• Microsoft Security Essentials released! And it's still good!
    97 replies, posted
[QUOTE=PvtCupcakes;17599692]Muffin isn't saying to build AV into the system, he's saying that there shouldn't be huge security holes in Windows to begin with. Windows is the only OS that even recommends that you use Antivirus. It's not just because they have the largest market either. Linux has a huge portion of the server market, which is even more attractive to would-be hackers, and cell phones don't have that problem either. AFAIK, there are no viruses/trojans/botnets/etc on even the Motorola Razr, Iphone, or Blackberry. [editline]09:45AM[/editline] Also, there are no viruses that I'm aware of for any Unix based OS like Mac OS X, BSD, Solaris, HP UX, or IBM AIX.[/QUOTE] There are Mac viruses, and Apple actually recommend getting a 3rd party AV program. There are more security holes in Mac OS X fully patched than windows Vista unpatched, it's just that hardly anyone exploits them, it would be uneconomical as Windows has the largest number of users. Now stop shitting up the thread and talk about the program before I imagine banning you.
[QUOTE=blankthemuffin;17598002]Did you just ignore the previous conversation, or are you just here to defend Microsoft like you're being paid? But I suppose in the interest of intelligent conversation. "the EU would fucking rape them" No, the EU raped them for anti-competitive behavior, promoting their services and products by bundling them with the operating system. One may argue that a web browser is an intrinsic part of computing today, but by no means can you argue that it's a concern of the operating system. Also, these came about also because Internet Explorer was built to be part of the operating system, so you could not remove or completely replace it.[/quote] I'm pretty sure if MS released MSE with Windows, that would count as using an existing monopoly to gain another ala IE. Also it's fair play to stop viruses that get in through security holes, but I'm talking about times when the program is authorised to run, but is still harmful to your PC. Normal users don't know any better and will run anything. In this case AV would still stop the program, and that is what I am talking about. That's additional security that doesn't really need to be provided by the OS. Sure UAC will warn you when things try to touch the registry or whatever, but if you say yes then it's full steam ahead. [quote]"And if MS cared about the money, why would they be giving this (highly competent) AV for free?" Right, Microsoft, a company, don't care about the money. OK, provided they turned into a magical philanthropic company overnight let's see what else is wrong with this. They're marketing it as a.[/QUOTE] You are taking what I said out of context. For this product, they don't care about the money. It improves the image of Windows security. If MS didn't care about money at all, you wouldn't have to pass WGA in order to run this (I know you can bypass WGA, but that isn't really the market this product is aimed at).
[QUOTE=blankthemuffin;17598002]Did you just ignore the previous conversation, or are you just here to defend Microsoft like you're being paid? But I suppose in the interest of intelligent conversation. "the EU would fucking rape them" No, the EU raped them for anti-competitive behavior, promoting their services and products by bundling them with the operating system. One may argue that a web browser is an intrinsic part of computing today, but by no means can you argue that it's a concern of the operating system. Also, these came about also because Internet Explorer was built to be part of the operating system, so you could not remove or completely replace it. "And if MS cared about the money, why would they be giving this (highly competent) AV for free?" Right, Microsoft, a company, don't care about the money. OK, provided they turned into a magical philanthropic company overnight let's see what else is wrong with this. They're marketing it as a. Ok, let's stop right there. Microsoft are selling this as a replacement for other anti-virus suites. They recommend uninstalling all other av software before installing WLE. You lied to me Plastical! "MSE is pretty decent, but it is not meant to replace other suites such as Symantec, McAfee, ESET, and Kaspersky; Microsoft stated that themselves." With this groundbreaking knowledge, I can say that this is a positive move from Microsoft, although I'd prefer a larger focus on security at the OS level, removing to a large extent the need for this kind of stuff.[/QUOTE] Microsoft almost got sued by Google for having the Search button in the start menu open search in Windows Explorer... They had to change it to avoid being sued. And now you don't see it in Vista SP1 or higher. And you might not find it anti-competitive, however the FCC/EU will. Which is why it remains separate.
Yes, since it is a anti-virus product, the companies building their own av systems would undoubtedly kick up a serious shit-fight if it were shipped with the OS. Roast Beast, your sources are impeccable. Studies by a company selling an anti-virus product for windows/mac/linux are telling you there are heaps of viruses and malware for these platforms! Crazy! Like I've said before, malware is often a user issue, but design in the operating system goes a long way to helping users. For example, with linux I almost never download and execute random binaries off the internet. It's just the way it's designed. All my software comes from secure servers, and is cryptographically signed.
I've been noticing lately how Linux users visit the Windows forum more than the actual Linux forum. My point is simply that if you don't like MS products at all and feel enmity towards them, why post?
[QUOTE=Plastical;17605540]I've been noticing lately how Linux users visit the Windows forum more than the actual Linux forum. My point is simply that if you don't like MS products at all and feel enmity towards them, why post?[/QUOTE] This really has nothing to do with Linux. He's saying that if Windows didn't have [b]BIG, GAPING SECURITY HOLES[/b] there wouldn't be a need for an antivirus. It sounds like you guys are arguing that having a secure OS "out of the box" that doesn't even need antivirus is anti-competitive in some way. All it does is make corporations like Symantec and McAfee irrelevant.
what's to say there's more holes? Windows is the most used OS so more holes are found for it to exploit, doesn't mean other OSes have less holes
ITT linuxfags bash windows as usual. I don't like MSE simply for the fact that installing it makes my laptop no longer get past the login screen. Dunno why. Works fine on my PC though, in which case I do like it.
[QUOTE=blankthemuffin;17604784]Yes, since it is a anti-virus product, the companies building their own av systems would undoubtedly kick up a serious shit-fight if it were shipped with the OS. Roast Beast, your sources are impeccable. Studies by a company selling an anti-virus product for windows/mac/linux are telling you there are heaps of viruses and malware for these platforms! Crazy! Like I've said before, malware is often a user issue, but design in the operating system goes a long way to helping users. For example, with linux I almost never download and execute random binaries off the internet. It's just the way it's designed. All my software comes from secure servers, and is cryptographically signed.[/QUOTE] "i love linux m$ sucks it has viruses lololol" let me ask you this. do you open every program you download and look at the source code? how do you know your "trusted" program won't do something nasty? "oh its linux if i open it as root ill be fine". seriously, stop thread shitting. also, there are more linux security exploits than windows exploits. [url]http://www.geek.com/articles/news/linux-exploits-top-windows-for-first-time-ever-2003065/[/url] and that's from 2003.
[QUOTE=blankthemuffin;17604784]Roast Beast, your sources are impeccable. Studies by a company selling an anti-virus product for windows/mac/linux are telling you there are heaps of viruses and malware for these platforms! Crazy![/QUOTE] I don't see you offering counter sources. [QUOTE=PvtCupcakes;17605927]This really has nothing to do with Linux. He's saying that if Windows didn't have [b]BIG, GAPING SECURITY HOLES[/b] there wouldn't be a need for an antivirus. It sounds like you guys are arguing that having a secure OS "out of the box" that doesn't even need antivirus is anti-competitive in some way. All it does is make corporations like Symantec and McAfee irrelevant.[/QUOTE] This sure sounds like he's suggested integrating an AV into Windows: [QUOTE=blankthemuffin;17597257]In my opinion, since viruses are so rampant in windows, [B]they really should be providing a high quality solution, for free. Hell it should be built in.[/B] There should be no "competition" to eliminate. It seems insane to me that something as high priority as security is palmed off to third parties. Not to mention this on its own is a massive vector for malicious software.[/QUOTE] Which is anti-competitive and what we're arguing about. [editline]01:14PM[/editline] Oh, and if it has nothing to do with linux then why do you keep dragging linux into it?
This is actually pretty good. It actually gives yo a clear choice of actions regarding an infected file, unlike Avast, which goes 'HEY LOOK A FALSE POSITIVVE DELETE IT DELETE IT QUARANTINE IT QUARANTINE IT NO YOU HAVE TO DO ONE OR THE OTHER YES THERE'S AN IGNORE BUTTON BUT IT'S THE FUCKING CLOSE WINDOW BUTTON SO NO-ONE WILL NOTICE.' Plus it looks nice which is always nice. I'm pretty internet savvy, so I hardly ever get viruses, but it pays to have the occasional scan.
[QUOTE=Roast Beast;17618759]Oh, and if it has nothing to do with linux then why do you keep dragging linux into it?[/QUOTE] Because it's an example of an OS that doesn't currently require an anti-virus, and most likely never will. If he replaced Linux by BSD, would people stop whining?
[QUOTE=gparent;17622928]Because it's an example of an OS that doesn't currently require an anti-virus, and most likely never will. If he replaced Linux by BSD, would people stop whining?[/QUOTE] No. I mentioned Linux, BSD, OS X, Solaris, HP-UX, and IBM AIX and that didn't stop them from whining. I'll throw in BeOS/Haiku, OS/2, Amiga, and the classic Mac OSs as well.
[img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/emoot/ughh.gif[/img] [QUOTE=Roast Beast;17600323][B]Stop trying to derail the thread.[/B][/QUOTE]
This is pretty goddamn good.
ok so I KNOW you've all been waiting for my report on this, and the reason I haven't done it till now is because I forgot. Anyway, so after however long I've been running MSE I really like it. It's completely silent, and when it actually detected a virus on my Eee, the box gave me clear instructions what to do, and it caught the file as soon as it finished downloading. I've had no reports on my main PC, but it caught that EICAR test file thing fine, so it should be working fine. Overall, this is a really solid AV solution and I'm sticking with it over NOD32 for the forseeable future
Same, I agree with Dr Egg.
Norton 2009 was great, but memory usage shot up again with the 2010 client. I have a feeling it's running the same course as the Norton 2005/6 suites, which sucked balls. I may have to give this a try once I get my full version of W7x64.
[QUOTE=Nevermind_;17761164]Norton 2009 was great, but memory usage shot up again with the 2010 client. I have a feeling it's running the same course as the Norton 2005/6 suites, which sucked balls. I may have to give this a try once I get my full version of W7x64.[/QUOTE] Norton was never great.
I got this to replace my broken Avast! (stopped launching with Windows, no matter what I tried). Picked up two or three things Avast never could, my guess is they were fucking with the scanner or something. Works really well as a replacement, I don't even notice it running half the time, so all is well.
[QUOTE=Panda X;17762311]Norton was never great.[/QUOTE]Incorrect, the 2008/9 versions were pretty bomb. I switched from Nod 32 and until the 2010 version came out, I never thought of going back. All of the Anti-Norton crowd most likely have never used the 2008 or 2009 Antivirus product (and not that POS Norton 360). I'll probably switch to something else once my subscription runs out in 52 days. The 2010 product is not good.
[QUOTE=Nevermind_;17766275]Incorrect, the 2008/9 versions were pretty bomb. I switched from Nod 32 and until the 2010 version came out, I never thought of going back. All of the Anti-Norton crowd most likely have never used the 2008 or 2009 Antivirus product (and not that POS Norton 360). I'll probably switch to something else once my subscription runs out in 52 days. The 2010 product is not good.[/QUOTE] Norton was never great.
Pretty good. Haven't had any problems so far. Even found some shit on my HD that AVG didn't see.
I found 8 things from my old XP install and I installed it on my dads laptop withought breaking it.
It's only a matter of time before malware will be able to outsmart it. I like it so far though.
[QUOTE=DamagePoint;17779064]It's only a matter of time before malware will be able to outsmart it. I like it so far though.[/QUOTE] I think Microsoft will keep updating it.
[QUOTE=DamagePoint;17779064]It's only a matter of time before malware will be able to outsmart it. I like it so far though.[/QUOTE] It has heuristics and will upload details about anything it thinks suspicious (with your consent) to Microsoft for analysis like every other major AV. This is a proper AV solution.
I will try to run it under Wine just for the kicks and giggles. [editline]07:34PM[/editline] [code]wine: Call from 0x7bc4571c to unimplemented function ADVAPI32.dll.QueryAllTracesW, aborting wine: Unimplemented function ADVAPI32.dll.QueryAllTracesW called at address 0x7bc4571c (thread 001c), starting debugger... [/code] omg omg i can't run it I will not be able to stop viruses halp halp :saddowns: [editline]07:35PM[/editline] Oh wait. [editline]07:36PM[/editline] [QUOTE=PvtCupcakes;17594610]Thats still 472k too much. Also, AV scanners thrash the hell out of hard drives which is far worse than their memory usage. I got some corporate Symantec scanner at work which thrashes my drive until I can't get anything done. [editline]09:59PM[/editline] Thats when I turn my Mac Mini on; and fire up my Fedora VM. :v:[/QUOTE] Now you stop trolling them. They have already their lives hard due to their flimsy operating system :v:
[QUOTE=Dr Egg;17780046]It has heuristics and will upload details about anything it thinks suspicious (with your consent) to Microsoft for analysis like every other major AV. This is a proper AV solution.[/QUOTE] True, but it didn't take long for people to create viruses that couldn't be detected by Windows Defender even though they updated the definitions for that.
[QUOTE=Panda X;17766379]Norton was never great.[/QUOTE]Novice computer users often say software/games/hardware are bad because they are not tech savvy enough to operate it.
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