.[/QUOTE] Ignoring all technical hurdles, if Android used Apple's Walled Appstore as its source of app, it would be just as secure as iOS even though it is not locked down at all. There are safeguards in place to prevent the user from accidentally making his phone insecure. You are warned when you do it. [QUOTE=kaukassus;37005277]But Microsoft still leaves prenty of room for the poweruser. Just look at the powershell2.0, or the ability to use Hyper-V on a non-server version of windows.[/QUOTE] I don't know how to say this, but if those are power user tools for you, we're clearly not working in the same field. Note that this doesn't take much away from Windows 8 as an OS, ignoring the whole ARM thing.
Microsoft added more backgrounds to the start screen. [img]http://i.imgur.com/gKaq7.jpg[/img] Cool although might be a little distracting. Wonder if OEMs can add their own backgrounds?
[QUOTE=Jimmy422;37015055]Microsoft added more backgrounds to the start screen. [img]http://i.imgur.com/gKaq7.jpg[/img] Cool although might be a little distracting. Wonder if OEMs can add their own backgrounds?[/QUOTE] I hope you can add your own background, without editing a dll file.
[QUOTE=Jimmy422;37015055]Microsoft added more backgrounds to the start screen. [img]http://i.imgur.com/gKaq7.jpg[/img] Cool although might be a little distracting. Wonder if OEMs can add their own backgrounds?[/QUOTE] Oh wow, some of those look pretty sexy. I wonder how you'd go about getting more. Maybe they'll release packs online or something.
Could be a registry key edit/placing an image in some folder. Like the login screen for Win7. [editline]31st July 2012[/editline] Yeah no it's a dll [url]http://www.addictivetips.com/windows-tips/windows-8-start-tweaker-change-metro-start-screen-background-color/[/url]
[QUOTE=GoDong-DK;37002781]Isn't Gatekeeper pretty much UAC? From what I've read in reviews, it seems like it's as nagging as the UAC in Vista. Can someone confirm this?[/QUOTE] Gatekeeper is just a mechanism to block downloaded apps from running that have not been signed by an Apple registered developer. Registration is free and is basically just a way to connect an app to a legally recognised individual, so if they/their app turns nefarious, Apple can simply block their signature, and their app can't run on any Mac (with Gatekeeper turned on anyway). Long story short, any decent Mac developer already has a signature, so while I'm sure there will be apps that are affected, given that registering for a key is free, and the devs sign the app themselves, they've no excuse to not do it. UAC is totally different and is more to do with givings users only having certain privileges, a concept Windows didn't really have (that worked in the real world anyway) until Vista, where the security overhaul showed just how many programs relied on running as an admin, by throwing up elevation requests every 2 seconds
[QUOTE=danielmm8888;37001934]RTM is going to be given to the OEM's on August 1st, let's hope one of them will leak it.[/QUOTE] It will most likely be one of those MSDN Subscribers who feels like breaking NDA. This is what I hate about people sometimes...
I guess this fits into here [url]http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-07-31/microsoft-to-phase-out-hotmail-focus-on-outlook-e-mail[/url] Go to outlook.com to test it out. I quite like it.
God damn the UI is pretty. Also I got some cool aliases.
I stopped using hotmail when gmail offered a decent and clean web interface and when I found out hotmail was advertising itself in the signatures of my emails many years ago.
[QUOTE=Elements;37022217]I guess this fits into here [url]http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-07-31/microsoft-to-phase-out-hotmail-focus-on-outlook-e-mail[/url] Go to outlook.com to test it out. I quite like it.[/QUOTE] There's a whole thread about it [URL="http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1202049"]here[/URL]
Gah, I'm falling in love with metro. It's so clean and modern, I just love the whole design language
[url]http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/1/3188541/windows-8-rtm-development-complete[/url] And it's finished! The final build is 9200.16384.win8_rtm.120725-1247. Now we just wait for it to get leaked!
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/IXyZx.png[/IMG]
[QUOTE=CarlBooth;37035231][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/IXyZx.png[/IMG][/QUOTE] Released to Manufactured.
[QUOTE=Panda X;37037060]Released to Manufactured.[/QUOTE] Oh Paul, you silly silly goose. Here's a screenshot of the final Windows 8 desktop UI. [img]http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/9739/clipboard2ug.png[/img]
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