General Linux Chat and Small Questions v. I broke my Arch Install - Hardware & Software

Can anyone explain Systemd and Upstart and the differences? I don't really understand the low-level Linux stuff.

If I'm getting this straight, [URL="http://vanemery.com/Linux/XoverSSH/X-over-SSH2.html"]it should be possible to display stuff from one computer to another over a network via X[/URL] (or whatever it's called now), right? If so, would it be possible to do something, for example, streaming a game over LAN to a weaker computer without other complicated tools besides the necessary stuff? Would a Raspberry Pi be a good candidate for an X client?

[QUOTE=Darkwater124;43837684]Can anyone explain Systemd and Upstart and the differences? I don't really understand the low-level Linux stuff.[/QUOTE] I couldn't tell you much about upstart beyond the fact that it's made by Canonical, who apparently like to be contrary to everyone these days

[QUOTE=Darkwater124;43837684]Can anyone explain Systemd and Upstart and the differences? I don't really understand the low-level Linux stuff.[/QUOTE] They are both replacements for the old and awful sysvinit. systemd is less conservative with functionality than Upstart is, and Upstart predates systemd by a few years. I couldn't give you a table of differences but they both do a much better job that sysvinit. systemd also has a bunch of other components under the same umbrella which makes a lot of people nervous for some reason or another. You can read about systemd [url=http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/systemd.html]here[/url] if you want to learn about it. I'm sure there's someone from Canonical willing to vouch for Upstart.

[QUOTE=Darkwater124;43837684]Can anyone explain Systemd and Upstart and the differences? I don't really understand the low-level Linux stuff.[/QUOTE] Well, both are "init-systems", which is simply put "the service who starts all other services", aswell as closing them cleanly when you shut down the system. Both Upstart (2006) and Systemd (2010) are replacements for the original SysV system. The problem with SysV was that it only simply executed shellfiles based on an numerical order. The other problem with SysV is that it only worked in serial (Starting one service after the other). It also had several issues with "dynamic systems", where hardware could change at any time while the system is running. Upstart fixed alot of these problems, it was dependance-based (Meaning it executed services after which that were dependant on which), and it worked in parallel. Upstart was also quite different from other dependance-based systems at the time, as it also utilizes "events", by using these events the system could also notify services about dynamic hardware changes. I do not have much experience with Systemd, so I cannot directly compare them or explain much on how it works. The thing I do know is that systemd is much larger, and integrates itself much more into the system. In this way processes could be even more tailored priority-wise, ex. waiting for sockets to open before running the service etc. Its also much more "aggressive" with parallizing, and its philosopy is that no system resources should be spared to boot faster. Some pages worthwile to read if you're interested: [URL="http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/#introduction"]Upstart Cookbook [by Canonical][/URL] (Explains alot of what an Init-system is, aswell as the benefits and downsites with different init-systems) [URL="http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/why.html"]Systemd: Why systemd? [By an systemd developer][/URL] [editline]8th February 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Stonecycle;43837685]If I'm getting this straight, [URL="http://vanemery.com/Linux/XoverSSH/X-over-SSH2.html"]it should be possible to display stuff from one computer to another over a network via X[/URL] (or whatever it's called now), right? If so, would it be possible to do something, for example, streaming a game over LAN to a weaker computer without other complicated tools besides the necessary stuff? Would a Raspberry Pi be a good candidate for an X client?[/QUOTE] I do not think remote X will be able to stream games. If I remember right then X does not support sending OpenGL/accelerated 2D/3D content. You should use something like VNC or something instead.

Howdy, so, got a problem right now with Mate on ubuntu 12.04 I initially installed it all fine and such, but I borked something up when trying to enable Compiz and now I can't even get to a fully rendered desktop, making mate completely useless. Removing mate is easy enough, but I was kinda hoping to make Mate the default thing there. I can't get mateconf-editor to show up anywhere, and I can't figure out where Mate keeps its configure files.

[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;43839163]Howdy, so, got a problem right now with Mate on ubuntu 12.04 I initially installed it all fine and such, but I borked something up when trying to enable Compiz and now I can't even get to a fully rendered desktop, making mate completely useless. Removing mate is easy enough, but I was kinda hoping to make Mate the default thing there. I can't get mateconf-editor to show up anywhere, and I can't figure out where Mate keeps its configure files.[/QUOTE] I do not use MATE myself, but have you checked for dot-files? Most DE's save their configurations in the users home folder as ex. ".kde". You can use "ls -a" to view hidden dot-files.

Well, Ian Jackson from the Debian Technical Committee just went off the fucking deep end of the pool. The chairman of the TC voted differently than he did, so now he called a vote on firing the chairman. [url]http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.debian.devel.ctte/5392[/url] After that, he called for votes [url="https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00347.html"]on the most complicated piece-of-shit ballot I have ever fucking seen[/url]. Then called for a vote on not allowing a specific init system (and the only vote options are "agree with me, or further discussion is needed"): [url]https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00353.html[/url] And because the votes are going towards the way of Systemd, he called for a general resolution to overrule the decision of the technical committee: [url]https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00355.html[/url] Aaaaaaand then he ragequit the technical committee: [url]https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00359.html[/url] Jesus, fucking, Christ. Oh, and he did all that shit within what, 30 minutes or so.

[QUOTE=nikomo;43849953]Well, Ian Jackson from the Debian Technical Committee just went off the fucking deep end of the pool. The chairman of the TC voted differently than he did, so now he called a vote on firing the chairman. [url]http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.debian.devel.ctte/5392[/url] After that, he called for votes [url="https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00347.html"]on the most complicated piece-of-shit ballot I have ever fucking seen[/url]. Then called for a vote on not allowing a specific init system (and the only vote options are "agree with me, or further discussion is needed"): [url]https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00353.html[/url] And because the votes are going towards the way of Systemd, he called for a general resolution to overrule the decision of the technical committee: [url]https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00355.html[/url] Aaaaaaand then he ragequit the technical committee: [url]https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/02/msg00359.html[/url] Jesus, fucking, Christ. Oh, and he did all that shit within what, 30 minutes or so.[/QUOTE] The debian comittee is currently riding a political rollercoaster. ANd I hope some people will fall off it, and land in a pit of GNU/hurd files. [quote] Software outside of an init system's implementation may not require a specific init system to be pid 1, although degraded operation is tolerable. [/quote] I'm sorry what?

In other news, I grabbed Debian, threw it in a VM, installed it, upgraded it to sid, installed Systemd and then switched to it. Jesus this thing is fucking fast to boot. Basically cut down boot-up by like 10 seconds, in a VM.

I've been running Android on my Nexus 7 for a while now, but after seeing some videos on YouTube of people running Ubuntu on the thing, would you guys see any problem if I choose to use Ubuntu over Android if I were to install it? I've got only a few days of Linux experience, so I'm not sure if there are a lot of issues with running Ubuntu on here.

[url=http://wilwheaton.tumblr.com/post/76189388483/i-remember-you-bringing-the-snark-with-patrick-norton]Turns out Wil Wheaton is a Debian guy.[/url] I just asked him to weigh in on the whole systemd/upstart thing, I'm curious. [editline]9th February 2014[/editline] Apparently the Debian thing was already previous knowledge, according to Wikipedia. Still, I want to know his opinion on low level shit he's probably none too concerned with.

I really need to pick up some popcorn while at the store, just in case something Debian-related happens today, other than the vote going through and Systemd being selected.

[QUOTE=Anderen2;43849823]I do not use MATE myself, but have you checked for dot-files? Most DE's save their configurations in the users home folder as ex. ".kde". You can use "ls -a" to view hidden dot-files.[/QUOTE] I had already waxed .mate and .caja, but it was still trying to load Compiz as its window manager. I ended up running "marco --replace" to get Compiz out of the way so I could actually use the damn thing and then just added "marco --replace" to the list of startup commands until I can be assed to deal with it later.

Apparently i3 has a limit on how many terminals you can have open. [url]http://img.nikomo.fi/Debian.ogv[/url]

[QUOTE=nikomo;43859547]Apparently i3 has a limit on how many terminals you can have open. [url]http://img.nikomo.fi/Debian.ogv[/url][/QUOTE] AwesomeWM froze when I held my terminal key combination for couple of seconds.

It feels like the current selection of DEs suck. The only choices are pretty, fast, or a usable interface. GNOME 3's my preferred one with usability (stop laughing) and looks, but lacks in the performance department. KDE's fast but looks Vista ugly no matter what theme you use and not to mention the Windows-like interface and launcher when I've just stopped using a taskbar. i3's broken when I attempted to use it. XFCE, LXDE, etc. fall under the KDE issue. Pantheon was good but games in fullscreen had a problem thanks to the custom WM. Unity is also close to my choice besides a few tweaks. Why would you even make scrolling up on an alt+tab switcher move the selection go right? tl;dr I wish GNOME 3 was faster, what's another DE you guys suggest?

Well, as mentioned earlier I use Mate, so GNOME 2 is what I really prefer. KDE to me was too flashy and the themes were annoying and I just couldn't stand it. XFCE was too... barebones. GNOME 3 and Unity piss me off, and I haven't tried Pantheon or i3. Friggen moody as fuck install, I swear. Boot up, wireless refuses to play along. ethernet and tethering work fine, but wireless just won't play ball whatsoever. So I start investigating, have to grab something so it goes to sleep, wake it up, wireless works. Mother[I]fucker[/I] I'll kill you.

[QUOTE=Stonecycle;43866197]It feels like the current selection of DEs suck. The only choices are pretty, fast, or a usable interface. GNOME 3's my preferred one with usability (stop laughing) and looks, but lacks in the performance department. KDE's fast but looks Vista ugly no matter what theme you use and not to mention the Windows-like interface and launcher when I've just stopped using a taskbar. i3's broken when I attempted to use it. XFCE, LXDE, etc. fall under the KDE issue. Pantheon was good but games in fullscreen had a problem thanks to the custom WM. Unity is also close to my choice besides a few tweaks. Why would you even make scrolling up on an alt+tab switcher move the selection go right? tl;dr I wish GNOME 3 was faster, what's another DE you guys suggest?[/QUOTE] You could try Cinnamon, but other than that I think you've already covered all the full DEs. I'm curious what you don't like about XFCE though, IMO it's just about perfect.

[QUOTE=IpHa;43866299]I'm curious what you don't like about XFCE though, IMO it's just about perfect.[/QUOTE] Partially because last time I tried it, you still couldn't press super to open a launcher of some form, type in what you want, and press enter to launch it and like S31 said, too barebones. KDE, trying it out again, doesn't even handle multi-monitor things (like a laptop docking to use one monitor when plugged). Cinnamon; never got out of a black screen when I bothered. MATE felt too outdated because it is (still on GTK2). I would totally do my own DE if I could but I'm not even skilled enough in programming to do much of anything involving an interface.

[QUOTE=Stonecycle;43866443]KDE, trying it out again, doesn't even handle multi-monitor things (like a laptop docking to use one monitor when plugged). .[/QUOTE] What is the problem exactly? I use KDE all the time from my laptop with an external monitor.

[QUOTE=danharibo;43866458]What is the problem exactly? I use KDE all the time from my laptop with an external monitor.[/QUOTE] Couldn't disable any monitor. Monitor settings are all about when to lock and what screensaver. Trying out Pantheon separate from eOS to see if it'll work.

[QUOTE=Stonecycle;43866507]Couldn't disable any monitor. Monitor settings are all about when to lock and what screensaver.[/QUOTE] uh are you sure your install isn't broken somehow because that's a thing that exists in KDE

[QUOTE=lavacano;43866531]uh are you sure your install isn't broken somehow because that's a thing that exists in KDE[/QUOTE] Something probably is broken since Display & Monitor in the system settings only takes me to Screen Locker. Maybe if Fedora didn't split an installation into several partitions and didn't have a complicated-looking installer, I may be using it right now. This is just some rotten luck right now. [editline]e[/editline] Screw it, I'm going back to Unity on a fresh install. Not arxing myself to go and get rid of all these DEs manually.

[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;43854605]I've been running Android on my Nexus 7 for a while now, but after seeing some videos on YouTube of people running Ubuntu on the thing, would you guys see any problem if I choose to use Ubuntu over Android if I were to install it? I've got only a few days of Linux experience, so I'm not sure if there are a lot of issues with running Ubuntu on here.[/QUOTE] I've heard Ubuntu touch is still buggy. When I installed the desktop version of ubuntu, it was a complete piece of shit and took like 15 seconds to respond to certain touch functions. The GUI was awful. That said, it's not the easiest thing to install ubuntu but if you do, you probably want a different DE as well as a few other modifications, but it can be done. My install's still a bit rough but I'm playing around with it. If you need help with installing it, I can definitely give you some assistance. [img]http://i.imgur.com/htyMcaZ.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/12MBPLZ.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/G8XKLpl.jpg[/img] [editline]10th February 2014[/editline] From experience, the best way to actually install the thing is to do it over a serial connection after getting through initial setup so you don't have to deal with the bullshit UI it comes with by default. I can help with that as well, but it's a tad tricky because you have to disable driver signing and whatnot. [editline]10th February 2014[/editline] Overall though, it's really fun to mess with.

[QUOTE=Stonecycle;43866443]Partially because last time I tried it, you still couldn't press super to open a launcher of some form, type in what you want, and press enter to launch it and like S31 said, too barebones. KDE, trying it out again, doesn't even handle multi-monitor things (like a laptop docking to use one monitor when plugged). Cinnamon; never got out of a black screen when I bothered. MATE felt too outdated because it is (still on GTK2). I would totally do my own DE if I could but I'm not even skilled enough in programming to do much of anything involving an interface.[/QUOTE] Xfce alone is intentionally bare-bones, it is packaged with just the essentials, and it is up to the user to install modules to add additional functionality. For example, if you want a fully featured search-able start menu, you can look into [url=http://gottcode.org/xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin/]Whisker[/url].

When it comes to floating Window Managers, I kinda prefer XFCE or LXDE rather than Gnome Shell or KDE. Sometimes I tend to use Cinnamon.

[QUOTE=Banandana;43867209]I've heard Ubuntu touch is still buggy. When I installed the desktop version of ubuntu, it was a complete piece of shit and took like 15 seconds to respond to certain touch functions. The GUI was awful. That said, it's not the easiest thing to install ubuntu but if you do, you probably want a different DE as well as a few other modifications, but it can be done. My install's still a bit rough but I'm playing around with it. If you need help with installing it, I can definitely give you some assistance. [img]http://i.imgur.com/htyMcaZ.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/12MBPLZ.png[/img] [img]http://i.imgur.com/G8XKLpl.jpg[/img] [editline]10th February 2014[/editline] From experience, the best way to actually install the thing is to do it over a serial connection after getting through initial setup so you don't have to deal with the bullshit UI it comes with by default. I can help with that as well, but it's a tad tricky because you have to disable driver signing and whatnot. [editline]10th February 2014[/editline] Overall though, it's really fun to mess with.[/QUOTE] I wonder; is there an ARM build of Krita available? It's fullscreen mode might be a bit more usable at 7" than GIMP.

I have a VPS in New York. I live in the UK and id like to run a couple of GUI applications on my VPS but the trouble is, its really laggy over VNC. Im in the UK so the pings around 80 to at its highest 120. Is there any alternative to VNC that work well over long distances? It becomes less laggy if I turn down the colors to 256 which id rather not. How do companies like Onlive do it? I used to play on US servers when using Onlive and it worked pretty well and everything was nice and smooth. I dont want everything liquid smooth, but not shuttering frames. I have another VPS in Italy which works great with millions of colors and everythings nice and smooth enough. Any ideas?

[QUOTE=Chizbang;43868536]I have a VPS in New York. I live in the UK and id like to run a couple of GUI applications on my VPS but the trouble is, its really laggy over VNC. Im in the UK so the pings around 80 to at its highest 120. Is there any alternative to VNC that work well over long distances? It becomes less laggy if I turn down the colors to 256 which id rather not. How do companies like Onlive do it? I used to play on US servers when using Onlive and it worked pretty well and everything was nice and smooth. I dont want everything liquid smooth, but not shuttering frames. I have another VPS in Italy which works great with millions of colors and everythings nice and smooth enough. Any ideas?[/QUOTE] You could try using XServer.