Donald Trump overtakes Hillary Clinton for first time since May in ABC poll
406 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51295466]It seems childish because it is
Seriously, look at him, just after the attention. Dont give him what he desires to get by voting for Trump[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295465]Nah. It's nice watching incredibly pretentious people get incredibly upset at the thought that SOMEONE MIGHT HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295465]Nah. It's nice watching incredibly pretentious people get incredibly upset at the thought that SOMEONE MIGHT HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION.
Seriously, you're all talking theoretically about how stupid and ignorant Trump supporters are. Yet here I am, an actual Trump supporter replying to you people, but instead all 5 or 6 of you are just fluffing each other of in your little hug box. The lack of self awareness here is unreal.[/QUOTE]
Literally all you just said applies to yourself and your "hug box" group of people. (stupid fucking term btw)
Your lack of self awareness is, ironically, unreal.
[QUOTE=BelatedGamer;51295311]I guess this is just a matter of opinion because it can't be proven, but here it is;
The majority of people voting Trump aren't angry, they just don't understand or follow politics at all. They just hear a rough outline of what his policies are, listen to some interviews with him and think "Yeah, America DOES need to be great again. He says it'll be great again, I knew who he was before this election even started, so he must be everything he's cracked up to be."
Because most people don't follow elections very well, they don't think about actual policies very much. They just hear some words and think they sound good. They don't think Trump is going to end the two party system or whatever, because if they knew politics enough to have a strong opinion on the electoral system they would know that electing him is very unlikely to do that.
And it's not stupidity, it's laziness.
Maybe I'm not giving people enough credit, but the vast majority of people I've spoken or listened to only barely know what the hell they're talking about, they just know the basics.
This by and large can apply to most Hillary voters too, obviously, and I'm not trying to present this as a fact, just the way I see it.[/QUOTE]
You sorta right but it is not a complete list. Here is a break down of Trump Supporters:
Always Republican. Never Democrat.
Gun Rights advocates.'
Trolls. Those who are doing for the lulz.
Swing voters who are in a blind nihilistic rage kamikaze revenge mode. They see Trump as the fuck you vote to a system (and those who own it) thats has constantly ignored them and fucked them over. They believe they tried their best to fix the system in previous elections and their efforts have failed. This is reason they think the system is beyond repair. They see Trump as their chance to burn it down so they can start anew.
There are those who see Trump as an agent of Chaos. So they are voting for him because they know he will force change. They dont care if this change is good or bad, as long things are forced to change.
Those who believe Trump is the lesser of the evils. They are aware how shit Trump is. They believe Hillary is shittier. They believe getting Trump elected is a vote against systemic corruption. Yes they are aware is his own brand of crook. They prefer his brand of crook over what brand of crook Clinton is.
Those who believe that Trump is a buffoon and will be contained by the other branches of government. So he will be a sitting duck. They believe he will cause the least amount of damage vs Clinton.
Those who are afraid Clinton is trying to take over and become dictator. Conspiracy theorist types whose paranoia is being fed by the scandal factory known as Clinton.
People who believe the left is pursuing white genocide. That or the left is destroying the Christian faith.
Anti SJWs who had enough of the hysterics and abuse of the political correctness crowd.
Scott Adams is one who explains this view.
[url]http://blog.dilbert.com/post/152293480726/the-bully-party[/url]
Actual white nationalists, fascists, white supremacists, Nazis and bigots.
Anti globalists.
People who want better border and immigration control.
Disgruntled Bernie supporters.
People who believe in Trump's rhetoric and narrative built up around him. They believe genuinely he is out to fight corruption. They are ignorant of how bad Trump is in his own right. Or they are willfully ignorant.
Veterans. People who served in the military understand how important OPSEC is. Due to Clinton's mis handling of the emails, they are afraid of her incompetence. Leaking of classified information leads to people dying.
People who are afraid of Clinton will try to go to war with Russia.
People who are impressed by how many people are against him. This picture show this view perfectly. [url=https://postimg.org/image/454ir7pjh/][img]https://s14.postimg.org/454ir7pjh/trumpgun.jpg[/img][/url] They feel if he is hated by everyone, he must be doing something right. Him being surrounded proves to them Trump is on their side.
Cynical democratic supporters. They believe by voting in Trump, it will destroy the GOP for good. Thus ensuring Democratic dominance for an infinite term.
As you pointed out and yes lazy people. I say some are not lazy but unsophisticated. I have a blood relative who believes how bold he speaks "proves" he is sincere and truthful. She a bit naive. She is one of those bless her heart types. Good person, just not deep in the know of well a lot of things.
I hope that covers them all. This is what I have seen.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295465]Nah. It's nice watching incredibly pretentious people get incredibly upset at the thought that SOMEONE MIGHT HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION.
Seriously, you're all talking theoretically about how stupid and ignorant Trump supporters are. Yet here I am, an actual Trump supporter replying to you people, but instead all 5 or 6 of you are just fluffing each other of in your little hug box. The lack of self awareness here is unreal.[/QUOTE]You also haven't put forth any arguments so what else are they to do
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295465]Nah. It's nice watching incredibly pretentious people get incredibly upset at the thought that SOMEONE MIGHT HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION.
Seriously, you're all talking theoretically about how stupid and ignorant Trump supporters are. Yet here I am, an actual Trump supporter replying to you people, but instead all 5 or 6 of you are just fluffing each other of in your little hug box. The lack of self awareness here is unreal.[/QUOTE]
lmao you Trumpsters are beyond a joke
Whenever asked to give a valid defense of your turd of a candidate you hide with your heads in the sand and ignore any criticism made against him, you don't even have the self awareness to admit this criticism and accept it for what it is instead of dismissing it out of hand. Nobody needs to make anything up about Donald Trump because he's literally an Onion parody of a presidential candidate, and a criminal to boot, and is literally the worst candidate on offer since the Know-Nothings.
We've nothing against people having a different opinion as long as they can accept criticism of it and can properly support their ideals, and we're also trying to make you understand that maybe Trump's not such a good idea as president after all. It's a forum, everybody's entitled to their opinions, but we're also entitled to criticize your opinions for being objectively shitty.
Man this is the election where the next president might actually get shot midterm by a disgruntled person that could be from both parties. I don't think this has happened before.
That'll be something to hopefully not read about.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295465]Nah. It's nice watching incredibly pretentious people get incredibly upset at the thought that SOMEONE MIGHT HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION.
Seriously, you're all talking theoretically about how stupid and ignorant Trump supporters are. Yet here I am, an actual Trump supporter replying to you people, but instead all 5 or 6 of you are just fluffing each other of in your little hug box. The lack of self awareness here is unreal.[/QUOTE]
I don't see how any rational, sane, fair human can listen to the rhetoric that Trump preaches and come to the conclusion that he's in any way fit to be a leader, but then again I've never really understood the vast majority of humans and the short sighted decisions they make.
I hope with every ounce of my being that you're right in your support of that man, because if you're wrong and if he gets elected then the entire world -- not just America -- has a bloody long road ahead of them.
[QUOTE=Guriosity;51295477]Snip[/QUOTE]
Oh I'm not saying those people don't exist, just what I think the majority of voters are like from my experience and inference.
God damn if that Scott Adams article wasn't the most hypocritical blood-boiling thing that I've ever read in my life though. Just. Ugh.
Legitimate question; are you voting? If you've mentioned it before I haven't noticed. Just curious.
[QUOTE=Blizzerd;51295453]You should hold these people in higher regard... you are underestimating the opponent you have and disenfranchising the people your opponent needs to sway.[/QUOTE]
theres no point lol
theres no swaying people who watched the republican elections and thought trump won because he was pulling out insults & zingers. cruz & rubio spent every debate correcting his idiocy, giving actual comprehensive policies & substantive answers that i personally disagree but respect, and they were still shafted because it was already decided he was the candidate cause he was flashy.
holding people that sees a human being like a religious messiah on higher regards will do nothing for me so why should i? they'll just go back to their 4chan /pol/ threads and spam more memes than care about any conflicting opinions seriously so there's no point
like i said, my family and i will be fine regardless of whose president but it'll be a tragedy to both minorities who'll be screwed and to the trump supporter once s/he realizes nothing has changed
[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;51295487]lmao you Trumpsters are beyond a joke
Whenever asked to give a valid defense of your turd of a candidate you hide with your heads in the sand and ignore any criticism made against him, you don't even have the self awareness to admit this criticism and accept it for what it is instead of dismissing it out of hand. Nobody needs to make anything up about Donald Trump because he's literally an Onion parody of a presidential candidate, and a criminal to boot, and is literally the worst candidate on offer since the Know-Nothings.
We've nothing against people having a different opinion as long as they can accept criticism of it and can properly support their ideals, and we're also trying to make you understand that maybe Trump's not such a good idea as president after all. It's a forum, everybody's entitled to their opinions, but we're also entitled to criticize your opinions for being objectively shitty.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;51295478]You also haven't put forth any arguments so what else are they to do[/QUOTE]
Literally no one asked for a reason, BUT if you look at page 4 of this thread you can see where i gave some reasons why i like Trump. Instead you all start flaming about how I'm just one of those darn stupid conservatives. How tolerant of you too accept my opinion and already jump to conclusions about me before I can even give a response, totally not pretentious at all.
Edit: I couldn't quote you all but you know who you are.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295504]Literally no one asked for a reason, BUT if you look at page 4 of this thread you can see where i gave some reasons why i like Trump. Instead you all start flaming about how I'm just one of those darn stupid conservatives. How tolerant of you too accept my opinion and already jump to conclusions about me before I can even give a response, totally not pretentious at all.[/QUOTE]
The issue is that you jump at reasonable people call them "pretentious" for seeing the very real madness in this presidential election.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295504]Literally no one asked for a reason, BUT if you look at page 4 of this thread you can see where i gave some reasons why i like Trump. Instead you all start flaming about how I'm just one of those darn stupid conservatives. How tolerant of you too accept my opinion and already jump to conclusions about me before I can even give a response, totally not pretentious at all.[/QUOTE]
tbh you could have put that in your post mate
That being said, he does have a point. Instead of actually arguing it's more like "You're a fucking twat, fuck you and the beliefs you hold" back and forth. That's the kinda stuff that put us in this mess in the first place.
[QUOTE=paul simon;51295510]The issue is that you jump at reasonable people call them "pretentious" for seeing the very real madness in this presidential election.[/QUOTE]
I've been reading this thread since it started. I posted early on why I liked Trump. No one replied, everyone just kept going on and on about how stupid Trump supporters are. I'm not jumping to conclusions. I'm making conclusions on what I've seen on this site and in this thread specifically. In one word, pretentious
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295504]Literally no one asked for a reason, BUT if you look at page 4 of this thread you can see where i gave some reasons why i like Trump. Instead you all start flaming about how I'm just one of those darn stupid conservatives. How tolerant of you too accept my opinion and already jump to conclusions about me before I can even give a response, totally not pretentious at all.
Edit: I couldn't quote you all but you know who you are.[/QUOTE]
You mean page 5?
I'm curious as to why illegal immigrants matter to people so much? I mean every government haemorrhages money in a countless number of ways; what effect does that have on you at a personal level? If you're gonna go down the list of ways that the United States government loses/wastes money I can almost guarantee you that illegal immigrants are not at the top of the list, and if you're to try to tackle that list in any kind of sensible manner you should be going from the top down.
[QUOTE=BelatedGamer;51295498]Oh I'm not saying those people don't exist, just what I think the majority of voters are like from my experience and inference.
God damn if that Scott Adams article wasn't the most hypocritical blood-boiling thing that I've ever read in my life though. Just. Ugh.
Legitimate question; are you voting? If you've mentioned it before I haven't noticed. Just curious.[/QUOTE]
I voted for green party.
[QUOTE=Guriosity;51295525]I voted for green party.[/QUOTE]
Thanks, that's what I figured.
[QUOTE=sltungle;51295522]You mean page 5?
I'm curious as to why illegal immigrants matter to people so much? I mean every government haemorrhages money in a countless number of ways; what effect does that have on you at a personal level? If you're gonna go down the list of ways that the United States government loses/wastes money I can almost guarantee you that illegal immigrants are not at the top of the list, and if you're to try to tackle that list in any kind of sensible manner you should be going from the top down.[/QUOTE]
Its a security/safety thing
If a mexican in a 1990's pickup truck/whatever can sneak in, how easy can a terrorist/whatever with a truck bomb sneak in? Plus, it's just nice to know our borders are safe and regulated.
It effects us personal because taxes. People gotta pay to keep them alive/around/whatever with the welfare payments and the food stamps and the other parts of government based welfarre that I don't exactly recall right now cause it's like 2 in the morning. And since they don't want to leave and we don't 'care' for them, it's kinda like this demon question in politics.
Its sort of like you and the Austrialian boat people thing
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295514]I've been reading this thread since it started. I posted early on why I liked Trump. No one replied, everyone just kept going on and on about how stupid Trump supporters are. I'm not jumping to conclusions. I'm making conclusions on what I've seen on this site and in this thread specifically. In one word, pretentious[/QUOTE]
I mean, if you're thinking Facepunch is pretentious, you could you know - stop posting.
[QUOTE=sltungle;51295522]You mean page 5?
I'm curious as to why illegal immigrants matter to people so much? I mean every government haemorrhages money in a countless number of ways; what effect does that have on you at a personal level? If you're gonna go down the list of ways that the United States government loses/wastes money I can almost guarantee you that illegal immigrants are not at the top of the list, and if you're to try to tackle that list in any kind of sensible manner you should be going from the top down.[/QUOTE]
I live in California (Don't ask why my flag is Canadian, I don't know why either). We have the highest state taxes in order to pay for these illegals. My state alone pays (I think) $20 billion in services out of tax money I pay. Illegals and the children of illegals commit the majority of the crime in my state. I have lost a lot of my friends to drugs because of how easy it is to access them from people who cross the border. Two of those friends got drugs from illegals directly. Almost everywhere I go it feels like a different country because of the lack of people who actually speak English. I'm not just talking about Mexicans either, Vietnamese and Chinese are just, if not more, common to hear than Spanish. Whether or not you think those are valid reasons is not my concern, those are my reasons. And anyone who will actually do something about closing our border and deporting these people will get my support.
[QUOTE=gufu;51295537]I mean, if you're thinking Facepunch is pretentious, you could you know - stop posting.[/QUOTE]
I think if we enforced that we would see numbers drop in SH and GD by like half
[QUOTE=gufu;51295537]I mean, if you're thinking Facepunch is pretentious, you could you know - stop posting.[/QUOTE]
In the age of irony? Never.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295538]I live in California (Don't ask why my flag is Canadian, I don't know why either). We have the highest state taxes in order to pay for these illegals. My state alone pays (I think) $20 billion in services out of tax money I pay. Illegals and the children of illegals commit the majority of the crime in my state. I have lost a lot of my friends to drugs because of how easy it is to access them from people who cross the border. Two of those friends got drugs from illegals directly. Almost everywhere I go it feels like a different country because of the lack of people who actually speak English. I'm not just talking about Mexicans either, Vietnamese and Chinese are just, if not more, common to hear than Spanish. Whether or not you think those are valid reasons is not my concern, those are my reasons. And anyone who will actually do something about closing our border and deporting these people will get my support.[/QUOTE]
Ah yes, immigration, the most American thing there is. Let's shut it down.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295504]Literally no one asked for a reason, BUT if you look at page 4 of this thread you can see where i gave some reasons why i like Trump. Instead you all start flaming about how I'm just one of those darn stupid conservatives. How tolerant of you too accept my opinion and already jump to conclusions about me before I can even give a response, totally not pretentious at all.
Edit: I couldn't quote you all but you know who you are.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51294823]His strong stance on illegal immigration. The amount of illegals that come in to this country is atrocious. It cost the federal and state governments $110 BILLION a year in services to "take care" of these people who shouldn't even be here in the first place. And no, they do not pay in taxes more than they take out.
Also his strong stance on trade. Free trade has done nothing but hurt American workers because of countries like China, Vietnam, Mexico, and other countries that have significantly less regulations and workers rights than the US does that make the cost of labor so cheap we can't even compete.
I'm a conservative as well so stuff like his stance on guns, abortion, and all that I like.[/QUOTE]
Ok then let's pick this apart;
[t]https://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/P1-BW199_ILLEGA_16U_20160208174809.jpg[/t]
Taking one state as an example we were looking at the loss of 3% GDP because of illegal immigrants and a total savings of maybe 500 million. This 3% when translated to numbers equals to 7.5 billion US$. So there's a net deficit of 7 billion gone, and so much for that.
[url]https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/cutting-immigration-myths-down-size[/url]
please read this and then tell me more about the myth of illegal immigrants swarming into america in enormous numbers.
As for your argument against free trade, it's again propped up on myths that bilateral agreements are making Americans lose money and jobs. Many companies rely on free trade simply to keep the balance books in order. If you think the American auto industry, for example, has it bad now, you've got another thing coming when the trade deals get torn up. Donald Trump, being a businessman through and through, will think nothing of continuing to exploit loopholes for his own benefit, such as cutting taxes for big businesses so that even less money ends up in the state treasury. He wants to appoint himself as representative for trade of the US, which is an even funnier joke considering he made less money as a businessman than if he'd have just let every cent lie collecting interest in a bank.
Try again.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295538]I live in California (Don't ask why my flag is Canadian, I don't know why either). We have the highest state taxes in order to pay for these illegals. My state alone pays (I think) $20 billion in services out of tax money I pay. Illegals and the children of illegals commit the majority of the crime in my state. I have lost a lot of my friends to drugs because of how easy it is to access them from people who cross the border. Two of those friends got drugs from illegals directly. Almost everywhere I go it feels like a different country because of the lack of people who actually speak English. I'm not just talking about Mexicans either, Vietnamese and Chinese are just, if not more, common to hear than Spanish. Whether or not you think those are valid reasons is not my concern, those are my reasons. And anyone who will actually do something about closing our border and deporting these people will get my support.[/QUOTE]
Okay I won't ignore your reasons, I appreciate you're giving some.
Now please answer me this; what about Trump's anti-immigration policies specifically are attractive to you?
[QUOTE=King Tiger;51293605]Lol Nate Bronze is melting down on Twitter posting all sorts of weird crap. He was totally wrong about Trump in the primaries and he's going to be wrong here. Him and his organization are an embarrassment now.[/QUOTE]
Maybe if you people ever bothered to read the "weird crap" Nate Silver posts people would known that they layed out Trump could win weeks ago, 10% is not zero percent.
And even if we accept the whole "migrant hordes are swarming the US and ruining it" narrative. His solutions really aren't there. At his most radical we have the incredibly fucking expensive and impractical border wall and an unprecedented mass deportation with a plethora of logistics and humanitarian issues, and at his softest (he's flip flopped on this at times) it's much like the mainstream Republican's views, like Jeb's. And in that case, prepare to complain as feel-good measures are put in like Bush's border fence, without actually solving the "problem."
[QUOTE=Saxon;51295560]Maybe if you people ever bothered to read the "weird crap" Nate Silver posts people would known that they layed out Trump could win weeks ago, 10% is not zero percent.[/QUOTE]
His statement on how anxious people should be on a scale of 1-10 is pretty truthful. He said hillary voters should be at a 4, and trump voters a 7 or so. Hillary supporters shouldn't be complacent, and Trump supporters should be very worried but not totally despondent.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51294823]His strong stance on illegal immigration. The amount of illegals that come in to this country is atrocious. It cost the federal and state governments $110 BILLION a year in services to "take care" of these people who shouldn't even be here in the first place. And no, they do not pay in taxes more than they take out.[/quote]
Source please.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51294823]Also his strong stance on trade. Free trade has done nothing but hurt American workers because of countries like China, Vietnam, Mexico, and other countries that have significantly less regulations and workers rights than the US does that make the cost of labor so cheap we can't even compete.[/quote]
Free trade is literally the most American thing ever. You goddamn godless commie. Also, those jobs wouldn't come back even if minimum wage and OSHA were simply gone - there is no good reason for manufacturing to come back to US, it's too much investment for what already can be achieved in the listed countries. US needs to work out an alternative to their population, because current service-based economy is not sustainable.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51294823]I'm a conservative as well so stuff like his stance on guns[/quote]
He's gonna claim that people are terrorist and take their guns away. Democratic president will do absolutely nothing to guns at all, except generate some scare waves to make things more expensive for a week or two. All anti-gun legislations that have been whined about are state-side, so if you want them changed, take it to your local Senator and Representatives - don't expect a President, of all people, to do anything.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51294823]abortion[/quote]
Unless you're a woman, that's not even relevant to you.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51295465]Nah. It's nice watching incredibly pretentious people get incredibly upset at the thought that SOMEONE MIGHT HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION.
Seriously, you're all talking theoretically about how stupid and ignorant Trump supporters are. Yet here I am, an actual Trump supporter replying to you people, but instead all 5 or 6 of you are just fluffing each other of in your little hug box. The lack of self awareness here is unreal.[/QUOTE]
It's good to have differing opinions.
Just some opinions are objectively worse than others.
And in this election cycle, supporting Trump is objectively worse than supporting Clinton.
[QUOTE=paul simon;51295551]Ah yes, immigration, the most American thing there is. Let's shut it down.[/QUOTE]
Easy there paul, you read that too fast. This is a slow reading zone.
If you read it again, you would see ILLEGAL immigrants in that first line. Something that should be shut down.
Huddled masses yearning to break free can go through naturalization and integration. It's the American thing to do. Einstein and Telsa did it. My grandfather did it. Heck, even my old neighbors did it, and they're from Tunisia for crying out loud. It's not hard to go through with this stuff.
[QUOTE=Komodoh;51294823]His strong stance on illegal immigration. The amount of illegals that come in to this country is atrocious. It cost the federal and state governments $110 BILLION a year in services to "take care" of these people who shouldn't even be here in the first place. And no, they do not pay in taxes more than they take out.
.[/QUOTE]
source pls
Illegal immigrants pay income tax but don't collect social security, like why do you go on the internet just to lie to people?
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.