If Russia Started a War in the Baltics, NATO Would Lose — Quickly
159 replies, posted
all i know is i sure hope war doesn't break out while im alive
i highly enjoy being a civilian living my tiny life
[QUOTE=BazzBerry;49671237]You're pretty confident of your military, that's good, but don't get too cocky ;) Remember that this is Russia. They are not North Korea, they do have a very powerful military themselves. I don't think it would be a walk in the park, as you seem to think - remember that we'd be going into [I]their[/I] territory so they automatically have the upper hand.[/QUOTE]
Eh, I am pretty sure the U.S. would stomp the shit out of pretty much any country in the world.
We also wouldn't be going into their territory. We'd just laugh and launch a shitload of Tomahawks.
[QUOTE=Incoming.;49669278]I'm not sure I follow, because the S-400 is capable of shooting down missiles mid-air, neither is the S-400 the only AA available, especially when drones are notoriously slow and large.[/QUOTE]There is no goddamn way a fucking tiny HARM launched by some dinky, dinky drone is going to be intercepted by something that fires missiles [I]the same size as the offending aircraft.[/I] What in the fuck would make you think this would be even feasible let alone economical?
We could just spray the countryside with cheap, tiny missiles and Russia would be out of it's S-400 stockpiles in a day. I guess the Russians are apparently mentally retarded in this scenario and so launch a massive telephone pole-sized missile at something that can be carried and lifted by a single man.
[QUOTE=Boba_Fett;49672670][img]https://landhajen.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/598px-twilight2000cover.jpg[/img]
Only 16 years late.[/QUOTE]Why is the woman with possible fetal alcohol syndrome the only one who is practicing proper trigger discipline?
[editline]5th February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Cocacoladude;49675967]Eh, I am pretty sure the U.S. would stomp the shit out of pretty much any country in the world.
We also wouldn't be going into their territory. We'd just laugh and launch a shitload of Tomahawks.[/QUOTE]Considering we have an insurmountable number of them yeah, probably. Sure, we'd lose some to interceptions but say we launched a thousand and the 70% kill rate of the S-400 stayed true and there were S-400s around all the targets: that still means 300 cruise missiles hit their targets.
[QUOTE=gudman;49668984]Holy shit you write so much and entirely in circles. You keep going to conflicts of XVIII century and after, when I specifically stated that I don't disagree when it comes to that. Is that because you actually know little about what happened before then? You constantly refer to Mongols as conquerors that conquered Russian lands when it wasn't even the case, they didn't manage the land, nor did they actually wanted to manage it, they just made what was Muskovy Rus' a tributary state. You say that wars with Poland were over conquering Poland, which shows that you know forget of a period in Russian history that is referred to as the Time of Troubles or in Russian, Smuta. You don't seem to know that none of the many wars waged by Ivan the Terrible were over territorial expansion (apart from Kazan, and even that was to destroy the marauding Khanate), you don't seem to know that most wars with Sweden were waged around territories that were part of ethnic Russian lands, and were over trade with Europe long before Baltics became part of Russia. You keep referring to territories of modern eastern Ukraine as "Ukraine" when Ukraine or Ukrainian nation was nowhere in sight in XV century (hell, proper Russian ethnic identity was barely established at that time) and territories around Kiev were rightly considered an important cultural, religious and economic core of Russia at the time and the people who lived there weren't in any way "lesser slavs", they were about as Russian as Novgorod's Russians.
For you it seems the history of Russia only started in XVIII century. Too bad that by then the territories of Russia were mostly already established.[/QUOTE]
Whoops. I thought your post said "after the 18th Century. Seriously, my bad.
Either way, the reason why I focused there is because, as you said, the Russian state and the Russian people wasn't really even formulated into its modern incarnation until Peter. So I guess we're actually in agreement. Unless you're arguing for a historical, national Russian ethos that runs back into the medieval ages that results in this siege mentality. I agree that the leaders of the state have attempted to mold this narrative, but it's mostly a fiction.
By the way, nobody has suffered more from Russian imperialism than the Russians themselves. It's the Muscovite state that has been the center and beneficiary of imperialism for multiple centuries.
[QUOTE=Cocacoladude;49675967]Eh, I am pretty sure the U.S. would stomp the shit out of pretty much any country in the world.
We also wouldn't be going into their territory. We'd just laugh and launch a shitload of Tomahawks.[/QUOTE]
Yeah fuck Tallinn just blow it to shit to get at those bad guys. And remember to laugh.
[QUOTE=Da Bomb76;49676601]Yeah fuck Tallinn just blow it to shit to get at those bad guys. And remember to laugh.[/QUOTE]... Tomahawks aren't indiscriminate weapons and are capable of precisely hitting a target to minimize collateral damage though...
[QUOTE=Da Bomb76;49676601]Whoops. I thought your post said "after the 18th Century. Seriously, my bad.
Either way, the reason why I focused there is because, as you said, the Russian state and the Russian people wasn't really even formulated into its modern incarnation until Peter. So I guess we're actually in agreement. Unless you're arguing for a historical, national Russian ethos that runs back into the medieval ages that results in this siege mentality. I agree that the leaders of the state have attempted to mold this narrative, but it's mostly a fiction.
By the way, nobody has suffered more from Russian imperialism than the Russians themselves. It's the Muscovite state that has been the center and beneficiary of imperialism for multiple centuries.
[/QUOTE]
I pretty much agree with everything here. Semi-present siege mentality ("besieged mentality" seems more appropriate) has been taken advantage of by pretty much any expansionist leader/government since 18th century to rally the population. Historical arguments are [b]extremely[/b] common in propaganda. I would go as far as to say that it's the most common one, by far. Anything and everything is attempted to be justified by "you see, historically this-and-that". That's why it resonates so well with the population, this outdated (by half a millennia, no less) mentality wasn't allowed to go away.
As for the very last sentence... I bet you can't even imagine how many Russians outside of Moscow would unconditionally agree. It's so ingrained that even a lot of people who generally support Putin's policies hate Moscow with burning passion, often without even knowing why. This sentiment is so common in Urals and Siberia that it became the reason to make a specific law against separatism.
[QUOTE=Da Bomb76;49676601]Whoops. I thought your post said "after the 18th Century. Seriously, my bad.
Either way, the reason why I focused there is because, as you said, the Russian state and the Russian people wasn't really even formulated into its modern incarnation until Peter. So I guess we're actually in agreement. Unless you're arguing for a historical, national Russian ethos that runs back into the medieval ages that results in this siege mentality. I agree that the leaders of the state have attempted to mold this narrative, but it's mostly a fiction.
By the way, nobody has suffered more from Russian imperialism than the Russians themselves. It's the Muscovite state that has been the center and beneficiary of imperialism for multiple centuries.
Yeah fuck Tallinn just blow it to shit to get at those bad guys. And remember to laugh.[/QUOTE]
Dude, they are high precision killing machines capable of traveling hundreds of miles.
[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomahawk_(missile)[/url]
Read that shit, they are fucking badass; and we just throw em at people like fucking candy.
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