• gamejournopro-esque skype group chat log leaked, reveals collaboration between game journalists.
    204 replies, posted
[QUOTE=PaChIrA;50982007].Isak. what you're saying seems kinda hypocritical. I remember you talking about how people should look past what people do under the banner of BLM, but here you are saying people shouldn't look past what people do under the banner of GG. I'm not saying anything for or against BLM as that is not the point of this thread, I am just saying that it seems weird to me that you can overlook bad things that happen in the BLM name, but not the bad things that happen in the GG name.[/QUOTE] That's the opposite of what I'm saying. I'm saying [I]I support Gamergate[/I] even though there are many people I disagree with because I agree with the core complaints and the core ideas. I say the exact same thing for BLM. I don't "overlook" bad things that happen in either of these examples - I criticize them. They're similar examples, both being leaderless hashtags, and it's fair to point that out, but I'm not being hypocritical here, I support both movements despite having many disagreements with other self-identifying members of those movements. If there was a BLM site that became largely about hating white people, I'd call that a cesspool exactly like I call KIA a cesspool, even though I still support the core of both movements. But this is quickly derailing into "isak's political views" so I'm gonna insist we bring the conversation back to GG. Sorry for making that wrong assumption on the last page - I misinterpreted what was being said and that's my fault. [editline]31st August 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Aredbomb;50982005]Not exactly. 8chan failed because gamergate fatigue combined with the site's massive technical issues drove away large numbers of the people that came in September/October 2014, while a huge wave of /pol/lacks were migrating from 4chan to 8chan around the same time. This caused a domino effect that reached KIA, Twitter, and while not directly responsible it probably helped kill Voat. Milo appealed to these people, but he didn't drive them to do anything they wouldn't have done in the first place.[/QUOTE] I never paid much attention to 8chan when this was all going on, so the relationship between 8chan-4chan-reddit-voat was confusing for me. Good points, though - from my perspective it seemed like the adoration of Milo led to a strong shift to the alt-right, but the /pol/ influx makes more sense.
[QUOTE=.Isak.;50982102]That's the opposite of what I'm saying. I'm saying [I]I support Gamergate[/I] even though there are many people I disagree with because I agree with the core complaints and the core ideas. I say the exact same thing for BLM. I don't "overlook" bad things that happen in either of these examples - I criticize them. They're similar examples, both being leaderless hashtags, and it's fair to point that out, but I'm not being hypocritical here, I support both movements despite having many disagreements with other self-identifying members of those movements. If there was a BLM site that became largely about hating white people, I'd call that a cesspool exactly like I call KIA a cesspool, even though I still support the core of both movements. But this is quickly derailing into "isak's political views" so I'm gonna insist we bring the conversation back to GG. Sorry for making that wrong assumption on the last page - I misinterpreted what was being said and that's my fault. [/QUOTE] I see, I apologize about what I said then.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50979981]So you can't name any tangible thing they've actually done, just what they might be able to do because they're "journalists". [editline].[/editline] I can also add TotalBiscuit to the list of real gaming journalists, for him exposing the negligence PC audience gets from shoddy PC ports and pushing for higher standards on developers, among other things. [editline].[/editline] The reason I'm saying all of this is to dispel the myth of "gaming journalists is a joke". Gaming journalism is a real thing, and has had an actual impact on the industry, but it doesn't come from these guys.[/QUOTE] If their influence is non existant then how did they orchestrate the 'gamers are dead' frontal assault? those articles WERE posted by real gaming journalists... and these skype logs log how they orchestrated it. [editline]1st September 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50980069]I've seen a lot of people who have that belief because of GG, so I guess you could call that an effect on the industry. But the problem doesn't rest solely on the journalists. It takes two sides to create a conflict.[/QUOTE] Yes, and one side is more right then the other... no one is perfect but you don't solve anything with 'yea but the Jews in ww2 said some pretty mean things to the Nazis before the concentration camps, so we need to have a balanced argument' thats just intellectual bankruptcy...
I think that people coming from an outside perspective should realize that "Gamergate is about ethics in game journalism" is a narrative that was [I]fabricated[/I] from Anti-GG. GamerGate was always a reaction to a host of problems, including [I]but not limited to[/I] game journalism ethics. It has always opposed SJW culture because that's what the opposition used as a weapon: Zoe/Chelsea with her "Woe me I'm a woman I'm being harassed" and Wu's "Woe me I'm a trans I'm being harassed. The two issues (corruption and SJWs are interconnected and the "It's about game journalism" narrative was (is?) to ne used whenever GG targeted part of the clique by basically saying "why are you doing this? Weren't you about ethics? Checkmate! GG is in fact a bunch of misoginist who do not care about ethics. Sarah Butts is part of these logs despite not being a journalist, and this exact excuse was used when GG targeted her for being a pedo and child groomer. A short way to put it is this: GG targets this clique of fuckers, and the clique uses BOTH corruption and SJW-culture as tools to further their own destructive agenda, so as a response GG is both about ethics and anti-sjw.
the fact that there is a clique of manchildren that pushes forward an agenda on their shitty websites indicates how much of a joke video games journalism actually is i'm so glad that social media such as reddit/youtube is beginning to slaughter these websites because it's often faster and better advertising for companies to go straight to the consumer base than go through the vacuous middleman maybe they'll buck their ideas up at some point like every other industry, but until then it'll be the toilet that it became in the later 2000's
Uh, one of the nice things about gamergate is that despite it mainly consisting of younger left leaning gamers, it consists of people from every demographic and both sides of the "left right" false dichotomy. You shouldnt need to be right or left to be against corrupt journalism, censorship, and the people who try to manipulate those to their ends. Just those people happen to be on the extreme left right now, doesnt mean their opponents will all be the extreme right. Besides, its not that long ago the same group of gamers had to fight against the extreme right in Jack thompson, the right wing version of anita with the exact same talking points.
snip, wrong thread, need sleep
[QUOTE=AaronM202;50978963]Uh. Yes? You didnt actually believe the shit accusations did you?[/QUOTE] Sarcasm is a thing, tho.
It didn't help that for the longest time if you so much as said Gamergate you would be laughed at. People who would normally support GG literally shut it down because they half bought into the slander and half saw the worst part of it, the shit that floats to the top so to speak. The narrative and discussion died then. I saw a dozen times in the news section someone would fairly relevantly compare something to GG and they would just be shut down as if it was a taboo word.
I'm basically going to say here I'm like TotalBiscuit in that I support the ideals of GamerGate when it comes to journalism and all that crap, but I am staying out of it otherwise because holy shit it's the stupidest, most toxic, awful conversation and has become a downright embarrassment for us all.
[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;50982954]the fact that there is a clique of manchildren that pushes forward an agenda on their shitty websites indicates [b]how much of a joke video games journalism actually is[/b] i'm so glad that social media such as reddit/youtube is beginning to slaughter these websites because it's often faster and better advertising for companies to go straight to the consumer base than go through the vacuous middleman maybe they'll buck their ideas up at some point like every other industry, but until then it'll be the toilet that it became in the later 2000's[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=No_0ne;50980057][QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50979981]The reason I'm saying all of this is to dispel the myth of "gaming journalists is a joke". Gaming journalism is a real thing, and has had an actual impact on the industry, but it doesn't come from these guys.[/QUOTE] i think most people are already aware of that, gg exists to call people out when they fuck up and create awareness, not to attack games journalism as a whole[/QUOTE] This is what I mean
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50983304]This is what I mean[/QUOTE] i have no association at all with gamergate, and i've held this opinion since 2012-2013 so i don't know why you're using me as a reference towards gamergate in any respect trying to ascribe the views of one individual as being representative of the views of a group seems pretty unfair to the group, unless that individual is the leader or focus of said group (which i am neither)
[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;50983319]i have no association at all with gamergate, and i've held this opinion since 2012-2013 so i don't know why you're using me as a reference towards gamergate in any respect trying to ascribe the views of one individual as being representative of the views of a group seems pretty unfair to the group, unless that individual is the leader or focus of said group (which i am neither)[/QUOTE] I'm saying people think video game journalism is a joke when in reality it has done a lot for the industry, but you only look at these clowns as "journalists"
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50983351]I'm saying people think video game journalism is a joke when in reality it has done a lot for the industry, but you only look at these clowns as "journalists"[/QUOTE] Pretty much any big video game journalism site pandered to the "GG is misogynistic harassers" narrative. How can you expect us to take them seriously when they can't even fucking fact-check something like that? They [I]are[/I] all clowns.
[QUOTE=Teddybeer;50983558]Back in the day maybe, now it's just press releases and RSS feeds with unsolicited opinions about Israel. Foreign language ones are pretty much the same but days and weeks late but on time when they are paid by company x to review/preview their product, even importing American only problems that make no sense anywhere else. And people just going to Youtube of companies that start their own outlets also really hurts them and encourages them to do lazy content like clickbait and list.[/QUOTE] I listed a lot of examples on the first and second page, such as Super Bunnyhop, TotalBiscuit, Jim Sterling, Giant Bomb, and Geoff Keighly to name a few. But you only focus on the bad.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50984060]I listed a lot of examples on the first and second page, such as Super Bunnyhop, TotalBiscuit, Jim Sterling, Giant Bomb, and Geoff Keighly to name a few. But you only focus on the bad.[/QUOTE] That's a wild and baseless accusation based purely on what's been said on this forum and not what he actually does. You're intentionally trying to stir up shit instead of having a discussion.
[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;50983238]I'm basically going to say here I'm like TotalBiscuit in that I support the ideals of GamerGate when it comes to journalism and all that crap, but I am staying out of it otherwise because holy shit it's the stupidest, most toxic, awful conversation and has become a downright embarrassment for us all.[/QUOTE] That's nice and all, but you've got to remember this group of assholes managed to get sympathy pieces from the BBC, NYT, CNN, and plenty of other outlets, not to mention policy changes on Twitter, funding from Intel, and an audience at the UN. Oh, and mentions from Trudeau and various US government officials. The fact that the group of internet trolls running CON managed to pull off all of this shit should be worrying to everyone.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50983351]I'm saying people think video game journalism is a joke when in reality it has done a lot for the industry, but you only look at these clowns as "journalists"[/QUOTE] They've done a lot for the industry. At the expense of consumers. The incestuous conflict-of-interest relationships between publishers/advertisers and the "critical" media covering them is [I]one of the fucking central points of Gamergate[/I]. Funny how the games media wasn't interested in hearing that story and happily latched onto a "this is about misogyny and attacking feminists" narrative so they didn't have to be the one in the spotlight. Starting with colluding over the "Gamers are dead" articles that declared that the sites' own audiences were "dead" and that gaming isn't about them anymore. The arrogance was stunning, and these logs vindicate anyone who was called a misogynist because they want publishers and game blogs to be honest about what is an honest review and what's a 8.5/10 score in exchange for cash.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50979846]I don't get why you guys continue to pay attention to these hacks. There are actual good gaming journalists like Super Bunnyhop, [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMK-kajdgMA]who reported the Konami pachinko thing back in 2015[/url] which ignited a major shitstorm with Konami; and Giant Bomb, who are composed of many professional gaming journalist industry veterans; and TotalBiscuit, who's exposed a lot of Greenlight's fraudulent developers. And that's only to name a few.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50983351]I'm saying people think video game journalism is a joke when in reality it has done a lot for the industry, but you only look at these clowns as "journalists"[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=KillerJaguar;50984060]I listed a lot of examples on the first and second page, such as Super Bunnyhop, TotalBiscuit, Jim Sterling, Giant Bomb, and Geoff Keighly to name a few. But you only focus on the bad.[/QUOTE] This point is literally moot the narrative isn't that all game journalists are bad (How convenient that most of your examples are independent journalists who work for themselves and are very open about what they do), its that mainstream game journalism is shitty and needs changing Like, your trying to make your point around the idea that people think ALL journalism in gaming is bad. That isn't what's happening here and I don't think you get it. The entire point is to weed out the bad, so no shit everyone focus's on those ones specifically.
Skimming back over page 2 for a second, this line caught my eye. [QUOTE=AaronM202;50980376]" Confirmation that Wikipedia Editor Ryulong was involved with the group as he edited an article highlighted by Quinn within 2 hours of being contacted."[/QUOTE] One look at the RationalWiki pages on Gamergate, architected primarily by Ryulong and zealously defended by the site sysadmin, could've told anyone this. But confirmation's good to have, a year or two too late--I think these leaks should've come out no more than five months into 2015. Even RW eventually got fed the fuck up with him and his obsessive, one-sided crusade. He has not edited the site since the end of last year. However, since then apparently some new shitlord has moved in to replace him. That wiki was set up to parody and satirize Conservapedia; now Conservapedia is dead and irrelevant (its traffic is nearly nil and the entire Internet thinks of it as a joke that isn't even funny or worth paying attention to anymore), and RW has matured into the biased, agenda-driven shitwiki it was set up to destroy and always destined to replace. I used to edit there and my account there is basically dead to me. Even vandalizing the wiki to troll them and make a mess wouldn't be worth my time because every active user (including me since I once was active) is a sysop with revert and block powers so it'd be a couple clicks. [URL="http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/RationalWiki:What_is_going_on_in_the_world%3F"]Funny how RW's page makes no mention of these leaks[/URL], which would be damning to their extensive, meticulous propaganda archive.
People may not take gamers seriously, but this is nothing new. Gaming media poisoned their own wells by shitting on their own audience, and the regressive left has become a joke. Dedicated "social experts" now write for clickbaity tabloid trash, indie devs are by standard seen as pretentious sanfran hipsters, and game journalists have their image reduced to blogging clowns with big egos. Gamers lost nothing, because we had nothing to lose. Gaming media? They lost influence, respect and income. They will eventually realize they were basically used by professional victims/manipulators, who now that the controversy has pretty much died down also find they have less and less attention and support with each passing day. Again, we had and still have nothing to lose. We win this war by default, because we only have win conditions.
[QUOTE=Teddybeer;50985653][url]http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Gamergate#CON_.28or_not.2C_actually.29_Skype_Leaks[/url][/QUOTE] "However I haven't checked them out yet and don't know the content. This article is given as "confirmation" that the chat logs are real. However beyond summarizing, the article doesn't list any evidence why this should be the case. " what
[QUOTE=J!NX;50985749]"However I haven't checked them out yet and don't know the content. This article is given as "confirmation" that the chat logs are real. However beyond summarizing, the article doesn't list any evidence why this should be the case. " what[/QUOTE] Ian Cheong literally said they were real and he's IN the logs.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;50985805]Arthur Chu literally said they were real and he's IN the logs.[/QUOTE] yes but that's not evidence!!!!! show me the proof i havent read it or anything but prove it! :downs:
[QUOTE=AaronM202;50985805]Arthur Chu literally said they were real and he's IN the logs.[/QUOTE] I thought it was Ian Cheong who confirmed it, not Chu.
[QUOTE=Fangz;50985825]I thought it was Ian Cheong who confirmed it, not Chu.[/QUOTE] Was it? I forget which name was mentioned in Bro Teams stream, cant check since they had that removed for "harassment." [editline]1st September 2016[/editline] Yeah it was Ian not Arthur. He's apparently alright now but Chu's still fucked up.
Yeah, Ian Cheong actually turned out pretty cool like a year ago. Something happened and he got really pissed off with the rest of them, then he did a little looking around himself and realized how shit they really were and turned against them completely.
[QUOTE=Teddybeer;50985653][url]http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Gamergate#CON_.28or_not.2C_actually.29_Skype_Leaks[/url][/QUOTE] [QUOTE=David fucking Gerard]In any case, there's nothing that would show any of Gamergate's ridiculous claims to be true, or somehow excuse the years of harassment - they're basically not relevant.[/QUOTE] Good to see the sysadmin of the site showing up and basically saying "even if these aren't fake they don't mean anything." He sounds like Andy Schlafly or Ken now. [QUOTE]So far what I've seen is gators going "LOOK AT ALL THESE LOGS" as if the existence of a chat log shows something[/QUOTE] I bet I could find no less than 20 instances of this in the GG articles where the shoe's on the other foot. Replace "chat log" with "unproven claim in a tweet". Like "I received death threats". [QUOTE]When Nyberg offered self-admitted paedo confession, still whitewashing from her own keyboard, David Gerard dismisses it whole as nothing. RationalWiki still endorsed this individual on Twitter. Likewise when Ian Miles Cheong, who was present in CON himself, also does damage control by admittting to some things, Gerard also doesn't want to hear it, either. Of course, he readily believes every conspiracy theory in the interest of the right people, like that #NotYourShield was all fake (for example). Likewise, when statements go in the desired direction, they are readily accepted and parotted ("[Quinn] released chat logs from #BurgersAndFries that revealed").[/QUOTE] This is pretty much why I have no interest in going to a site I once frequented.
Are you fucking kidding me? It's the third quarter of 2016 and people are still going on about gamergate? It was stupid then and it was stupid now and I seriously don't understand why anyone takes it seriously at this point
[QUOTE=Irockz;50987021]Are you fucking kidding me? It's the third quarter of 2016 and people are still going on about gamergate? It was stupid then and it was stupid now and I seriously don't understand why anyone takes it seriously at this point[/QUOTE] Thanks for dropping by to shit post
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