Donald Trump Says the Hate Speech from His Supporters ‘Saddens’ Him
132 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Snoberry Tea;51368081]Can you cite source for him saying the one about torture? That seems uncharacteristic even for him.
As far as "We'll go after their families" I understood that to mean he would go after the children of illegals who are, IIRC, still technically illegal, but get lots of government assistance where most American citizens don't, and either deport them or get them naturalized and cut off support/make them pay taxes. I'm assuming most sane people understood that to be the case. The insane people would misconstrue it as "git em boys"[/QUOTE]
[url=http://www.weeklystandard.com/trump-torture-works-ok-folks/article/2001124?custom_click=rss]Trump on[/url] [url=http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/02/contra-donald-trump-torture-does-not-work/463293/]torture[/url]
Basically, not "even if torture doesn't work", but flat out denying all evidence that torture does not work.
As for the "go after their families", he was referring to terrorists with that quote, not illegals. The difference is that, with illegals, "go after their families" could mean deportation, legal pressure, financial pressure, etc. Why I brought it up is that in the context in which he said it, he was literally saying that we have to kill the families of terrorists. He was arguing for the murder of innocent people, and that's way, way worse than anything he's said about illegal immigration.
EDIT: [url=http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/02/politics/donald-trump-terrorists-families/]Source on "take out their families"[/url]
[QUOTE=Pascall;51367716]Maybe Biden threatened him.[/QUOTE]
"I've replaced half the cold taps with hot water taps and put whoopee cushions under some of the seats.
I'm not telling you which until you stop being a dick. Maybe. "
Boy I expect some of these hard flips in personality are going to go down well with his actually bigoted supporters.
Honestly so far this election seems a lot less of a tragedy than anticipated
In fact, momentarily it even looks good
[QUOTE=Govna;51368139]Human beings on average behave like extremely fickle animals. They have bad memories, poor attention spans, and too much sentimentality/are driven by emotion more than logic. Naturally then when we're talking about politics, they're easily duped and manipulated. It happens again and again, as history shows us. Whether we're talking Hitlers, Mussolinis, Lenins, Stalins, Reagans, Bushes, Thatchers, etc., this is how the cycle works. Trump is yet another part of that cycle.
What I love is how it's working like a charm here. He told the radical right-wingers and centrists (basically anybody who was pissed off at the left) what they wanted to hear back when he was campaigning, now he's pandering to the left-wingers and remaining centrists since he's apparently been awarded the election by the electoral college system. And they're eating it up. "Oh he was just pretending to be retarded/hateful the whole time. There's a chance he'll be reasonable and maybe a not so bad president after all." "He hasn't done anything yet, stop being so critical of him." "Ignore his past behavior and everything he said before, it didn't mean anything." Etc. They've completely forgotten how much of a dishonest ass he is; that, or they always sympathized with him to some degree or another, and now they're just using his current rhetoric to give in to that sympathy.
This whole election, as others have pointed out, is one for the history books. It's going to be studied and analyzed by social and political scientists, psychologists, economists, etc. for decades to come.[/QUOTE]
I think a lot of people are just hoping it won't be as bad as they expect and are trying to give him a chance to not be an arse backwards attack on the progress America made over the past 8 years. When people are saying 'maybe he will turn around', I think that's often optimism not expectation.
[editline]14th November 2016[/editline]
Also, it was always clear trump would never implement half of his policy because it was just straight up impossible. What's worrying is wondering what he'll do instead.
[QUOTE=SirJon;51368240]Honestly so far this election seems a lot less of a tragedy than anticipated
In fact, momentarily it even looks good[/QUOTE]
I'm in a predicament cause if Trump turns out to be a good president then I have to do my TOXX.
So I'm essentially hoping for the ruination of America with Trump's policies.
[QUOTE=Govna;51368139]What I love is how it's working like a charm here. He told the radical right-wingers and centrists (basically anybody who was pissed off at the left) what they wanted to hear back when he was campaigning, now he's pandering to the left-wingers and remaining centrists since he's apparently been awarded the election by the electoral college system. And they're eating it up. "Oh he was just pretending to be retarded/hateful the whole time. There's a chance he'll be reasonable and maybe a not so bad president after all." "He hasn't done anything yet, stop being so critical of him." "Ignore his past behavior and everything he said before, it didn't mean anything." Etc. They've completely forgotten how much of a dishonest ass he is; that, or they always sympathized with him to some degree or another, and now they're just using his current rhetoric to give in to that sympathy.[/QUOTE]And it will continue to work for centuries, even millenia to come.
Right or left, humans have always been malleable since the dawn of any sort of government.
Running the country into the ground wouldn't be beneficial if he ever wants a second term, I am still skeptical, seeing what the Republicans will do, especially with Mr Mike "Gay Therapy" Pence as VP.
My bet is that this Presidency will be similar to Bush.
[QUOTE=SirJon;51368240]Honestly so far this election seems a lot less of a tragedy than anticipated
In fact, momentarily it even looks good[/QUOTE]
I'll just say what I did previously: Any good that will come of this buffoon being elected President will come accidentally and not on purpose. Donald Trump has proved time and again how chaotic his thought processes are, and the flip flopping he's done even during his campaign should be evidence of how nothing he said, good or bad, can be taken at face value, and that's not something you should expect to see in a President
[QUOTE=Coolboy;51368448]Running the country into the ground wouldn't be beneficial if he ever wants a second term, I am still skeptical, seeing what the Republicans will do, especially with Mr Mike "Gay Therapy" Pence as VP.
My bet is that this Presidency will be similar to Bush.[/QUOTE]
I hope that Trump will be more inwardly authoritarian and controlling, given his experience.
Even if Trump swings hardcore moderate, which I'm praying to God he does for the sake of many of my friends who's education and lifestyles are at risk, I will never consider him a good president. He could bring about an economic miracle and lift up half of America, but I'll still remember that his entire presidential campaign relied on flinging shit and prodding the hateful and bigoted for votes.
The amount of pure fear I've seen from my peers isn't something I'm willing to forget. I had a 78-year-old professor confide that he's never seen in his entire life seen so much fear from the results of an election. The campaign rhetoric, no matter the results in office, are unforgivable for inciting fear, hatred, anger, and negativity into America. It wouldn't have been hard to run a positive, forward-looking campaign - just look at Sanders - but instead it preyed on the worst of our society and left many of my friends in fear and legitimized hatred (on both sides of the aisle).
He can be "saddened" by it, but unless he takes action against it and atones for his predatory shitshow of a campaign, I don't care.
[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;51368459]I'll just say what I did previously: Any good that will come of this buffoon being elected President will come accidentally and not on purpose. Donald Trump has proved time and again how chaotic his thought processes are, and the flip flopping he's done even during his campaign should be evidence of how nothing he said, good or bad, can be taken at face value, and that's not something you should expect to see in a President[/QUOTE]
I wouldn't be sure of that. Might be that he did all that shit because he knew it would get him elected. Might be he just played the politics game. We'll just have to wait and see, with an open mind. Let's not be petty about this, if he does a good job, he does a good job.
Im not entirely sure what your expectations of a politician are, with all due respect. What you're describing is pretty usual (although in trumps case particularly controversial)
[QUOTE=.Isak.;51368515]Even if Trump swings hardcore moderate, which I'm praying to God he does for the sake of many of my friends who's education and lifestyles are at risk, I will never consider him a good president. He could bring about an economic miracle and lift up half of America, but I'll still remember that his entire presidential campaign relied on flinging shit and prodding the hateful and bigoted for votes.
The amount of pure fear I've seen from my peers isn't something I'm willing to forget. I had a 78-year-old professor confide that he's never seen in his entire life seen so much fear from the results of an election. The campaign rhetoric, no matter the results in office, are unforgivable for inciting fear, hatred, anger, and negativity into America. It wouldn't have been hard to run a positive, forward-looking campaign - just look at Sanders - but instead it preyed on the worst of our society and left many of my friends in fear and legitimized hatred (on both sides of the aisle).
He can be "saddened" by it, but unless he takes action against it and atones for his predatory shitshow of a campaign, I don't care.[/QUOTE]
You know I don't know what's more disgusting
1. He turns out to be moderate and deliberately abused humanity's lesser nature to get into power and has pretty much abandoned the people who got him there
2. He sticks to his guns and is a piece of shit, but a consistent piece of shit.
Practically it's the latter that's worse, but the former might crush hope in the democratic process in even more people than before
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;51368722]You know I don't know what's more disgusting
1. He turns out to be moderate and deliberately abused humanity's lesser nature to get into power and has pretty much abandoned the people who got him there
2. He sticks to his guns and is a piece of shit, but a consistent piece of shit.
Practically it's the latter that's worse, but the former might crush hope in the democratic process in even more people than before[/QUOTE]
The former is worse because the Rust Belt will become even more disillusioned and I would be seriously scared of a fascist candidate rising out of that anger. Like, an actual, literal, anti-democratic fascist.
It's a very dangerous game Trump is playing.
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;51368722]You know I don't know what's more disgusting
1. He turns out to be moderate and deliberately abused humanity's lesser nature to get into power and has pretty much abandoned the people who got him there
2. He sticks to his guns and is a piece of shit, but a consistent piece of shit.
Practically it's the latter that's worse, but the former might crush hope in the democratic process in even more people than before[/QUOTE]
I've had a similar problem trying to choose between the two. If he backs away from some of his crazier ideas then I think that would be best but at the same time we are hardwired at this point to get outraged at politicians who lie to us on the campaign trail.
[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;51368459]I'll just say what I did previously: Any good that will come of this buffoon being elected President will come accidentally and not on purpose. Donald Trump has proved time and again how chaotic his thought processes are, and the flip flopping he's done even during his campaign should be evidence of how nothing he said, good or bad, can be taken at face value, and that's not something you should expect to see in a President[/QUOTE]
What else does your biased crystal ball tells you?
[QUOTE=Jouska;51369077]What else does your biased crystal ball tells you?[/QUOTE]
He's not claiming premonition, it's just a fact that Trump says a bunch of shit to see where the pieces fall and rolls from there.
[QUOTE=.Isak.;51368515]Even if Trump swings hardcore moderate, which I'm praying to God he does for the sake of many of my friends who's education and lifestyles are at risk, I will never consider him a good president. He could bring about an economic miracle and lift up half of America, but I'll still remember that his entire presidential campaign relied on flinging shit and prodding the hateful and bigoted for votes.
The amount of pure fear I've seen from my peers isn't something I'm willing to forget. I had a 78-year-old professor confide that he's never seen in his entire life seen so much fear from the results of an election. The campaign rhetoric, no matter the results in office, are unforgivable for inciting fear, hatred, anger, and negativity into America. It wouldn't have been hard to run a positive, forward-looking campaign - just look at Sanders - but instead it preyed on the worst of our society and left many of my friends in fear and legitimized hatred (on both sides of the aisle).
He can be "saddened" by it, but unless he takes action against it and atones for his predatory shitshow of a campaign, I don't care.[/QUOTE]
My roommate mentioned they knew seven trans people who attempted to commit suicide after the election. I don't think people saying to just get over it understand how scary trump is for the marginalized.
[QUOTE=MissingNoGuy;51368318]And it will continue to work for centuries, even millenia to come.
Right or left, humans have always been malleable since the dawn of any sort of government.[/QUOTE]
Except it's not malleability, it's stupidity.
And we can't afford to keep doing this. Especially when it comes to climate change, which his administration denies the existence of. You can only ignore reality and bullshit your way through for so long before it finally catches up with you and knocks you and everybody else down a few notches. This is why we keep getting screwed over.
[QUOTE=Pitchfork;51368186][url=http://www.weeklystandard.com/trump-torture-works-ok-folks/article/2001124?custom_click=rss]Trump on[/url] [url=http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/02/contra-donald-trump-torture-does-not-work/463293/]torture[/url]
Basically, not "even if torture doesn't work", but flat out denying all evidence that torture does not work.
As for the "go after their families", he was referring to terrorists with that quote, not illegals. The difference is that, with illegals, "go after their families" could mean deportation, legal pressure, financial pressure, etc. Why I brought it up is that in the context in which he said it, he was literally saying that we have to kill the families of terrorists. He was arguing for the murder of innocent people, and that's way, way worse than anything he's said about illegal immigration.
EDIT: [url=http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/02/politics/donald-trump-terrorists-families/]Source on "take out their families"[/url][/QUOTE]
Honestly I think it's rather telling that these snippets need to be brought back up, it shows that some Trump supporters either:
1) Didn't pay attention to half the shit he says, or
2) Didn't pay attention to him or the campaign at all.
The main that bothers me about Trump is he doesn't own up to anything. The whole latter half of his campaign has been "Wrong" or "I didn't say that", when there's recorded, certifiable evidence that he did say/do those things. For fuck's sake, he wouldn't even admit he was sniffling in the 2nd debate when it was not only recorded and freely available for any doubters to watch, but was [I]witnessed live by the multitudes who watched the debate[/I].
Maybe that was Trumps plan all along. Remember how he said in the past that when he will be a candidate for the POTUS, he will only try it if he is sure he could win.
Seeing his acceptance speech about uniting the people after this horrible election, that democrats and republicans have to think of the people and have to work together for the country, and his whole body language really shows a different kind of person.
It looks to me that the only way to win for him was to become the opposite of clinton. It was his strategy to do it this way. It meant to get those people to vote which are tired of political correctness and being ignored by the political parties. If he tried it any other way, just look at Bernie Sanders.
Well, we will see what will happen in the future.
[QUOTE=Lambeth;51369103]My roommate mentioned they knew seven trans people who attempted to commit suicide after the election. I don't think people saying to just get over it understand how scary trump is for the marginalized.[/QUOTE]
Trump did literally nothing and people are already killing themselves over it? They REALLY need mental help. There is worry and then there's just being mentally unstable.
[QUOTE=rndgenerator;51369977]Trump did literally nothing and people are already killing themselves over it? They REALLY need mental help. There is worry and then there's just being mentally unstable.[/QUOTE]
well thankfully our president and most of our federal government think people like that need forced into torturous conversion therapy to make them "normal" now
Didn't he say veterans with PTSD are cowards?
[QUOTE=TheNerdPest14;51370104]Didn't he say veterans with PTSD are cowards?[/QUOTE]
No, he implied that people with PTSD aren't as "strong" as those without which, while simplistic and counterproductive, isn't nearly as bad as outright calling them cowards
[QUOTE=Raidyr;51370158]No, he implied that people with PTSD aren't as "strong" as those without which, while simplistic and counterproductive, isn't nearly as bad as outright calling them cowards[/QUOTE]
IIRC he said the vets that commit suicide were unable to cope, not calling them weak.
[QUOTE=Pops;51370216]IIRC he said the vets that commit suicide were unable to cope, not calling them weak.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]“When you talk about the mental health problems, when people come back from war and combat — [B]and they see things that maybe a lot of the folks in this room have seen many times over and you’re strong and you can handle it, but a lot of people can’t handle it,”[/B] Trump said. “And they see horror stories. They see events that you couldn’t see in a movie. Nobody would believe it.”[/QUOTE]
The implication is that veterans who suffer aren't as strong as the people who he was addressing. I never said he called them weak.
[QUOTE=rndgenerator;51369977]Trump did literally nothing and people are already killing themselves over it? They REALLY need mental help. There is worry and then there's just being mentally unstable.[/QUOTE]
Trans rights are in a very fickle state right now. Transgender people are very close to not being considered a protected class under Title IX, which would mean that it would be legal to discriminate against us and not offer us housing, healthcare, service, jobs, etc. Most of the movement being done for trans rights has been in the last quarter of Obama's last term, it would be very easy for the government to overturn almost all of them. Compound that with the anxiety and depression that comes with being trans (imagine feeling unsafe every time you step outside or use a public bathroom for fear of ridicule, harassment, and even assault) and the election results would be very traumatic to us. Taking away Obamacare would be for many taking away their access to hormone replacement therapy, surgeries, therapy, anything else they would need to survive. Remember too that 2016 has been the deadliest year for transgender people of color so far, there is legit cause for worry.
How anyone can trust anything this man says after everything is beyond me.
[QUOTE=rndgenerator;51369977]Trump did literally nothing and people are already killing themselves over it? They REALLY need mental help. There is worry and then there's just being mentally unstable.[/QUOTE]
Two transgender friends of mine actually did threaten suicide after the election. LGBT suicide hotlines were at max capacity for 48 hours after Trump was declared the winner. You can't tell me you wouldn't suffer from bad depression if you had to spend a lot of time worried about genuine threats to your wellbeing or even your life from those around you.
Many trans people rely on the ACA for healthcare and access to antidepressants. The threat of that being ripped away is basically eroding their already very tiny safety net.
[QUOTE=Ona;51367680]It's [I]almost[/I] as if launching a campaign with a bases of hatred and civil rights abuse brings out the assholes in the world!
Regardless of how Trump handles his presidency, nobody an deny at this point that he came to power while promising to systematically hurt millions of people. Whether this was a legitimate desire or just a political fast one to increase his voter count, it's pretty fucking deplorable all the same.
Spinning around and pretending like he's "saddened" by all this now that he's secured the victory absolutely reeks of PR. And even if it is genuine, how the hell are we suppose to trust anything Trump says?
At this point, I don't think [I]anybody[/I] has any clear idea of what he's going to do in the next 4 years.[/QUOTE]
Honestly, if they weren't legitimate promises, I can't be mad at him. All he's done is bring out people's true colors and biases. He's not the one participating in the riots, he's not the one spraying offensive graffiti on walls, he's not the one setting fires and breaking windows, he just used his right to free speech to say a bunch of bullshit and enough people who believed in his ideas voted for him.
Hell, if he came out the day after being sworn in and went "look, the fact that so many people voted for me after saying all these racist, bigoted things is a problem we need to solve" I'd have a newfound respect for him, despite me hating his guts this entire election.
I mean I guess that's easier for me to say considering I'm a blue-eyed straight white male so not once did he actually say something to directly offend me, but it's still how I feel.
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