• 4-year-old boy dies after being mauled by pit bulls in Detroit
    193 replies, posted
[QUOTE=OvB;49271711]Crackdown on puppy mills, dog fighting rings, and animal abuse really hard.[/QUOTE] Definitely, but of course there's no universal fix-it-all method for problems like these, it is something that is haulted by many preventative measures and countless interventions.
This whole thread is just gonna become a shit show of people screaming to either make it impossible to own a perfectly safe animal or cull the entire breed from existence while the people who have spent time alongside these amazing creatures and understand them (I mean more than a few pit bulls not someone who knows of just 1) defend them to the death because they aren't fucking monsters and the lack of understanding shouldn't be reason to kill them all
[QUOTE=Zezibesh;49271751]first off, pit bull is not a breed, it's just visual characteristics that apply to many breeds quickly googled some stats, 25-33 (???) pit bull fatalities this year. considering at least a million pit bull type dogs are put down in shelters every year, it's a very popular breed. you could probably extrapolate that into a rough estimate of how many dogs of this type there are in the US altogether somehow. the point is, it's a type of dog that's extremely popular. even if they make up the majority of dog attacks nowadays (p sure rottweilers held that statistic some time back) saying "a few" are sweet family dogs implies there's millions of baby killing assault dogs scattered throughout the country which is simply not true.[/QUOTE] In general, these threads are referring to the [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Pit_Bull_Terrier]American Pit Bull Terrier[/url] specifically.
[QUOTE=ghghop;49271737]Everything above 20lbs could be considered a dangerous breed. I get thay pitbulls are big but what about breeds like Mastiffs and huskies.[/QUOTE] By dangerous breed, I'm referring to any breed that was selectively bred for aggression against larger beasts.
[QUOTE=FZE;49271733]Could this topic be any bigger a shit show of irrational self-righteous reactionaries? "This [I]breed of dog[/I] doesn't have any [I][B]legitimate uses[/B][/I], you should need a license to own them!!!", the subtext being "I have zero understanding of correlation versus causation and it has not occurred to me even once that the myth of inherently dangerous dogs could be self-perpetuating because people who want vicious animals seek out these breeds specifically for that reputation and tailor them to fit those traits!!!"[/QUOTE] This Pit Bulls are some of the nicest dog breeds, seriously. But the prevailing idea of them being monsters leads terrible assholes to buy them, and it's those assholes who raise them to be fierce monsters. If you treat them like any other pet dog you're basically going to have a dog that will never think about mauling people to death. Pit Bulls in general were bred to do blood sports, yes. But people somehow think that all that murderous instinct is physically bred into the dog and not taught to the puppies at a young age. Even now when dog fighting is deemed illegal, people still only see these breeds as being capable of violence and nothing more. And in case you haven't noticed, living beings are capable of more than one thing, especially when that one thing is some weird unnatural purpose like being forced to fight your own kind constantly.
[QUOTE=Zezibesh;49271751]first off, pit bull is not a breed, it's just visual characteristics that apply to many breeds quickly googled some stats, 25-33 (???) pit bull fatalities this year. considering at least a million pit bull type dogs are put down in shelters every year, it's a very popular breed. you could probably extrapolate that into a rough estimate of how many dogs of this type there are in the US altogether somehow. the point is, it's a type of dog that's extremely popular. even if they make up the majority of dog attacks nowadays (p sure rottweilers held that statistic some time back) saying "a few" are sweet family dogs implies there's millions of baby killing assault dogs scattered throughout the country which is simply not true.[/QUOTE] How many golden lab fatalaties have occured this year.
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;49271783]How many golden lab fatalaties have occured this year.[/QUOTE] less, because dumb people don't buy labs to train them into fighting dogs because they don't have a tough image there's probably even less chihuahua fatalities, does this mean labs should be banned?
[QUOTE=Lunik;49271782]This Pitbulls are one of the nicest dog breeds, seriously. But the prevailing idea of them being monsters leads terrible assholes to buy them, and it's those assholes who raise them to be fierce monsters. If you treat them like any other pet dog you're basically going to have a dog that will never think about mauling people to death. Pit Bulls in general were bred to do blood sports, yes. But people somehow think that all that murderous instinct is physically bred into the dog and not taught to the puppies at a young age. Even now when dog fighting is deemed illegal, people still only see these breeds as being capable of violence and nothing more. And in case you haven't noticed, living beings are capable of more than one thing, especially when that one thing is some weird unnatural purpose like being forced to fight your own kind constantly.[/QUOTE] They are not ~one of the nicest breeds~, give me a break. It's a fact that they have natural energy that must be released, and the instinctive release of energy is aggression. It's proper owners that teach their dogs to properly vent their energy that give rise to the "agressively chill" pit bulls you see most of the time. [editline]8th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Zezibesh;49271801]less, because dumb people don't buy labs to train them into fighting dogs because they don't have a tough image there's probably even less chihuahua fatalities, does this mean labs should be banned?[/QUOTE] I'll humour your fallacy. I never said that Pit bulls should be banned, I said you should recquire proper education on how to raise them before buying them, why is that so disagreeable?
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;49271803]They are not ~one of the nicest breeds~, give me a break. It's a fact that they have natural energy that must be released, and the instinctive release of energy is aggression. It's proper owners that teach their dogs to properly vent their energy that give rise to the "agressively chill" pit bulls you see most of the time. [editline]8th December 2015[/editline] I'll humour your fallacy. I never said that Pit bulls should be banned, I said you should recquire proper education on how to raise them before buying them, why is that so disagreeable?[/QUOTE] They are notoriously well known to be good with kids if taken care of correctly
[QUOTE=OvB;49271711]Crackdown on puppy mills, dog fighting rings, and animal abuse really hard.[/QUOTE] A "good start", but it ultimately comes down on the owners, which is a factor that's nearly impossible to control. You don't know if the person whose coming in to adopt one is someone who had dogs in the past(don't know if there is a thing like that or not) and can raise them, or someone whose just getting a dog for the first time and thus might need adequate training. Much like parenting, your dog will be shaped on how you raise them. If a dog bites or even kills someone, there's something that you did [I]really wrong.[/I] "Only [I]you [/I]can prevent dog attacks."-Some pet spokesperson Smokey Rip-off
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;49271803]They are not ~one of the nicest breeds~, give me a break. It's a fact that they have natural energy that must be released, and the instinctive release of energy is aggression. It's proper owners that teach their dogs to properly vent their energy that give rise to the "agressively chill" pit bulls you see most of the time.[/quote] "Release of energy"... Like how people play with dogs?
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;49271701]Well it's a relevant issue and we as a society should speculate on ways that issue can be put to rest or else nothing will change or even get worse. Being afraid of debate is being afraid of change.[/QUOTE] It's not that they're afraid of debate. It's just that this specific debate always turns into a shit show every time it occurs here.
[QUOTE=ghghop;49271833]They are notoriously well known to be good with kids if taken care of correctly[/QUOTE] Well yeah, but you usually hear how good they are with kids because the person is surprised to find out how good a pit bull does with kids. [editline]8th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Lunik;49271839]"Release of energy"... Like how people play with dogs?[/QUOTE] Precicely, the thing is your average person doesn't even play with their dog as much as they should [editline]8th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;49271852]It's not that they're afraid of debate. It's just that this specific debate always turns into a shit show every time it occurs here.[/QUOTE] Well we've gotten to the 2nd page at least without it being a shitshow, let's hope we can keep it civil (for the most part).
[QUOTE=ghghop;49271714]Fuck off, there are millions of pit bulls and you're condemning the whole breed because you read about one mauling every 3 months or so. If the trainer isn't a dipshit then they're more friendly than a lot of common breeds, even for children. Being an edge master because you're igor ant doesn't excuse the retarded stuff like this people spout. [editline]8th December 2015[/editline] They aren't ferocious by default, that's something they're taught. You choose a pitbull because they are deathly loyal, friendly beyond compare and compassionate more so than a lot of other dog breeds.[/QUOTE] remember that lady who raised a dog perfectly fine, i think she was a pitbull advocate she was mauled to death by her own pitbull
Any dog can be violent. Some might be a bit more aggressive, but it's up to the owner to work the dog out of that. Too many shitheads buy pitbulls because they think it makes them look hard, then fail to take care of them. I've met properly cared for pitbulls that are some of the sweetest animals on the planet, and 'family breeds' that I'd mistake for having fucking rabies. For reference, I was mauled by a golden retriever, which is generally considered one of the nicer dog breeds. Fairly certain the dog had issues.
[QUOTE=Billy-Bobfred;49271879]remember that lady who raised a dog perfectly fine, i think she was a pitbull advocate she was mauled to death by her own pitbull[/QUOTE] Yep. A member of some Pitbull defenders group and pregnant as well. Mauled to death by the dog she'd raised as a puppy. But remember guys, there are no bad pitbulls, ~only bad owners~ :vs:
[QUOTE=Billy-Bobfred;49271879]remember that lady who raised a dog perfectly fine, i think she was a pitbull advocate she was mauled to death by her own pitbull[/QUOTE] Can we agree that "this lady was attacked by a pit" and "my pit never attacked anyone" aren't valid criticisms/support of the entire breed?
[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;49271902]Can we agree that "this lady was attacked by a pit" and "my pit never attacked anyone" aren't valid criticisms/support of the entire breed?[/QUOTE] sorry, but when everyone is "oh there so sweet with kids bad owner no bad dog :^)" that is just direct proof against that
[QUOTE=Billy-Bobfred;49271909]sorry, but when everyone is "oh there so sweet with kids bad owner no bad dog :^)" that is just direct proof against that[/QUOTE] A cherry picked event isn't evidence against a cherry picked situation. It just means both were shit arguments.
I'm always sick of the pit bull debate. Yes, we know they are a very friendly dog like any other breed. The thing is, if you raise them like an idiot, you will be punished more often. "In the 10-year period from 2005 to 2014, two dog breeds accounted for 74% of the attacks that resulted in death: pit bulls and rottweilers. 2014 Dog Bite Fatalities by DogsBite.org, 2015"
[QUOTE=Billy-Bobfred;49271909]sorry, but when everyone is "oh there so sweet with kids bad owner no bad dog :^)" that is just direct proof against that[/QUOTE] Didn't say there are no bad dogs. But insinuating that all pits are bloodthirsty monsters is mental. They're a popular breed so obviously they'd have more attacks there are incredibly more than other dog breeds.
[QUOTE=ghghop;49271924]Didn't say there are no bad dogs. But insinuating that all pits are bloodthirsty monsters is mental. They're a popular breed so obviously they'd have more attacks there are incredibly more than other dog breeds.[/QUOTE] I dont know, pit bulls and rottweilers making up 74% is quite a difference
[QUOTE=ghghop] They aren't ferocious by default, that's something they're taught. You choose a pitbull because they are deathly loyal, friendly beyond compare and compassionate more so than a lot of other dog breeds.[/QUOTE] Find it hard to believe you aren't biased when you think that the dog "can't be ferocious by default, but they [I]are[/I] compassionate, friendly, and loyal by default"
[QUOTE=Lium;49271900]Yep. A member of some Pitbull defenders group and pregnant as well. Mauled to death by the dog she'd raised as a puppy. But remember guys, there are no bad pitbulls, ~only bad owners~ :vs:[/QUOTE] btw surrounding an argument with ~tildes~ isn't really an argument and I'd recommend actually making a decent point about it.
[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;49271943]btw surrounding an argument with ~tildes~ isn't really an argument and I'd recommend actually making a decent point about it.[/QUOTE] surrounding with tildes isn't supposed to be an argument, it's supposed to be a mocking quote. ~it's levi OH sa, not levio SA~
[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;49271943]btw surrounding an argument with ~tildes~ isn't really an argument and I'd recommend actually making a decent point about it.[/QUOTE] I've already made the point. Several times, in several threads. We're just going over the same old ground now, really. Pitbulls statistically make up up the majority of dog attacks. How many of these attacks attacks reported over the last years, and even before that, were confirmed to come from animals involved in activities such as dogfighting rings? None that I've seen. They're dangerous by nature. If I kept a pet tiger, no one would be shocked if it went off and ate someone. That's why we have registers and bans on such animals. But somehow if it's a dog, a breed proven to attack children and adults, it gets off the hook?
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;49271957]surrounding with tildes isn't supposed to be an argument, it's supposed to be a mocking quote. ~it's levi OH sa, not levio SA~[/QUOTE] I get that but when people only address something commonly said from the other side through mockery, it doesn't really add to the discussion. It just kind of delves into that shit show that we're afraid of the thread turning into again.
[QUOTE=Lium;49271972]I've already made the point. Several times, in several threads. We're just going over the same old ground now, really. Pitbulls statistically make up up the majority of dog attacks. How many of these attacks attacks reported over the last years, and even before that, were confirmed to come from animals involved in activities such as dogfighting rings? None that I've seen. They're dangerous by nature. If I kept a pet tiger, no one would be shocked if it went off and ate someone. That's why we have registers and bans on such animals. But somehow if it's a dog, a breed proven to attack children and adults, it gets off the hook?[/QUOTE] no i saw this video where someone raises a lion and in the video the lion hugs the man so beautifal lions are gentle docile creatures [editline]8th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;49271977]I get that but when people only address something commonly said from the other side through mockery, it doesn't really add to the discussion. It just kind of delves into that shit show that we're afraid of the thread turning into again.[/QUOTE] fair enough
[QUOTE=itisjuly;49271705]I don't understand people defending pitbulls. Why not just get a breed that is not known for being ferocious by default? [/QUOTE] Umm...Excuse me? Pit Bulls are not ferocious by default. No dog is, just like how no dog is nice by default. Just because you hear one story every few months about a pit bull attacking someone doesn't mean that every pit bull in the world is dangerous. By this logic, hearing a story about a Dalmatian, or Husky, or German Shepard, or even a Pomeranian attacking someone means that every dog of that breed is dangerous.
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;49271933]Find it hard to believe you aren't biased when you think that the dog "can't be ferocious by default, but they [I]are[/I] compassionate, friendly, and loyal by default"[/QUOTE] Didn't say they were nice by default though. They are able to be either and aren't more inclined to be one or the other without training or experience. It's come up a million times over that the stigma behind these dogs makes the human default attitude towards them to be fear, and they sense that. Not every case is like that, and I don't disagree with you saying some education or regulation would be ok, but they aren't good/evil by default and is a common mistake that I make too
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