• Gettysburg Park and Museum Asked to Remove all Purchasable Items From Stores, And They Actually Migh
    70 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48053606]Not glorifying a racist failed state whose symbol is often used by racists groups today =/= purging history.[/QUOTE] Ah yes I almost forgot how perfect it was for people of color in the North. All flowers and rainbows in Delaware.
[QUOTE=Elstumpo;48053365]If we're going to demonise the confederate flag like we do the nazi flag, does that mean we will see some confederate zombie games now too?[/QUOTE] woah that'd be awesome [I]the south will rise again... FROM THE GRAVE[/I]
[QUOTE=ironman17;48053230]Just a bunch of upset peasants trying to destroy everything linked to a murderer. If it was popularized that he idolized oranges they'd probably be marching on Florida as we speak.[/QUOTE] It has more to do with this one incident! This flag has historically been used by racist groups like the KKK and Skinheads across the world, much like how Nazi flags were.
[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;48053621]woah that'd be awesome [I]the south will rise again... FROM THE GRAVE[/I][/QUOTE] If you ladies and gents will excuse me, I have to go talk to some people for a little bit......
I'm going to commit a mass murder under the image of ice cream ice cream everywhere will be banned
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48053623]It has more to do with this one incident! This flag has historically been used by racist groups like the KKK and Skinheads across the world, much like how Nazi flags were.[/QUOTE] So was the American flag.
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48053623]It has more to do with this one incident! This flag has historically been used by racist groups like the KKK and Skinheads across the world, much like how Nazi flags were.[/QUOTE] Doesn't mean you ban it and try to prevent people of all creeds and ideologies from getting it.
I know the confederate flag may be associated with terrible shit but trying to remove history like this is ignorant, it doesn't make slavery and racism not a thing, and it doesn't stop actual racists from actually using it in racist ways. It effective does [I]nothing positive.[/I] people who use it as a racist symbol deserve hate but come-fucking-on It doesn't magically make racism go away by not existing. Holocaust victims aren't healed of their pain by burning nazi flags. All that pain and suffering has to be remembered. We need to know what these flags are.
[QUOTE=AJ10017;48053231]what the fuck is going on in this country. why are we trying to purge our history from everything? whats next, are they going to force history to be rewritten in text books to exclude the civil war?[/QUOTE] Please, my APUSH exam (and course) failed to include anything relating to war history other than what a couple of political chuckle-fucks did while it raged on, especially the second world war. [editline]25th June 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Aldawolf;48053623]It has more to do with this one incident! This flag has historically been used by racist groups like the KKK and Skinheads across the world, much like how Nazi flags were.[/QUOTE] And yet Europe still has neo-nazi groups despite many countries banning the swastika.
[QUOTE=ExplosiveCheese;48053668]Please, my APUSH exam (and course) failed to include anything relating to war history other than what a couple of political chuckle-fucks did while it raged on, especially the second world war.[/QUOTE] APUSH has to cover a lot thought, and in general it covers politics far more than it does anything else since you're cramming nearly 300 years of politics and events into 1 year and you aren't looking at it from a grand perspective, but basically with a mircoscope. AP Euro was different in that it looks more at the grand scheme of things and concepts and as such allowed for a bit more on wars.
[QUOTE=bdd458;48053694]APUSH has to cover a lot thought, and in general it covers politics far more than it does anything else since you're cramming nearly 300 years of politics and events into 1 year and you aren't looking at it from a grand perspective, but basically with a mircoscope. AP Euro was different in that it looks more at the grand scheme of things and concepts and as such allowed for a bit more on wars.[/QUOTE] True, but still, an emphasis on W.E.B Du Bois and Malcolm X over MLK and Booker T. Washington? I mean, I understand the course had a lot to cover in detail, but from what I was told this was skipped over because people should "already know it". AP Euro was difficult for me, ironically because there were stuff I actually wanted to go in detail but my instructor was always telling me we had no time for it, lol. European history is fucking fascinating.
[QUOTE=ExplosiveCheese;48053713]True, but still, an emphasis on W.E.B Du Bois and Malcolm X over MLK and Booker T. Washington? I mean, I understand the course had a lot to cover in detail, but from what I was told this was skipped over because people should "already know it". AP Euro was difficult for me, ironically because there were stuff I actually wanted to go in detail, lol.[/QUOTE] Oh man, I lucked out with my APUSH teacher, he tried his best to cover everything as equally as he could. He was even better as a Modern History teacher the year after. I do wish we covered Wars a bit more indepth in APUSH though, because we did the actual War part of the Civil War in like a day, too fast tbh for something of its scale and impact.
Jesus Fuck, this whole controversy is getting stuppider and stuppider every day now.
[QUOTE=bdd458;48053772]Oh man, I lucked out with my APUSH teacher, he tried his best to cover everything as equally as he could. He was even better as a Modern History teacher the year after. I do wish we covered Wars a bit more indepth in APUSH though, because we did the actual War part of the Civil War in like a day, too fast tbh for something of its scale and impact.[/QUOTE] Yeah same here, we covered maybe two major battles in an hour and suddenly we dove into the reconstruction era which was also a shit load because this heavily connected with the politics during the gilded age. But the curriculum is a political and social history course, not a whole lot to discuss about the wars here.
[QUOTE=Breezeep;48053818]Jesus Fuck, this whole controversy is getting stuppider and stuppider every day now.[/QUOTE] it's so stuppid, i agree
I'm still waiting for society to shun people that do stupid things. Like on a you-can't-even-get-a-job level. This isn't a case for the government, this is a case for us as people to establish that you're not gonna get by in life doing dumb things.
[QUOTE=ExplosiveCheese;48053668]Please, my APUSH exam (and course) failed to include anything relating to war history other than what a couple of political chuckle-fucks did while it raged on, especially the second world war.[/QUOTE] I remember my APUSH class focused heavily on pre-Civil War and the Civil War itself. So much so that I took an US History II class in college because I wanted to cover stuff after the Civil War more.
[QUOTE=Sonador;48053865]I'm still waiting for society to shun people that do stupid things. Like on a you-can't-even-get-a-job level. This isn't a case for the government, this is a case for us as people to establish that you're not gonna get by in life doing dumb things.[/QUOTE] I too, agree that people who have social and political disagreements with me should be denied a job and a livelihood by the entirety of society and forced to spend their life in crippling poverty. After all, they do stupid things!
I uh... kinda meant to throw in a "Confederate Flag" in the title... oops
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48053606]Not glorifying a racist failed state whose symbol is often used by racists groups today =/= purging history.[/QUOTE] Ah, yes, this is what we need to get up in arms about. By selling confederate merchandise they're glorifying a racist group somehow. And do tell me, what do we solve by ridding the app store of anything having to do with Confederate imagery including civil war games? Or taking down statues, or making stores stop selling flags, or doing any of that? It doesn't solve anything. It doesn't do anything to racism. A bigoted shithead from the South is still going to be a bigoted shithead from the south slightly inconvenienced. It's a complete waste of our fucking time.
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;48053616]But some of the stuff just had confederate flags -AND UNION FLAGS-. There's stuff like mugs that have the two crossed saying "Gettysburg". Crying whenever there's a confederate flag and just trying to shove it off in the corner and pretend it never happened will only give it more power and influence and will continue to make it lucrative to people like Roof.[/QUOTE] The complaint specifically said merchandise that had "Just the Confederate flag".
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;48054081]Ah, yes, this is what we need to get up in arms about. By selling confederate merchandise they're glorifying a racist group somehow. And do tell me, what do we solve by ridding the app store of anything having to do with Confederate imagery including civil war games? Or taking down statues, or making stores stop selling flags, or doing any of that? It doesn't solve anything. It doesn't do anything to racism. A bigoted shithead from the South is still going to be a bigoted shithead from the south slightly inconvenienced. It's a complete waste of our fucking time.[/QUOTE] Granted, there are a lot of pointless PR-grabs regarding this that dont make much sense, but not commercializing and glorifying the confederate flag, which has readily apparent connotations to slavery and racism, is totally fine. Selling confederate flags, flying them above or near government institutions, etc., projects a message of casual racism and further institutionalizes it.
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48053606]Not glorifying a racist failed state whose symbol is often used by racists groups today =/= purging history.[/QUOTE] Having reminders of something historically significant is not the same as glorifying something. It's not purging history, but it is whitewashing it by hiding it away.
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;48054130]Having reminders of something historically significant is not the same as glorifying something. It's not purging history, but it is whitewashing it by hiding it away.[/QUOTE] It's not like the flag is being wiped from existence. It's probably not even going to be removed from museums, history textbooks, classrooms, etc. If it gets to that point, then sure, we have an issue.
[QUOTE=Duck M.;48054156]It's not like the flag is being wiped from existence. It's probably not even going to be removed from museums, history textbooks, classrooms, etc. If it gets to that point, then sure, we have an issue.[/QUOTE] People have the right to wear the Confederate Flag as a belt buckle, that's covered under Free Speech. They also have the right to fly it from their homes. I may disagree with it, but that's their god damn right. Stores and marketplaces don't want to stock things with the Confederate Flag? Fine, their choice, but people will just find other places to get their tacky Confederate Merchandise. Welcome to the US, where rights [I]don't[/I] end where your feelings begin. The only real issue was the institutions of the US Government were flying a flag of a DEFEATED GOVERNMENT THAT WAS IN DIRECT OPPOSITION TO US. That should have been the end of it.
The most famous battle site of the American Civil War is the last place the Rebel flag needs to be pulled from.
[QUOTE=bdd458;48054185]People have the right to wear the Confederate Flag as a belt buckle, that's covered under Free Speech. They also have the right to fly it from their homes. I may disagree with it, but that's their god damn right. Stores and marketplaces don't want to stock things with the Confederate Flag? Fine, their choice, but people will just find other places to get their tacky Confederate Merchandise. [/QUOTE] And that is totally fine. People seem to have an issue with stores and marketplaces not wanting to sell things with the confederate flag on it, though.
[QUOTE=Duck M.;48054207]And that is totally fine. People seem to have an issue with stores and marketplaces not wanting to sell things with the confederate flag on it, though.[/QUOTE] Because it's a knee-jerk reaction to what happened, and it's accomplishing nothing other than pissing people off.
I've been lightly following this whole thing to do with the confederate flag and history being removed and i don't really get it. It honestly seems to me like a textbook definition of a diversion or a scapegoat. I get like the general idea behind it but it seems like in the long run even if remnants of the confederacy history were buried it'd do absolutely nothing to combat racism. Like someone suggested this and everyone hopped on thinking if we remove these symbols we'll somehow end racism? It'll 'help' but like so minorly at the expense of stripping history. Like slacktivism i feel, people hopped on this as a bandwagon and think by doing this they can pat themselves on the back for 'making a difference'
[QUOTE=bdd458;48054236]Because it's a knee-jerk reaction to what happened, and it's accomplishing nothing other than pissing people off.[/QUOTE] But they have the right to do it, just like people have the right to fly the confederate flag from their homes-as much as either of us disagree with either of these actions. [QUOTE=Viva;48054247]I've been lightly following this whole thing to do with the confederate flag and history being removed and i don't really get it. It honestly seems to me like a textbook definition of a diversion or a scapegoat. I get like the general idea behind it but it seems like in the long run even if remnants of the confederacy history were buried it'd do absolutely nothing to combat racism. Like someone suggested this and everyone hopped on thinking if we remove these symbols we'll somehow end racism? It'll 'help' but like so minorly at the expense of stripping history. Like slacktivism i feel, people hopped on this as a bandwagon and think by doing this they can pat themselves on the back for 'making a difference'[/QUOTE] In my opinion, people's objections to others flying the confederate flag isn't "stripping history". I could go open up an AP USH textbook right now and read about the confederacy and the civil war, and in five years, I will also be able to read about the confederacy and the civil war, regardless of what sort of acts of racism or terrorism are committed that are lightly, directly, or tangentially related to the confederacy or their flag. The history of the civil war will not be erased because of reactionary activism.
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