Little late to this but Zimmerman is fucked either way honestly. He's gonna have to move before someone comes after him, but if he was sentenced guilty you can bet someone woulda killed him in prison.
He's got a shitty life ahead of him
[QUOTE=deadoon;41464419]What, any homogeneous group is able to be swayed emotionally by similar things, empathy and sympathy are relatively easy to manipulate if you are dealing with a group of people that are not too diverse.
And you basically just said that guys don't have emotions.[/QUOTE]
No I didn't basically say shit, I said that in the fantasy world of internet misogynists, men are superior logical thinkers and you just can't count on women to look past their danged emotions!
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41464368]Are you implying an all male jury would be more reasonable?[/QUOTE]
I'm not implying anything.
I'm stating that's why some people were scared of an all female jury.
Well I am implying that people shouldn't concern themselves with the final jury in big cases like this. Because the jury was selected for a reason.
I'm the only sane one in my family, my sister and brother and law, and mum, are convinced that zimmerman beat his 'girlfriend' on multiple occasions, beat a police officer down, probably beat himself up to make it look like he was hit, and stalked him down - spouting racial slurs, and the eyewitnesses were probably racist and/or police plants.
They also think that zimmerman is actually 6'4 and 400 pounds, and that trayvon 'at most' was 5'4, despite me pulling up multiple online resources.
God help me :suicide:
He was charged with assaulting an officer and accused of domestic violence, fyi
[QUOTE=Mexican;41464542]He was charged with assaulting an officer and accused of domestic violence, fyi[/QUOTE]
Was reduced to resisting officer, so there's probably more to it than that
In the domestic violence one, Zimmerman was also granted a counter-restraining order against his ex-wife for reasons unknown so the "domestic violence" was probably just a mutual dispute
Defense wasn't allowed to use trayvon's suspension records/text/pictures so Zimmerman's past records don't apply either
[QUOTE=Mexican;41464542]He was charged with assaulting an officer and accused of domestic violence, fyi[/QUOTE]
Domestic violence and [I]resisting arrest[/I] actually. First was dropped and second was reduced so it wasn't violently resisting arrest.
[editline]15th July 2013[/editline]
[I]fucking...[/I]
[editline]15th July 2013[/editline]
Frankly I'm interested in my family's opinion on this. Should be fuuun.
Open the paper this morning and spy an article about the Zimmerman trial. Very first paragraph mentions an 'innocent black youth'.
Ugh.
Well... I guess you can say that
you can't jimjam the zimman.
[QUOTE=theVendetta;41465434]Well... I guess you can say that
you can't jimjam the zimman.[/QUOTE]
I said that outside the courthouse and the judge came out and hit me.
I've mostly kept out of this, but the fact is Zimmerman still followed Martin even after being told to stop.
Either way he still harassed an innocent kid which he ended up shooting.
Guilty of murder? Nah
Innocent? Nah
[editline]15th July 2013[/editline]
And even if Martin was kicking his arse, it doesn't warrant shooting him
[QUOTE=Doozle;41465603]I've mostly kept out of this, but the fact is Zimmerman still followed Martin even after being told to stop.
Either way he still harassed an innocent kid which he ended up shooting.
Guilty of murder? Nah
Innocent? Nah
[editline]15th July 2013[/editline]
And even if Martin was kicking his arse, it doesn't warrant shooting him[/QUOTE]
It's not illegal to follow someone, you don't have to listen to the 911 operator even though he did listen to them. He is not a innocent '"kid", he was a teenager adult. He could have kept walking to his house, inwhich he didn't. If either of them weren't so aggressive they could have just talked it out but I guess that didn't work out.
But if Zimmerman had listened to the advice he was given it wouldn't have happened. He wouldn't have been dragged through this. Martin would still be alive.
I'd also argue that being 17 isn't being an adult, i'd also argue that Martin was innocent
I'm waiting for the inevitable court case on Zimmerman shooting revenge driven mobs.
[QUOTE=Doozle;41465724]But if Zimmerman had listened to the advice he was given it wouldn't have happened. He wouldn't have been dragged through this. Martin would still be alive.
I'd also argue that being 17 isn't being an adult, i'd also argue that Martin was innocent[/QUOTE]
the 'ifs'. What if trayvon never got kicked out of school for "drugs, truancy, graffiti and carrying burglary tool" and never sent to live with his father in sanford then he would still be alive, every scenario you change there is another reason.
From what i've seen; The photos of him holding a gun, trying to obtain a gun illegally, drug dealer, theft, thats not what a "kid" would do.
I dunno about you, but when I was 17 I knew drug dealers (some were younger than me!), I've also had my picture taken holding guns before (granted replicas and air guns but this is the UK), took drugs and all that.
I knew some dodgy people growing up but we were still kids. And nothing we did could ever be used as some sort of warped justification for losing our lives.
It's just alien to me, here when a person much more dodgy than Martin was shot by police, London burned for 3 days.
[QUOTE=Doozle;41465880]I dunno about you, but when I was 17 I knew drug dealers (some were younger than me!), I've also had my picture taken holding guns before (granted replicas and air guns but this is the UK), took drugs and all that.
I knew some dodgy people growing up but we were still kids. And nothing we did could ever be used as some sort of warped justification for losing our lives.
It's just alien to me, here when a person much more dodgy than Martin was shot by police, London burned for 3 days.[/QUOTE]
you live in the UK though, where as martin lives in the US. a majority of street gangs here consist of teenagers his age and if he wasn't shot by a white guy then no one would care that some random kid who commits all these crimes got shot walking home.
Though i was with zimzim through all this, my uncle and i still dont believe how he got ground pounded by a teenager. The guy is heavier and lengthier than him.
[sp]im not edgy, i dont promote fights[/sp]
[QUOTE=Lefter;41466040]Though i was with zimzim through all this, my uncle and i still dont believe how he got ground pounded by a teenager. The guy is heavier and lengthier than him.
[sp]im not edgy, i dont promote fights[/sp][/QUOTE]
Trayvon was much much stronger than Zimmerman.
this whole zimmerman case is a beautiful example of how anyone can use hyperbolic language and pick and choose facts to reaffirm their world view and make them feel better about themselves
it's depressing
I still believe that Zimmerman should not have gotten out of his car and confronted the kid.
This is the big point, and no matter what, I can't help but go back to it. If he stayed in the car, Trayvon would have gone home or wherever, and we wouldn't be where we are today. Just because he suspected the kid was up to no good, and instead of letting a real police officer handle it, he took it into his own hands.
It's like walking into a Lion's den. You know what you're getting yourself into, yet you do it anyway.
What the hell did he think he was going to do, ya know?
I dunno, that point just still comes up to me whenever I think about it. How easily everything could have been avoided.
[QUOTE=Dragoshi1;41466614]I still believe that Zimmerman should not have gotten out of his car and confronted the kid.
This is the big point, and no matter what, I can't help but go back to it. If he stayed in the car, Trayvon would have gone home or wherever, and we wouldn't be where we are today. Just because he suspected the kid was up to no good, and instead of letting a real police officer handle it, he took it into his own hands.
It's like walking into a Lion's den. You know what you're getting yourself into, yet you do it anyway.
What the hell did he think he was going to do, ya know?
I dunno, that point just still comes up to me whenever I think about it. How easily everything could have been avoided.[/QUOTE]
He was an adrenline-fuelled [i]idiot[/i] who thought he was going to be a hero and stop some ill-defined crime. A wrongful death (civil) suit would be quite easy to advance, I am quite sure.
It may have been self-defense. But self-defense wouldn't have been goddam necessary if he hadn't been a flaming moron.
[QUOTE=Doozle;41465724]But if Zimmerman had listened to the advice he was given it wouldn't have happened. He wouldn't have been dragged through this. Martin would still be alive.
I'd also argue that being 17 isn't being an adult, i'd also argue that Martin was innocent[/QUOTE]
Yeah. Also, mother Zimmerman could've decided not to fuck father Zimmerman so George Zimmerman wouldn't have been born. You can walk a long way with this, and that's precisely why this stuff never works in a court: who decides where to stop?
[QUOTE=Jeep-Eep;41466682]He was an adrenline-fuelled [i]idiot[/i] who thought he was going to be a hero and stop some ill-defined crime. A wrongful death (civil) suit would be quite easy to advance, I am quite sure.
It may have been self-defense. But self-defense wouldn't have been goddam necessary if he hadn't been a flaming moron.[/QUOTE]
t's fun when people make posts like this where they assume the worst about Zimmerman's character but little Trayvon Angel could not have possibly been up to anything suspicious.
It's also 100% impossible that Zimmerman, as neighborhood watch, felt suspicious of Martin b/c he was some guy walking around late at night in the rain looking at houses.
Honestly, nobody but those two will know what they were actually thinking, so it's really irrelevant to speculate. What we do know is that every bit of evidence points to Martin beating the absolute shit out of Zimmerman, and Zman firing in order to save his life while being within his legal rights to do so.
[editline]15th July 2013[/editline]
the post I just quoted is a perfect example of people not understanding that being followed doesn't give you the right to beat the shit out of someone.
[QUOTE=Dragoshi1;41466614]I still believe that Zimmerman should not have gotten out of his car and confronted the kid.
This is the big point, and no matter what, I can't help but go back to it. If he stayed in the car, Trayvon would have gone home or wherever, and we wouldn't be where we are today. Just because he suspected the kid was up to no good, and instead of letting a real police officer handle it, he took it into his own hands.
It's like walking into a Lion's den. You know what you're getting yourself into, yet you do it anyway.
What the hell did he think he was going to do, ya know?
I dunno, that point just still comes up to me whenever I think about it. How easily everything could have been avoided.[/QUOTE]
If Zimmerman hadn't followed a suspicious character it could have been avoided. If Martin hadn't been out late at night it could have been avoided. If a gun shop hadn't sold Zimmerman a gun it could have been avoided. If the complex hadn't allowed Zimmerman to be volunteer security it could have been avoided.
Except none of these things are illegal in the slightest and were perfectly reasonable for everyone involved. A 911 operator isn't even police- by your logic, if a guy on the street tells you an alley isn't safe, then you lose the right to self-defense if you get mugged going down the alley. That's absurd, advice doesn't compromise your rights.
And is everyone just forgetting the part where Martin beat him to the pavement and tried to kill him? Even if Zimmerman was chasing Martin shouting racial slurs that doesn't justify attempted murder in the slightest.
Every Neighborhood Watch Manuel out there tells you NOT to single-handedly confront a loiterer by yourself. You are suppose to use your watch network in order to track their movements while police are on their way.
This is because, in the case of an actual burglar, he or she may be armed. Even if Zimmerman had a concealed carry, he would have been defenseless if Trayvon was an armed burglar willing to stick up Zimmerman.
Following Trayvon was incredibly foolish on Zimmerman's part for a variety of reasons. If Trayvon was a professional criminal, he could have done any number of things, including:
*Suddenly sticking up Zimmerman and robbing him on the spot, taking away his gun in the process.
*Suddenly sticking up Zimmerman, and shooting him before he got a chance to reach for his own gun.
*Leading him into a concealed area, and have several other men jump Zimmerman. (Burglars often work as a team, not just alone)
*Making a sharp turn away from Zimmerman and then immediately confronting/hitting him on the other side.
*Running away; preventing the police from detaining an actual burglar suspect in the process.
Even if you think Zimmerman is not responsible for a single thing that happened that night, he acted incredibly foolish by following Trayvon. A Neighborhood Watch Captain is suppose to act as a surveillance leader; not an actual police officer doing the footwork. For your own safety, you should never follow a suspicious figure when you yourself are alone.
Likewise, legality isn't the end of responsibility. I think most people agree that OJ Simpson is responsible for murder, even if the court found him not guilty. Same with Casey Anthony.
Plus I think the court room pretty much verified that Trayvon Martin was simply walking around the neighborhood. He was not looking for a confrontation, even if a confrontation happened. If Zimmerman never approached Trayvon, and listened to the police dispatcher's request, Trayvon would still be alive.
Take the gunman out, and no one is injured/dead. It's that simple.
[QUOTE=Reimu;41467247]Every Neighborhood Watch Manuel out there tells you NOT to single-handedly confront a loiterer by yourself. You are suppose to use your watch network in order to track their movements while police are on their way.
This is because, in the case of an actual burglar, he or she may be armed. Even if Zimmerman had a concealed carry, he would have been defenseless if Trayvon was an armed burglar willing to stick up Zimmerman.
Following Trayvon was incredibly foolish on Zimmerman's part for a variety of reasons. If Trayvon was a professional criminal, he could have done any number of things, including:
*Suddenly sticking up Zimmerman and robbing him on the spot, taking away his gun in the process.
*Suddenly sticking up Zimmerman, and shooting him before he got a chance to reach for his own gun.
*Leading him into a concealed area, and have several other men jump Zimmerman. (Burglars often work as a team, not just alone)
*Making a sharp turn away from Zimmerman and then immediately confronting/hitting him on the other side.
*Running away; preventing the police from detaining an actual burglar suspect in the process.
Even if you think Zimmerman is not responsible for a single thing that happened that night, he acted incredibly foolish by following Trayvon. A Neighborhood Watch Captain is suppose to act as a surveillance leader; not an actual police officer doing the footwork. For your own safety, you should never follow a suspicious figure when you yourself are alone.
Likewise, legality isn't the end of responsibility. I think most people agree that OJ Simpson is responsible for murder, even if the court found him not guilty. Same with Casey Anthony.
Plus I think the court room pretty much verified that Trayvon Martin was simply walking around the neighborhood. He was not looking for a confrontation, even if a confrontation happened. If Zimmerman never approached Trayvon, and listened to the police dispatcher's request, Trayvon would still be alive.
Take the gunman out, and no one is injured/dead. It's that simple.[/QUOTE]
It was never even established that Zimmerman continued to follow him though.
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