• George Zimmerman To Be Charged In Trayvon Martin Shooting
    85 replies, posted
[QUOTE=brianosaur;35532753]The real question they will fight in court is whether or not it's really 'self defense'. He already admitted that he pulled the trigger, and he thinks he justified it because "self defense." The prosecutors will tear his ass up in court.[/QUOTE] It should be interesting seeing this put to rest. They will have evidence we don't I'm sure. And it won't be as fucked up as the media made it to please their viewers.
Unless they have some previously unknown evidence I don't see how they can prove second degree murder beyond a reasonable doubt. I have the feeling they are charging him just so the state can say "Well, we tried to do something but the jury...".
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35532683]911 Operator told him not to, obviously he did. That's not speculation.[/QUOTE] How do you get that he "obviously" did not stop following him. There is nothing to say that Zimmerman did not stop following him when the operator told him it was unnecessary. Who confronted who is still complete speculation.
[QUOTE=BusterBluth;35532911]How do you get that he "obviously" did not stop following him. There is nothing to say that Zimmerman did not stop following him when the operator told him it was unnecessary. Who confronted who is still complete speculation.[/QUOTE]Then how did he end up outside of and far away from his vehicle where he undoubtedly shot Martin?
[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;35533010]Then how did he end up outside of and far away from his vehicle where he undoubtedly shot Martin?[/QUOTE] Because Zimmerman was following him, that is in the 911 call. If Zimmerman continued following him or did not after the 911 call is up to speculation because as far as we know there is no solid evidence ether way.
[QUOTE=Ybbats;35532537]Yeah, because he obviously should have been at least arrested and investigated. The people who were protesting werent doing it just to get some 'big old bad' white man, they had a legitimate reason that you go and then assume is because THEY are racist. So you can see why I called you a 'subconscious racist' and not a 'racist' which you seem to have thought I called you.[/QUOTE] But... But Zimmerman is Latino...
[QUOTE=faze;35532736]I [B]married[/B] into a black family. Pretty sure I am not a bigot.[/QUOTE] this isn't how racism works misogynists marry women all the time :)
[QUOTE=Shadaez;35533503]this isn't how racism works misogynists marry women all the time :)[/QUOTE] Apparently you are ignorant of reality. Go ahead and keep judging, and watching your PC news.
[QUOTE=BusterBluth;35532911]How do you get that he "obviously" did not stop following him. There is nothing to say that Zimmerman did not stop following him when the operator told him it was unnecessary. Who confronted who is still complete speculation.[/QUOTE] Well seeing as Zimmerman's story changed several times, it's kinda hard to pin point what happened. [editline]12th April 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=faze;35533551]Apparently you are ignorant of reality. Go ahead and keep judging, and watching your PC news.[/QUOTE] No misogynist has ever married someone before, true fact.
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35533652]Well seeing as Zimmerman's story changed several times, it's kinda hard to pin point what happened. [/QUOTE] The problem isn't that we cant pin point exactly what happened, its that right now we don't have a clear picture at all.
[QUOTE=faze;35533551]Apparently you are ignorant of reality. Go ahead and keep judging, and watching your PC news.[/QUOTE] lol I'm not saying you're racist but having a black friend or SO doesn't disqualify you as being racist.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;35533904]lol I'm not saying you're racist but having a black friend or SO doesn't disqualify you as being racist.[/QUOTE] My wife is half black and I love the black side of the family. They're the nicest people I've ever met. Keep going. I'll keep shooting you down.
-snip, moved to current thread-
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35530490]You're like Jim_Reily "I am neutral and want to see the facts as they happen, including the fact that Martin is 100% GUILTY."[/QUOTE] I never said Martin was 100% guilty but I disagree that he's entirely innocent. In the last few weeks however more information has come out (I guess you could call it 'more') to start leaning toward a side. Not to mention the disturbing responses from the ill-informed and how bias the media has portrayed Zimmerman initially made me feel that all this isn't as cut and dry as you'd like to think. There's so much more that we don't know. Which is true. I question support for Martin because of the incredible bias for him and that doesn't sit well with me. I think that's fair enough since the majority of opposition liked to say how good of a person Martin was, full articles written on how good of a student he was (conveniently ignoring the two school suspensions for a variety of delinquency) and then others purposely skewing Zimmerman's words to use the race card. When you're arguing against people like that, then hell yes, I'm neutral. Of course, this is Governor Goblin (I got your name right, you could at least get mine right too). You're part of that minority of people that believe that this is some sort of police conspiracy against the black man or something. Police being corrupt or some shit like that. That's why I rate you funny.
I don't know whether or not Zimmerman is guilty of murder in the second degree. However, my gut tells me that he's lying or not telling the whole truth about what happened that night.
[QUOTE=archangel125;35534059]I don't know whether or not Zimmerman is guilty of murder in the second degree. However, my gut tells me that he's lying or not telling the whole truth about what happened that night.[/QUOTE] He has fully cooperated so far...
[QUOTE=faze;35534102]He has fully cooperated so far...[/QUOTE] Okay, picture this. You do something bad. You realize your best chance to walk away from it with the minimum amount of pain is to confess to it. However, because you feel guilty and don't want to look like a monster, you omit certain truths or otherwise skim over the parts that make you look bad. Everyone does it. I've done it. I'm almost certain Zimmerman's doing it, because his testimony doesn't make sense.
Shouldn't have charged him with this. You could probably lock him up on a lesser charge without many problems, but 2nd degree murder? Good luck trying to prove that, and even if they DO find him guilty, he can probably appeal it. Should've just gone with a lesser charge that you can prove
[QUOTE=TheTalon;35534148]Shouldn't have charged him with this. You could probably lock him up on a lesser charge without many problems, but 2nd degree murder? Good luck trying to prove that, and even if they DO find him guilty, he can probably appeal it. Should've just gone with a lesser charge that you can prove[/QUOTE] What makes you so sure they can't prove it? D'you really believe that the police don't know already not to charge someone with something they think he can get out of easily? Do you think they've shared ALL their findings and important evidence with the media?
[QUOTE=archangel125;35534186]What makes you so sure they can't prove it? D'you really believe that the police don't know already not to charge someone with something they think he can get out of easily? Do you think they've shared ALL their findings and important evidence with the media?[/QUOTE] The Media is trying to side with Trayvon as much as they can, even flat out editing and lying to do it, and the evidence is STILL in favor of Zimmerman. The whole case is going to be flimsy, so much so that EVEN IF he's found guilty, which at this point I don't think he would, we'll find out in 930892084 years from now when it finally goes to trial, but even IF, I think he can get it appealed Unless a video surfaces of him executing the kid, I don't think he's going to see jail time for 2nd Degree Murder
[QUOTE=TheTalon;35534210]The Media is trying to side with Trayvon as much as they can, even flat out editing and lying to do it, and the evidence is STILL in favor of Zimmerman[/QUOTE] Not necessarily. My point was that the media doesn't have all the evidence yet, and so you don't know what that evidence is. Everything the media HAS got their hands on, they've blown out of proportion, but even a cursory inspection would reveal that more is afoot than the little we've seen.
[QUOTE=archangel125;35534146]Okay, picture this. You do something bad. You realize your best chance to walk away from it with the minimum amount of pain is to confess to it. However, because you feel guilty and don't want to look like a monster, you omit certain truths or otherwise skim over the parts that make you look bad. Everyone does it. I've done it. I'm almost certain Zimmerman's doing it, because his testimony doesn't make sense.[/QUOTE] Apparently his story made enough sense to where police had no basis to arrest him for this long (unless you buy into the whole racist conspiracy thing). If there is evidence proving that George Zimmerman was lying about his self defense claim, I have not seen it. I find it disgusting that the media was pushing this lie of "light skinned guy goes out looking to murder some black kids, then pretends it was self defense" to start a new witch hunt and get ratings. It's gotten to the point where people have this lie so cemented in their heads that they don't even want to bother looking at both sides of the story.
[QUOTE=archangel125;35534238]Not necessarily. My point was that the media doesn't have all the evidence yet, and so you don't know what that evidence is. Everything the media HAS got their hands on, they've blown out of proportion, but even a cursory inspection would reveal that more is afoot than the little we've seen.[/QUOTE] While true, I also think that the reason they're charging him now is to appeal to the large number of people calling for it, rather than on evidence. So now they HAVE to prove that it was 2nd Degree Murder. They've cornered themselves by doing it, really
[QUOTE=Noble;35534266]Apparently his story made enough sense to where police had no basis to arrest him for this long (unless you buy into the whole racist conspiracy thing). If there is evidence proving that George Zimmerman was lying about his self defense claim, I have not seen it. I find it disgusting that the media was pushing this lie of "light skinned guy goes out looking to murder some black kids, then pretends it was self defense" to start a new witch hunt and get ratings. It's gotten to the point where people have this lie so cemented in their heads that they don't even want to bother looking at both sides of the story.[/QUOTE] Yeah I wasn't surprised.
[QUOTE=Noble;35534266]Apparently his story made enough sense to where police had no basis to arrest him for this long (unless you buy into the whole racist conspiracy thing). If there is evidence proving that George Zimmerman was lying about his self defense claim, I have not seen it. I find it disgusting that the media was pushing this lie of "light skinned guy goes out looking to murder some black kids, then pretends it was self defense" to start a new witch hunt and get ratings. It's gotten to the point where people have this lie so cemented in their heads that they don't even want to bother looking at both sides of the story.[/QUOTE] That said, the police did charge him with 2nd degree murder, and that's not something they'd do on the spur of the moment without thinking about it. The police departments in the USA are all very experienced - they know their stuff. They wouldn't lay a charge they thought he'd have a good chance of getting away from. So they've got something we don't know about yet.
Apparently second degree murder is defined as [quote]Second-degree murder is ordinarily defined as 1) an intentional killing that is not premeditated or planned, nor committed in a reasonable "heat of passion" or 2) [B]a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life.[/B][/quote] That second one sounds like it could fit... sorta.
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