One Million Moms Calls for Boycott of Fox’s ‘Lucifer’
92 replies, posted
It was interesting, seems like something that would be on spike TV or something
i got to love how these groups still exist, let your kids make up their own minds, besides which, 90% of fox's shows last 1 season anyways it doesn't need their help
[QUOTE=June;49645604]They filmed some of this in the restaurant next to my work, i've been looking forward to seeing it![/QUOTE]
So is it filmed in Vancouver?
If so I'm going to see 500 actors I've seen in every other Vancouver production :v:
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;49645437]yeah but he's also an asshole[/QUOTE]
Less of an asshole than Old Testament God.
[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;49645877]Less of an asshole than Old Testament God.[/QUOTE]
Greek and Roman philosophers conception of God seems alright though.
[QUOTE=Annoyed Grunt;49645389]People tend to side with Lucifer on the basis that he's [I]fucking badass.[/I][/QUOTE]
and the fact that he apparently gave humans free will. which to me free will is pretty fucking important for our modern world.
[QUOTE=codemaster85;49645942]and the fact that he apparently gave humans free will. which to me free will is pretty fucking important for our modern world.[/QUOTE]
I thought it was God that gave humans free will? He made us in His image, with the gifts of reason and free will that He too possesses?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49645257]I don't think it's that black and white[/QUOTE]
This is the Old Testament we're talking about here. It's more black and white than a grayscale picture of a zebra.
Which is why I can't believe people still embrace such outdated ideas in this day and age, let alone think they're somehow compatible with modern life. It's a problem that goes beyond people simply believing in a fairy tale.
But Lucifer is a really good show. At least the first episode was on point.
But hey if a bunch of soccer moms think that the imaginary son of an imaginary deity should only be portrayed as evil to scare kids from doing literally anything the bible says is bad, who am I to judge.
One Million Moms is doing a better job of advertising it than Olive Garden. I haven't even heard of this show but now I intend to check it out
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;49645996]I thought it was God that gave humans free will? He made us in His image, with the gifts of reason and free will that He too possesses?[/QUOTE]
If god created us, and if god is omniscient, a requirement of being god, then no matter what he does, or wants to do, he knows that whatever he creates, he will be able to see it's future, removing the choice of the matter in a manner of speaking. You couldn't make a choice god doesn't know about. Is that free will?
Why is this thread such an echo chamber? You have people who don't believe in god arguing how illogical it is with other people who also don't believe in god arguing the same thing.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49646041]If god created us, and if god is omniscient, a requirement of being god, then no matter what he does, or wants to do, he knows that whatever he creates, he will be able to see it's future, removing the choice of the matter in a manner of speaking. You couldn't make a choice god doesn't know about. Is that free will?[/QUOTE]
Being able to see the future choice isn't necessarily to mean that you can or should influence it.
If I am offered a choice between a cup of tea or coffee by somebody, even if they know I don't like coffee, then obviously they know which one I will pick. I still have free will to choose, but just because they know what I'm going to pick doesn't necessarily mean I lack free will.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;49646088]Being able to see the future choice isn't necessarily to mean that you can or should influence it.
If I am offered a choice between a cup of tea or coffee by somebody, even if they know I don't like coffee, then obviously they know which one I will pick. I still have free will to choose, but just because they know what I'm going to pick doesn't necessarily mean I lack free will.[/QUOTE]
Sure
But that has literally nothing to do with an omniscient god setting up the tea, the coffee, you and everything about you, and whether or not you like coffee or tea, whether or not the person you're with likes either, whether or not the world itself allows for such things.
It's an entirely different ball game for you, and for an all knowing god.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49646141]Sure
But that has literally nothing to do with an omniscient god setting up the tea, the coffee, you and everything about you, and whether or not you like coffee or tea, whether or not the person you're with likes either, whether or not the world itself allows for such things.
It's an entirely different ball game for you, and for an all knowing god.[/QUOTE]
As far as I understand it, God exists outside of time and thus has a completely different conception of the universe than we do. Everything happens all at once from His perspective. He doesn't "foresee" events as such, but witnesses them all at once so there's no question really of being able to influence the future. If I am making the choice between coffee and tea tomorrow, he is already seeing it "now" so to speak.
Why boycott olive garden though, the breadsticks must be unholy.
I'm reading this thread and I'm still unclear as to how we got from soccer moms complaining about fiction to a ridiculous theological argument.
[editline]31st January 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Snapster;49646243]Why boycott olive garden though, the breadsticks must be unholy.[/QUOTE]
The breadsticks are never enough.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49646141]Sure
But that has literally nothing to do with an omniscient god setting up the tea, the coffee, you and everything about you, and whether or not you like coffee or tea, whether or not the person you're with likes either, whether or not the world itself allows for such things.
It's an entirely different ball game for you, and for an all knowing god.[/QUOTE]
I don't want to take this further off topic, but I suggest you take a look at molinism and God's middle knowledge. I was introduced to the idea a little over a year go and I think it goes a long way to answer this challenge by preserving both God's absolute providence and human kind's true free will without contradiction.
[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;49646255]I'm reading this thread and I'm still unclear as to how we got from soccer moms complaining about fiction to a ridiculous theological argument.[/QUOTE]
Not many places to discuss theology on this forum I suppose.
[QUOTE=Cocacoladude;49645209]I mean, the serpent did give Adam the knowledge of good and evil and all that shit. Which enabled the rise of mankind's civilization.
The story basically amounts to god throwing a tantrum cause they didn't play the game the way he wanted. I mean fuck, you read the bible you can clearly tell that the god portrayed in it is not the kindest of beings. At the same time Lucifer is a bit of a cunt as well.[/QUOTE]
Sometimes i wonder if Lucifer is just a dickish Prometheus
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;49646220]As far as I understand it, God exists outside of time and thus has a completely different conception of the universe than we do. Everything happens all at once from His perspective. He doesn't "foresee" events as such, but witnesses them all at once so there's no question really of being able to influence the future. If I am making the choice between coffee and tea tomorrow, he is already seeing it "now" so to speak.[/QUOTE]
That just sounds sounds made-up realm invented solely for the purpose of sticking God somewhere completely inscrutable.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;49646220]As far as I understand it, God exists outside of time and thus has a completely different conception of the universe than we do. Everything happens all at once from His perspective. He doesn't "foresee" events as such, but witnesses them all at once so there's no question really of being able to influence the future. If I am making the choice between coffee and tea tomorrow, he is already seeing it "now" so to speak.[/QUOTE]
Which to me only further strengthens the case that if god exists, we can't have free will as he is always aware of what decisions we are making, and even created us to make the choices we will make, and not other ones.
I really hope they make a Sandman tv series to compliment this, heard rumors that Joseph Gordon Levit t wants to give it a whirl
[editline]1st February 2016[/editline]
[img]http://images.sequart.org/images/Sandman-23-page.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=Mingebox;49646474]That just sounds sounds made-up realm invented solely for the purpose of sticking God somewhere completely inscrutable.[/QUOTE]
Haha I mean...
Streisand effect, I now know of the show and I'm sure more people do as well.
[QUOTE=Deathtrooper2;49646367]Sometimes i wonder if Lucifer is just a dickish Prometheus[/QUOTE]
That's a pretty good comparison.
[QUOTE=codemaster85;49645942]and the fact that he apparently gave humans free will. which to me free will is pretty fucking important for our modern world.[/QUOTE]
He didn't give humans free will. In the Bible they chose to eat the forbidden fruit. They already had free will to begin with and misused it.
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49647353]How do you misuse free will, by not doing what god wants you to do?
Why did god put forbidden fruit there in the first place?
What kind of cut-rate garden was he running?[/QUOTE]
It's a parable about temptation. Plot devices.
I suppose the point about the free will thing is it means humans have the option to choose between good acts and evil acts. Without free will, there isn't much point to saying "this is bad" and "this is good" because all of your actions will have been predetermined beforehand - ultimately making arguments about the rightness or wrongness of particular actions null if we consider that the person making those decisions didn't have the ability to choose between them.
Being Roman Catholics ourselves, my parents don't really give a shit. It's a fun show they told me, so I need to pick up the series premier.
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