• Steam Controller apparently gains an analog stick
    80 replies, posted
All this looks like a big joke. Alienware "Steambox" is a Windows PC that boots to Steam Big Picture mode and uses an Xbox 360 controller. That is probably the best solution for the Steambox idea.
Watch it eventually devolve into a standard 360 pad :v:
[QUOTE=J!NX;45497316]Would you rather it was another shitty remake of the xbox controller? because the trackpads are what makes it so good. they just need to change what is around those. it's not different for the sake of being different it's not different for the sake of being BETTER. and it's made to be a "Controller for the PC by PC" xbox one has an amazing controller but joysticks aren't the only thing out there you know.[/QUOTE] Um no, I couldn't care less about whether it was a clone of controller X or something totally new, I just want something that is actually good and something I'd actually like to use. Maybe it already is that? I wouldn't know, like I said, I haven't tried the controller. All I'm saying is that it's kinda pointless to complain about all the changes they've made so far, they were most likely made based on a lot testing and feedback. What's the point of having a controller that is different and "cool" if it ends up being awful to use. [QUOTE=J!NX;45497316] it's not different for the sake of being BETTER. and it's made to be a "Controller for the PC by PC" [/QUOTE] I assume you meant the opposite, otherwise there is no reason for this controller to exist.
[QUOTE=RautaPalli;45497452]Um no, I couldn't care less about whether it was a clone of controller X or something totally new, I just want something that is actually good and something I'd actually like to use. Maybe it already is that? I wouldn't know, like I said, I haven't tried the controller. [/QUOTE] Here's the thing, if we end up with a controller that's pretty much just the same as a 360 controller, then yeah, you have a solid controller, but nobody's going to buy it. You know why? Because everybody who wants a 360 controller already has a 360 controller. If the trackpads, which are really the only reason the thing was made in the first place, don't work well, then Valve might as well just scrap the whole project. I don't see any reason for the steam controller to exist if it doesn't change the standard design [I]somehow[/I] to make it work better in some respect. Adding a single joystick isn't making it instantly a pointless generic controller though. The trackpads are what's important, so unless they decide to scrap those, this thing could finally fill a long-overdue niche in accurate gamepads.
[QUOTE=RautaPalli;45497452]Um no, I couldn't care less about whether it was a clone of controller X or something totally new, I just want something that is actually good and something I'd actually like to use. Maybe it already is that? I wouldn't know, like I said, I haven't tried the controller. All I'm saying is that it's kinda pointless to complain about all the changes they've made so far, they were most likely made based on a lot testing and feedback. What's the point of having a controller that is different and "cool" if it ends up being awful to use. I assume you meant the opposite, otherwise there is no reason for this controller to exist.[/QUOTE] I don't know, I'm playing dark souls so maybe I psychotically thought you said something else whatever the case is, I'm damn stoked for this controller.
This is a big improvement. you have analog movement with precise aiming. best of both worlds! really, if you don't want to use an analog stick (i would have no idea why you wouldn't), you don't have to. because they are still keeping the touch pad.
[QUOTE=VinLAURiA;45492857]Honestly, that's just what it's gonna end up as. Pretty much the only thing I expect them to keep are the grip buttons and [i]maybe[/i] the pads. Everything else has been pretty much gutted at this point, and it's a damn shame because I really thought they had something special with the original design. [t]http://cdn.akamai.steamstatic.com/store/livingroom/rljKewyz3M/controller.jpg[/t][/QUOTE] It literally looks like they flipped the 360 controller over and put all of the stuff on the back of it.
[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;45493694]Well, also consider that they gutted so much of it only because people have been testing the thing a lot and they came to the conclusion that it didn't really work in those designs. It doesn't look as "unique" but the newer designs are most likely much more compatible and much easier to use.[/QUOTE] Which makes me question: why make yet another controller that, in the end, works almost like all the other controllers, except for a few things? [editline]25th July 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=J!NX;45497196]you're bitching about how it looks its not even come out yet, the entire point of prototyping is "Throw as many ideas out there as you can, see what actually works"[/QUOTE] The fact that they dropped some pretty neat ideas about it, like the touchscreen, and now gave it an analog stick, makes me think its not gonna be all that great.
[QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;45499008]Which makes me question: why make yet another controller that, in the end, works almost like all the other controllers, except for a few things? [editline]25th July 2014[/editline] The fact that they dropped some pretty neat ideas about it, like the touchscreen, and now gave it an analog stick, makes me think its not gonna be all that great.[/QUOTE] The fact that they made it more like other controllers makes me want to stick with the controllers i have.
[QUOTE=tempunary;45481701]what a shitty controller.[/QUOTE] Why? [editline]25th July 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=.Lain;45484037]so you've used one?[/QUOTE] And why is this being rated dumb? It's kind of difficult to judge something when you've only seen pictures of the prototype.
Instead of the buttons and that joystick, how about replacing those-two with 2 additional smaller haptic feedback touch pads.
[QUOTE=.Lain;45484037]so you've used one?[/QUOTE] I actually have. It sucked. I hate controllers in general, but if you somehow came up with a scenario where I couldn't not use a controller, I'd choose a dozen different ones before I got to the steam one. I'd even use any of the various xbox controllers, awful D-pads and all. Fuck, I'd use a wiimote with a nun chuck before touching the steam controller, and I maintain to this day that whoever at Nintendo thought of that abomination deserves to be shot. Repeatedly.
[QUOTE=Zephyrs;45503097]I actually have. It sucked. I hate controllers in general, but if you somehow came up with a scenario where I couldn't not use a controller, I'd choose a dozen different ones before I got to the steam one. I'd even use any of the various xbox controllers, awful D-pads and all. Fuck, I'd use a wiimote with a nun chuck before touching the steam controller, and I maintain to this day that whoever at Nintendo thought of that abomination deserves to be shot. Repeatedly.[/QUOTE] It'd be real swell if you gave us a description of what was bad about it. Were the trackpads imprecise? Did it not feel comfortable? Don't just shit on it, tell us why it's so terrible.
[QUOTE=Mort Stroodle;45503128]It'd be real swell if you gave us a description of what was bad about it. Were the trackpads imprecise? Did it not feel comfortable? Don't just shit on it, tell us why it's so terrible.[/QUOTE] Some of the stuff comes down to personal preference. Ergonomically I thought it was a complete joke. It felt awkward as hell to me. That's subjective though. I don't particularly mind sony's dual shocks, or xbox's black behemoths as controllers. This is like an inverted hybrid of them, and I can't figure out how the hell I'm supposed to hold it. Some of that's because I have a tendency to death grip controllers for some reason I guess, but it just feels inverted. Maybe some people will like it, just like those split down the middle keyboards. I personally couldn't stand to use it for a long period of time. In terms of usability. The track pads were just horrific. I had to continuously recenter my thumbs on them as they drifted off to the side. Little things like being able to release a joystick and have it automatically snap back to neutral don't work. Some of that you can fake with drivers/firmware. Some of it you can't. If you do a quick release and reapply with a joystick, you can just put your finger/thumb back on it, and it's in the neutral position, even if your thumb isn't perfectly centered. The texture and cavitation lets you slip your thumb back into place in a fraction of a second without you having to consciously even recognize that it wasn't in place in the first place. With a bump on the touchpad, you still have to press on it and activate the pad, which means you might be slightly offcenter, causing you to move or aim to shift or whatever. You could potentially get around this with a small zone where everything was treated as neutral, or have it require a certain level of pressure to activate or something, but both require more elaborate firmware (if they want this to be truly plug and play and not rely on arcane drivers), and potentially a lot of irritating configuration time. Joysticks have springs in them, so they have increasing resistance as you push towards the edge. There was no pressure when moving around, so short of hitting the edge, it was very hard to gauge exactly how far you had pushed in a direction. Some of that will come down to having experience with it, and I guess you can argue the same for using a joystick. I know of the resistance, and all it takes is spinning the stick a half dozen times while a game is loading to get a decent feel for it. I initially didn't like this, but I concede that I might be able to get used to it. I still think it absolutely must have a texture or something to better gauge this though. In terms of the actual accuracy of the touchpad, I can't say that I felt it was amazing. Merely mostly adequate. It wasn't blatantly horrendous in that aspect, but I simply didn't get enough time with it to see if it had unexpected dead zones, inconsistent sensitivity (pressure and distance of motion), acceleration, or any other bizarre things right/wrong. Ultimately it comes down to my first comment on this thread. Tactile feedback is king. Any attempt to do anything that sacrifices tactile feedback (or the illusion of it in some very limited cases) will be shit, particularly for gaming. This is a product marketed for gaming. It sacrifices tactile feedback for what I view to be a stupid gimmick without practical purpose. Therefore I find it to be a shitty product.
[QUOTE=Zephyrs;45503314] Ultimately it comes down to my first comment on this thread. Tactile feedback is king. Any attempt to do anything that sacrifices tactile feedback (or the illusion of it in some very limited cases) will be shit, particularly for gaming. This is a product marketed for gaming. It sacrifices tactile feedback for what I view to be a stupid gimmick without practical purpose. Therefore I find it to be a shitty product.[/QUOTE] But... they said that it had tactile feedback added into it you're going to have to actually use the device when it comes out before you say that because what you're saying makes no sense how could you possible know how this has no tactile feed back if you've never even touched it? And besides that, the thing isn't even out yet, how do you know they don't fix the lack of feel, if they haven't already? unless I'm really really missing something. though, its completely fair to prefer tactility. After all, I own cherry blue MX switches for my keyboard because of how it feels, so yeah. I guess I'm just tired of other controllers.
I'd like to know what they define as having tactility. A slight concave doesn't cut it. I don't doubt that there have been some major revisions, but the core design problem of using a touchpad doesn't go away while you are using a touchpad. I did use it. Don't ask me how. I don't know how the person who had it got it. It came up in conversation in a class, the offer was made, and I was intrigued enough to accept.
[QUOTE=J!NX;45503387]But... they said that it had tactile feedback added into it you're going to have to actually use the device when it comes out before you say that because what you're saying makes no sense how could you possible know how this has no tactile feed back if you've never even touched it? And besides that, the thing isn't even out yet, how do you know they don't fix the lack of feel, if they haven't already? unless I'm really really missing something. though, its completely fair to prefer tactility. After all, I own cherry blue MX switches for my keyboard because of how it feels, so yeah. I guess I'm just tired of other controllers.[/QUOTE] There's a beta program, and I imagine there's been a couple cons where Valve has shown the controllers off. Presumably Zephrs got in on one of those. *ninja'd*
[QUOTE=Zephyrs;45503436]I'd like to know what they define as having tactility. A slight concave doesn't cut it. I don't doubt that there have been some major revisions, but the core design problem of using a touchpad doesn't go away while you are using a touchpad. I did use it. Don't ask me how. I don't know how the person who had it got it. It came up in conversation in a class, the offer was made, and I was intrigued enough to accept.[/QUOTE] to be fair, xbox one/ps4 controller is already one of the best joystick based controllers out there so tactile or not it's very pleasant to have something 'new' I guess that and when you use any control device for the first time it almost always feels awkward as hell. Just shifting between a xbox 360 and xbone controller is very weird once you're used to the other. It'd probably feel better once you're used to it, but then again, it also could be the worst crap you've ever laid a finger on even after a year of use. First impressions are important at least though.
At this point I could care less about the Steam Controller or Steambox. I'm more excited on the SteamBoy though, Steam gaming on the go.
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