• Netflix is going after VPN-using "pirates" after studios complained
    111 replies, posted
[QUOTE=catbarf;46851209]The gaming industry is a tiny fraction the size of the movie industry[/QUOTE] That's not true, actually, and you'd be surprised by how much it's not true. You're definitely right that there's all sorts of layers of fuckery involved in the movie industry's management but in terms of gaming vs movie industry [i]earnings[/i] gaming is actually a much bigger industry in some places and globally close to a tipping point. Examples: [QUOTE]In the US, gaming generated $17.02 billion (±R130 billion) in 2011, according to the NPD Group, while movie sales in the US generated $9.42 billion (±R72 billion) according to The-Numbers.com.[/QUOTE] Aside from all that, the revenue of big game releases typically shatters that of movies, the top grossing films of all time don't even make a tiny dent in the amount of money that world of warcraft has made over time, and call of duty black ops made more than the avengers despite call of duty being a [i]yearly release[/i].
fuck movie studios, all they care about is juicing money out of everyone they can
[QUOTE=Cmx;46849344]Good job dumbasses. Instead of being paid for people watching it, they will just download it for free[/QUOTE] Can literally state here what I posted in the MPAA thread. Trying to stop piracy only encourages more piracy. Plus, what about the legit consumers who use VPN to access content that isn't available in their country? Don't they get a say in this? Especially since they're PAYING consumers?
[QUOTE=Elspin;46851427]That's not true, actually, and you'd be surprised by how much it's not true. You're definitely right that there's all sorts of layers of fuckery involved in the movie industry's management but in terms of gaming vs movie industry [i]earnings[/i] gaming is actually a much bigger industry in some places and globally close to a tipping point.[/QUOTE] At the end of 2013, the gaming industry had earned [url=http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/2614915]$93 billion[/url]. The film industry, by the end of 2014, earned [url=http://www.statista.com/topics/964/film/]$564 billion[/url]. That's also leaving out the entire television industry, not to mention that gaming is much bigger comparatively in the US than most other countries (barring a few exceptions like S. Korea), while film and television have much stronger worldwide presence. The gaming industry is pretty tiny compared to film and television. That's not to say that that isn't changing, but it's not a 1:1 comparison right now.
[QUOTE=Solo Wing;46851497]Can literally state here what I posted in the MPAA thread. Trying to stop piracy only encourages more piracy. Plus, what about the legit consumers who use VPN to access content that isn't available in their country? Don't they get a say in this? Especially since they're PAYING consumers?[/QUOTE] Yeah they're paying customers that are still technically violating Netflix's TOS. I'm pretty bummed about this since I use a VPN to access Netflix tho.
[QUOTE=catbarf;46851530]At the end of 2013, the gaming industry had earned [url=http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/2614915]$93 billion[/url]. The film industry, by the end of 2014, earned [url=http://www.statista.com/topics/964/film/]$564 billion[/url]. That's also leaving out the entire television industry, not to mention that gaming is much bigger comparatively in the US than most other countries (barring a few exceptions like S. Korea), while film and television have much stronger worldwide presence. The gaming industry is pretty tiny compared to film and television. That's not to say that that isn't changing, but it's not a 1:1 comparison right now.[/QUOTE] Pretty sure that $564 billion is the all time revenue, not the yearly one, it says $88.3 billion yearly, which would put video games ahead by those measures. [editline]addition[/editline] Yeah, it's definitely not the yearly revenue [QUOTE]In 2012, the global movie production and distribution industry is projected to generate revenue of $126.8 billion[/QUOTE] The projected earnings for 2012 were $126.8 billion so it would be utter nonsense for the 2014 earnings to be $564 billion. $126.8 billion for movies is still a bit ahead of the video game industry at that point in time but what I'm trying to bring across here is the gap is nowhere near as big as you think it is and gaming is closing it [i]fast[/i]
What the fuck, we'll take your money, but you're still a pirate. That makes as much sense as geofiltering in a first place.
[QUOTE=Elspin;46851563]Pretty sure that $564 billion is the all time revenue, not the yearly one, it says $88.3 billion yearly, which would put video games ahead by those measures. [editline]addition[/editline] Yeah, it's definitely not the yearly revenue The projected earnings for 2012 were $126.8 billion so it would be utter nonsense for the 2014 earnings to be $564 billion. $126.8 billion for movies is still a bit ahead of the video game industry at that point in time but what I'm trying to bring across here is the gap is nowhere near as big as you think it is and gaming is closing it [i]fast[/i][/QUOTE] Sorry, both those figures were not the yearly revenue, you're right. Still, while [url=http://consumerist.com/2014/06/09/its-time-to-start-treating-video-game-industry-like-the-21-billion-business-it-is/]the gap is closing[/url], it's still not fair to compare them directly. In any case, the differences between film and gaming largely come down to the established distribution methods rather than just size. The games industry is largely a product of the digital age and doesn't have to fight for a presence in conventional distribution schemes like film and television do. I think over the next few years we'll see a large increase in the amount of online-only television programming specifically in response to things like region locking.
[QUOTE=SIRIUS;46851452]fuck movie studios, all they care about is juicing money out of everyone they can[/QUOTE] wanna actually reply rather than JUST dumb me?
So if someone gets a VPN and then Netflix blocks it, which do you think they'll do: disable the VPN connection just so they can watch Netflix, or cancel their Netflix subscription and use that VPN connection to pirate movies safely and anonymously - while saving money? I'm guessing the second one. Nice job, Netflix.
it's very disrespectful to their paying customers, and shows their true alliance
[QUOTE=catbarf;46851731]Sorry, both those figures were not the yearly revenue, you're right. Still, while [url=http://consumerist.com/2014/06/09/its-time-to-start-treating-video-game-industry-like-the-21-billion-business-it-is/]the gap is closing[/url], it's still not fair to compare them directly. In any case, the differences between film and gaming largely come down to the established distribution methods rather than just size. The games industry is largely a product of the digital age and doesn't have to fight for a presence in conventional distribution schemes like film and television do. I think over the next few years we'll see a large increase in the amount of online-only television programming specifically in response to things like region locking.[/QUOTE] Well, my point wasn't whether or not it's -fair- that they're doing x or y, just that considered solely on their size as a revenue generator gaming is actually getting pretty close to film. I'm definitely onboard with online-only television though because cable has been kind of a nonsensical service for a while now. When I signed up for internet but said I had no interest in cable the companies are somehow baffled that you'd rather watch the TV shows you want to watch when you want with no adverts or delays. It's honestly time that movies and TV ditch the old systems they're typically distributed with because even people who are dinosaurs with technology like my parents prefer things like Netflix over cable despite the internet on their island being a wreck often times
I'm on the Canadian Netflix and I have no idea how much bigger and better the USA version is. I'd imagine USA gets more new movie releases among other things. Something new that I see on ads a whole lot is this "Crave TV" which costs like $4 a month and by the looks of their ads, they have TV content that Netflix doesn't. It looks like it's available on a bunch of platforms and it even has HBO. [QUOTE][URL="http://info.cravetv.ca/"]CraveTV [/URL]will have the exclusive Canadian rights to HBO's full catalogue of off-air scripted shows, including game-changing series such as “The Sopranos,” “Sex and the City,” "The Wire" and "Six Feet Under." Read more: [URL]http://www.ctvnews.ca/entertainment/bell-media-unveils-cravetv-premium-streaming-service-1.2130622#ixzz3NohwuSg2[/URL][/QUOTE] One thing that I found annoying was that On Demand on Rogers or Bell lacked the ability to just go and watch the entire season. Usually it only had like 3 of the latest episodes so this is something new.
[QUOTE=SIRIUS;46851761]it's very disrespectful to their paying customers, and shows their true alliance[/QUOTE] Their alliance is obviously to money but they definitely have the clout to get their way. They just refuse to use it. [editline]3rd January 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=garychencool;46851788]I'm on the Canadian Netflix and I have no idea how much bigger and better the USA version is. I'd imagine USA gets more new movie releases among other things. Something new that I see on ads a whole lot is this "Crave TV" which costs like $4 a month and by the looks of their ads, they have mostly TV content that Netflix doesn't.[/QUOTE] I'd argue that Canadian Netflix is actually [i]better[/i] than American Netflix for movies, but absolute shit for TV.
[QUOTE=Solo Wing;46851497]Can literally state here what I posted in the MPAA thread. Trying to stop piracy only encourages more piracy. [B]Plus, what about the legit consumers who use VPN to access content that isn't available in their country?[/B] Don't they get a say in this? Especially since they're PAYING consumers?[/QUOTE] except they aren't paying for [B]that[/B] content lets say i want to watch the show "tom's big adventure" and i live in the united states, well "tom's big adventure" isn't on US netflix, it's on canadian netflix the contract for "tom's big adventure" was negotiated completely independently of the US contract for the other shows. i'm not technically paying for that show, so it's still technically piracy
[QUOTE=Zeke129;46851789] I'd argue that Canadian Netflix is actually [i]better[/i] than American Netflix for movies, but absolute shit for TV.[/QUOTE] Argue away because I have no idea which one is better or not.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;46851785]yeah because not obliging to publisher complaints is surely going to keep all the shows you like on there[/QUOTE] Which the publishers make harder for me anyway. i'm not suggesting any particular solution here, it just sucks
[QUOTE=garychencool;46851811]Argue away because I have no idea which one is better or not.[/QUOTE] You can use something like Hola Unblocker to see, it's obviously going to be completely subjective. I don't really trust that extension, mind you
[QUOTE=Mooe94;46849891]Honestly, I'm equally as mad at Netflix as I am on the movie studios pressuring them. Netflix fought them at first, why the hell did they stop? Why not show a fucking example and [I]fight them[/I]? Drop their fucking contracts, circumvent them somehow, find loopholes, whatever. I feel that more should make a clear statement, content should be free of all to buy and use regardless of region. Fuck capitalism.[/QUOTE] "hello sony pictures/warner brothers/take your pick fuck you we're gonna show what we want in canada/norway/uzbekistan" -- netflix "hello netflix all licenses for our content are revoked effective immediately, any continuation of this will be met with severe legal action" -- aforementioned studios as soon as one studio responds, all the rest will pull titles from netflix, meaning netflix has nothing to show. a netflix with nothing to show is a netflix that doesn't make money, netflix that doesn't make money is a netflix that shuts down
[QUOTE=Zeke129;46851843]You can use something like Hola Unblocker to see, it's obviously going to be completely subjective. I don't really trust that extension, mind you[/QUOTE] what's wrong wit the extension?
A shame, because ironically enough, I try to view UK Netflix to watch The Last Airbender, since that's been off of U.S. Netflix for ages.
Okay Netflix. Say goodbye to my 10$ sub per month anyway, even though I access your US TV shows. It's really stupid that they'd opt to lose customers. my entire UK based family uses Netflix for US based shows via plugins etc.. that's 12 customers ($60) they're losing out on. multiply that and see the effects.
rip netflix outside of the US
All this stuff about licencing and distribution is interesting, but it still doesn't seem efficient for the movie producers. What downsides would the movie industry experience if there were movies on a direct to consumer service like Steam? People pay a few dollars to own a movie on their account. Movie studio gets their money in a more direct manner and people get to enjoy their movies with less of a hassle. Do trade deals with local distributors really make that much money, or is it just that the people who control the industry are old and don't know that people use the internet in this way?
[QUOTE=catbarf;46851379]It can take months or even years to get DVDs into certain markets, and even then they're frequently region-locked, so DVDs are hardly an example of worldwide distribution. But the main difference here is that a streaming service is a third-party agreement that requires closer coordination with the rightsholders, whereas with a DVD the licensed distributor can just print up DVDs and send them out for sale. If studios could maintain international presence to distribute their content, then they could sell DVDs and stream their shows wherever they want. But as long as telecom companies have deals with local companies to show content, the studios have to make deals. If you want your show to be on TV in, say, Australia, you probably have to make a deal with an Australian network. That deal will say that you can't stream to Australia or broadcast through another network, because that would undercut their business, so instead they'll handle it and give you a cut of the profits, a continuous payment, or a lump sum. So if the original rightsholder decides they want to distribute the DVDs to whatever market in the world, they can do that, but the local network still has the rights to present the show directly. They can sell the DVDs, but can't stream the content on the DVDs without the permission of the network. So now you have a three-way deal being negotiated between the studio, the network, and the streaming service- is it any wonder that a lot of programs get stuck in this bullshit and never reach Netflix? Basically the way TV networks legally operate is largely to blame for region-locking of movies and shows through streaming services, it can't all be pinned on the studios that ultimately own the publishing rights.[/QUOTE] The problem then seems to be the same as what was/is happening on the UK Steam due to brick and mortar stores; which is a reverse of logic. You have the rights holders, the providers of content, bowing to the services which rely on their content to have customers, which in turn simply extends the seeming stranglehold these older services (which are becoming less and less relevant in modern times) have on the rights holders. If the MPAA, for example, embraced internet streaming as a first class delivery method and told other delivery methods (such a cable) that they have exclusive airing rights to their medium (so a cable TV channel would have the rights to exclusive rights to just cable or whatever) what are those other delivery methods going to do? Not carry those shows and become less relevant even faster? Instead they spend who knows how much money trying to destroy the internet, which in turn just makes people, especially the newer generation that have grown up with the internet, hate them.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;46851755]So if someone gets a VPN and then Netflix blocks it, which do you think they'll do: disable the VPN connection just so they can watch Netflix, or cancel their Netflix subscription and use that VPN connection to pirate movies safely and anonymously - while saving money? I'm guessing the second one. Nice job, Netflix.[/QUOTE] You're acting like Netflix has a choice here... Legally they don't. They pay monies for distribution rights which are sold in a very limited way. That is to say - movie x for this period of time in this particular country. If they ignored the content owners complaints they can easily face legal action.
[QUOTE=H8Entitlement;46852657]You're acting like Netflix has a choice here... Legally they don't. They pay monies for distribution rights which are sold in a very limited way. That is to say - movie x for this period of time in this particular country. If they ignored the content owners complaints they can easily face legal action.[/QUOTE] They mostly don't, you are completely right. I'm not sure if they can face legal action, but they certainly will have trouble with updating their licenses for a lot of the content. That however does not change the endpoint if something like this happens. I am not going to keep my neutered Netflix sub just because it wasn't the fault of Netflix that I can't access the US site.
Fuck and I'm just in the middle of futurama and house M.D. which are available on US but not on the dutch netflix
Anyone know of a better streaming service than Netflix? I don't use a VPN, nor do I intend to start pirating, I just don't like the idea that I could have my subscription cancelled, or content yanked away, just because some CEO decided: "b-but teh pirates", whined at Netflix and I happened to be in the crossfire.
[QUOTE=Zerohope;46853861]Anyone know of a better streaming service than Netflix? I don't use a VPN, nor do I intend to start pirating, I just don't like the idea that I could have my subscription cancelled, or content yanked away, just because some CEO decided: "b-but teh pirates", whined at Netflix and I happened to be in the crossfire.[/QUOTE] What does this even mean? Fine, most people seem to have no understanding of this so I'll try to sum it up. Netflix doesn't operate worldwide. So there's no point in buying worldwide distribution rights. Instead they can pay less and only get the right to show X in countries A, B, C. Sometimes the content owner won't sell the rights to distribute it in C. Maybe the content holders already sold the rights to C. Maybe Netflix doesn't think ppl in C would like the stuff so they purposely exclude C from the contract. For whatever reasons C doesn't get that content. That doesn't mean C can pretend to be from A to watch the content. Even though the person from C has paid Netflix- netflix hasn't paid the content owners. So now when person from C pretends to be from A to watch the show- he is effectively pirating (read not paying) for that show. And Netflix, being the middleman here, can be held legally liable for the person from location C pirating of the content. Which is bad. Especially if you want to buy distributing rights from those content holders in the future. So tl/dr- it was never legal to use a program to circumvent region locking. You could get in trouble and Netflix could be sued into oblivion (this is way more important to Netflix)
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