• US Soldier 'Kills 16' Afghans In Their Homes
    134 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Motherfuckers;35099005]Of course. I'm not even American. Thank god (also ironic I'm not even religious)[/QUOTE] Im not American either, but you dont see me shitting on the country and it's people. Grow up.
[QUOTE=ashton93;35099230]Im not American either, but you dont see me shitting on the country and it's people. Grow up.[/QUOTE] Oh now hey it isn't funny to shit on people online you should go over to their country and shoot them in person :patriot:
It would be better if we knew more about the guy. My assumption is this wasn't his first deployment, suffered from PTSD, and snapped.
[QUOTE=Motherfuckers;35099005]Of course. I'm not even American. Thank god (also ironic I'm not even religious)[/QUOTE] Oh man, you're so ~edgy~
Yeah, it's time to leave. Those people are never going to forgive us for the shit that happened THIS YEAR, let alone the rest of the war. Revenge is a driving factor of life for Afghans, they hold grudges over generations.
[QUOTE=Scot;35091661]And Americans wonder why the middle east hate them so much.[/QUOTE] they shouldn't, it's far from a mystery.
[QUOTE=ashton93;35099230]Im not American either, but you dont see me shitting on the country and it's people. Grow up.[/QUOTE] After a while, it comes to a point where it's difficult to expect anything less. [editline]12th March 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=UncleJimmema;35100455]It would be better if we knew more about the guy. My assumption is this wasn't his first deployment, suffered from PTSD, and snapped.[/QUOTE] Seems like you people are trying to justify it.
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35100749]After a while, it comes to a point where it's difficult to expect anything less. [editline]12th March 2012[/editline] Seems like you people are trying to justify it.[/QUOTE] I don't think anyone is trying to find justification, only a reason for why it happened.
[QUOTE=Motherfuckers;35099005]Of course. I'm not even American. Thank god (also ironic I'm not even religious)[/QUOTE] You give both demographics a bad name.
[QUOTE=Deadman123;35093553]This is terrible. Like Led Zeppelin said, we need more psychological screening in the military.[/QUOTE] which song was that in
[QUOTE=Tony;35094204]Am I the only one who is pissed off by this? (quote from BBC): Karzai is such an idiot, unforgivable? Yeah it's really terrible that this happened, but to not be able to forgive the US because of the actions of *one* of its soldiers, who did this for purely psychological reasons, is stupid and really ignorant. Surely Karzai realises that not all US troops are like this. What sort of explanation does he want anyway? One man had some sort of mental breakdown and went on a shooting spree. There's not a whole lot more to it, other than maybe finding out more about the soldier's past and then scrutinising the way mental health is dealt with in the armed forces.[/QUOTE] You know it's not the first time afghan civilians were killed intentionally... There is no good reason at all to be staying in Afghanistan for another 2 or more years. The sooner the better.
He killed 16 people, deranged or not this is a fucking disgusting crime. [QUOTE]It would be better if we knew more about the guy. My assumption is this wasn't his first deployment, suffered from PTSD, and snapped.[/QUOTE] I [I]really [/I]doubt you'll say that when these dudes retaliate and kill a bunch of our soldiers.
[QUOTE=DaysBefore;35100510]Oh man, you're so ~edgy~[/QUOTE] [img]http://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-jerkbag.gif[/img] You sure showed me.
[QUOTE=Tony;35094204]Am I the only one who is pissed off by this? (quote from BBC): Karzai is such an idiot, unforgivable? Yeah it's really terrible that this happened, but to not be able to forgive the US because of the actions of *one* of its soldiers, who did this for purely psychological reasons, is stupid and really ignorant. Surely Karzai realises that not all US troops are like this. What sort of explanation does he want anyway? One man had some sort of mental breakdown and went on a shooting spree. There's not a whole lot more to it, other than maybe finding out more about the soldier's past and then scrutinising the way mental health is dealt with in the armed forces.[/QUOTE] yeah you're right how dare he demand an explanation for why a nation that supposedly has the most modern and well trained army in the world fielded someone who was clearly deranged and then killed 16 of his countrymen. maybe if the US properly screened it's soldiers and gave them proper mental health care and didn't just send any high school drop out to war this kind of thing wouldn't happen.
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35100749]After a while, it comes to a point where it's difficult to expect anything less. [editline]12th March 2012[/editline] Seems like you people are trying to justify it.[/QUOTE] What's wrong with speculating a reason to it? I'm going to guess you have 0 background in mental health which is why you said that. Also we do a pretty fine job with our service members. Before we send them overseas we do deployment health screenings, also we have various support groups for our service members.
[QUOTE=Pirate Ninja;35091406]I do hope this man was just a psychopath and not so disturbed by what he has seen while on service that he was driven to do this, either way it's incredibly tragic.[/QUOTE] Disturbed? People have been seeing others die since the beginning. To think the 'horrors' he saw would drive him to just slaughter sixteen people is insanely stupid, not a valid excuse for what happened. There is screening in place to weed out the people who would break that much under pressure. He even made it to staff sergeant, you don't get there by snapping or suffering from extreme PTSD.
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35100749]After a while, it comes to a point where it's difficult to expect anything less. [editline]12th March 2012[/editline] Seems like you people are trying to justify it.[/QUOTE] Justifying and clarifying are two different things. [editline]11th March 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Gundevil;35102017]Disturbed? People have been seeing others die since the beginning. To think the 'horrors' he saw would drive him to just slaughter sixteen people is insanely stupid, not a valid excuse for what happened. There is screening in place to weed out the people who would break that much under pressure. He even made it to staff sergeant, you don't get there by snapping or suffering from extreme PTSD.[/QUOTE] You don't know war, and also you don't know about screening. How combat affects people isn't really seen until you're in combat yourself. Just because you've made it through a battle doesn't mean you'll react the same on the next. Watch the mini series The Pacific. You see a Marine Gunnery Sergeant who made it through WWI and fought in WWII completely break down and come apart in the middle of a battle.
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;35102103]Justifying and clarifying are two different things. [editline]11th March 2012[/editline] You don't know war, and also you don't know about screening. How combat affects people isn't really seen until you're in combat yourself. Just because you've made it through a battle doesn't mean you'll react the same on the next. Watch the mini series The Pacific. You see a Marine Gunnery Sergeant who made it through WWI and fought in WWII completely break down and come apart in the middle of a battle.[/QUOTE] Nevertheless, he should be jailed to the full extent.
[QUOTE=Sickle;35102535]Nevertheless, he should be jailed to the full extent.[/QUOTE] And receive the treatment he needs.
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;35102778]And receive the treatment he needs.[/QUOTE] Treatment? The man hasn't yet to be identified, and we know nothing of his motives or background yet. Let the story finish before zooming to conclusions.
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;35102778]And receive the treatment he needs.[/QUOTE] If that is the case, of course. But we cannot allow the murder of 16 people go without some form of justice. If treatment is needed, he shall receive it, but at the same time should be punished as any other mass murderer would be.
This morning on the newspaper they reported that one of the villagers by the name of Agha Lala told, that it was not one soldier but infact a group of soldiers who might have been drunk.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;35091416]I have to wonder what drives these people to do this. I mean it's one thing if some psycho snaps and kills a bunch of people in his 2nd year of service, but this guy must've been serving for like 10 years to reach where he is.[/QUOTE] Might be just me, but I think you have as much chance of flipping out at your first years of service than as your last ones. Maybe he just had more and more pressure building up, wasn't very mentally stable in the first place (pretty sure there's a minority of people joining the army just for the thrill of having the ability to kill someone as easily as pulling a trigger), and eventually snapped out. I'd guess you can flip out at the beginning of a career because you can't handle the pressure, and that you can flip out a bit later on because you can't handle it anymore. [editline]12th March 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Falchion;35104034]This morning on the newspaper they reported that one of the villagers by the name of Agha Lala told, that it was not one soldier but infact a group of soldiers who might have been drunk.[/QUOTE] Well that does explain a part of it. Just a part though, I don't think the urge of killing people is a general consequence of drinking but I may be wrong.
[QUOTE=Falchion;35104034]This morning on the newspaper they reported that one of the villagers by the name of Agha Lala told, that it was not one soldier but infact a group of soldiers who might have been drunk.[/QUOTE] My dad speculated that it was a group of drunk soldiers, it makes sense since it's kinda hard to kill 16 people on your own.
[QUOTE=Sickle;35104269]My dad speculated that it was a group of drunk soldiers, it makes sense since it's kinda hard to kill 16 people on your own.[/QUOTE] Not if they're intimidated unarmed civilians.
[QUOTE=InvaderNouga;35102011]What's wrong with speculating a reason to it? I'm going to guess you have 0 background in mental health which is why you said that. Also we do a pretty fine job with our service members. Before we send them overseas we do deployment health screenings, also we have various support groups for our service members.[/QUOTE] You say the military does a pretty fine job, but the fact that soldiers have such serious mental issues before and after, shows that is not true. [editline]12th March 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=UncleJimmema;35102103]You don't know war[/quote] Neither do you, so you can't act like you know him more. [quote]and also you don't know about screening. How combat affects people isn't really seen until you're in combat yourself. Just because you've made it through a battle doesn't mean you'll react the same on the next. Watch the mini series The Pacific. You see a Marine Gunnery Sergeant who made it through WWI and fought in WWII completely break down and come apart in the middle of a battle.[/QUOTE] Thanks for telling us that PTSD exists, that really helps And that was in fucking WW2, mid-battle. Afghanistan isn't the pacific, so you can't compare the two.
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;35104066]Well that does explain a part of it. Just a part though, I don't think the urge of killing people is a general consequence of drinking but I may be wrong.[/QUOTE] Well, all alcohol really does is lower inhibitions a lot. I'd say it's pretty likely to be alcohol coupled with underlying mental issues. Even if booze wasn't involved, you kinda need to be crazy to pull shit like this.
[QUOTE=Falchion;35094340]So you don't have the decency to atleast understand Karzai but instead you go on the offensive and "get pissed"?[/QUOTE] Understand Karzai? What is there to understand with regards to this situation? If he wants serious progress in the region then he needs to admit it's an isolated incident, the first of it's kind in 10 or so years. [QUOTE=Noble;35094365]He won't look good to the people if he admits right away that it's an isolated incident by one man, so he has to pretend to support the outraged people's anti-USA mentality for a while for political reasons (so people think he's on their side and he retains support).[/QUOTE] Exactly this. It's time to get out of Afghanistan I think. If we do, shit like this won't happen, and the Afghani government/military which is losing patience with the coalition forces will be happy, and we'll be happy because we saved billions of dollars and hundreds of our own coalition lives. They want to pretend they're losing patience after stuff like this happens, then lets leave and see how they enjoy the Taliban being back in power. Yeah, like I said before, it's shit that stuff like this happens, but with a deployment of 150k troops for 10+ years it's not exactly surprising, and it's certainly not a reason to lose faith in an entire nation's armed forces just because of the actions of one man.
[QUOTE=Tony;35105791]Understand Karzai? What is there to understand with regards to this situation? If he wants serious progress in the region then he needs to admit it's an isolated incident, the first of it's kind in 10 or so years.[/QUOTE] at what point does he stop admitting all these 'isolated events', really are isolated. How many more Dilawar's and massacres do there have to be before Karzai stops and says, the United States needs some fucking accountability.
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35105684]You say the military does a pretty fine job, but the fact that soldiers have such serious mental issues before and after, shows that is not true. [editline]12th March 2012[/editline] Neither do you, so you can't act like you know him more. Thanks for telling us that PTSD exists, that really helps And that was in fucking WW2, mid-battle. Afghanistan isn't the pacific, so you can't compare the two.[/QUOTE] Oh because one soldier has a psychotic break military medicine sucks? Not everything is preventable, I hope you know this. War is war and people ARE going to have issues after being down range. The most we can do is try to prevent and treat it. So listen to me you armchair doctor when I say we DO a fine job, and I like to think I do a pretty damn good job to when it comes to service members mental health.
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