• Unsurprisingly, Donald Trump supports waterboarding and will move to end it's "status as a war crime
    455 replies, posted
[QUOTE=J!NX;49692829]the thing about torture, is that the psychological impact is far worse than the physical impact you might think because they're not physically damaged they'll just walk it off but only a sociopath would believe this torturing someone who is innocent would only make them into a killer. You'd just be making more terrorists, and you'd give them a perfectly valid reason to do it too.[/QUOTE] Like I said prior, they likely already were terrorists. Also that is the beauty of waterboarding, it's effects aren't permanent.
[QUOTE=wystan;49692812]I don't trust the information they release the public.[/QUOTE] why not? what would they have to gain by this? what's the advantage?
[QUOTE=wystan;49692746]Yes. If the CIA is doing their job right and correctly, this would be the case, mistakes have been made sure. But you all want to tout the reports and information from the CIA as if they are a reliable truthful source. Answer me this, would ANY organization willfully admit that torture is a good option, even if, for the sake of argument, is the best source ever?[/QUOTE] maybe they would, maybe they wouldn't. but you definitely don't need to directly say it works to make an admission of its effectiveness. you can even acknowledge that it [I]doesn't[/I] work and still phrase it to make it look effective. like what you're doing right now, for example. you're plainly admitting that you have no idea if it works, that it has an obvious potential to go hideously wrong and most certainly has in the past (notice you don't even need to cite individual cases of this), that the chief sources on it are extremely unreliable, and that it's mostly sentimental with dubious and unfalsifiable and entirely presumed deterrent effects. and yet you still think it's probably fine. so yeah actually i think a vague admission like that is perfectly doable in America
[QUOTE=wystan;49692847]Like I said prior, they likely already were terrorists. Also that is the beauty of waterboarding, [B]it's effects aren't permanent.[/B][/QUOTE] Psychological trauma can last the rest of your life.
[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;49692850]why not? what would they have to gain by this? what's the advantage?[/QUOTE] To try and satiate public unrest, but their actions and policies likely never changed.
[QUOTE=wystan;49692847]Like I said prior, they likely already were terrorists. Also that is the beauty of waterboarding, it's effects aren't permanent.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/05/22/torture.health.effects/index.html?iref=24hours[/url] PTSD can and will permanently ruin your life. This is why rape victims usually kill themselves. People like you who think that being sad is just some temporary condition.
[QUOTE=proch;49691174]Why can't we just revive Reagen[/QUOTE] Reagen raped the US in terms of economy and was a sellout, his only good side was trying to cool shit down with Russia. Honestly not surprised though with Trump's waterboarding thing.
[QUOTE=J!NX;49692861][URL]http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/05/22/torture.health.effects/index.html?iref=24hours[/URL] PTSD can and will permanently ruin your life. This is why rape victims usually kill themselves. People like you who think that being sad is just some temporary condition.[/QUOTE] Well that is untrue, I don't believe that
[QUOTE=wystan;49692878]Are you trying to imply I'm a rape victim?[/QUOTE] what the fuck kind of conclusion is that to make
[QUOTE=wystan;49692847]Like I said prior, they likely already were terrorists. Also that is the beauty of waterboarding, it's effects aren't permanent.[/QUOTE] keyword likely and not "definitely" you should read up about predator drones, if you haven't already, and see how accurate our government can be when it comes to identifying terrorists
[QUOTE=Starlight 456;49692886]what the fuck kind of conclusion is that to make :goodjob:[/QUOTE] At the time, his post was incomplete and his posted just ended with "People like you", he edited it now, and I edited my response.
[QUOTE=wystan;49692859]To try and satiate public unrest, but their actions and policies likely never changed.[/QUOTE] and why didn't they apologize for the other shit then
[QUOTE=wystan;49692847]Like I said prior, they [B]likely[/B] already were terrorists. Also that is the beauty of waterboarding, [B]it's effects aren't permanent.[/B][/QUOTE] [I]likely[/I]? I wonder what wystan would think if the DEA got approval to do this and he was wrongly targeted as being a crack dealer and taken into custody without due process at some place like [URL="http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/19/homan-square-chicago-police-disappeared-thousands"]Homan Square[/URL]. [QUOTE]"I'm innocent, I'm innocent!" wystan cries out while being waterboarded for the third time on four days of continuous sleep deprivation and without any contact with a lawyer since being taken into custody. "Uh huh, so were the teens you got hooked, shitbag," spits the agent as he tips wystan back for another round.[/QUOTE] Don't worry, son, the effects of being unconstituitionally held prisoner and waterboarded aren't permanent.
[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;49692898]and why didn't they apologize for the other shit then[/QUOTE] Most people don't care or don't remember. So there isn't much of a reason. I'm not going to defend them not apologizing, but that's likely why. [editline]7th February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=elixwhitetail;49692902][I]likely[/I]? I wonder what wystan would think if the DEA got approval to do this and he was wrongly targeted as being a crack dealer and taken into custody without due process at some place like [URL="http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/19/homan-square-chicago-police-disappeared-thousands"]Homan Square[/URL]. Don't worry, son, the effects of being unconstituitionally held prisoner and waterboarded aren't permanent.[/QUOTE] Yea, I'm not worried
[QUOTE=wystan;49692878]Well that is untrue, I don't believe that[/QUOTE] lol m8 you're not even trying "torture is good" well it doesn't wor- "i don't believe that. also the damage isn't permanent" you know, actua- "nice try i don't believe that either"
I'd love for you to prove to me these things. Use only reliable sources that aren't propaganda. 1. That torture is safe 2. That there have been no innocent tragic victims of torture. 3. That there is 0 psychological impact of torture in all cases 4. That torture is an effective way to collect information [B]If you can do this I will argue for torture for the rest of this thread.[/B] But you can't, because it simply isn't true. [sp]not a toxx[/sp]
[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;49692917]lol m8 you're not even trying "torture is good" well it doesn't wor- "i don't believe that. also the damage isn't permanent" you know, actua- "nice try i don't believe that either"[/QUOTE] I was saying I don't believe sadness is a temporary condition, as he was trying to tell me what my beliefs were.
[QUOTE=wystan;49692927]I was saying I don't believe sadness is a temporary condition[/QUOTE][QUOTE=wystan;49692847]effects aren't permanent.[/QUOTE] gj
[QUOTE=RichyZ;49691892]you're all obviously just taking this out of context when are the resident trump supporters going to come in and try to make justifications for a developed country to do torture?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=wystan;49692927]I was saying I don't believe sadness is a temporary condition, as he was trying to tell me what my beliefs were.[/QUOTE] Clearly you believe that PTSD doesn't exist because you, yourself, have said that the effects don't last forever. the word "Sadness" was to play on your lack of an ability to sense emotion. I was making fun of you.
[QUOTE=wystan;49692927]I was saying I don't believe sadness is a temporary condition, as he was trying to tell me what my beliefs were.[/QUOTE] you're fucking stupid [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Well that's a bit rude" - postal))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=J!NX;49692918]I'd love for you to prove to me these things. Use only reliable sources that aren't propaganda. 1. That torture is safe 2. That there have been no innocent tragic victims of torture. 3. That there is 0 psychological impact of torture in all cases 4. That torture is an effective way to collect information [B]If you can do this I will argue for torture for the rest of this thread.[/B] But you can't, because it simply isn't true. [sp]not a toxx[/sp][/QUOTE] Torture isn't meant to be safe, I've already said there have been innocent victims of torture, I know there are psychological effects of torture. And here is some quick reading [url]http://onviolence.com/?e=69[/url]
[QUOTE=wystan;49692878]Well that is untrue, I don't believe that[/QUOTE] Holy mother of God lads, we've hit it. The motherlode. A stupid so dense it could put us back 20 years without us even knowing it had happened. So, you don't trust the CIA with releasing information. But the information they released was "yeah torture fucking bombed rofl". What benefit would they have in telling the public that this supposed "perfect" information gathering system doesn't actually work? That'll just make the public want it gone faster you doof. And nothing in the post you quoted implied you were the rape victim, rather it implies you are the jackass who doesn't take mental health seriously enough to consider the lasting effects of physical and mental abuse. Which, tbh, seems spot on based on this thread and well...any other Trump thread you've posted in.
[QUOTE=J!NX;49692945]Clearly you believe that PTSD doesn't exist because you, yourself, have said that the effects don't last forever. the word "Sadness" was to play on your lack of an ability to sense emotion. I was making fun of you.[/QUOTE] I never said that, you are now implying that torture will always give PTSD, don't trying and change the discussion about mental issues and health, when I mentioned the beauty of waterboarding I meant physically damage, perhaps I was unclear. [QUOTE=Mining Bill;49692951]you're fucking stupid[/QUOTE] Sick ad hominem, way to add to the discussion.
[QUOTE=wystan;49692973]I never said that, you are now implying that torture will always give PTSD, don't trying and change the discussion about mental issues and health, when[B] I mentioned the beauty of waterboarding[/B] I meant physically damage, perhaps I was unclear. Sick ad hominem, way to add to the discussion.[/QUOTE] jesus fucking christ
[QUOTE=hexpunK;49692970]Holy mother of God lads, we've hit it. The motherlode. A stupid so dense it could put us back 20 years without us even knowing it had happened. So, you don't trust the CIA with releasing information. But the information they released was "yeah torture fucking bombed rofl". What benefit would they have in telling the public that this supposed "perfect" information gathering system doesn't actually work? That'll just make the public want it gone faster you doof. And nothing in the post you quoted implied you were the rape victim, rather it implies you are the jackass who doesn't take mental health seriously enough to consider the lasting effects of physical and mental abuse. Which, tbh, seems spot on based on this thread and well...any other Trump thread you've posted in.[/QUOTE] Changing the goal posts again. There was a miscommunication somewhere here. I never once said or intentionally meant to imply that PTSD or mental illnesses don't exist. I think I was unclear when I said "I don't believe that", I don't believe that sadness is madeup and PTSD isn't real.
[QUOTE=wystan;49692973]Sick ad hominem, way to add to the discussion.[/QUOTE] There isn't much to discuss to begin with mate
[QUOTE=wystan;49692973]I never said that, you are now implying that torture will always give PTSD, don't trying and change the discussion about mental issues and health, when I mentioned the beauty of waterboarding I meant physically damage, perhaps I was unclear.[/QUOTE] we left him a husk of a person but hey at least there's no physical damage!!! [editline]7th February 2016[/editline] and this is what i call "beautiful"
[QUOTE=wystan;49692963]Torture isn't meant to be safe, I've already said there have been innocent victims of torture, I know there are psychological effects of torture. And here is some quick reading [url]http://onviolence.com/?e=69[/url][/QUOTE] it's an opinion piece that uses interviews as its proof this isn't proof, and even the blog itself disagree's with its use
[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;49692991]we left him a husk of a person but hey at least there's no physical damage!!! [editline]7th February 2016[/editline] and this is what i call "beautiful"[/QUOTE] Gonna speak for all waterboarded persons? Again, I have no sympathy for those who want to kill me and my countrymen. [editline]7th February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=J!NX;49692988]There isn't much to discuss to begin with mate[/QUOTE] Clearly two whole pages worth of discussion. And frankly this is more entertaining that the typical hugbox and circle jerk usually taking place here. You all should enjoy a differing opinion.
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