Manga images 'not child porn', says Sweden's Supreme Court
497 replies, posted
Well, good that someone knows what's up. It's fabricated stuff anyway; no little girls were harmed in the making of this lolicon. Sure it's not exactly kosher in most people's Torahs, but if no-one gets hurt (except mentally-challenged older conservatives), there's nothing overtly wrong from a moral standpoint. Unless it's traced from actual CP, in which case it's objectively not kosher at all. Some dude called Dr Comet apparently did that, and that's bad too.
[QUOTE=DentalDoctor;36340839]look even your wording implies it's one way or another; black/white with you.
I honestly don't give a fuck about the schizophrenia and mental disorders because it has nothing to do with this thread. Yeah guy, you're not born with them and you don't choose them either (Unlike this dumbass fetish) which is why your argument has no back because its barely even relative to the topic at hand
Look guy, I'm going to make it as clear as possible to [b]my[/b] understanding. There is [i]nothing[/i] wrong with the fucking pictures or what ever, fap to what you want to; but trying to defend it to society as "I can't help it, I'm born this way" is completely false because you CAN help it, it's not an illness its just a sexual fetish, and could lead some people to wanting to try the shit they see, on kids [b]and I don't mean absoloutley everyone who looks at loli porn.[/b]
I think I had to clear that part up for you so you don't think I mean everyone or noone :)
You can keep arguing about defending fictional child porn if you really want to, i'm not into that kind of shit though.[/QUOTE]
You clearly do not understand how fetishes work. Please re-educate yourself before you return to this thread. You've made it obvious over the 10 or so posts that spout senseless hate on a topic you know nothing of.
Please DentalDoctor tell us more about how people choose to be pedophiles in a world that absolutely despises them.
Meanwhile, in Norway:
[quote=Wikipedia]As of 2005, the Norwegian penal act criminalizes any depictions that 'sexualize' children, even if it does not actually show sexual acts with children. This would include any artificially produced material, for example, written text, drawn images, animation, manipulated images, an adult model with childish clothes/toys/surroundings.[/quote]
[QUOTE=DentalDoctor;36340839]look even your wording implies it's one way or another; black/white with you.
I honestly don't give a fuck about the schizophrenia and mental disorders because it has nothing to do with this thread. Yeah guy, you're not born with them and you don't choose them either (Unlike this dumbass fetish) which is why your argument has no back because its barely even relative to the topic at hand
Look guy, I'm going to make it as clear as possible to [b]my[/b] understanding. There is [i]nothing[/i] wrong with the fucking pictures or what ever, fap to what you want to; but trying to defend it to society as "I can't help it, I'm born this way" is completely false because you CAN help it, it's not an illness its just a sexual fetish, and could lead some people to wanting to try the shit they see, on kids [b]and I don't mean absoloutley everyone who looks at loli porn.[/b]
I think I had to clear that part up for you so you don't think I mean everyone or noone :)
You can keep arguing about defending fictional child porn if you really want to, i'm not into that kind of shit though.[/QUOTE]
Are you reading anything people are trying to tell you? Do you think one choses to be aroused by things that are unusual and disturbing? It is just how the brain works.
As stated before if someone looks at porn it doesn't mean they are going to go commit rape, it just relieves a bit of the tension.
Please put more thoughts into your posts.
[QUOTE=DentalDoctor;36340839]but trying to defend it to society as "I can't help it, I'm born this way" is completely false because you CAN help it[/quote]
"As a medical diagnosis, pedophilia, or pedophilia, is defined as a psychiatric disorder in adults or late adolescents (persons age 16 or older) typically characterized by a primary or exclusive sexual interest in prepubescent children"
You really don't get to choose what it is you are attracted to I think perhaps all the time, I don't claim to possess any specialised knowledge on how the human mind works, but I am pretty sure there are plenty of people cursing their poor luck for being attracted to what they are attracted to.
There are two classified types of pedophiles of which I am aware, exclusive pedophiles and non-exclusive, the latter simply being attracted to children in addition to the other things they are attracted to, and the former being those who only find attraction in children.
Both groups have a choice when it comes to whether they decide to fap to lolicon, or whether they do not, they do not have a choice as to whether they are attracted to children however. I will concede that provided they do not have an additional serious mental condition, that they can just choose to not fap to lolicon.
The issue I take with what you are saying is that there is really no reason other than it may provoke the mentally unstable to go to increasing lengths to get their delicious flat chest, to ban lolicon . No child is being harmed in the creation of the content (with perhaps the exception of some studios which I have heard about who use child models to draw from though I am not sure as to the legitimacy of the claim that some do, though I wouldn't discount it) and anyone of sound mind is not going to violate their own morals because years of lolicon has whittled away at their self-restraint, it doesn't work that way.
You cannot prohibit or demonise something that itself is not harmful simply because those of mental instability may be influenced negatively by it, because a significant chunk of the entertainment we enjoy today could be banned under this chain of logic.
Society has no place deciding what pornography is deemed right or wrong, the reason why real child pornography is viewed the way it is, is because I don't believe it is possible to create it without causing serious bodily/mental harm to the child/ren taking part in the creation of said content. You don't have that with lolicon (with the exception I mentioned above but then that is real child pornography as it's simply a different rendering method used to present a real child in a sexual situation) because the children within that are not real, no one is harmed.
[quote]it's not an illness its just a sexual fetish[/quote]
I don't know who to trust on this matter, DentalDoctor of Facepunch Studios, or the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders.
[quote]and could lead some people to wanting to try the shit they see, on kids [b]and I don't mean absoloutley everyone who looks at loli porn.[/b][/QUOTE]
Slippery slope without proof, people have sexually violated children without even having bore witness to child pornography of any form, the problem is with the people, not with the content.
Well I think it's hot.
Alright, you're all so against this, what about those people you're murdering mindlessly in FPS games?
Oh, that's right, they aren't real.
I seem to find that FP defends video game violence with high regards and insists that it does not lead you on
Bunch of hypocrites.
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;36342002]Alright, you're all so against this, what about those people you're murdering mindlessly in FPS games?
Oh, that's right, they aren't real.
I seem to find that FP defends video game violence with high regards and insists that it does not lead you on
Bunch of hypocrites.[/QUOTE]
What thread have you been looking at, most of the people here have been supportive, albeit some still were disgusted by it they didn't think it should be illegal.
[QUOTE=Crimor;36342062]What thread have you been looking at, most of the people here have been supportive, albeit some still were disgusted by it they didn't think it should be illegal.[/QUOTE]
Well, point still stands to anyone that is against it
-snip-
Good.
Let people jerk it to whatever, man. Long as it doesn't hurt somebody it's 100 percent cool with me.
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;36342294]Good.
Let people jerk it to whatever, man. Long as it doesn't hurt somebody it's 100 percent cool with me.[/QUOTE]
Then you'd like denmark, that's pretty much our freedom of expression in a nutshell :v:
[QUOTE=deltasquid;36338608]Exactly. If no one was harmed, it shouldn't be criminal. If it's just drawings, then no one was harmed, and punishing him would be amoral.[/QUOTE]
It is a bit odd that you would use the word "amoral", as it is so often sharply criticized by the more liberal members of this board.
[editline]15th June 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Crimor;36340139]I bet you also think homosexuality is a choice.[/QUOTE]
I do believe that exposure to fetish porn will indeed make your fetishes take up more of your sexual desire, pushing away the more conventional wants.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;36342846]It is a bit odd that you would use the word "amoral", as it is so often sharply criticized by the more liberal members of this board.[/QUOTE]
He also used it incorrectly.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;36342846]
I do believe that exposure to fetish porn will indeed make your fetishes take up more of your sexual desire, pushing away the more conventional wants.[/QUOTE]
So homosexuality and pedophilia are fetishes in your mind? Good job hammering someone for using a word when you can't use the word fetish right.
[QUOTE=Riutet;36341433]"As a medical diagnosis, pedophilia, or pedophilia, is defined as a psychiatric disorder in adults or late adolescents (persons age 16 or older) typically characterized by a primary or exclusive sexual interest in prepubescent children"
You really don't get to choose what it is you are attracted to I think perhaps all the time, I don't claim to possess any specialised knowledge on how the human mind works, but I am pretty sure there are plenty of people cursing their poor luck for being attracted to what they are attracted to.
There are two classified types of pedophiles of which I am aware, exclusive pedophiles and non-exclusive, the latter simply being attracted to children in addition to the other things they are attracted to, and the former being those who only find attraction in children.
Both groups have a choice when it comes to whether they decide to fap to lolicon, or whether they do not, they do not have a choice as to whether they are attracted to children however. I will concede that provided they do not have an additional serious mental condition, that they can just choose to not fap to lolicon.
The issue I take with what you are saying is that there is really no reason other than it may provoke the mentally unstable to go to increasing lengths to get their delicious flat chest, to ban lolicon . No child is being harmed in the creation of the content (with perhaps the exception of some studios which I have heard about who use child models to draw from though I am not sure as to the legitimacy of the claim that some do, though I wouldn't discount it) and anyone of sound mind is not going to violate their own morals because years of lolicon has whittled away at their self-restraint, it doesn't work that way.
You cannot prohibit or demonise something that itself is not harmful simply because those of mental instability may be influenced negatively by it, because a significant chunk of the entertainment we enjoy today could be banned under this chain of logic.
Society has no place deciding what pornography is deemed right or wrong, the reason why real child pornography is viewed the way it is, is because I don't believe it is possible to create it without causing serious bodily/mental harm to the child/ren taking part in the creation of said content. You don't have that with lolicon (with the exception I mentioned above but then that is real child pornography as it's simply a different rendering method used to present a real child in a sexual situation) because the children within that are not real, no one is harmed.
I don't know who to trust on this matter, DentalDoctor of Facepunch Studios, or the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders.
Slippery slope without proof, people have sexually violated children without even having bore witness to child pornography of any form, the problem is with the people, not with the content.[/QUOTE]
If pedophilia is a disorder, then so is every other philia.
No, that's stupid.
[QUOTE=Crimor;36342997]So homosexuality and pedophilia are fetishes in your mind? Good job hammering someone for using a word when you can't use the word fetish right.[/QUOTE]
The subject was pedophilia which I would probably consider a kind of fetish. That bit about homosexuality was responding to a bit about pedophilia, I would not call homosexuality a fetish.
[QUOTE=Inufin;36338818]Well I just basically mean that anything can happen. Here is the case what I thought up in my head.
Someone random browsing the internet and finds loli. He goes through them, faps, whatever. "Well, that was weird." He might think. Anyway, at this point he might actually start trying to find more because now he knows that he liked it. And at that point when there is an opportunity to "harm" children instead of passing the chance he already have been in contact with the subject through internet and pictures and maybe even photos, if he hadn't found the pictures in the first place he wouldn't even realize it. It might be just watching first, but if your moral isn't working as it should it might turn into a real life horror story. And we know these things do happen.[/QUOTE]
We really should not be basing extremely pertinent legislation on "What If." When a country or nation starts to do that, it sets itself onto the fast track to Totalitarianism.
i find it funny how some people can assume that anyone that likes loli and other variants are going to want the real thing
sorry but that's not really how it works
[sp]i like loli but god knows any thought of an actual boy or girl doing this makes me want to throw up in my mouth[/sp]
Not sure how does one get turned on by loli I always do my sessions on e-hentai galleries ..... and stumbled upon crap like furry or this I just cannot get a boner from those things.
[QUOTE=7331;36344727]Not sure how does one get turned on by loli I always do my sessions on e-hentai galleries ..... and stumbled upon crap like furry or this I just cannot get a boner from those things.[/QUOTE]
what?
[QUOTE=Riutet;36341433]-a lot of stuff from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders.-[/QUOTE]
You do realize the ONLY REASON society views pedophilia as bad or weird is because about 200(possibly more I forgot) or so years ago, we started thinking of children as more precious than we used to. We used to fuck kids a bit after they hit puberty to keep the population alive.
The disgusting feelings you get over someone being a pedophile is entirely a social construct.
(Also that used to classify being gay as a mental disorder and still classifies being trans as one)
[QUOTE=J!NX;36339921]meanwhile in america
simply seeing loli for 1 second will have you marked down as a sex offender for the rest of your life.[/QUOTE]
Actually no that doesn't happen at all
I dont think he should face full charges for posessing pedophilic imagery, but he shouldn't get off scot-free. Community service or a small fine should be good enough
[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;36344914]I dont think he should face full charges for posessing pedophilic imagery, but he shouldn't get off scot-free. Community service or a small fine should be good enough[/QUOTE]
Except he does not/did not possess pedophillic imagery; only one image, and that's hardly a good basis.
For additional background and those that are interested, here is my thread from last year, about the previous ruling: [url]http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1055534&highlight=[/url]
What I've always wondered;
How do they judge the age of a drawn character?
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;36345950]What I've always wondered;
How do they judge the age of a drawn character?[/QUOTE]
Tit-size
[QUOTE=iLife_Aftermath;36346034]Tit-size[/QUOTE]
So if someone draws a picture of Ariel Rebel, is it considered child porn, even though she's 27 now?
:v:
[editline]fish[/editline]
Fucking [b]awesome[/b] page king. Totally.
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