Facepunch should be pissed about the majority of Russians, who wholeheartly support this idea.
This time, the Duma represented the electorate - stuck in the past, and conservative.
But could you really be mad if society is not ready? Those people don't have that much of exposure to ideas and views of the other world, and the inheritance of Iron Curtain, habit of being isolated carries over to the children former Soviet Union citizens. Add to that harsh, criminal 90's, filling the masses with prison culture (which is really anti-gay, and I mean it), and the current state of society with its non-existent level of minority acceptance becomes obvious.
[QUOTE=Mr Kirill;40997930]It says "propaganda of nontraditional sexual relations"
I see it as propaganda is banned, which means no gay parades and public shit like that. Homosexual people aren't banned/opressed.
Gay parades are annoying and useless. Nobody really cares who you have relationships with, just keep it private and stop attention whoring.
So I support this (if I understood it correctly).[/QUOTE]
You don't understand correctly. At all.
I'm betting my balls there are even few gays among these voters.
[QUOTE=Ban Camp;40998389]No, homophobes exist on fp.[/QUOTE]
They just came out of the fucking woodworks didn't they? I'm seriously dumbstruck.
[QUOTE=J!NX;40993286]
[t]http://api.ning.com/files/QHzdcwao8AhG89TvJA4jH2OACror*0Ofv7pil3p7gG-SJjJQ6XDD1kanPjIqHeuhehNJIK1QAMo8ovlTZUL0TzzB1YOFI84C/GayTheologyPropaganda.jpg[/t]
yeah
I don't get it either[/QUOTE]
Well, yeah. Christians aren't under the covenants of the old testament anymore. That's why Christians, by rules, can shave their beard and eat pork. Jews can't.
And Jesus didn't say anything about gays, afaik. Go and comb the four gospels yourself.
[QUOTE=redhaven;40999589]Well, yeah. Christians aren't under the covenants of the old testament anymore. That's why Christians, by rules, can shave their beard and eat pork. Jews can't.
And Jesus didn't say anything about gays, afaik. Go and comb the four gospels yourself.[/QUOTE]
I can't tell if its progays making fun of anti gays or antigays not knowing what the fuck they are saying
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;40999585]They just came out of the fucking woodworks didn't they? I'm seriously dumbstruck.[/QUOTE]
A good portion are obviously the homphobes, but a lot of chucklefucks rate something if they see complaints about ratings. Seeing as the very first post in the thread is "Grr stop rating winner", a lot of people will try to be cheeky and rate it winner.
From what I understand from relatives living there, it's more that nobody thinks teaching kids about homosexuality is necessary. They teach about regular sex as a biological function, not like western sex ed where you learn about birth control and STD's. My parents and their age group never had anyone at school explain to them why or how you should use a condom (there's a joke in here for you to make, you're welcome). From that perspective, I can see why teaching about homosexuality would be considered pointless, as it serves no biological function.
I get that it's shitty and the homophobic stance is wrong, but this specific bill isn't as bad as it's being made to look.
how can the persecution of "nontraditional sexual relations" sponsored by the state not be as bad as it's being made to look?
were not dumb tia
[QUOTE=thisispain;40999696]how can the persecution of "nontraditional sexual relations" sponsored by the state not be as bad as it's being made to look?
were not dumb tia[/QUOTE]
I'm sorry, where exactly is the persecution of nontraditional sexual relations?
"A bill that stigmatizes Russia's gay community and bans the distribution of information about homosexuality to children was overwhelmingly approved by the lower house of parliament Tuesday."
As in, you can't give kids information about homosexuality. Nobody's telling kids not to be gay, nobody's telling them it's wrong to be gay, it's just legally not anyone's business but the kid and his/her parent's now.
[QUOTE=I Know Karate;40999733]I'm sorry, where exactly is the persecution of nontraditional sexual relations?
"A bill that stigmatizes Russia's gay community and bans the distribution of information about homosexuality to children was overwhelmingly approved by the lower house of parliament Tuesday."
As in, you can't give kids information about homosexuality. Nobody's telling kids not to be gay, nobody's telling them it's wrong to be gay, it's just legally not anyone's business but the kid and his/her parent's now.[/QUOTE]
"The bill banning the 'propaganda of nontraditional sexual relations'"
propaganda is really just a dog-whistle word for any sexual expression. in a nation where gay kids get beat up for being gay, to support this is putting their blood on your hands.
why shouldn't kids know about homosexuality? whats the point of making them isolated and ashamed of something they can't control? it's sadistic.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40999781]"The bill banning the 'propaganda of nontraditional sexual relations'"
propaganda is really just a dog-whistle word for any sexual expression. in a nation where gay kids get beat up for being gay, to support this is putting their blood on your hands.
why shouldn't kids know about homosexuality? whats the point of making them isolated and ashamed of something they can't control? it's sadistic.[/QUOTE]
Or.. it's propaganda. How is banning the distribution of information the same as banning homosexual relations? How would you even enforce that? Kids get beat up for being gay everywhere, let's not pretend Russia's alone in that regard.
No one says they shouldn't know about homosexuality, all the bill is saying is that it shouldn't be from school or from the public, as it's a sensitive issue. You're looking at it from a western perspective where sex ed is the norm, it's not like that over there. Sex is taught as part of science, it's a strictly biological explanation. It's a chapter in a biology textbook, not a separate class that teaches you about the intricacies of sex. No one is being isolated or shamed, in fact the topic is being dropped entirely. Isn't that better than a bunch of terrible homophobic europeans teaching kids about their view on homosexuality?
It's a topic for kids and their parents, not for schools or the public.
information is power, when you remove information you breed fear
this isnt a new concept by any means
and kids do get beat up for being gay, but theres a fucking difference. when a kid gets beat up for being gay where i live, he or she can go to the police and theres a wide support network of people who are proud and not afraid to look out for their fellow LGBT's.
in russia they stand alone, theres no open support network and the government is against them and supported by a church who preaches the death of you. theres no comparison, dont give me that shit
when the kremlin wins, gay people lose. when the orthodox church wins, gay people lose.
As long as the ignorant majority sucks on Putin's Tsarist dick without question and the state acts under the guise of the church nothing will ever change. GG Putin, GG.
And then there's the journalists and protesters we've seen who are brave enough to speak against the authority despite the utter lack of hope for the future. Not to mention how every day that goes by they risk their very lives for the sake of liberty and democracy. Americans should take notice, complaining about paying taxes ffs when there are people in the world who will literally give their lives for freedom.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40999901]information is power, when you remove information you breed fear
this isnt a new concept by any means
and kids do get beat up for being gay, but theres a fucking difference. when a kid gets beat up for being gay where i live, he or she can go to the police and theres a wide support network of people who are proud and not afraid to look out for their fellow LGBT's.
in russia they stand alone, theres no open support network and the government is against them and supported by a church who preaches the death of you. theres no comparison, dont give me that shit
when the kremlin wins, gay people lose. when the orthodox church wins, gay people lose.[/QUOTE]
Again, the only thing that's banned is the unsolicited distribution of information to kids. Their parents and other adults they trust can still talk to them about it. The only thing that's changing is that some protester on the street can't. That's pretty reasonable.
The rest of the points you're correct on. However, they have nothing to do with this bill. Russia has done, and will do, a lot worse than this fairly reasonable bill.
Me as a Russian, I strongly support this, it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay, and what it is. If a child/person wants to be homosexual he will be, no need to "advertise" it all around.
I remember when I was a kid, we used to sit in school in class, our teacher comes in and says: "today we have a speaker to talk to you about equality and shit like that". Then some weird dude comes in and starts talking his life stories how he met his other half (other guy) and how it's okay to do it and there is nothing bad about it.
I agree, there is nothing bad about it, it's okay but there is no need to advertise and promote it. I strongly support the typical: Woman + Man marriage so they both have child rather than any other set of this. I don't mind people with different orientation. I just don't think this should be brought up as a "Special" topic or guide to children.
[QUOTE=arleitiss;41000514]it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay[/QUOTE]
Oh my God please get banned and never come back
[QUOTE=J!NX;40999639]I can't tell if its progays making fun of anti gays or antigays not knowing what the fuck they are saying[/QUOTE]
most definitely anti-gay
but it's awful since the tactic the author is making fun is in reality an excellent point
[QUOTE=arleitiss;41000514]Me as a Russian, I strongly support this, it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay, and what it is. If a child/person wants to be homosexual he will be, no need to "advertise" it all around. [/QUOTE]
you have no idea how isolated that makes a child. its fucking abuse to do that. they grow up with shame and that can manifest in serious mental issues for them.
people like you are the reason why gay kids turn to suicide or self-harm. you trap them and make them feel like there's something wrong with them
[QUOTE=arleitiss;41000514]Me as a Russian, I strongly support this, it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay, and what it is. If a child/person wants to be homosexual he will be, no need to "advertise" it all around. [/QUOTE]
The guy is basically telling children "don't be ashamed of who you are".
If you get rid of him, then who the hell is the kid going to talk to if the Russian government effectively bans all discussion on sexuality?
[QUOTE=arleitiss;41000514]Me as a Russian, I strongly support this, it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay, and what it is. If a child/person wants to be homosexual he will be, no need to "advertise" it all around.
I remember when I was a kid, we used to sit in school in class, our teacher comes in and says: "today we have a speaker to talk to you about equality and shit like that". Then some weird dude comes in and starts talking his life stories how he met his other half (other guy) and how it's okay to do it and there is nothing bad about it.
I agree, there is nothing bad about it, it's okay but there is no need to advertise and promote it. I strongly support the typical: Woman + Man marriage so they both have child rather than any other set of this. I don't mind people with different orientation. I just don't think this should be brought up as a "Special" topic or guide to children.[/QUOTE]
so you support a bill that will be extrapolated to count any form of homosexuality 'propaganda' because a guest speaker came in to say 'it's ok to be gay' and you feel this is flaunting and advertising sexuality?
i don't think you understand that the guest speaker wasn't there for you to be reducated, it was for other homosexuals who probably have some sort of dissonance due to sharing the same beliefs as you about homosexuality.
tough shit. if you want to hug box yourself from things you disagree with, get off the internet.
[editline]12th June 2013[/editline]
wow same arguments as the people above
that's enough of you russia, fuck off.
[QUOTE=arleitiss;41000514]Me as a Russian, I strongly support this, it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay, and what it is. If a child/person wants to be homosexual he will be, no need to "advertise" it all around.
I remember when I was a kid, we used to sit in school in class, our teacher comes in and says: "today we have a speaker to talk to you about equality and shit like that". Then some weird dude comes in and starts talking his life stories how he met his other half (other guy) and how it's okay to do it and there is nothing bad about it.
I agree, there is nothing bad about it, it's okay but there is no need to advertise and promote it. I strongly support the typical: Woman + Man marriage so they both have child rather than any other set of this. I don't mind people with different orientation. I just don't think this should be brought up as a "Special" topic or guide to children.[/QUOTE]
The "I'm ok with it, but you better keep it away from me" mindset is just as bad as condemning it completely.
[QUOTE=Mr Kirill;40997930]It says "propaganda of nontraditional sexual relations"
I see it as propaganda is banned, which means no gay parades and public shit like that. Homosexual people aren't banned/opressed.
Gay parades are annoying and useless. Nobody really cares who you have relationships with, just keep it private and stop attention whoring.
So I support this (if I understood it correctly).[/QUOTE]
Yeah man lets ban black history month. Its just useless propaganda.
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=arleitiss;41000514]Me as a Russian, I strongly support this, it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay, and what it is. If a child/person wants to be homosexual he will be, no need to "advertise" it all around.
I remember when I was a kid, we used to sit in school in class, our teacher comes in and says: "today we have a speaker to talk to you about equality and shit like that". Then some weird dude comes in and starts talking his life stories how he met his other half (other guy) and how it's okay to do it and there is nothing bad about it.
I agree, there is nothing bad about it, it's okay but there is no need to advertise and promote it. I strongly support the typical: Woman + Man marriage so they both have child rather than any other set of this. I don't mind people with different orientation. I just don't think this should be brought up as a "Special" topic or guide to children.[/QUOTE]
So lets dissect this po-
"Wants to be homosexual"
nevermind.
[QUOTE=arleitiss;41000514]Me as a Russian, I strongly support this, it's fucking stupid when some guys come in to your school and start talking about how homosexuality is okay, and what it is.[/QUOTE]
It is okay to be gay, though. It's important for that to be told to children when they're still learning.
[QUOTE]If a child/person wants to be homosexual he will be, no need to "advertise" it all around.[/QUOTE]
But it's not a choice, though. That's the thing. People are condemned for something they cannot choose, and it is awful.
[QUOTE]I remember when I was a kid, we used to sit in school in class, our teacher comes in and says: "today we have a speaker to talk to you about equality and shit like that". Then some weird dude comes in and starts talking his life stories how he met his other half (other guy) and how it's okay to do it and there is nothing bad about it.[/QUOTE]
Good man, that guy.
[QUOTE]I agree, there is nothing bad about it, it's okay but there is no need to advertise and promote it. I strongly support the typical: Woman + Man marriage so they both have child rather than any other set of this. I don't mind people with different orientation. I just don't think this should be brought up as a "Special" topic or guide to children.[/QUOTE]
You don't get it, do you? You can't say "Oh, I think being gay is fine but I don't want them to have the same rights as me." Do you realize how stupid and ridiculous that sounds?
And yes, it should be taught to children that being gay is okay. It's an important issue to ensure no more ignorance arises.
well russia did great, i don't see what's wrong here
russian children will grow up and forget that there are no homosexuals, and homosexuals won't get any harm
[QUOTE=EddieLTU;41002230]well russia did great, i don't see what's wrong here
russian children will grow up and forget that there are no homosexuals, and homosexuals won't get any harm[/QUOTE]
Are you--
You're joking, right? Surely.
[QUOTE=Kyle902;41001167]Yeah man lets ban black history month. Its just useless propaganda.
[/QUOTE]
lol I've actually seen people on facepunch suggesting that black history month be banned because it's racist to white people
[QUOTE=Wizards Court;40995862]russia is authoritarian as hell, racism is widespread(is probably the most racist country atm in this planet, seriously if you happen to be black, don't EVER go to russia), corruption is also widespread, and pretty much the only thing keeping russia relevant is mostly its massive stockpiles of nuclear weapons and its gigantic area full of natural resources.
also russia will never have a revolution as long as they have permanent-elected putin, who despite being utterly horrible, is ridiculously smart.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Sr.;40998488]I was hinting at suicide and depression.
Also the occasional murder.[/QUOTE]
Okay seriously Russia has been improving for the last 15 years. Putin, while authoritarian is democratically elected, with more than 50% of voting Russians supporting him. What keeps Russia relevant is its huge global influence, natural resources, territorial claims, military and population. It's also one of the most educated countries on the planet and they have well developed industry due to the Soviet Union being mostly self sufficient.
[QUOTE=laserguided;41003311]Okay seriously Russia has been improving for the last 15 years. Putin, while authoritarian is democratically elected, with more than 50% of voting Russians supporting him. What keeps Russia relevant is its huge global influence, natural resources, territorial claims, military and population. It's also one of the most educated countries on the planet and they have well developed industry due to the Soviet Union being mostly self sufficient.[/QUOTE]
The Soviet Union was anything but self-sufficient. It was forcibly subsidized by their soviet bloc vassals that they collected during WW2, and when their economy was starting to rot in the 1970s, oil kept them afloat for a few more years.
Plus their industry is shit. It was inherited from the Soviet Union, and most factories had overaged capital equipment.
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