• Guns on College Campus? What.
    306 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Ridge;28197624] How can it be an outdated cliche from 30 years ago if it is parodying the people OF 30 years ago?[/QUOTE] 30 years ago was 1980. Flower Power, The San Francisco Sound, and Rock and Roll were all long dead by then.
[QUOTE=McFuckle;28197653]Guns are like credit cards - you really shouldn't go anywhere without one[/QUOTE] On the same line of rationale, neither should be used beyond what you can afford. [editline]21st February 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=SigmaLambda;28197663]30 years ago was 1980. Flower Power, The San Francisco Sound, and Rock and Roll were all long dead by then.[/QUOTE] 1987 [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1tj2zJ2Wvg[/media]
[QUOTE=Ridge;28197624]I'm getting angry because that is your excuse every time. Yet all republicans are bible thumping racists and conservatives in generals are one step above neanderthals in your eyes, no exceptions.[/QUOTE] i didn't say anything about republicans nor conservatives. [QUOTE=Ridge;28197624]As I said before, I spent 5 years on 2 college campuses, graduating in Summer 2009, and there were no shortage of idealistic people that believed that if you banned gun ownership the world would be a perfect place with no crime or hunger. Wake up and see what is really going on outside your mom's basement.[/QUOTE] is that what they really believe or is that what you think they believe? and how does restricting gun ownership translate to being hippie? is david cameron a hippie?
[QUOTE=Ridge;28197624]I'm getting angry because that is your excuse every time. Yet all republicans are bible thumping racists and conservatives in generals are one step above neanderthals in your eyes, no exceptions.[/QUOTE] no one has said this, stay yer persecution conflict [editline]b[/editline] actually david cameron is definitely a rich hippy what with the blue ferngully and all but there are countless other examples
[QUOTE=thisispain;28197796]i didn't say anything about republicans nor conservatives. [/quote] I refer to other threads [quote]is that what they really believe or is that what you think they believe? and how does restricting gun ownership translate to being hippie? is david cameron a hippie?[/QUOTE] I already mentioned gun control in a previous post. Reading up on David Cameron, he seems to be more of a libertarian than a typical American-style hippie.
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;28197602]well obviously you spent it on some bizzarro campus because the perception of colleges as being full of old-school style hippies is so outdated it's cliched in pieces of media from 30 years ago[/QUOTE] It's a tragedy that learning institutions are still stereotyped as a place for elitist left-wingers guess who I blame!!
[QUOTE=Ridge;28197955]I refer to other threads[/QUOTE] but this isn't another thread and neither of [i]us[/i] post things like that argue with the people at hand not a generalized chariacture of your opponent's side
[QUOTE=Ridge;28197955]I refer to other threads I already mentioned gun control in a previous post. Reading up on David Cameron, he seems to be more of a libertarian than a typical American-style hippie.[/QUOTE] you are criticizing me for stereotyping people while you don't even know who i am and you went on a hissy tirade about non-existent hippies
This is a great idea. Tragedies, massacres like Columbine and Virginia Tech could have been stopped if someone aside from the criminal psychopaths was armed.
[QUOTE=yuki;28198028]This is a great idea. Tragedies, massacres like Columbine and Virginia Tech could have been stopped if someone aside from the criminal psychopaths was armed.[/QUOTE] When UK nationally banned all firearms, violent crime skyrocketed - because the only people who had guns were criminals.
[QUOTE=yuki;28198028]This is a great idea. Tragedies, massacres like Columbine and Virginia Tech could have been stopped if someone aside from the criminal psychopaths was armed.[/QUOTE] unlikely, the idea that guns will completely prevent massacres is as laughable as saying schools won't happen if guns were banned
[QUOTE=thisispain;28198054]unlikely, the idea that guns will completely prevent massacres is as laughable as saying schools won't happen if guns were banned[/QUOTE] As if guns aren't getting snuck into schools regardless.
[QUOTE=thisispain;28198022]you are criticizing me for stereotyping people while you don't even know who i am and you went on a hissy tirade about non-existent hippies[/QUOTE] Stereotypical hippies still exist. Hell, my sister is one. [editline]21st February 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=McFuckle;28198081]As if guns aren't getting snuck into schools regardless.[/QUOTE] I wont lie. After Virginia Tech, I kept one in my backpack.
[QUOTE=Ridge;28198089]I wont lie. After Virginia Tech, I kept one in my backpack.[/QUOTE] I'll bet a lot of people did.
[QUOTE=McFuckle;28198053]When UK universally banned all firearms, violent crime skyrocketed - because the only people who had guns were criminals.[/QUOTE] okay first of all, the uk has not banned all firearms, second of all, violent crime skyrocketing happened because the one i assume you are talking about is the one that occurred during an economic and social crisis. it's no surprise that british punk begun in the 70's.
[QUOTE=thisispain;28198172]okay first of all, the uk has not banned all firearms, second of all, violent crime skyrocketing happened because the one i assume you are talking about is the one that occurred during an economic and social crisis. it's no surprise that british punk begun in the 70's.[/QUOTE] if they haven't banned all firearms, why couldn't i buy a gun anywhere?
[QUOTE=McFuckle;28198053]When UK nationally banned all firearms, violent crime skyrocketed - because the only people who had guns were criminals.[/QUOTE] "skyrocketed" is a gross exaggeration (if it even is true), and the UK still has a much lower violent crime rate than the US and the violent crime rate didn't skyrocket when tons of gun restrictions were passed over the past two decades in Australia, for example
[QUOTE=Ridge;28198089]Stereotypical hippies still exist. Hell, my sister is one. [/QUOTE] aww yes, the typical "resentment towards your sister results in animosity to the social group your sister belongs to" please tell me more, i absolutely love figuring out people, it's like a sick little game of mine
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;28198193]"skyrocketed" is a gross exaggeration (if it even is true), and the UK still has a much lower violent crime rate than the US and the violent crime rate didn't skyrocket when tons of gun restrictions were passed over the past two decades in Australia, for example[/QUOTE] At least it's still feasible to get a hold of a gun in Australia, try doing it in UK though.
[QUOTE=McFuckle;28198191]if they haven't banned all firearms, why couldn't i buy a gun anywhere?[/QUOTE] what you can't just buy guns from anywhere you go to a gun shop to buy guns i mean i know in america you can buy guns from the most random of places but i don't see what that has to do with violent crime
[QUOTE=thisispain;28198251]what you can't just buy guns from anywhere you go to a gun shop to buy guns i mean i know in america you can buy guns from the most random of places but i don't see what that has to do with violent crime[/QUOTE] you don't seem to see a lot of things...
[QUOTE=McFuckle;28198235]At least it's still feasible to get a hold of a gun in Australia, try doing it in UK though.[/QUOTE] i knew quite a lot of people who owned guns in the UK since they lived in the country side guns are just heavily restricted in metropolitan areas because the population lives in very dense areas
[QUOTE=McFuckle;28198260]you don't seem to see a lot of things...[/QUOTE] oh fuck burn
[QUOTE=McFuckle;28198260]you don't seem to see a lot of things...[/QUOTE] and you don't seem to have an argument let alone a coherent thought i would say i have better things to do but i'm listening to icelandic post-rock
[QUOTE=Kontradaz;28197224]Damn, it's like I'm reading some Ultra-Libertarianist propaganda here. As I have said before, you seem to have absolutely no regard for the possible consequences of lifting such a ban. Colleges across the world are not facing imminent danger of too many shootings or too much violence due to the lack of guns. In fact, as research has shown, colleges are some of the most safe institutions. Now, you want to make such a drastic change and allow guns simply because there is not enough research done to disprove that guns in campuses are bad? Just because freedom of the individual somehow trumps the possible issues that such a release of a ban may have? Until more conclusive research is conducted, I would rather stick to the safe college environment rather than risk the lives and well-being of students for some narrow-minded libertarian who is fixated on glorifying the rights of the individual.[/QUOTE] Okay lets pass laws based entirely off of what you feel might happen and never off of actual logic or evidence. Good plan. We've had concealed carry laws for a good while now and they are spreading and becoming more encompassing because people have realized that, surprise, people who go through the process of getting one are almost universally law-abiding citizens. Here is a lovely animation showing the spread of concealed carry laws over the past couple of decades. This is happening because, again, concealed carry has proven itself time and time again as being beneficial. Each of these state governments has come to exactly the same conclusion. Concealed carry permits are so prevelant now that most of the states on that list will recognize another state's carry permit. Alaska doesn't even require you to have a permit, (Even without the class they still haven't suffered at all under the new law) but will let you go through the course and obtain one so that you can travel out of the state (into states that they have a reciprocity agreement with) and still be covered. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Rtc.gif[/url] So no, take your fear mongering bullshit elsewhere. Whatever the hell you think is going to happen, hasn't happened. The entire state of Utah legally prevents college campuses from restricting concealed carry on campuses. Nothing has happened. Students and professors carry concealed and life goes on.
the us is certainly not as metropolitan or dense as the uk i think there's a general uncomfortably with guns that's been part of the UK culture since the 1950's. consider the fact that our crime shows often did not solve things with gun violence but with witty retorts and remarks about emma peel's hair
[QUOTE=thisispain;28198201]aww yes, the typical "resentment towards your sister results in animosity to the social group your sister belongs to" please tell me more, i absolutely love figuring out people, it's like a sick little game of mine[/QUOTE] I have no resentment towards her. We are of course very close. We simply know where each other stands in regards to politics and other topics we do not agree with, and we just don't discuss them.
[QUOTE=GunFox;28198354]Okay lets pass laws based entirely off of what you feel might happen and never off of actual logic or evidence. Good plan. We've had concealed carry laws for a good while now and they are spreading and becoming more encompassing because people have realized that, surprise, people who go through the process of getting one are almost universally law-abiding citizens. Here is a lovely animation showing the spread of concealed carry laws over the past couple of decades. This is happening because, again, concealed carry has proven itself time and time again as being beneficial. Each of these state governments has come to exactly the same conclusion. Concealed carry permits are so prevelant now that most of the states on that list will recognize another state's carry permit. Alaska doesn't even require you to have a permit, (Even without the class they still haven't suffered at all under the new law) but will let you go through the course and obtain one so that you can travel out of the state (into states that they have a reciprocity agreement with) and still be covered. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Rtc.gif[/url] So no, take your fear mongering bullshit elsewhere. Whatever the hell you think is going to happen, hasn't happened. The entire state of Utah legally prevents college campuses from restricting concealed carry on campuses. Nothing has happened. Students and professors carry concealed and life goes on.[/QUOTE] No, it's more like "Let's remove restrictions based entirely off what you feel might happen and never off of actual logic or evidence". The laws are passed, they currently block CC in campuses (for the majority of cases). Sadly, you can't simply generalize every CC sucess-story across the board to include campuses as well. Secondly, where do you get this BS that concealed-carry has "proven time and time again" to be beneficial? I just checked a few studies done and they say that CC has slightly increased the rates of violence (Shall issue), while having no "shall issue" law significantly decreased levels of gun violence; a gun control law decreased levels of violence and prevented deaths. ([url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15805435[/url]) and ([url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1669841[/url]) and ([url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15805435[/url]). That's some solid evidence right there. And even then, this is mostly a moot discussion and a fallacious correlation between having CC in areas other than campuses. Unless we have research, such as those done in colleges with CC (Like Uthah; which I have seen none of and haven't been able to find), the argument that CC in campuses is somewhat better is unsubstantiated.
[QUOTE=thisispain;28198379]the us is certainly not as metropolitan or dense as the uk i think there's a general uncomfortably with guns that's been part of the UK culture since the 1950's. consider the fact that our crime shows often did not solve things with gun violence but with witty retorts and remarks about emma peel's hair[/QUOTE] this is true
[QUOTE=Kontradaz;28198731]No, it's more like "Let's remove restrictions based entirely off what you feel might happen and never off of actual logic or evidence". The laws are passed, they currently block CC in campuses (for the majority of cases). Sadly, you can't simply generalize every CC sucess-story across the board to include campuses as well. Secondly, where do you get this BS that concealed-carry has "proven time and time again" to be beneficial? I just checked a few studies done and they say that CC has slightly increased the rates of violence (Shall issue), while having no "shall issue" law significantly decreased levels of gun violence; a gun control law decreased levels of violence and prevented deaths. ([url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15805435[/url]) and ([url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1669841[/url]) and ([url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15805435[/url]). That's some solid evidence right there. And even then, this is mostly a moot discussion and a fallacious correlation between having CC in areas other than campuses. Unless we have research, such as those done in colleges with CC (Like Uthah; which I have seen none of and haven't been able to find), the argument that CC in campuses is somewhat better is unsubstantiated.[/QUOTE] The middle one is suicides and has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Concealed carry doesn't apply to suicides. [quote]RESULTS: When a "shall issue" law was present, the rate of firearm homicides was greater, RR 1.11 (95% confidence interval 0.99 to 1.24), than when the law was not present, as was the rate of all homicides, RR 1.08 (95% CI 0.98 to 1.17), although this was not statistically significant. [b]No law was associated with a statistically significant decrease in the rates of firearm homicides or total homicides.[/b] No law was associated with a statistically significant change in firearm suicide rates.[/quote] Bud, this isn't evidence for you, it's against you. It points out that concealed carry laws do nothing one way or the other. Hell, it points out that nothing you legally do pertaining to firearms stops anyone from doing anything. Again a total lack of evidence supporting a ban.
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