IT BEGINS: Texas Senate is Voting on a REFERENDUM on INDEPENDENCE from the United States today.
351 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49252206]But they'd have more representation if that happened?[/QUOTE]
If we did divide into 5 states we would essentially get 10 senators vs. 2. So yes. It should be noted that Texas doesn't need federal authority to do this.
[QUOTE=Broseph_;49252169]Hey I don't want Texas to secede, let go out and start shooting people, destroy businesses and turn my neighborhood into a war zone because 'Murikah.
That's fucking psychotic.
They can ether deal with it, or fuck off to California, it's not like Texas is forcing them to give up their U.S. citizenship.[/QUOTE]
Go ahead and leave, but we keep Austin.
[QUOTE=Alan Ninja!;49252184]Last I checked, the federal government doesn't have the power to unilaterally strip people of their US citizenship[/QUOTE]
Read your passport. There are more then a few scenarios that allow the US government to strip your citizenship. Serving in the Armed forces of a foreign state being the most immediate example to come to mind.
What's with the people in here just blindly insulting Texas👌
[QUOTE=plunger435;49252231]What's with the people in here just blindly insulting Texas👌[/QUOTE]
No one here is blindly insulting Texas.
[QUOTE=plunger435;49252231]What's with the people in here just blindly insulting Texas[/QUOTE]
They bring up this secession stuff [B]alot[/B] and its frequently people [B]running for president[/B] doing it.
Not really blind when its pretty much all based on facts and experience.
[QUOTE=plunger435;49252231]What's with the people in here just blindly insulting Texas👌[/QUOTE]
Because 90% of people learn about a state the size of Europe from news reports of rural conservatives doing things they don't like, and it's easier to apply that to the whole state rather than learn about what makes Texas unique.
[QUOTE=Swilly;49252175]You keep arguing about state rights but that was decided already.[/QUOTE]
I haven't said shit about states rights, I'm pointing out what the States actually provide and do to Foreigners who think the Federal Government controls and provides for everything in the states.
[QUOTE=Big Bang;49251699]who's going to defend your borders? Texas militias? would they in any way be stronger than any other national military? ?[/QUOTE]
In our age that's a pretty irrelevant thing.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;49251772]"If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede."
To me, that's a stupid mentality to follow because the issue wasn't resolved through law-binding legislation but by the reasoning that the Union, in 1860-1864 had bigger guns.
That doesn't make them right, it makes them more powerful - which is an international level of argumentum ab auctoritate.[/QUOTE]
You need to realize, after the Civil War, the US stopped becoming a sort of "gentlemen's club" of states, that you could enter or leave at will.
You absolutely [I]cannot[/I] leave. Say what you want about "tyranny of the majority", it doesnt matter. The US owns texas, and all the other states for that matter.
1.5 million Americans died during the first civil war, that didn't happen for nothing. If texas tries to secede they'll get destroyed in a war.
[QUOTE=Kyle902;49252225]Read your passport. There are more then a few scenarios that allow the US government to strip your citizenship. Serving in the Armed forces of a foreign state being the most immediate example to come to mind.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://immigration.findlaw.com/citizenship/can-your-u-s-citizenship-be-revoked-.html[/url]
Only naturalized citizens can have it revoked, and even then you'd have to be joining an explicitly hostile army like AL Qaeda or ISIS. Birthright citizenship can only be renounced voluntarily
[QUOTE=Broseph_;49252250]I haven't said shit about states rights, I'm pointing out what the States actually provide and do to Foreigners who think the Federal Government controls and provides for everything in the states.[/QUOTE]
the federal government is the supreme authority of the united state of america, it's a pretty important entity regardless
yeah the subdivisions of your country have varying degrees of devolved power but you really underestimate how important the central government is
Here lets make a list of why texas should succeed
-FREEDOM
-No TAXES
-Texan flag instead of american
-Confederate flag legal
-No LIBERAL LAWS
-All GUNS LEGAL
-HOLY BIBLE ONLY RULEBOOK WE NEED
-No gays
-Can marry cousins
-LIBERTY
-legal slavery
-No more minorities
-REMEMBER THE ALAMODE
Fine. Let Texas secede. We shouldn't have to deal with their shit any more, most of the states in the deep south are just blocking any form of progress. Texas probably wouldn't even last a year on it's own.
[QUOTE=Xubs;49252276]We're not arguing that Texan secession could never possibly work ever, of course it could. Texas has a diverse enough industrial workforce that could, potentially, form its own independent nation. We're arguing that there is nothing to be [I]gained[/I] from this, which Broseph_ is saying Texas would gain many things. I, and most of the other posters here, seem to disagree and think nothing can be gained from a seceded Texas.
It's a fun 'what-if' scenario to think about but it's neither good for Texas nor likely. It would be destructive in the short-term.[/QUOTE]
They won't even have the manpower to secede if they do what Brosef says though. Kicking out anyone who wants to stay in the US will literally halve the manpower available to Texas.
[QUOTE=Broseph_;49252147]The United States isn't a centralized state like France is, it's a Federal country.
As such Texas is already governed in the same manner on the state level much in the same way as most countries are; We already have a state judiciary, legislature, and executive branch.
All law enforcement, internal matters, and a lot of the social services are already handled by the state as is.
The only thing we don't control is our borders, foreign relations, or have a real military.[/QUOTE]
nevermind the post office or the national parks or interstate or Texans losing access to the USGS, fair housing, federal disability, a massive number of federal jobs, all veterans losing access to VA benefits, cemeteries, customs, the arts, financial aid for students at your universities, federal insurance and credit services, small business loans, social security, bond agreements, AMTRAK, patents and trademarks, grain and meat inspection and so on
[QUOTE=Kyle902;49252237]No one here is blindly insulting Texas.[/QUOTE]
You're right, all the people saying, 'Good riddance let them leave.', aren't really insulting them.
No one I know has any idea this is even happening, this shit happens all the time in Austin or Dallas and never actually leads to anything so no one in Texas actually gives a shit about it. Like someone else said most of the people who vote just vote on local ordinances.
E: Lmao how the fuck did I get that weird emote in my post.
[QUOTE=Kommodore;49252290]nevermind the post office or the national parks or interstate or Texans losing access to the USGS, fair housing, federal disability, a massive number of federal jobs, all veterans losing access to VA benefits, cemeteries, customs, the arts, financial aid for students at your universities, federal insurance and credit services, small business loans, social security, bond agreements, AMTRAK, patents and trademarks, grain and meat inspection and so on[/QUOTE]
The interstate is funded by the states. If you ever drive between Minnesota/iowa, the difference in quality is immediately noticeable. And Texas has like 3 AMTRAK stations.
[QUOTE=Xubs;49252243]I like Texas when it isn't silly secessionists with pipe dreams and neo-Confederates, Texas is usually pretty alright
this is not one of those good things[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49252241]They bring up this secession stuff [B]alot[/B] and its frequently people [B]running for president[/B] doing it.
Not really blind when its pretty much all based on facts and experience.[/QUOTE]
Do either of you actually know anyone in Texas to think that the entire state supports let alone knows about this shit?
I've lived in seven different states, and Texas is by the far the nicest.
[QUOTE=Mr.Moustachio;49252270]Here lets make a list of why texas should succeed
-FREEDOM
-No TAXES
-Texan flag instead of american
-Confederate flag legal
-No LIBERAL LAWS
-All GUNS LEGAL
-HOLY BIBLE ONLY RULEBOOK WE NEED
-No gays
-Can marry cousins
-LIBERTY
-legal slavery
-No more minorities
-REMEMBER THE ALAMODE[/QUOTE]
you forgot propane
[QUOTE=Xubs;49252323]We're debating with Broseph_, not all of Texas.
And yes, I have friends in Austin and my cousins live there.[/QUOTE]
You said and I quote "Texas is [i]usually[/i] pretty alright." Not "Broseph is [i]usually[/i] pretty alright."
[QUOTE=Mr.Moustachio;49252270]Here lets make a list of why texas should succeed
-FREEDOM
-No TAXES
-Texan flag instead of american
-Confederate flag legal
-No LIBERAL LAWS
-All GUNS LEGAL
-HOLY BIBLE ONLY RULEBOOK WE NEED
-No gays
-Can marry cousins
-LIBERTY
-legal slavery
-No more minorities
-REMEMBER THE ALAMODE[/QUOTE]
Texas is almost mostly minorities. We have gay elected officials, and most of our urban centers are democratic.
[QUOTE=OvB;49252310]The interstate is funded by the states. If you ever drive between Minnesota/iowa, the difference in quality is immediately noticeable. And Texas has like 3 AMTRAK stations.[/QUOTE]
state DOTs get the money for them partly from federal taxes
[editline]5th December 2015[/editline]
as if everything else i said wasn't enough
brospeh how do you account for the shortfall in revenue when $350 million dollars is less than 0.1% of your 1.4 trillion gdp
[QUOTE=OvB;49252333]Texas is almost mostly minorities. We have gay elected officials, and most of our urban centers are democratic.[/QUOTE]
Not to mention the Latino voters usually go Republican.
I think it's really funny that there are people from all over the world that are pointing out all the reasons that this won't ever happen, with one person sticking his fingers in his ears and humming. Thereby proving that all Texans are morons
[QUOTE=Mr.Moustachio;49252270]Here lets make a list of why texas should succeed
-FREEDOM
-No TAXES
-Texan flag instead of american
-Confederate flag legal
-No LIBERAL LAWS
-All GUNS LEGAL
-HOLY BIBLE ONLY RULEBOOK WE NEED
-No gays
-Can marry cousins
-LIBERTY
-legal slavery
-No more minorities
-REMEMBER THE ALAMODE[/QUOTE]
please secede from posting
[QUOTE=OvB;49252333]Texas is almost mostly minorities. We have gay elected officials, and most of our urban centers are democratic.[/QUOTE]
they probably aren't the ones pushing for secession
In the modern world Texas can survive off of being its own nation due to things like trade (assuming the USA doesn't embargo them) but the real question is: Why? There really isn't much to gain from being it's own nation other than "Texas fuck yeaaaaahhhh". It would benefit the Democrats however because the largest Republican state would be gone, but would that really be worth it in the long run?
[QUOTE=Grenadiac;49252363]please secede from posting[/QUOTE]
how am I supposed to respond with that avatar
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