You guys realize that the $15/hr is more or less a bargaining chip, right?
They know they're not going to get it, so they have room to negotiate.
Hell, even if they come out to $10 or $11, I'd consider that a win.
i had a rich fulfilling academic career ahead of me with a complete college fund and i was born in one of the safest cities to a rich loving family with connections but i instead chose to become a inner-city single mother who works minimum wage
Where I live:
[url]http://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/22105[/url]
Equivalent hourly wage: $30 / hr
Less than 2 miles from me are terrible neighborhoods that are home to some exceedingly poor.
Everyone reading this thread is so much better off than most, just saying.
I'd give people at least 1.5 times the cost of living wage for their area.
According to this source: [url]http://www.le.ac.uk/economics/research/RePEc/lec/leecon/dp06-9.pdf[/url]
[quote]most studies reviewed above
found that a 10% US minimum wage increase raises food prices by no more than 4% and overall
prices by no more than 0.4%[/quote]
I'll gladly pay that difference considering how tough some people have it. I rather they work than take welfare or resort to crime. People have to have an option that's actually viable.
lotsa victim blaming in here
Henry Ford did it right. Increased Wages and cut the prices on his cards by making the assembly line. His own workers wanted to stay working there because of the wage and they also bought cars from him with their new money, thus making him more money. A burger can be assembled quickly and cheaply and still taste delicious, you have to pay for quality ingredients. Increasing wages and upping quality will increase your worker's value at home and the chances of them eating at where they work. McDonald's and others are just reaping huge profits off the fact that their burgers are just horseshit with some pickles on the top. They are ruining a valued sentiment, "You have to spend money to make money."
[QUOTE=Lonestriper;43086095]Seeing as we're talking about living wage, everyone who lives in the US can check their respective counties living wage courtesy of MIT
[url]http://livingwage.mit.edu/[/url]
The average for California for a single person is $11.20, whereas minimum wage is $8[/QUOTE]
Hah. Where I am the living wage is no more than $9.50 and a single parent is $20. Actually really low. Things I learned today.
Also, it says that Food prep should be paid $9.10. Thats a reasonable wage.
[QUOTE=Mad Chatter;43086167]You guys realize that the $15/hr is more or less a bargaining chip, right?
They know they're not going to get it, so they have room to negotiate.
Hell, even if they come out to $10 or $11, I'd consider that a win.[/QUOTE]
even a raise to $10 or 11 for a base employee with no additional training is not gonna really be possible with fast food industry. especially with such a large labor pool, and i really think it might backfire if the strikes go on for too long the industry would be likely to move on to technology that would be more efficient than humans. machines don't need wages, and as i previously posted. the technology exists.
[QUOTE=TheKingofBees;43086366]even a raise to $10 or 11 for a base employee with no additional training is not gonna really be possible with fast food industry. especially with such a large labor pool, and i really think it might backfire if the strikes go on for too long the industry would be likely to move on to technology that would be more efficient than humans. machines don't need wages, and as i previously posted. the technology exists.[/QUOTE]
Not by the individual owners, no but if the corporation would lower the franchise fees by a few % then they could. Don't tell me they can't afford it mcdonalds cleared $20,000,000,000 in profit last year.
[QUOTE=frozensoda;43086388]Not by the individual owners, no but if the corporation would lower the franchise fees by a few % then they could. Don't tell me they can't afford it mcdonalds cleared $20,000,000,000 in profit last year.[/QUOTE]
This article
[url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/21/mcdonalds-profit-taxpayers_n_4136336.html[/url]
Says $1.5B in the 3rd quarter. That means around $6 billion dollars in profit last year. Not 20 billion.
[QUOTE=darunner;43086434]This article
[url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/21/mcdonalds-profit-taxpayers_n_4136336.html[/url]
Says $1.5B in the 3rd quarter. That means around $6 billion dollars in profit last year. Not 20 billion.[/QUOTE]
My mistake. Still doesn't change my point in the slightest.
[QUOTE=frozensoda;43086388]Not by the individual owners, no but if the corporation would lower the franchise fees by a few % then they could. Don't tell me they can't afford it mcdonalds cleared $20,000,000,000 in profit last year.[/QUOTE]
i'm sure they'd rather try out lowering franchise fee percent to stores that integrate the burgerbot tech, spin it as a "futuristic" thing to select stores and then spread it, cutting the amount they hire and maximizing profits even more. similar to how ATMs started out.
edit:
i'm not arguing against a raise, just stating that we've seen the results of this in other industries. and in micro econ-wise the fast food industry is likely to follow that path too.
McDonnalds for all their response said it would kill the company to have workers that could contribute positively to the tax system
[QUOTE=areolop;43084001]Hydraulic effect. If you change the wage to something of skilled labor, then the price of everything will also increase[/QUOTE]
Pay the CEO's less.
That third Yacht and second private jet isn't crucial to living.
[QUOTE=Van-man;43086496]Pay the CEO's less.
That third Yacht and second private jet isn't crucial to living.[/QUOTE]
Why should the owner of a for-profit company have to take any less than what he wants?
It's all about what the people will put up with. You can talk all of the big talk, but apparently people don't feel the same way as you do, because if they did, nobody would work there and nobody would eat there.
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;43086553]Why should the owner of a for-profit company have to take any less than what he wants?
It's all about what the people will put up with. You can talk all of the big talk, but apparently people don't feel the same way as you do, because if they did, nobody would work there and nobody would eat there.[/QUOTE]
That's not really much of a justification though. Though this certainly doesn't account for all employees, some folks working on minimum wage are doing it because they're simply unable to find a better job even if they're qualified. Like it or not, that's the unfortunate reality and it seems to be something that a lot of people in this thread are unwilling to admit.
[QUOTE=TheKingofBees;43086366]even a raise to $10 or 11 for a base employee with no additional training is not gonna really be possible with fast food industry. especially with such a large labor pool, and i really think it might backfire if the strikes go on for too long the industry would be likely to move on to technology that would be more efficient than humans. machines don't need wages, and as i previously posted. the technology exists.[/QUOTE]
That case could be argued for anything from the fast food industry, to office work, to construction; it's just the natural progression of the modern world.
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;43086553]Why should the owner of a for-profit company have to take any less than what he wants?
It's all about what the people will put up with. You can talk all of the big talk, but apparently people don't feel the same way as you do, because if they did, nobody would work there and nobody would eat there.[/QUOTE]
You sound like one of those people who consider Socialism to be a bad ting, and that everyone whining should just pull themselves up by the bootstraps, even though they're literally a wageslave that would end in financial ruin if they tried and most likely will end in that anyway if they don't.
[t]http://s30.postimg.org/8gd1l6cw1/Sk_rmbillede_06_12_2013_07_57_00.png[/t]
See this? that's a chart on the inequality in major countries.
The US is only beaten on having worse equality among its citizens by Mexico, Chile and Turkey.
IF that doesn't embarrass you, then all hope is lost for you.
Source: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equality[/url]
[QUOTE=JeanLuc761;43086561]That's not really much of a justification though. Though this certainly doesn't account for all employees, some folks working on minimum wage are doing it because they're simply unable to find a better job even if they're qualified. Like it or not, that's the unfortunate reality and it seems to be something that a lot of people in this thread are unwilling to admit.[/QUOTE]
So the CEO of McDonalds should give a major portion of his 13.8 million dollar salary back to pay the workers? I don't think he's getting a yacht as it is on that salary.
Yes, the COMPANY made 1.5 billion in profits. But tell me, what do companies do with all of those profits? Let me give you a little secret.... They better themselves. They put that money into R&D, expansions, etc.... That is the point of a business. A business isn't there to provide you with a wage. It's there to provide you with a service.
[QUOTE=areolop;43084031]If you're sick of being paid shit somewhere go find a new job that pays more. Your job currently does not mean its your job forever[/QUOTE]
Yes because as we all know every last person in the world goes from burger flipper to making annual 80-100k throughout their life
It's not like the backbone of society is shitty service jobs or anything
I somehow need to come up with 20 grand for college at 7.75/hr, at a restaurant that makes upwards of $3k in [U]profit[/U] daily.
[QUOTE=Van-man;43086711]You sound like one of those people who consider Socialism to be a bad ting, and that everyone whining should just pull themselves up by the bootstraps, even though they're literally a wageslave that would end in financial ruin if they tried and most likely will end in that anyway if they don't.[/QUOTE]
Not necissarily. I believe that while people do need help sometimes, but just giving them what they need isn't going to help. You have to also help them get the tools they need so it doesn't happen to them again. On the other hand, I do not believe unskilled labor should pay enough to provide for a family of 4 as the only income source. I also do no believe that unskilled labor should be competitive with skilled labor. That's just how I feel. I also believe that if you give someone every chance to make something of themselves and they don't because they don't want to put fourth the effort, then I hope minimum wage is good enough for them.
[QUOTE=Mad Chatter;43086581]That case could be argued for anything from the fast food industry, to office work, to construction; it's just the natural progression of the modern world.[/QUOTE]
yes which is why more and more you see less people staffing or on the job, but a higher general pay. however the ones implementing the new tech will see an increase in wage, usually with the addition of a higher level of training. an example since you brought up construction.
two contractors did similar work earlier this month, one used 30 laborers, the other used 6 and an excavator that came with different bits. the 6 people had a wage of $15-25/hr and from talking to some of the crew of 30 they had around $7 - $11 depending on their skill set.
that being said the amount a CEO is being paid is grotesque of course there's not a real way a company can change without their own leadership deciding to.
The entire idea that fast food and all minimum or below-living wage workers should just "find a better job" is so obtusely stupid that I'm bewildered people are actually typing it into reality even on the internet.
Do you really think that massive businesses like McDonalds and Wal-Mart would exist if there wasn't a steady supply of workers who simply have no other job to work for a myriad of personal, societal, geographical, or systemic conditions? That everyone can walk down after their graduation and immediately step into a well paying job? What kind of fantastical mental gymnastics does one have to do to enter this world you describe?
I always expect people questioning the $15 an hour demand. Employees demanding their wages be doubled will certainly pull in people who think it's just too high. But the outright hostility towards service industry workers in this thread is disgusting.
[QUOTE=Gatsby;43084994]Pretty much this, anybody here who thinks $15 minimum wage is a good idea have no understanding of basic economics.[/QUOTE]
Anyone who thinks that they're actually expecting $15 is stupid - if they went and said "Hey - we want a ONE DOLLAR wage increase!" they'll end up with less. Demanding $15 is a place to start, they obviously won't get that much (if anything).
[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;43084055]because that's easy right[/QUOTE]
because that matters right
[QUOTE=areolop;43084031]If you're sick of being paid shit somewhere go find a new job that pays more. Your job currently does not mean its your job forever[/QUOTE]
*Streamers and confetti fall from the sky*
Congratulations!
*The crowd beings applauding, a standing ovation so impressive that the heavens themselves shake*
You have solved the issue of poverty! You've freed all minimum wage workers! Who would have thought that the solution would be as simple as "just getting a new job??"!!!! I'm glad that white guys living in the US that were born into the middle class like you are so great at stickin' it to the rest of us!
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;43086255]lotsa victim blaming in here[/QUOTE]
I think victim is the wrong word here - you have [I]some[/I] control over your life, and there's people with much shittier lives. But that's besides the point; even if some people fail to overcome obstacles, they shouldn't have to live like shit in a developed part of the world. When I see some of the hoods in the US, I'm taken aback, because literally nothing looks like that here in Denmark, and how some would say that people can deserve living there, whether it's their own fault or not, honestly makes me a bit disgusted.
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;43086553]Why should the owner of a for-profit company have to take any less than what he wants?
It's all about what the people will put up with. You can talk all of the big talk, but apparently people don't feel the same way as you do, because if they did, nobody would work there and nobody would eat there.[/QUOTE]
because we as human beings have these things called "humility" and "empathy." i really don't know how these big wig money-guy people sleep at night knowing they could [I]literally[/I] save peoples' lives by giving away less than like, a single percent of their salary.
Why not just take money from the company owners and send it throughout the company? What does the Wal-Mart owner family have? 30 some billion or something like that?
[QUOTE=Chernobyl426;43087063]Why not just take money from the company owners and send it throughout the company? What does the Wal-Mart owner family have? 30 some billion or something like that?[/QUOTE]
Because when you've figured out how to legally exploit people you gotta bank it like Scrooge McDuck.
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