Arizona to fine obese people on welfare if they don't follow their doctors diets
203 replies, posted
[QUOTE=STeel;29931080]Well yeah but in the end of the day it's your decision what the fuck do you do with your life.
And here the government tells you what to do with it.[/QUOTE]
As long as the government is supporting your livelihood they have a bit of a say in what you do in your life.
[editline]19th May 2011[/editline]
It's not like obese people who can support themselves are getting fined
[QUOTE=analrapist;29931968]Your rights end where mine begin.
As someone who has to pay for my own insurance, I have the right to not have to pay for someone else's shitty choices. Fatties are more expensive to care for than people of a normal weight, and they drive up the cost of health care for everyone.[/QUOTE]
Tax fat food, make more monies.
[QUOTE=Cmx;29897191]one problem I see with this is the healthier food is more expensive...[/QUOTE]
Healthy food /=/ Organic food
[QUOTE=Brt5470;29946566]Healthy food /=/ Organic food[/QUOTE]
All the healthy stuff is massively overpriced where I am, organic or not.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;29915621]What if you don't have a doctor? :v:[/QUOTE]
You go on the internet for your diagnosis.
By the way, your headache indicates brain tumors and testicular cancer. You should get this really expensive herbal remedy that cures everything, just don't tell the pharmeceuticals because they're all anti-life shitheads who want to kill us.
I don't comment on the issue of weight compared to the person's psyche, because I'm one of those skeletons that walks around all day. I went through much of my childhood having my meals watched because I was unhealthily underweight, and couldn't seem to gain weight. Still can't to this day, I'm 21 and I am always in the early 130's. So I have no idea how hard it is to lose weight because I can drop lunch for a week and drop back into an unhealthy weight. I take the smallest waist size in the men's department and I still need a belt because my pants hang off my ass. I also don't flaunt that to people, others I know "oh well I can eat whatever I want and not get fat, so they shouldn't have any problem."
So again, I don't comment on the weight = state of mind. I see plenty of people who are fat fuckers, but equal to the number of skinny assholes. I think it just sticks out more because you notice the fat person's other features.
I agree that the conditions need to be changed that healthy food is cheaper and shit food becomes something of a once in a while vanity, and that comes through boosting production of healthy foods. It can't be done through legislation banning shit foods or taxing them to the point where they are more expensive. The first thing the government can do is break the combination of tax breaks and tariffs that result in sugar being more expensive than high fructose corn syrup. Tell the corn industry to go fuck itself.
The FDA has been doing a pretty good job recently dealing with foods that make baseless claims of being healthy. They've instituted more regulations on bottled water, they introduced [url]http://www.foodsafety.gov/[/url] that has a wealth of information. There's still a lot of road to cover, but they're on their way for a government organization that regularly finds itself understaffed and underfunded.
oh my god oh my god the government is governing people rah rah nanny state
[QUOTE=Cmx;29897191]one problem I see with this is the healthier food is more expensive...[/QUOTE]
Going for a run or brisk walk is free
[QUOTE=Perfumly;29928067]
You know you can lower your portions with more calorie dense food and still lose weight yeah?
[editline]19th May 2011[/editline]
That could be used as a reason as why poor people are [i]unhealthy[/i] but not a reason as to why they are [i]obese as fuck[/i] because it doesn't cost more to eat less shit food.
If you have to eat shit food because of your financial situation you can still always lower your portions and save even more money.[/QUOTE]
Junk food isn't filling in the slightest, that's why poor people end up eating so much and getting fat.
Are you seriously going to go on the record claiming to understand how this works better than scientists, sociologists, and economists who have spent decades studying this shit? I'm going to guess you've never been in a situation like this, I haven't either. But you don't see me shooting off a bunch of anecdotes and attempting to refute studies with them
[QUOTE=Zeke129;29955281]Junk food isn't filling in the slightest, that's why poor people end up eating so much and getting fat.
[/QUOTE]
ok brofessor
[QUOTE=Perfumly;29997454]ok brofessor[/QUOTE]
Are you still trying to downplay the link between poverty and obesity
Because a quick google of [i]poverty, obesity[/i] will prove you wrong
But I'm not wrong. It doesn't cost more to eat less. In any situation.
[QUOTE=Perfumly;29998042]But I'm not wrong. It doesn't cost more to eat less. In any situation.[/QUOTE]
You cannot possibly be applying that as a blanket statement.
srsly.
In purely physical terms, yes, that's correct.
However you're completely ignoring the psychological side of - as mentioned previously - not feeling full or satiated and eating more.
And the foods that make people more like people and less like ravenous beasts tend to be the more expensive ones.
Also, another situation where your blanket statement fails?
Gourmet restaurants. Fucking tiny portion bullshit for 10k.
contag would you mind explaining how the most satiating macronutrient ,protein, is also fairly cheap ( as in <10 dollars for 5 days of food)? or how even say carbohydrates , if the person so desires, is even cheaper ( depending on source, such as flour and bread and crackers )?
[editline]23rd May 2011[/editline]
i reread what you said and are you literally claiming that buying whole food in smaller amounts than the same obese persons normal diet may cost more?
[QUOTE=caaaasus;29998532]contag would you mind explaining how the most satiating macronutrient ,protein, is also fairly cheap ( as in <10 dollars for 5 days of food)? or how even say carbohydrates , if the person so desires, is even cheaper ( depending on source, such as flour and bread and crackers )?
[editline]23rd May 2011[/editline]
i reread what you said and are you literally claiming that buying whole food in smaller amounts than the same obese persons normal diet may cost more?[/QUOTE]
$10 for five days of food? What the hell is that, I want to buy it!
Where can you buy 5 days worth of bread for under $10?
In addition, carbohydrates in drinks have very little satiating effect, which is a significant contributor to obesity.
[quote]are you literally claiming that buying whole food in smaller amounts than the same obese persons normal diet may cost more?[/quote]
? yes? Have you even been shopping before?
Fruit, nuts, vegetables and meat are bloody expensive. Organic? At least double the price.
Wait, could you give me a rough estimate of the cost of some items in your area?
Because it could just be regional differences.
[QUOTE=Perfumly;29998042]But I'm not wrong. It doesn't cost more to eat less. In any situation.[/QUOTE]
You seemingly don't understand the situation, or are purposely choosing to ignore what's right in front of you
There are people in the western world that cannot afford to purchase healthy food either due to the cost of it, or due to the cost of going to get it (supermarkets generally don't exist in the "ghetto"), nor can they afford gym memberships, nor can they afford the time required to exercise on their own (underemployment often leads to working multiple part time jobs just to make ends meet)
Their financial situation forces them into a relatively sedentary lifestyle where they only have access to high-sugar, high-fat, high-sodium foods.
This will MAKE YOU FAT, stop pretending that you are smarter than the hundreds or even thousands of professionals who have researched this
[QUOTE=Contag;29999525]$10 for five days of food? What the hell is that, I want to buy it!
Where can you buy 5 days worth of bread for under $10?
In addition, carbohydrates in drinks have very little satiating effect, which is a significant contributor to obesity.
? yes? Have you even been shopping before?
Fruit, nuts, vegetables and meat are bloody expensive. Organic? At least double the price.
Wait, could you give me a rough estimate of the cost of some items in your area?
Because it could just be regional differences.[/QUOTE]
youre asking me if ive ever been shopping yet you dont know the prices of raw chicken breast and the leaner cuts of beef and pork. at the same time of saying this i cant say or even estimate the prices of food in Australia but from the other country's ive seen the prices are fairly low compared to fast food or resturants. also since when do carbohydrates have a major effect on obesity ( unless you were referring to sugar/syrup filled drinks )
[editline]23rd May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Zeke129;29999899]You seemingly don't understand the situation, or are purposely choosing to ignore what's right in front of you
There are people in the western world that cannot afford to purchase healthy food either due to the cost of it, or due to the cost of going to get it (supermarkets generally don't exist in the "ghetto"), nor can they afford gym memberships, nor can they afford the time required to exercise on their own (underemployment often leads to working multiple part time jobs just to make ends meet)
Their financial situation forces them into a relatively sedentary lifestyle where they only have access to high-sugar, high-fat, high-sodium foods.
This will MAKE YOU FAT, stop pretending that you are smarter than the hundreds or even thousands of professionals who have researched this[/QUOTE]
i dont mean to get in you and perfumlys argument but are you saying all poor people live in ghettos and dont even live within walking or driving distance from some kind of grocery market that sells whole food? i think you have some misconceptions as to what is healthy food.
[QUOTE=caaaasus;30000071]
i dont mean to get in you and perfumlys argument but are you saying all poor people live in ghettos and dont even live within walking or driving distance from some kind of grocery market that sells whole food? i think you have some misconceptions as to what is healthy food.[/QUOTE]
I never said anything about "all" poor people because I wouldn't make an absolute statement like that
[QUOTE=caaaasus;30000071]youre asking me if ive ever been shopping yet you dont know the prices of raw chicken breast and the leaner cuts of beef and pork. at the same time of saying this i cant say or even estimate the prices of food in Australia but from the other country's ive seen the prices are fairly low compared to fast food or resturants. also since when do carbohydrates have a major effect on obesity ( unless you were referring to sugar/syrup filled drinks )[/QUOTE]
I was talking about the sugar/syrup drinks.
One kilo of chicken breast (about 2 pounds) is about $17 USD, the organic stuff is about $35 USD per kilo.
The cheapest beef mince is about $12 USD per kilo, the more expensive is $17 USD per kilo.
[editline]23rd May 2011[/editline]
How is that compared to US prices?
[QUOTE=Contag;30000403]I was talking about the sugar/syrup drinks.
One kilo of chicken breast (about 2 pounds) is about $17 USD, the organic stuff is about $35 USD per kilo.
The cheapest beef mince is about $12 USD per kilo, the more expensive is $17 USD per kilo.
[editline]23rd May 2011[/editline]
How is that compared to US prices?[/QUOTE]
I remember someone saying earlier that chicken was dirt cheap in the states
still doesn't matter if the nearest supermarket that sells fresh meat is 20 miles away
And even then, you have to cook the chicken, which is difficult for the underemployed as you mentioned before, hence why fast food is personally preferable to them.
[QUOTE=Contag;30001055]And even then, you have to cook the chicken, which is difficult for the underemployed as you mentioned before, hence why fast food is personally preferable to them.[/QUOTE]
well cooking chicken is easy it's just the frequent trips to the supermarket that may be far away that get expensive
it isn't like poor people have giant freezers in their apartment to stock up on meat either
[QUOTE=Contag;30001055]And even then, you have to cook the chicken, which is difficult for the underemployed as you mentioned before, hence why fast food is personally preferable to them.[/QUOTE]
Unless they're straight up retarded, they can pan fry some chicken.
i'm just going to leave this interesting quote here that is vaguely related to the topic
[quote=Kurt Vonnegut]America is the wealthiest nation on Earth, but its people are mainly poor, and poor Americans are urged to hate themselves. To quote the American humorist Kin Hubbard, ‘It ain’t no disgrace to be poor, but it might as well be.’ It is in fact a crime for an American to be poor, even though America is a nation of poor. Every other nation has folk traditions of men who were poor but extremely wise and virtuous, and therefore more estimable than anyone with power and gold. No such tales are told by the American poor. They mock themselves and glorify their betters. The meanest eating or drinking establishment, owned by a man who is himself poor, is very likely to have a sign on its wall asking this cruel question: ‘if you’re so smart, why ain’t you rich?’ There will also be an American flag no larger than a child’s hand – glued to a lollipop stick and flying from the cash register…
Americans, like human beings everywhere, believe many things that are obviously untrue. Their most destructive untruth is that it is very easy for any American to make money. They will not acknowledge how in fact hard money is to come by, and, therefore, those who have no money blame and blame and blame themselves. This inward blame has been a treasure for the rich and powerful, who have had to do less for their poor, publicly and privately, than any other ruling class since, say Napoleonic times. Many novelties have come from America. The most startling of these, a thing without precedent, is a mass of undignified poor. They do not love one another because they do not love themselves.[/quote]
It is funny though, to me at least, that when they try to justify this by reasoning with budgetary concerns. Lot of legislation I've seen in Texas recently has been along the same lines, particularly against "welfare" recipients. In having to enforce it though they end up creating another bureaucratic stratum to enforce it. And you get "big government" from the same people who tell their constituents that big government is bad. Fun times.
[QUOTE=MercZ;30001452]It is funny though, to me at least, that when they try to justify this by reasoning with budgetary concerns. Lot of legislation I've seen in Texas recently has been along the same lines, particularly against "welfare" recipients. In having to enforce it though they end up creating another bureaucratic stratum to enforce it. And you get "big government" from the same people who tell their constituents that big government is bad. Fun times.[/QUOTE]
the budget is basically the republicans goto excuse for legislating their horrible social agenda
I like this, although there are some people who just genetically aren't going to be anything other than fat
[QUOTE=Contag;30000403]I was talking about the sugar/syrup drinks.
One kilo of chicken breast (about 2 pounds) is about $17 USD, the organic stuff is about $35 USD per kilo.
The cheapest beef mince is about $12 USD per kilo, the more expensive is $17 USD per kilo.
[editline]23rd May 2011[/editline]
How is that compared to US prices?[/QUOTE]
for 20 bucks you could buy like 5 or 6 lbs chicken where im from
ground beef(im assuming thats what beef mince is) is probably at a competitive price to you
but since ground beef is so fatty its almost worthless to buy in a lot of cases since most of the mass ends up cooking off
[QUOTE=Zeke129;30000907]I remember someone saying earlier that chicken was dirt cheap in the states
still doesn't matter if the nearest supermarket that sells fresh meat is 20 miles away[/QUOTE]
it is for me. but then again that might be regional, apparently washington has a ton of chicken farms or somethin
[editline]23rd May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=CjienX;30001198]Unless they're straight up retarded, they can pan fry some chicken.[/QUOTE]
that takes effort
when i was pulling 12-15 hour days when i got home i didnt want to pan fry or cook anything
fast food is also designed to make you want to eat more because it lacks what the body considers filling food.
you can eat a lot more processed beef and cheap bread than you can eat whole beef and organic bread
Finally tackling the real problem in America, people getting getting aid.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;30002416]for 20 bucks you could buy like 5 or 6 lbs chicken where im from
when i was pulling 12-15 hour days when i got home i didnt want to pan fry or cook anything[/QUOTE]
Damn that's pretty cheap.
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