Did Putin Blow Up the Whole Polish Government in 2010? A Second Look.
87 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;44533984]Well did anybody prove it was actually gunshots? Couldn't it be cracking of burning debris or something? The video quality is nothing stellar.[/QUOTE]
it could be fire cracking but the guy filming doesn't seem to be near anything on fire that would be audible, and the cracking would be a bit more frequent
then again the only burning wreckage I'm familiar with is burning cars, not a plane
Yeah I don't know about gunshots either, especially since it's a fresh airplane wreck. However, as I quoted earlier:
[QUOTE]On 6 June 2010, it was reported that payments worth €1,400 had been made from a credit card found on the body of historian Andrzej Przewoźnik, one of the victims of the crash. Credit cards belonging to the politician Aleksandra Natalli-Świat were also missing, but not used in transactions.[51] On 8 June 2010, ITAR-TASS reported that four soldiers of Unit 06755 had been charged in connection with the theft, after being found in possession of three credit cards used to withdraw a total of 60,345 руб .[52] A Polish spokesperson said that the first withdrawals using the cards had been made around two hours after the crash.[53] The Polish government admitted that the Russian soldiers involved in the theft were probably conscripts, and that earlier reports blaming members of Russia's OMON forces for the theft had been a mistake.[54][/QUOTE]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Polish_Air_Force_Tu-154_crash#Theft_from_victims[/url]
There were soldiers there and they did interact with the bodies/survivors.
An airplane with awhole government on board is checked, double checked and triple checked. It must be sabotage, a normal malfunction would have been found by the polish engineers
[QUOTE=Starpluck;44533982]The guy who taped this was supposedly stabbed to the point of life support by masked assaliants. They came back again to unplug his life ssupport and squeeze im a few more stabs ultimately killing him.[/QUOTE]
Sauce please
[QUOTE=mfreyrie;44534012]An airplane with awhole government on board is checked, double checked and triple checked. It must be sabotage, a normal malfunction would have been [B]caused[/B] by the polish engineers[/QUOTE]
There we go. Now everything makes sense.
[QUOTE=Laserbeams;44533648]Of course it wasn't an accident, accidents like this do not happen[/QUOTE]
Lol what. A month ago we lost a plane for 2 weeks, and eventually 'found' it a thousand miles away. I'd say that definitely outranks this crash on the 'crazy' list.
[QUOTE=FunnyBunny;44534185]Lol what. A month ago we lost a plane for 2 weeks, and eventually 'found' it a thousand miles away. I'd say that definitely outranks this crash on the 'crazy' list.[/QUOTE]
I think in this case the type of passengers on the plane makes a whole lot of difference, like mfreyrie said.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;44533752]It's a disgustingly cowardly way of killing your enemies.[/QUOTE]
No, it's a clever way to kill your enemies without having to go to war.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;44534338]No, it's a clever way to kill your enemies without having to go to war.[/QUOTE]
it would be both of these things had he actually done this
[QUOTE=Turnips5;44534437]it is both of these things
except in this case it's not clever because it's blatantly obvious.[/QUOTE]
Doesn't matter if it's obvious or not, no one will do anything about it
[QUOTE=Matthew0505;44534644]If it was so blatantly obvious why did it take until now for people to seriously consider it as a possibility.[/QUOTE]
Because it is pretty reasonable for the Russian military wanting to secure the area and tell all civilians to evacuate the burning wreckage.
[QUOTE=download;44534056]Sauce please[/QUOTE]
This is a source I found:
[url]http://www.prisonplanet.com/claim-man-who-shot-polish-plane-crash-gunshots-footage-stabbed-to-death.html[/url]
But it was only a quick search, there might be a better one.
[editline]13th April 2014[/editline]
Also this: [url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1278175/Footage-Polish-air-crash-emerges-claiming-Russian-speaking-men-shooting-survivors.html[/url]
Talks about claims of him being stabbed further in the article.
Prison Planet is an awful source and the Daily Mail isn't much better
"Smoleńsk conspiracy" theorists are being mostly laughed at in Poland; and for a reason. While at first look this whole thing might make sense to most of you (Putin killed president and 95 other people becouse they were all anti-russian, it was easier for him becouse the plane crashed in russia and therefore russian goverment was taking part in investigating the case), it's actually a bit more complicated then that. To start off, there was no good motive for kiling all these people. The president (and most of the people on board) was a part of a right-wing party called "PiS" that at the time of the accident was facing serve problems with popularity. It lost the first place in an election to polish parlament and it seemed like Lech Kaczyński is going to loose next president elections (that were supposed to happen soon. There was no real reason for Putin to kill him, he was already a falling star.
"Oh, perhabs he did that to finish off PiS, then? You know, since it was already facing problems, mabe he thought that if he hit it harder, it woud die?" If so, then he was very dumb, becouse if anything Smoleńsk accident [B]made PiS (and polish right wing in general) stronger.[/B] They have been pulling this whole "Lech was murdered, and polish goverment helped to cover it up!" card for four years now, with rather nice results - PiS now have very serious chances to win the next elections.
[QUOTE=WhyNott;44535123]"Smoleńsk conspiracy" theorists are being mostly laughed at in Poland; and for a reason. While at first look this whole thing might make sense to most of you (Putin killed president and 95 other people becouse they were all anti-russian, it was easier for him becouse the plane crashed in russia and therefore russian goverment was taking part in investigating the case), it's actually a bit more complicated then that. To start off, there was no good motive for kiling all these people. The president (and most of the people on board) was a part of a right-wing party called "PiS" that at the time of the accident was facing serve problems with popularity. It lost the first place in an election to polish parlament and it seemed like Lech Kaczyński is going to loose next president elections (that were supposed to happen soon. There was no real reason for Putin to kill him, he was already a falling star.
"Oh, perhabs he did that to finish off PiS, then? You know, since it was already facing problems, mabe he thought that if he hit it harder, it woud die?" If so, then he was very dumb, becouse if anything Smoleńsk accident [B]made PiS (and polish right wing in general) stronger.[/B] They have been pulling this whole "Lech was murdered, and polish goverment helped to cover it up!" card for four years now, with rather nice results - PiS now have very serious chances to win the next elections.[/QUOTE]
The next elections might be too late when you'll have "peaceful pro-russian protests" in Eastern Poland :v:
Yeah those sources are the best I could find that had to do with the rumor.
I also found this from RT (everyones favorite russian propaganda site):
[url]http://rt.com/news/polish-president-crash-suicide-483/[/url]
Not the stabbing, but a key witness due to give testimony apparently "committed suicide" as they are telling everyone, which seems hilariously suspicious.
Next on:
"Is Putin responsible for the 9/11?"
... Right after:
"Scientists absolutely sure no cold war bullshit is going on"
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;44535233]Next on:
"Is Putin responsible for the 9/11?"
... Right after:
"Scientists absolutely sure no cold war bullshit is going on"[/QUOTE]
This was compared to 9/11 already in this thread, and it was explained why such a comparison is stupid as fuck
[QUOTE=Laserbeams;44535160]The next elections might be too late when you'll have "peaceful pro-russian protests" in Eastern Poland :v:[/QUOTE]
Somehow I doubt that would ever happen, considering how anti-russian our eastern half is. If such protests were to happen, I would expect a bunch of hoodoos with baseball bats to come and invite the protesters for a "friendly talk" :v:
[QUOTE=Laserbeams;44535280]This was compared to 9/11 already in this thread, and it was explained why such a comparison is stupid as fuck[/QUOTE]
I am not comparing it. I am just saying that if we are going to bring up some bullshit about how Russia is evil we might as well blame Putin for everything.
[QUOTE=WhyNott;44535453]Somehow I doubt that would ever happen, considering how anti-russian our eastern half is. If such protests were to happen, I would expect a bunch of hoodoos with baseball bats to come and invite the protesters for a "friendly talk" :v:[/QUOTE]
Which means Russia would have to move in to support their oppressed people. Smooth, huh?
[QUOTE=Laserbeams;44535160]The next elections might be too late when you'll have "peaceful pro-russian protests" in Eastern Poland :v:[/QUOTE]
You underestimate how much hate we have for anything remotely related to communism, especially in the slightly older generations.
Didn't they crash because of poor weather?
[QUOTE=laserguided;44535521]Didn't they crash because of poor weather?[/QUOTE]
Probably the Russian Winter.
[QUOTE=WhyNott;44535123]"Smoleńsk conspiracy" theorists are being mostly laughed at in Poland; and for a reason. While at first look this whole thing might make sense to most of you (Putin killed president and 95 other people becouse they were all anti-russian, it was easier for him becouse the plane crashed in russia and therefore russian goverment was taking part in investigating the case), it's actually a bit more complicated then that. To start off, there was no good motive for kiling all these people. The president (and most of the people on board) was a part of a right-wing party called "PiS" that at the time of the accident was facing serve problems with popularity. It lost the first place in an election to polish parlament and it seemed like Lech Kaczyński is going to loose next president elections (that were supposed to happen soon. There was no real reason for Putin to kill him, he was already a falling star.
"Oh, perhabs he did that to finish off PiS, then? You know, since it was already facing problems, mabe he thought that if he hit it harder, it woud die?" If so, then he was very dumb, becouse if anything Smoleńsk accident [B]made PiS (and polish right wing in general) stronger.[/B] They have been pulling this whole "Lech was murdered, and polish goverment helped to cover it up!" card for four years now, with rather nice results - PiS now have very serious chances to win the next elections.[/QUOTE]
This is Russia conspiracy theory and fear-mongering general, it's not a place for common sense.
this is an awfully coincidental time for this report to surface again
I think its possible they could of taken advantage of the opportunity after the plane crashed and killed any survivors and seized the stuff they need. But making a plane crash in such a manner at that exact place seems a little hard to pull off.
[QUOTE=Puvleek;44533941]And yet, Antoni Macierewicz, who has been trying to prove that it was not an accident for all those years, is still being laughed at.[/QUOTE]
And for good reasons. Because for him, and for his party truth is not important. At least not anymore. They've been milking this catastrophe for their own selfish, political reasons, and it's actually the only thing that make them relevant on polish political scene (most of their voters are elderly and catholics who sadly are easy to manipulate in different ways).
[QUOTE=Thunderbolt;44533689]Also it's really suspicious that the russians are [I]still[/I] holding onto the black boxes.
I mean, it was [I]our[/I] plane, shouldn't they like, give them to us as soon as they found them?[/QUOTE]
They did the same thing with a flight they shot down in 1983- the soviets found the black boxes within a few hours, and held them until 1992...
Didn't the Polish military officer in charge of investigating the crash attempt suicide?
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