[QUOTE=Chekko;35079923]Why work your butt off for thirty years when you can mooch off [B]other, hard-working people[/B] and get free stuff?[/QUOTE]
That's one of the places where the hate comes from.
[QUOTE=Xenocidebot;35079952]Hitler ate sugar. Do you have a point?[/QUOTE]
Do NOT go Godwin's law on this thread.
[QUOTE=acds;35078796]Not many Gypsies here in Sweden, but in Italy I remember there being quite a lot. First a single caravan arrived, then a few days after you wake up and some open space has been filled to the brim with their caravans. Then the stealing begins, if it isn't bolted to something it's going to disappear overnight (they also sometimes stab cats and dogs, for no fucking reason at all, not to forget abducting children).
Oh and 8 year olds with knives smoking at the side of the street everywhere.[/QUOTE]
This sums up gypsies in general around here.
Hell, I left my bike strapped to a tree for like 3 hours in a busy street, and when I came back, all that was left was the tree and the cut lock. This was last november.
About a week ago, I was gonna meet a friend of mine, and I found one of those scumbags with my bike loading shit from off of a dumpster. I called the cops and followed him back to his camp. When the cops got there and said what was going on, 2 of their whores that looked like the queen slug from Futurama came straight at me ready to beat me up with their bags, yelling like fuck. They even wanted 100€ saying they had bought the bike for that much from someone, and at the same time threatned me countless times saying they would come for me. Lucky me they were pointing to the opposite of where I live and then again, I live like 5 miles away from that place.
I got my bike all scratched up, with no grips, fucked up bolt on the brake lever, oiled up disc, no seat and some bullshit strapped to my wheel's beams for a "dirty ricey" effect.
And thats not all. My granma had to sell some property because the sons of bitches had occupied it. When she went there, everything was full of trash and they released their "hounds" straight at her plus a couple of their own trolls.
Not only that, these pathetic excuses of "people" probably sell more coke and shit of the sort than the pot dealers around school.
Honestly, if you have pitty for these scumbags, you deserve to be robbed so you wake up. The difference between these bastards and politics in my country is that politics gradually steal from you "for a reason", while gypsies could even occupy your house and take away all your shit in a day while probably killing you for shits and giggles, and pulling the racist card when you say you hate them is laughable.
[QUOTE=Cone;35079951]So you're defending a broad generalization (apparently without any sources for this information that aren't just anecdotes) by saying it's human nature to retardedly assume that they're all linked together because they're Gypsies?
Also, we do have a word already for these criminals: criminals.[/QUOTE]
Well, uh, defending. Wouldn't call it that much of a defending. It's something you'll hardly ever change. Generalization simplifies. People like doing stuff simply.
The problem with gypsies if they are trying to live as a pre-industrial people, in a society that is industrial. They roam and thieve in order to survive, rather than stay in one place and work.
To solve it, they need to be actually forced to permanently settle down, and to be integrated into an industrial society with all their children to be given compulsory education so as to integrate them into the modern world. They need to be kept track of, and made citizens with the ability to partake in voting whilst also being taxed. If you make them feel like they are a part of society, they will join it.
Say what you want about gypsies, but their culture is pretty rad.
There's an argument that gypsies are nomadic. They're not used to live the lifestyle of today. It's in their blood, and you can't change that.
Not sure about my opinion on that.
[QUOTE=teh pirate;35079949]I've always made the distinction between "romani" and "gypsy" because romani gypsy is just one category of gypsy. There are also Irish gypsies (who are, in fact, white gypsies.)[/QUOTE]
You mean the pavee, who are ethnically Irish but live like nomads and therefore are called gypsies by a wild association but not even them like the monicker. I don't mean them. All gypsies belong to a racial minority, or in the best case scenario are from a mixed background and therefore are treated better. But the Romani group is homogeneous, and the people you describe as gypsies are all from the same racial background.
The true offense here is that the culprit is instantly gypsy. Nobody has come to assume neo-nazis did it, or maybe a crazy person. If you throw an unfounded accusation towards a minority, whether it is a social or racial minority, you ARE discriminating.
[QUOTE=JurajIsNotPirat;35079996]Well, uh, defending. Wouldn't call it that much of a defending. It's just something you'll hardly ever change. It would be overcomplicating to not generalize, though. I guess I am a defending it a bit, then.[/QUOTE]
See, you just said that you're generalizing too much. Maybe you should crank down on the assumptions for a short while, try and think of everyone as being equal for a day or two.
I mean, it doesn't even matter if it's racism. It's totally irellevant. The thing is, it's still an over-generalization anyway, and I think we can all agree that not everyone in a group thinks the same way. If that were true, we wouldn't be seeing people with radical beliefs standing with perfectly socially acceptable people with those same beliefs.
[QUOTE=Mr. N;35079569]Some gypsies/travelers tried burning a forest behind my house down here. They also stole anything with metal on it that wasn't nailed down, and I caught some punk fifteen year old's trying to steal my car just a year ago.
I honestly don't give a fuck if I am "racist" about this, they are horrible.[/QUOTE]
This sums up my feelings about gypsies.
Wait... Scratch that... Mine and everyone else's feelings.
[QUOTE=dass;35080054]This sums up my feelings about gypsies.
Wait... Scratch that... Mine and everyone else's feelings.[/QUOTE]
seconded
[QUOTE=Cone;35080049]See, you just said that you're generalizing too much. Maybe you should crank down on the assumptions for a short while, try and think of everyone as being equal for a day or two.
I mean, it doesn't even matter if it's racism. It's totally irellevant. The thing is, it's still an over-generalization anyway, and I think we can all agree that [B]not everyone in a group thinks the same way[/B]. If that were true, we wouldn't be seeing people with radical beliefs standing with perfectly socially acceptable people with those same beliefs.[/QUOTE]
True. I doubt my view of gypsies will ever change, though, given my experience I've had with them. I don't have anything against the race. I'm just not fond of what most of the individuals are doing. I do have plenty of gypsy friends, they're good fun.
[QUOTE=Appolox;35079585]Racism is such an overused word today, how about discrimination? What gypsies are and what they do, there are maybe 1-5% honest gypsies those who broke up from their group and live a different life, but those we speak about, they are simple criminals, they lie, they steal, sometimes kill, they live off your benefits, wreck places, they live in your country but they don't care and they don't obey the law.[/QUOTE]
Some city here in Portugal has a gypsy for a president.
He's probably the only decent gypsy I have ever heard of. He and this friend of mine and his sister back when I was in the first grade.
[QUOTE=ewitwins;35079978]Do NOT go Godwin's law on this thread.[/QUOTE]
Blame the people who have been saying "that's something racists do" since page 2.
It's not my fault the thread is full of such amateur hour horseshit.
Im Slovak.
If you haven't lived there, you cant possibly imagine how terrible the situation is.
Call it racism all you want, but they are the biggest scum.
They mooch off of state welfare, have 6+ kids and steal EVERYTHING. They are fucking crazy, they even steal electrical wires and transformers. (some retards tried to steal live wires). The manhole covers are made of iron, they steal those too so they can sell it for a few bucks to buy more drugs.
MOST of them live in shitty illegal "villages"/camps in inhumane conditions.
Id say that less than 1% actually makes it past mandatory school education (1st year of high school)
[QUOTE=JurajIsNotPirat;35080086]True. I doubt my view of gypsies will ever change, though, given my experience I've had with them. I don't have anything against the race. I'm just not fond of what most of the individuals are doing. I do have plenty of gypsy friends, they're good fun.[/QUOTE]
So if you're friends with some Gypsies, being a Gypsy can't possibly have anything to do with it, or else they'd be criminals too, wouldn't they?
[QUOTE=Big Bang;35080047]You mean the pavee, who are ethnically Irish but live like nomads and therefore are called gypsies by a wild association but not even them like the monicker. I don't mean them. All gypsies belong to a racial minority, or in the best case scenario are from a mixed background and therefore are treated better. But the Romani group is homogeneous, and the people you describe as gypsies are all from the same racial background.
The true offense here is that the culprit is instantly gypsy. Nobody has come to assume neo-nazis did it, or maybe a crazy person. If you throw an unfounded accusation towards a minority, whether it is a social or racial minority, you ARE discriminating.[/QUOTE]
I'm not accusing them of doing this. I didn't realize that anyone was [I]assuming[/I] they were gypsies until now - I thought it was known for sure.
We're still only using the term gypsy because of a lack of a term to describe the particular (minority?) of criminal gypsies - among ourselves, that's an understood thing, and we know the implied difference between the various races that happen to compose the gypsy travellers in varying amounts and the gypsies we're using the term to describe. We're using the word gypsy here to refer to the criminal nomads, not the ordinary people who are not criminal nomads but happen to share a race with some of them.
UGH, how come you folk don't realize that what you're describing as the situation with "gypsies" is the same for any racial minority anywhere. Any oppressed and segregated minority lives in substandard conditions, have a big problem with crime, and are treated like garbage.
There's NOTHING special about the gypsies in relation to other minorities, the problem is that the places you live are entirely racially homogeneous. So stop trying to say it's not a race issue when it IS a race issue cause if it were people from the same racial group as the majority they would be just CRIMINALS, and that would be what you'd be calling them.
[QUOTE=Unsmart;35080097]Im Slovak.
If you haven't lived there, you cant possibly imagine how terrible the situation is.
Call it racism all you want, but they are the biggest scum.
They mooch off of state welfare, have kids and steal EVERYTHING. They are fucking crazy, they even steal electrical wires and transformers. (some retards tried to steal live wires). The manhole covers are made of iron, they steal those too so they can sell it for a few bucks to buy more drugs.
MOST of them live in shitty illegal "villages"/camps in inhumane conditions.
Id say that less than 1% actually makes it past mandatory school education (1st year of high school)[/QUOTE]
It's sad they don't value what they have. This was in the news about a year ago(?) - in a town containing one of these "villages", the mayor bought and had new water pipes installed for the gypsy people providing them with fresh water. Not a day passed and the pipes have been already torn out of the ground and sold as scrap.
[editline]10th March 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Cone;35080125]So if you're friends with some Gypsies, being a Gypsy can't possibly have anything to do with it, or else they'd be criminals too, wouldn't they?[/QUOTE]
Being a gypsy doesn't have anything to do with being a criminal. Other than that it's common.
[QUOTE=teh pirate;35080141]I'm not accusing them of doing this. I didn't realize that anyone was [I]assuming[/I] they were gypsies until now - I thought it was known for sure.
We're still only using the term gypsy because of a lack of a term to describe the particular (minority?) of criminal gypsies - among ourselves, that's an understood thing, and we know the implied difference between the various races that happen to compose the gypsy travellers in varying amounts and the gypsies we're using the term to describe. We're using the word gypsy here to refer to the criminal nomads, not the ordinary people who are not criminal nomads but happen to share a race with some of them.[/QUOTE]
We call the bad ones pikeys over in the UK
Even the good gypsies hate pikeys
[QUOTE=Big Bang;35080150]UGH, how come you folk don't realize that what you're describing as the situation with "gypsies" is the same for any racial minority anywhere. Any oppressed and segregated minority lives in substandard conditions, have a big problem with crime, and are treated like garbage.
There's NOTHING special about the gypsies in relation to other minorities, the problem is that the places you live are entirely racially homogeneous. So stop trying to say it's not a race issue when it IS a race issue cause if it were people from the same racial group as the majority they would be just CRIMINALS, and that would be what you'd be calling them.[/QUOTE]
It's not a race issue because we know the difference between the "gypsy" races and this:
[img]http://www.omfg.sk/obrazok/1197/Cigani.jpg[/img]
We're not implying that all "gypsy" races are [U]that[/U] - we're referring to that specific group, because the group exists and recognizing that is better than grouping them with every generic criminal for the sake of this discussion.
[QUOTE=teh pirate;35080141]I'm not accusing them of doing this. I didn't realize that anyone was [I]assuming[/I] they were gypsies until now - I thought it was known for sure.
We're still only using the term gypsy because of a lack of a term to describe the particular (minority?) of criminal gypsies - among ourselves, that's an understood thing, and we know the implied difference between the various races that happen to compose the gypsy travellers in varying amounts and the gypsies we're using the term to describe. We're using the word gypsy here to refer to the criminal nomads, not the ordinary people who are not criminal nomads but happen to share a race with some of them.[/QUOTE]
you've just explainend in one post what I am trying to say this whole time
No body hates the ethnicity, they hate the gypsy culture.
[QUOTE=carcarcargo;35080189]No body hates the ethnicity, they hate the gypsy culture.[/QUOTE]
I am not sure culture is the right word for this.. there's a slight difference between culture and lifestyle I think.
[QUOTE=teh pirate;35080176]
[img]http://www.omfg.sk/obrazok/1197/Cigani.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
Find ONE person there who is not of the same race.
[QUOTE=carcarcargo;35080189]No body hates the ethnicity, they hate the gypsy culture.[/QUOTE]
Using the term gypsy to describe the culture in reference here seems to be the reason the racist flag is being thrown. To Big Bang and Cone and the others, gypsy [B]is[/B] a race - so they're reading that sentence like "Nobody hates the ethnicity, they hate the black culture!"
[QUOTE=Big Bang;35080209]Find ONE person there who is not of the same race.[/QUOTE]
That's hard given it's shot in a gypsy village.
[QUOTE=Big Bang;35080150]UGH, how come you folk don't realize that what you're describing as the situation with "gypsies" is the same for any racial minority anywhere. Any oppressed and segregated minority lives in substandard conditions, have a big problem with crime, and are treated like garbage.
There's NOTHING special about the gypsies in relation to other minorities, the problem is that the places you live are entirely racially homogeneous. So stop trying to say it's not a race issue when it IS a race issue cause if it were people from the same racial group as the majority they would be just CRIMINALS, and that would be what you'd be calling them.[/QUOTE]
Hello Big Bang, have you ever lived in Europe? Have you ever treated this problem badly? Allow me to explain, Gypsy's would fall under what you've said if they had unneeded oppressive views brought upon them by nothing, but the reason why there's so much oppressive views to them is because of what they've wrought. Any Oppressed and segregated minority lives in substandard conditions, have a big problem with crime and are treated like garbage would also apply if all the things Gypsy's have done weren't willing to go into it, but they are and do not take the option that's open for them that's education, healthcare and employment.
[QUOTE=Big Bang;35080209]Find ONE person there who is not of the same race.[/QUOTE]
This group is probably the same race, but there's many groups composed of many races. We aren't targeting a single race.
[QUOTE=JurajIsNotPirat;35080228]That's hard given it's shot in a gypsy village.[/QUOTE]
And THIS, is what I'm trying to tell you all along. If a white guy had the same tattoo, mustache and glasses than the guy on the picture, he would be a douchebag. Because he is not white and belongs to the Romani ethnic group, he's a gypsy.
The implication that somebody is a gypsy necessarily implies that this person is also ethnically Romani.
[QUOTE=Keyblockor;35080233]Hello Big Bang, have you ever lived in Europe? Have you ever treated this problem badly? Allow me to explain, Gypsy's would fall under what you've said if they had unneeded oppressive views brought upon them by nothing, but the reason why there's so much oppressive views to them is because of what they've wrought. Any Oppressed and segregated minority lives in substandard conditions, have a big problem with crime and are treated like garbage would also apply if all the things Gypsy's have done weren't willing to go into it, but they are and do not take the option that's open for them that's education, healthcare and employment.[/QUOTE]
I've been to 7 European countries, I am 5 generations European and I hold British citizenship. I just live in Venezuela.
You're using the exact same argument that happens in Venezuelan barrios. Where people are, much worse off. Here, allow me to illustrate. This is Petare, it holds nearly 1.2 million inhabitants. This is a slum in Caracas.
[img]http://www.rnv.gov.ve/galeria/albums/userpics/lluvias_20050208/normal_Lluvias%20Petare%207.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.6topoder.com/imagenes/2012/02/petare.jpg[/img]
It is composed almost strictly of racial minorities, and crime is rampant, much worse than stealing bicycles and cables, there's organized criminal groups who kill people for their fucking cellphones. Barrios are not strictly racially homogeneous, but they are composed by minorities, and share one more thing, they are all poor and with low education standards.
Unlike most of you, I'm not acknowledging that the problem is them. The problem ain't the barrio, the problem is how hard it is to get out of the barrios, because all that politicians do is give them free shit, which only resorts in them abusing of said gifts. It's an educational, social, political and economical problem, and despite just how similar it is to the gypsy situation, I am WELL aware gypsies are better off than this people. I don't blame the barrio for crime, I blame everyone who contributes to the problem by discriminating people by their social background.
You think only Europe has this kind of problems?
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.