Study: Disciplinary spanking increases childhood defiance and mental health issues
137 replies, posted
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;50210324] you're automatically dismissed and no matter how eloquent your argument is you've fucked yourself right out of the gate.[/QUOTE]
This is equvalent to putting your fingers in your ear and going "LALALA CANT HEAR YOU LALALA!!!"
[QUOTE=DesumThePanda;50209587]not if you live in the southern U.S. just about every other guy in my class has some sort of story about when they were beaten as a child, a couple of them even have stories about how the principal paddled them (which they acted all macho and said didn't hurt). shit, my parents occasionally threaten to beat me and i'm 18. the attitude in the south in general is very much behind on this issue.[/QUOTE]
It's not just the South, it's a generation thing. Oddly enough my dads parents always threatened it by the sound of things and he always threatened it, but then again my dad always remembers things quite a bit differently than his siblings and his parents had a massive double standard for him that he still has a chip on his shoulder for
[QUOTE=KonorB;50210975]This is equvalent to putting your fingers in your ear and going "LALALA CANT HEAR YOU LALALA!!!"[/QUOTE]Yes, and your point is?
The entire concept of spanking is foreign to me and to me it seems to have no other purpose other than scaring a kid and also embarrassing them. It's way out of place and out of time, imo.
I was a little shit when I was young, I was spanked, my parents were kind and loving, I turned out fine.
My girlfriend was spanked, borderline beaten, her mom is a physio cunt who puts everything else before her kids, my girlfriend and her 3 siblings turned out how the title suggests.
I think there is a major difference between getting 4 finger slapped on the ass after throwing a tantrum in a store by a good parent vs getting beat with the first object found after using a little sass or getting a D in school by a parent that treats you like a welfare check the rest of the time.
I'm sure it's different for everyone, although that study had become the result of the majority of kids. Me and my brother were occasionally hit and smacked when we were kids whenever our behaviours got too out of control. Since then we've learned manners and respect :v:
[QUOTE=FreyasFighter;50211345]I'm sure it's different for everyone, although that study had become the result of the majority of kids. Me and my brother were occasionally hit and smacked when we were kids whenever our behaviours got too out of control. Since then we've learned manners and respect :v:[/QUOTE]
yeah I've learned manners too, with a touch of having fucking anxiety.
[QUOTE=highvoltage;50211279]I was a little shit when I was young, I was spanked, my parents were kind and loving, I turned out fine.[/QUOTE]
Same here, also a shit when younger and got the slap for being so, I didn't develop any of these mental health issues, I dealt with the consequences for my actions and turned out perfectly normal and have no criminal record etc.
[editline]27th April 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=FreyasFighter;50211345]I'm sure it's different for everyone, although that study had become the result of the majority of kids. Me and my brother were occasionally hit and smacked when we were kids whenever our behaviours got too out of control. Since then we've learned manners and respect :v:[/QUOTE]
This too.
then what are you supposed to do with children who are being unruly little assholes
talking doesn't do anything because they just say 'lmao fuck u dad ;))))'
everything else they won't give a shit and are more likely to just be cunts just because they know it pisses you off and you won't do anything
i mean fuck they try that shit around other kids and they'd probably get their shit stomped in and be confused as to why violence was used against them when they were being complete twats and i guarantee you the other kids would beat the fuck out of them far more harshly than you ever would so what is the """"correct"""" way to do handle things
I discussed this with a few asian friends who were spanked when they were kids (it's a lot more common in asia). They all turned out nice and respectful people. One of them even told me that, according to him, spanking was a better way to be taught respect compared to lecturing. And he'd gladly spank his kids if he needed to. He thought that western way of education was too laxist because western kids usually seem less respectful than asian's (and I think that's true)
I figured it would depend on how it's used.
If you use it for literally everything of course it's going to cause problems.
My father only used it in extreme situations and I don't recall there being any problems at all coming from it.
I was spanked as a child and turned out to be a sjw
[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;50211406]then what are you supposed to do with children who are being unruly little assholes
talking doesn't do anything because they just say 'lmao fuck u dad ;))))'[/QUOTE]
not if you're actually a good parent lmao, there are plenty of other ways to discipline a child
the only ones who endorse spanking are the ones who were spanked as children
[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;50211406]then what are you supposed to do with children who are being unruly little assholes
talking doesn't do anything because they just say 'lmao fuck u dad ;))))'
everything else they won't give a shit and are more likely to just be cunts just because they know it pisses you off and you won't do anything
i mean fuck they try that shit around other kids and they'd probably get their shit stomped in and be confused as to why violence was used against them when they were being complete twats and i guarantee you the other kids would beat the fuck out of them far more harshly than you ever would so what is the """"correct"""" way to do handle things[/QUOTE]
Your conception of discipline is disturbingly narrow.
[QUOTE=Retardation;50211757]Good job assuming children are more influenced by their parents than by their environment.[/QUOTE]
but if their parents teach their children about their environment?
[QUOTE=Retardation;50211757]Good job assuming children are more influenced by their parents than by their environment.[/QUOTE]
Aren't parents pretty much the biggest factor in their environment?
[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;50211406]then what are you supposed to do with children who are being unruly little assholes
talking doesn't do anything because they just say 'lmao fuck u dad ;))))'
everything else they won't give a shit and are more likely to just be cunts just because they know it pisses you off and you won't do anything
i mean fuck they try that shit around other kids and they'd probably get their shit stomped in and be confused as to why violence was used against them when they were being complete twats and i guarantee you the other kids would beat the fuck out of them far more harshly than you ever would so what is the """"correct"""" way to do handle things[/QUOTE]
I predicted a response like yours in the last comment I made on this thread. If you're actually a good parent then you don't need to rely on anything physical to discipline your child or even apply any means of physical discipline. There are plenty of other ways to discipline a child. Thinking physical discipline is the ONLY effective means of discipline is a laughably narrow view on discipline.
[QUOTE=Megadave;50211347]yeah I've learned manners too, with a touch of having fucking anxiety.[/QUOTE]
I have had major depression and anxiety for ten years and counting however, BUT that had nothing to do with my upbringing or my family, it was moreso my years in high school and my social life in the past.
How closed-minded and self-centered do you have to be to see an actual academic study say that spanking causes harm to kids and still say "Yeah, well >>>>I'm<<<< fine, so this study is bullshit!"
[editline]27th April 2016[/editline]
It's funny too cause you actually aren't fine, you think beating kids is acceptable punishment
[QUOTE=BelatedGamer;50211753]Your conception of discipline is disturbingly narrow.[/QUOTE]
This is not a rebuttal, and the fact you spent no more time on it than a few seconds typing this sentence-long response shows you haven't actually got anything concrete against his argument.
Spanking isn't societal cancer like these studies always claim it is. They always neglect, as others have pointed out, to mention the much more significant number of factors that influence the development of individuals in their lives-- the majority of which are external and have to do with peer relations, social standing and belonging, networking and support, etc. They also fail to establish a consistent definition for what exactly constitutes spanking compared against, say for example, what constitutes abuse. It's one thing to spank a child rarely because it has done something wrong and won't listen to reason; it's something else entirely to spank them over and over again whenever they do something wrong and no attempts are made to reason with them.
But whatever. That's the politicization of science for you, and this is a very political topic, so of course this is going to be the narrative.
[editline]27th April 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Starlight 456;50212156]How closed-minded and self-centered do you have to be to see an actual academic study say that spanking causes harm to kids and still say "Yeah, well >>>>I'm<<<< fine, so this study is bullshit!"
[editline]27th April 2016[/editline]
It's funny too cause you actually aren't fine, you think beating kids is acceptable punishment[/QUOTE]
Spanking is not the same as beating. Sorry.
[QUOTE=Eric95;50211694]
the only ones who endorse spanking are the ones who were spanked as children[/QUOTE]
I was never spanked nor punished in any physical way, I absolutely endorse spanking. I think I'd turn out better if I was spanked a few times when I deserved it.
Quit Hitting Children 2016
Yet another sweeping study revealing the harmful affects of physical punishment on childhood development, and yet again people look for reasons to dismiss it. Real question: what would actually take to finally drill the concept into your head? Hitting children hurts more than it helps when it comes to curbing bad social behavior.
I really want to know why people are arguing that spanking isn't the same as beating. It's all physical violence as punishment.
Is it severity? Are we supposed to trust that because your parents didn't spank you too hard, all spankings are light and in balance of whatever the child did to wrong the parent? All of this because we say spank instead of hit?
Is it because spanking is hitting a kid's ass? Is there some kind of magical 'learning zone' on a child's posterior that transforms any violence into a useful learning experience rather than pain and fear?
Honestly very curious about the differences, because right now it just seems like cognitive dissonance.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, the line that separates diciplinary violence and a parents outlet for anger is a blurry one.
I would imagine that parents who resort to corporal punishment are more likely to foster a generally negative home environment which I would argue contributes much more to poor development of a child than the action of spanking itself.
I think this is an important distinction to make when those of us who were spanked said we turned out fine. Overall, I think the environment at home was pretty positive for us. I know as my anecdote that my father only resorted to spanking when I was deliberately causing trouble, and otherwise we were a fairly normal, eat dinner every night and chat and laugh kind of family.
Point being, there is a bigger picture than "spanking." Motivations for doing so, and the type of environment that is most constant in the home. There are certainly worse cases compared to others.
[QUOTE=Govna;50212169]This is not a rebuttal, and the fact you spent no more time on it than a few seconds typing this sentence-long response shows you haven't actually got anything concrete against his argument.
Spanking isn't societal cancer like these studies always claim it is. They always neglect, as others have pointed out, to mention the much more significant number of factors that influence the development of individuals in their lives-- the majority of which are external and have to do with peer relations, social standing and belonging, networking and support, etc. They also fail to establish a consistent definition for what exactly constitutes spanking compared against, say for example, what constitutes abuse. It's one thing to spank a child rarely because it has done something wrong and won't listen to reason; it's something else entirely to spank them over and over again whenever they do something wrong and no attempts are made to reason with them.
But whatever. That's the politicization of science for you, and this is a very political topic, so of course this is going to be the narrative.
[editline]27th April 2016[/editline]
Spanking is not the same as beating. Sorry.[/QUOTE]
If he thinks that physical discipline is the only kind that works, or that it's the most effective, he has no idea what he's talking about. Sorry, but it's that simple.
And the fact that you went on such a tangent that was completely irrelevant to my point only shows your reading comprehension isn't good enough to decipher my "one sentence rebuttal". Move your soapbox to another street please.
Spanking is the same as beating. This study just proved it. Read the abstract.
In addition, the point of having such a huge sample size is to prevent other familial factors from distorting the results. You have parents ranging from not spanking their child, to parents that spanked their child but were non-abusive elsewhere, to parents that full on beat their kid and were abusive all around. These factors are forcibly considered in sample sizes in the hundreds of thousands.
If you dismiss this via "oh but correlation causation" you're also wrong - are you actually suggesting the kids' future mental illness and aggression caused them to be beaten in the past?
[editline]27th April 2016[/editline]
In fact, if you have access to the study, you can see net outcomes in various subcategories, each citing specific studies and their findings, such as impaired cognitive ability and low self esteem, as well as the study examining problems in their cited studies (such as a lack of distinguishing beating and being hit by objects). This study's completely solid.
I like how whenever an argument about spanking pops up people start shitting out anecdotes as if those are actual evidence for the utility of spanking
Not surprisingly, there's a .38 positive correlation between being spanked and advocating spanking as an adult. It's cancer.
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