We're on our way to Britain: A year from now up to 29m Bulgarians and Romanians will have the right
461 replies, posted
[QUOTE=dass;39011878]What.
It doesn't sounds similar at all.[/QUOTE]
one of the backwards 'supportive reasons' that the nazis used against gypsies to execute them en masse was their cultural background, because they felt it didn't slide along with theirs
[QUOTE=dass;39011878]What.
It doesn't sounds similar at all.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
So you're willing to go all out to call someone a racist but you wont read half of a sentence?[/QUOTE]
You're basically blaming an entire ethnic group for acts of individuals, and generalizing their behavior. It might not be genocidal racism, but it certainly is unwarranted xenophobia.
[QUOTE=Wizards Court;39011864]i didn't twist your words, it not my fault that what you said sounds similar to the excuse nazis gave to murder half-milion roma.
and not every roma is like that, again you're generalizing horribly, did you knew that roma in france for instance find it extremely hard to get their children to study, also makes it hard for them to find jobs and homes? then the goverment blames the roma for that lol, the same also happens in other countries.[/QUOTE]
The same roma whos younger population drops out of school?
Around here, we got lots of roma children in our preschools. Probably half the kids are roma.
It's not just the government to be honest.
Their own culture and the way they are raised has a lot of matter into that.
Heck, I know a story from one of the camps around here.
One of their kids who went to school was put in a foster home because her parents were bloody awful. She was basically wasting her potential and getting dragged rock bottom by her drug dealing parents, so she was taken by child services and is now in a foster home with everything she needs.
[QUOTE=dass;39011878]What.
It doesn't sounds similar at all.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
So you're willing to go all out to call someone a racist but you wont read half of a sentence?[/QUOTE]
what fucking sentence? the burden of proof is upon you provide the facts that show that all romani people/gypsies are criminals. a wikipedia article on their culture shows me nothing, and if anything, shows you're willing to use the smallest shred of 'evidence' to further your neo-nazi esque views. all that wikipedia article showed me is that the prison population is disproportionately skewed towards an ethnic minority. so fucking what. there's a high prison population of black people in london, does that mean i want all black people to leave london?
you're using statistics to treat people as numbers and justify your own terrifyingly racist views with them. even if the rate of crime amongst an ethnicity was 90% i would never, even for one second generalize to justify my casual racism; and what bigots like you don't understand is that everybody is an individual- race and social minority is a worthless determiner for whether or not they're going to be a criminal or not. most of these problems stem from persecution, poor living conditions and financial struggle. it's people like you that want to keep them down, then after you've kept them down you wonder why they still want to steal your shit to feed their kids.
to try and tell [i]me[/i] that [i]i[/i] don't understand is absolutely fucking insane. i've known more people from persecuted minorities than you can hope to dream of and it's always the white privileged rich kid that claims they have it the worst.
[QUOTE=Ownederd;39011906]one of the backwards 'supportive reasons' that the nazis used against gypsies to execute them en masse was their cultural background, because they felt it didn't slide along with theirs[/QUOTE]
One of. Not all of them, by far.
And they don't fit.
Their culture is far more different from most people. It's almost like taking someone from a tribe located in a far land and putting him in a big city. Something bad is bound to happen because he doesn't follows or even knows the same rules as anyone else.
[b]But that doesn't means I'm justifying it with genocide. That's just twisting words and just fishing for an excuse to ban someone.[/b]
[QUOTE=dass;39011977]One of. Not all of them, by far.
[B]And they don't fit.[/B]
Their culture is far more different from most people. It's almost like taking someone from a tribe located in a far land and putting him in a big city. Something bad is bound to happen because he doesn't follows or even knows the same rules as anyone else.
[b]But that doesn't means I'm justifying it with genocide. That's just twisting words and just fishing for an excuse to ban someone.[/b][/QUOTE]
annnnnnnnnnnnnd this is why people are bumping heads with you, dude
[QUOTE=UnknownDude;39011930]You're basically blaming an entire ethnic group for acts of individuals, and generalizing their behavior. It might not be genocidal racism, but it certainly is unwarranted xenophobia.[/QUOTE]
Rulling me out of the equation then... From where else does most of this generalization come from?
[QUOTE=dass;39012000]Rulling me out of the equation then... From where else does most of this generalization come from?[/QUOTE]
do you [b]seriously[/b] believe that because a generalization exists it has to be true? are you that thick?
[QUOTE=Ownederd;39011985]annnnnnnnnnnnnd this is why people are bumping heads with you, dude[/QUOTE]
So, if someone doesn't fits in with other people, and doesn't accepts their rules, we just let them be?
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Bobie;39012019]do you [b]seriously[/b] believe that because a generalization exists it has to be true? are you that thick?[/QUOTE]
How is it not true if it exists and if there are numerous reports of it?
[QUOTE=dass;39012021]So, if someone doesn't fits in with other people, and doesn't accepts their rules, we just let them be?
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
How is it not true if it exists and if there are numerous reports of it?[/QUOTE]
if all of your peers were criminals, would you consider yourself a criminal?
[QUOTE=dass;39012021]So, if someone doesn't fits in with other people, and doesn't accepts their rules, we just let them be?
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
How is it not true if it exists and if there are numerous reports of it?[/QUOTE]
"i dont like browns lol"
this is your argument; i don't care if what i'm doing is ad-hominen; you are en-forcing discrimination towards a group of people based on their cultural background
[QUOTE=dass;39012000]Rulling me out of the equation then... From where else does most of this generalization come from?[/QUOTE]
Generalization is built upon from stereotypes, and no person in their right mind would take stereotypes as fact.
[QUOTE=dass;39012021]
How is it not true if it exists and if there are numerous reports of it?[/QUOTE]
I would ask to see some of these reports, but [B]acts of individuals do not represent an entire group[/B]. Some dude robs another dude, and happens to be a gypsy. That kind of stuff isn't exclusive to gypsies, and that kind of stuff isn't something all gypsies do for a living. This is why generalizations are not true, because they cannot accurately represent an entire group because people act differently.
[QUOTE=Bobie;39011967]what fucking sentence? the burden of proof is upon you provide the facts that show that all romani people/gypsies are criminals. a wikipedia article on their culture shows me nothing, and if anything, shows you're willing to use the smallest shred of 'evidence' to further your neo-nazi esque views. all that wikipedia article showed me is that the prison population is disproportionately skewed towards an ethnic minority. so fucking what. there's a high prison population of black people in london, does that mean i want all black people to leave london?
you're using statistics to treat people as numbers and justify your own terrifyingly racist views with them. even if the rate of crime amongst an ethnicity was 90% i would never, even for one second generalize to justify my casual racism; and what bigots like you don't understand is that everybody is an individual- race and social minority is a worthless determiner for whether or not they're going to be a criminal or not. most of these problems stem from persecution, poor living conditions and financial struggle. it's people like you that want to keep them down, then after you've kept them down you wonder why they still want to steal your shit to feed their kids.
to try and tell [I]me[/I] that [I]i[/I] don't understand is absolutely fucking insane. i've known more people from persecuted minorities than you can hope to dream of and it's always the white privileged rich kid that claims they have it the worst.[/QUOTE]
So, we have to accept their scavenging ways and let them take whatever they feel like taking?
I wouldn't give a shit about them if they didn't take whatever they felt like taking from someone and make random threats just because someone is looking at them.
Guess what: I have a problem with people who do nothing but bad.
Have I interacted with gypsies and gotten good opinions out of them? Yes I fucking have, up to a big point even.
I would have a lot more if all the others didn't shank me for whatever the hell they would want.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Bobie;39012041]if all of your peers were criminals, would you consider yourself a criminal?[/QUOTE]
No, but I could have the chance of being raised like one aswell.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=UnknownDude;39012096]Generalization is built upon from stereotypes, and no person in their right mind would take stereotypes as fact.
I would ask to see some of these reports, but [B]acts of individuals do not represent an entire group[/B]. Some dude robs another dude, and happens to be a gypsy. That kind of stuff isn't exclusive to gypsies, and that kind of stuff isn't something all gypsies do for a living. This is why generalizations are not true, because they cannot accurately represent an entire group because people act differently.[/QUOTE]
But this isn't just a case of one guy robbing another. But I do understand the generalization..
It's just really really hard to find good people within the gypsy ethnicity. At most, you get people who have their own "business" but don't have any beef with you and can even befriend you to a point.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Anti-Zyganism, but let's just say racism--Again (Last chance)" - Megafan))[/highlight]
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Anti-Zyganism, but let's just say racism--Again (Last chance)" - Megafan))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=dass;39012105]So, we have to accept their scavenging ways and let them take whatever they feel like taking?
I wouldn't give a shit about them if they didn't take whatever they felt like taking from someone and make random threats just because someone is looking at them.
Guess what: I have a problem with people who do nothing but bad.
Have I interacted with gypsies and gotten good opinions out of them? Yes I fucking have, up to a big point even.
I would have a lot more if all the others didn't shank me for whatever the hell they would want.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
No, but I could have the chance of being raised like one aswell.[/QUOTE]
and people insultingly say that jews are money-grubbing sob's and that black people are unwanted and violent; what are you arguing dude
[QUOTE=dass;39012105]So, we have to accept their scavenging ways and let them take whatever they feel like taking?
I wouldn't give a shit about them if they didn't take whatever they felt like taking from someone and make random threats just because someone is looking at them.
Guess what: I have a problem with people who do nothing but bad.
Have I interacted with gypsies and gotten good opinions out of them? Yes I fucking have, up to a big point even.
I would have a lot more if all the others didn't shank me for whatever the hell they would want.[/QUOTE]
arguing with you is a waste of time. it's clear you don't understand what individuality and the root causes of crime are.
one day you'll look back on this and realise how disgusting your mindset is. or not. i don't give a shit, try maintaining these views however and watch as you get rejected by anyone with an ounce of sense in their head.
it makes me sick that romani people have to endure persecution while assholes like you can sit on a computer, live comfortably and oppress people virtually without any fear of rejection.
[QUOTE=Ownederd;39012129]and people insultingly say that jews are money-grubbing sob's and that black people are unwanted and violent; what are you arguing dude[/QUOTE]
I'm just stating facts?
[QUOTE=dass;39012159]I'm just stating facts?[/QUOTE]
go fuck yourself.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Flaming, yet again" - Megafan))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=dass;39012159]I'm just stating facts?[/QUOTE]
don't support borderline baby-racism with a simple hand-swipe of 'i'm just stating facts... ;))'
[QUOTE=Bobie;39012132]arguing with you is a waste of time. it's clear you don't understand what individuality and the root causes of crime are.
one day you'll look back on this and realise how disgusting your mindset is. or not. i don't give a shit, try maintaining these views however and watch as you get rejected by anyone with an ounce of sense in their head.
it makes me sick that romani people have to endure persecution while assholes like you can sit on a computer, live comfortably and oppress people virtually without any fear of rejection.[/QUOTE]
Individuality?
Endure persecution?
Dude, even the cops are scared of them... What makes you think that they give a shit about whatever I say?
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Ownederd;39012186]don't support borderline baby-racism with a simple hand-swipe of 'i'm just stating facts... ;))'[/QUOTE]
when in fact, I am stating facts...
that their culture doesn't fits with everyone.
Do I have a problem with brazilians? No. Blacks? No. Asians? No, and believe me, theres more than gypsies actually... Ucranians? Nope.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;39012180]No, your stating the facts in a negative way IE this entire post:
Reading this it makes it seem like EVERY person of this ethnicity is going to mug you, steal your shit, then sell it to the next guy they see.[/QUOTE]
That does happen around here actually.
[QUOTE=dass;39012159]I'm just stating facts?[/QUOTE]
You're not stating fact, you're stating xenophobic bullshit based on your own representation of fact.
[QUOTE=Bobie;39012168]go fuck yourself.[/QUOTE]
Oh, how nice.
Why did you even bother to reply if the handful of experience you got is bigger than mine and you obviously know more than anyone else?
[QUOTE=dass;39012231]Oh, how nice.
Why did you even bother to reply if the handful of experience you got is bigger than mine and you obviously know more than anyone else?[/QUOTE]
You don't even see his point, and if you still refuse to try to understand what he's saying, then there's no use in trying to argue with you.
[QUOTE=UnknownDude;39012217]You're not stating fact, you're stating xenophobic bullshit based on your own representation of fact.[/QUOTE]
My own?
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people_in_Spain[/url]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people_in_Portugal[/url]
[QUOTE=dass;39012251]My own?
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people_in_Spain[/url]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_people_in_Portugal[/url][/QUOTE]
Posting the same useless statistics isn't going to prove a point.
[QUOTE=UnknownDude;39012245]You don't even see his point, and if you still refuse to try to understand what he's saying, then there's no use in trying to argue with you.[/QUOTE]
His point is basically "oh the only few people I know from a certain ethnicity were nice people, so I know more than a whole lot of countries that had or have real problems with said ethnicity" while I keep saying their culture and way of doing things has never mixed with anyone else.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=UnknownDude;39012264]Posting the same useless statistics isn't going to prove a point.[/QUOTE]
How are those useless statistics?
That's like saying a certain brand of vehicles makes unsafe cars due to having a large number of unsafe releases and then saying that large number constitutes useless statistics.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;39012228]Statistically you're more likely to be injured in a car if you get into a car, does that mean that your going to die every time you get in a car? fuck no it doesn't.[/QUOTE]
It isn't the same.
Probabilities are you wont even find another car in the road or any danger, while certain places here are just like walking into a bad neighbourhood.
You know what?...
I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.
African American incarceration rates are disproportionate to their population share. [I]Obviously[/I] they are just naturally criminals and don't deserve to be here. And their culture is just so different, look at how they do their hair and how they talk and they all just live in rundown houses and drop out of school and join gangs. We just need to get rid of them, right?
[sp]It should be pretty obvious I'm not serious about this.[/sp]
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;39012319]1: Your second article doesn't mention anything about them being "dangerous"
2: They are useless statistics because every human being, is an individual, and is capable of taking their own actions.[/QUOTE]
"Early on, due to their sociocultural differences and nomadic lifestyle, the ciganos were the object of fierce discrimination and persecution."
Doesn't implies them being dangerous directly. Nomadic lifestyle just doesn't fits with everyone else.
But ok, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and not take these around here as examples.
[QUOTE=dass;39012271]His point is basically "oh the only few people I know from a certain ethnicity were nice people, so I know more than a whole lot of countries that had or have real problems with said ethnicity" while I keep saying their culture and way of doing things has never mixed with anyone else.
[/QUOTE]
No, no and no. His point is that people are individual and whatever ethnic group they belong to does not represent the actions of an individual.
[QUOTE=dass;39012271]
How are those useless statistics?
That's like saying a certain brand of vehicles makes unsafe cars due to having a large number of unsafe releases and then saying that large number constitutes useless statistics.
[/QUOTE]
Bobie already said that romani prison populations do not prove that all gypsies are criminals, and ethnicity isn't the root cause for crime. As I have said countless times, the actions of individuals doesn't represent an entire group.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=dass;39012348]Nomadic lifestyle just doesn't fits with everyone else.[/QUOTE]
What is your fucking proposal for a solution, then? Toss them all out of the country because someone else in their ethnic group did something?
[QUOTE=UnknownDude;39012352]No, no and no. His point is that people are individual and whatever ethnic group they belong to does not represent the actions of an individual.
Bobie already said that romani prison populations do not prove that all gypsies are criminals, and ethnicity isn't the root cause for crime. As I have said countless times, the actions of individuals doesn't represent an entire group.
[editline]29th December 2012[/editline]
What is your fucking proposal for a solution, then? Toss them all out of the country because someone else in their ethnic group did something?[/QUOTE]
Individuals in certain ethnic groups are taught the same way as their elders. It's a big part of them to pass on their culture to the next generation, whatever it might be.
My question would be why are they migrating to a country who doesn't likes them in the first place.
I know the reasons why, but, how can they be better off?
[QUOTE=dass;39012385]Individuals in certain ethnic groups are taught the same way as their elders. It's a big part of them to pass on their culture to the next generation, whatever it might be.[/QUOTE]
And what makes you think that crime is part of their culture? Stereotypes? Experiences with individuals?
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