Computer hacker Gary McKinnon loses extradition battle
56 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Amez;18610958]The chances of humans coming in contact with aliens is pretty damn high in my opinion.[/QUOTE]
Already several thousands of years, and still no saucers floating above a city. I refuse to believe that Aliens ever personally visited Earth. Observe or some shit, yes. Abduction and floating over houses, no.
I'm pretty sure there are aliens in other worlds, but I think they said 'Fuck these guys' after the holocaust, Rwanda genocide, and pretty much our intolerance toward everything.
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;18610987]Well, in mathematic's opinion, you're wrong. Look up your facts, haul out a calculator, and you'll get the rough chances of us coming into contact with aliens.[/QUOTE]
Shit like this can't fly out of the blue, there must have been some sort of events that occurred involving extraterrestrial beings. Also the countless recounts by experienced, trustworthy pilots and officials. Plus this guy found shit when he broke into the Pentagon's computers.
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;18601620][url]http://www.wired.com/techbiz/it/news/2006/06/71182[/url][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Amez;18610958]The chances of humans coming in contact with aliens is pretty damn high in my opinion.[/QUOTE]
We're lightyears away from any other solar systems. Let alone any planets that may be able to harbor any life at all, not intelligent beings but microbes and the like.
[QUOTE=TAU!;18611062]We're lightyears away from any other solar systems. Let alone any planets that may be able to harbor any life at all, not intelligent beings but microbes and the like.[/QUOTE]
With that attitude, we'll never find space communists in battle suits >:(
[QUOTE=Amez;18611041]Shit like this can't fly out of the blue, there must have been some sort of events that occurred involving extraterrestrial beings. Also the countless recounts by experienced, trustworthy pilots and officials. Plus this guy found shit when he broke into the Pentagon's computers.[/QUOTE]
What makes you think that the guy didn't just make all that shit up?
[QUOTE=Amez;18611041]Shit like this can't fly out of the blue, there must have been some sort of events that occurred involving extraterrestrial beings. Also the countless recounts by experienced, trustworthy pilots and officials. Plus this guy found shit when he broke into the Pentagon's computers.[/QUOTE]
Well, I did some simple math just to get an idea while ago for debunking somebody on another forum:
[quote]There are an estimated:
1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
planets in the universe.
About 1% (that's being [I]very[/I] generous) of them are capable of supporting natural life.
leaving
10,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
Inhabitable planets
On earth, there are varying estimates of species, ranging from 5 million, to 100 million, so we will go with 20 million species per inhabitable planet.
Since we are the only highly intelligent lifeforms known, I will use us as an example for every other planet. Humans in their modern form have only been around for 50, 000 years. Earth has been around for 5 billions years. Humanity is pretty close to destroying itself from the eyes of earth, and it's 5 billion years of age.
My guess is humans will only be around for another 100, 000 years at most. We will have to assume that 300, 000 years is the maximum possible age for a lifeform as or more intelligent than humans, without destroying themselves by accident, or during some sort of war. It took 4.9_ billion years for a life form as smart as humans to come around. Leaving us with about .01% intelligent species possibilities per planet.
That leaves us with
100,000,000,000,000,000,000
Possible intelligent life forms.
On earth, there is only one species capable of radio transmission and basic space travel. Humans. it took us 49,950 years to get to that point. That makes it so only
.05%
Of those lifeforms remotely capable of even contacting an alien species
leaving us with
1,000,000,000,000,000,000
Species remotely capable of contacting other life forms.
Now, the universe is an estimated 5 billion light years wide. That means if a ray of light was shot from earth, it would take it 5 billion years to get back to us. By then (5 billion years) our planet would be gone. Now, we take into account that it takes an infinite amount of energy to accelerate one particle to the speed of light, assuming it has no mass. A spaceship has a fuckload more mass than no mass at all. meaning it would require an above infinite source of energy to accelerate it to a speed that gives it a sliver of a chance of making it to earth before people die out, or the solar system disappears (due to the sun dying out). I'm not taking into account that time stops when you move at light speed, and when time stops, it is really fucking hard to navigate, as you might imagine.
That leaves us with a 0% chance of having an alien species find us intentionally.
That makes
0.00000000000000
Alien life forms capable of finding humans on purpose.
The only marginally possible way any alien species could find us, is by a complete accident. Because it would probably take even the fastest possible spaceship a few billions years at most to reach earth[/quote]
I'm not particularly talented at math, but that's a fairly accurate judgment, because professionals have given similar results in various magazines/articles.
Judging by current technology trends, Quantum Communication may one day allow for instantaneous data travel. IE, you could send a voice communication across the universe in no time at all. Though, that's assuming another lifeform has the same technology. That's purely speculative, though, because I don't know the technicals of that sort of technology. The way I see it, that's the only way you'd even be able to come into contact with an alien species. That's not including the billion year travel time. Most of you "believers" tend to severely underestimate the unimaginably large size of the universe, and just how difficult that makes travel time.
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;18611284]Well, I did some simple math just to get an idea while ago for debunking somebody on another forum:
I'm not particularly talented at math, but that's a fairly accurate judgment, because professionals have given similar results in various magazines/articles.
Judging by current technology trends, Quantum Communication may one day allow for instantaneous data travel. IE, you could send a voice communication across the universe in no time at all. Though, that's assuming another lifeform has the same technology. That's purely speculative, though, because I don't know the technicals of that sort of technology. The way I see it, that's the only way you'd even be able to come into contact with an alien species. That's not including the billion year travel time. Most of you "believers" tend to severely underestimate the unimaginably large size of the universe, and just how difficult that makes travel time.[/QUOTE]
Alright you got me :frown:.
His left eye makes him look like a martian :v:
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;18610836]No, that would be impressive that somebody with such a low IQ could accomplish that. Your point makes no sense. On the other hand, people with aspergers have absolutely no forethought, and cannot seem to appreciate the magnitude of any situation.[/QUOTE]
That was kinda my point, with Gary being a high functioning individual he needs to be treated as such. For him to not be treated so, individuals who work for autistic rights will have a major setback. To be equally treated in all ways even punishment. Though myself having been diagnosed with Aspergers Syndrome, I can where his motivations might have come from. I do suppose as well that the severity of his case may pose a factor in the debate, I've met individuals who I doubt will ever live independently.
I don't know how well I've worded or clarified my point.
[QUOTE=Biotoxsin;18612123]That was kinda my point, with Gary being a high functioning individual he needs to be treated as such. For him to not be treated so, individuals who work for autistic rights will have a major setback. To be equally treated in all ways even punishment. Though myself having been diagnosed with Aspergers Syndrome, I can where his motivations might have come from.
I don't know how well I've worded or clarified my point.[/QUOTE]
Well, I've known a guy with aspergers, and you seem a lot higher functioning than him. Seems the US is really trigger happy about punishing people with mental disabilities.
Even if he's "high functioning" (is there something to compare that to..?) he's still got some weird ideas. His reasons about hacking into the pentagon weren't ones of bad intention regardless of the sanity of them. I can't help but think they are punishing for the sake of punishing, US law can't stand the thought of somebody going unpunished for anything, regardless of the intentions (or lack of in this case). This is ultimately a waste of taxpayer money, nobody will benefit from him being extradited or going to prison.
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;18601555]9/11 was 8 years ago, yes it was horrible but only 3,000 people died. Who fucking cares? I don't, let alone sentence someone to 60 years in prison because of it.[/QUOTE]
wait...are you saying that a 60 year sentence is too long for a person who killed 3000 people? I know this person didn't do anything, but you're typing like 60 years is a long fucking time for a person who murdered/aided in the murder of 3000 people
[QUOTE=Amez;18610958] How is he crazy? He found top-secret government documents that further prove aliens exist. Regardless they do because we cannot be the only life forms in the whole universe.[/QUOTE]
Or he found top-secret government documents that had info on classified technology or classified operations that in no way relate to aliens.
[QUOTE=Amez;18610958]The chances of humans coming in contact with aliens is pretty damn high in my opinion.[/QUOTE]
With the information we have we can't determine the chances of aliens existing because we only have evidence of life existing on one planet in the universe.
Just because we don't know if something exists or not does not mean it is likely to exist.
This guy isn't going to a prison either, he's going to be put in the places where terrorists and serial killers are at.
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;18612193]Well, I've known a guy with aspergers, and you seem a lot higher functioning than him. Seems the US is really trigger happy about punishing people with mental disabilities.
Even if he's "high functioning" (is there something to compare that to..?) he's still got some weird ideas. His reasons about hacking into the pentagon weren't ones of bad intention regardless of the sanity of them. I can't help but think they are punishing for the sake of punishing, US law can't stand the thought of somebody going unpunished for anything, regardless of the intentions (or lack of in this case). This is ultimately a waste of taxpayer money, nobody will benefit from him being extradited or going to prison.[/QUOTE]
I think that there quite a variance in the severity of cases, I've met individuals who honestly were indistinguishable from those with classical autism. Really I think it just comes down to ones definition of "functioning" and "sane". Functioning, in my opinion can be defined as able to support oneself completely, to be self-sufficient. Honestly though, I'm not sure what to think; the government is being unreasonable with a potential 60 years in prison, yet he did commit a crime. It would be wrong to not punish him on the grounds that there is a lack of a definition of functioning politically established well, yet he can't be put in prison for reasons of safety. (People have a tendency to be intolerant of those with autism, semi-understandably)
[QUOTE=Advancedrock;18612265]wait...are you saying that a 60 year sentence is too long for a person who killed 3000 people? I know this person didn't do anything, but you're typing like 60 years is a long fucking time for a person who murdered/aided in the murder of 3000 people[/QUOTE]
In Norway, you'd get 21 years for that.
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;18613256]This guy isn't going to a prison either, he's going to be put in the places where terrorists and serial killers are at.[/QUOTE]
Were do you get this from?
Isn't 60 years in conflict with the US Constitution's Eighth Amendment? Typical that they only stand by their consititution when it suits them.
[QUOTE=UberMensch;18616719]Isn't 60 years in conflict with the US Constitution's Eighth Amendment? Typical that they only stand by their consititution when it suits them.[/QUOTE]
The Constitution was purposely left open for interpretation. What you may consider cruel and unusual others may not.
The US law system is fucking retarded, Obama can pardon a turkey but not him
[QUOTE=BusterBluth;18616694]Were do you get this from?[/QUOTE]
It's called assuming, and in this case he's most likely right.
[QUOTE=Advancedrock;18612265]wait...are you saying that a 60 year sentence is too long for a person who killed 3000 people? I know this person didn't do anything, but you're typing like 60 years is a long fucking time for a person who murdered/aided in the murder of 3000 people[/QUOTE]
it's too short, but he was trying to get across that since no one will benifit from this dudes punishment, there's little point in 60 years of prison. in fact, he didn't do anything to harm anyone, there's no reason to punish him at all.
punishment is no more than revenge, don't let anyone tell you otherwise, it's just revenge in a controlled environment and a lot of false righteous bullshit.
it's an utter waste of time punishing this guy, americas law system really does manage to be useless about 50% of the cases. the problem is that it's still riding on something as low as revenge, if they actually punished people according to the harm done, this guy would be fined 50,000 and sent to prison for 60 days in the UK, that's it!
[editline]02:46PM[/editline]
in the long run, he helped improve pentagon security and that's it
Apart from hacking he was also an avid boxer.
[img]http://d.yimg.com/i/ng/ne/pressass/20091127/00/3690277863-hacker-loses-extradition-battle.jpg#200,200[/img]
[img]http://sports.popcrunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/ricky-hatton.jpg[/img]
[img]http://images.famouskick.com/items/original/0d10b2305eeaa21d27bd7f5cbb15b3e605621ddf.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=lolwutdude;18611033]Already several thousands of years, and still no saucers floating above a city. I refuse to believe that Aliens ever personally visited Earth. Observe or some shit, yes. Abduction and floating over houses, no.
I'm pretty sure there are aliens in other worlds, but I think they said 'Fuck these guys' after the holocaust, Rwanda genocide, and pretty much our intolerance toward everything.[/QUOTE]
Who's to say that sentient life from outside our solar system are more advanced than us?
For all we know, there's a race of bloody aliens that are at the equivalent of our Dark Ages.
IMO people like this (grey hats) should be hired by the government as a hacker for them.
[quote=Charter of Fundamental Rights]2. No one may be removed, expelled or extradited to a State where there is a serious risk that he or she would be subjected to the death penalty, torture or other inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.[/quote]
Unluckily for him, this is only valid after the 1st December. Also "degrading treatment" is arguable, unless they threw him in Guantanamo (shouldn't it be closed by now anyways?).
[QUOTE=Fire and Ice;18618032]Who's to say that sentient life from outside our solar system are more advanced than us?
For all we know, there's a race of bloody aliens that are at the equivalent of our Dark Ages.[/QUOTE]
only humans are stupid enough to have a dark age. we were meant to jump from the roman/greek period onwards to the 1600s. scientifically, that is.
500-1300 was a massive step back scientifically, mentally and philosophically. it was a waste of time, was it not for the dark ages, this hacker would not be looking at 60 years, he'd be looking at a considerable fine, a year of prison and an employment at the pentagon.
had we not had the dark ages, a lot of bad and useless shit wouldn't be included in todays society, hell we wouldn't be at war in Iraq and Afghanistan right now. (obviously becuase no crusades would have been done)
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