• Florida school produces waivers to ‘be excused from reciting’ Pledge of Allegiance at school'
    100 replies, posted
[QUOTE=InvaderNouga;50937061]I love saying the pledge of allegiance. Every Friday at my Hospital we recite the pledge over the Hospital wide PA system after morning colors, it's patriotic as hell to see everyone stop what they're doing to recite it (for you smart asses that doesn't include people involved in direct patient care.) I think some of you guys look too much into it, it's pretty harmless. There's nothing wrong with a little bit of patriotism and pride in your country.[/QUOTE] I myself don't really care one way or the other that it plays and people pledge. Its the fact that most schools end up enforcing this shit like its the law which gets on my nerves and plenty of others.
Getting schoolkids to pledge allegiance to the flag and country is weird af and some turbo nationalist shit. In my primary school we sang the national anthem once a week and every month or 2 in secondary school but that was literally it. Anything more than that is just fucken weird.
Pledge needs to be changed or removed. Shits fucking old and outdated
[QUOTE=Aztec;50935506]I was once so engrossed in a book in 4th grade that I didn't notice the pledge, when it was over, my teacher demanded I stand up and say it alone in front of everyone. When I started saying it quietly she shouted "louder!". I used to have terrible social anxiety as a kid and the fact that my teacher didn't appreciate that I was reading and made me feel terrible really stuck with me and I tried as much as possible to skip the pledge from that point on.[/QUOTE] somewhat unrelated, but my crazy 4th grade teacher made me sing Portugal's national hymn just because I knew it. Just like you, I used to have social anxiety, which just got worse when a crazy bitch that screamed her lungs off and rubbed bad marked exams on kid's heads grabbed me real hard by the arm and forced me to do it while crying my eyes out every time I remember her, I realise a little more how fucked up in the head she was, and how everyone fucking allowed that behavior with really young kids... ontopic: I find the concept of the pledge of allegiance to be cult level of shit. Don't take me seriously on it, its just an opinion, but it sounds fucking wrong to have kids idolizing something forcefuly, kind of like brainwashed cult members or something of the sort. I don't know, it just sounds wrong and creepy. [editline]24th August 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=InvaderNouga;50937061]I love saying the pledge of allegiance. Every Friday at my Hospital we recite the pledge over the Hospital wide PA system after morning colors, it's patriotic as hell to see everyone stop what they're doing to recite it (for you smart asses that doesn't include people involved in direct patient care.) I think some of you guys look too much into it, it's pretty harmless. There's nothing wrong with a little bit of patriotism and pride in your country.[/QUOTE] Not to say that America is shit, but theres a lot to not feel pride about in not just America, but pretty much every country, and the whole patriotism deal goes down the moment big interests of big dogs come into play. While you say people look too much into it, the people you talk about might say you are too much into the whole patriotism and pride deal, or in other words, too much stereotypical "murica fuck yea" kind of person. Not saying you are. Just saying you don't need to breath red white and blue and exhale M16s and bald eagles to show that you like your country, is all. I love my country, despite its flaws, but I dont engage in whatever are the stereotypical portuguese activities nor do I flaunt around the fact that Portugal is this or that or that I love it.
When I became aware of what the pledge actually meant, I decided in middle school just to not say the "under god" part. I would still recite the rest. "One Nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." It flows a lot better anyways
Why are people against the pledge lol Im an atheist but Im still proud to be american and I understand the context. I bet these people also say oh my god but then they are mad about this lol
You don't need a waiver in the USA. Supreme court already said it's fine to sit down regardless of what the teacher says.
[QUOTE=FingerSpazem;50935491]Me and several other students throughout elementary school and junior high would never recite the pledge, we never even stood for it either. No one ever made a fuss about it and no one should.[/QUOTE] I am not juding your decison, but I am just curious as to why people do not like the pledge? Is it the god line?
[QUOTE=Firetornado;50937332]Why are people against the pledge lol Im an atheist but Im still proud to be american and I understand the context. I bet these people also say oh my god but then they are mad about this lol[/QUOTE] I don't think many people are against the pledge, they are against how it is mandated. The pledge should be a choice to participate, not something one needs a paper to op-out. Which legaly is the case, but practically it isn't always handled that way.
[QUOTE=redBadger;50937161]Pledge needs to be changed or removed. Shits fucking old and outdated[/QUOTE] Which part? [editline]23rd August 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=richard9311;50937340]I don't think many people are against the pledge, they are against how it is mandated. The pledge should be a choice to participate, not something one needs a paper to op-out.[/QUOTE] That is true, but cant people just sit down, I think it is a choice. If the teacher tries to stop a student then they should be fired. I feel like a lot of the kids at my highschool who do it just do it to be edgy tho lol....the emo kids never say it.
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[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;50937345]Look at it from an outsider perspective. It's an attempt at brain washing[/QUOTE] I guess it is a little creepy, but It seems pretty harmless to me overall. I think patriotism is good.
Never had a problem with the pledge, nothing wrong with instilling unity and pride in one's country. I just skipped the under god part
[QUOTE=SnakeHead;50937371]Never had a problem with the pledge, nothing wrong with instilling unity and pride in one's country. I just skipped the under god part[/QUOTE] Pledge falls under the same category as baptisms for me. You're forcing a child to swear to an ideal before they have any idea the implications of that.
The pledge is always a favorite topic of mine. I got sent down to the vice-principal's office for not reciting the pledge, who basically asked why I hated America and why he shouldn't give me a week's detention. As soon as I said ACLU I got sent back to the classroom, this was back in '05 when the ACLU was suing a bunch of school districts.
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;50937397]Partiotism and nationalism are the main method of governments getting their population to go to war, especially throughout the 1800s.[/QUOTE] Patriotism isnt bad lol......It can be manipulated but I truly love what america stands for as an AP Us history Student. [editline]23rd August 2016[/editline] Are you seriously arguing the pledge it used for war :what: today????
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[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;50937420]No, I said nationalism and patriotism.[/QUOTE] ok fair enough.
[QUOTE=Firetornado;50937424]ok fair enough.[/QUOTE] I'm happy for you that you intellectually reached your pride for your country, but the fact remains that near every child in america is forced to repeat a mantra every day, involving swearing their eternal allegiance to a country AND religion
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;50936252]I've heard people at my school talk shit when they see people not standing for the pledge, calling them unpatriotic scum who essentially shit on the graves of dead soldiers. welcome to texas?[/QUOTE] I mean I talked shit on the kids who didn't do it tbh because it was always the annoying edgelord who had to let everyone know his political opinion and couldn't bother to stand for five seconds at the beginning of class.
[QUOTE=TheBloodyNine;50937452]I mean I talked shit on the kids who didn't do it tbh because it was always the annoying edgelord who had to let everyone know his political opinion and couldn't bother to stand for five seconds at the beginning of class.[/QUOTE] I dont think people should have to do it but this is the case at my school also...its just edgelords lol. I respect people who do it out of principal but a lot of kids just do it to be different or edgy. [editline]23rd August 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Mining Bill;50937439]I'm happy for you that you intellectually reached your pride for your country, but the fact remains that near every child in america is forced to repeat a mantra every day, involving swearing their eternal allegiance to a country AND religion[/QUOTE] Ok I can see what you mean.
[QUOTE=Mining Bill;50937439]I'm happy for you that you intellectually reached your pride for your country, but the fact remains that near every child in america is forced to repeat a mantra every day, involving swearing their eternal allegiance to a country AND religion[/QUOTE] You say that as if us reciting it actually means that we swore allegiance like die hard patriots. Saying the pledge before class every day is not some major form of societal manipulation, especially when most of said people are too young to make any serious decisions for themselves let alone political discourse. The pledge isn't hurting anybody, if people don't want to recite it than that's fine, but don't go saying it turns people into fanatic nationalists.
[QUOTE=Araknid;50937147]Getting schoolkids to pledge allegiance to the flag and country is weird af and some turbo nationalist shit. In my primary school we sang the national anthem once a week and every month or 2 in secondary school but that was literally it. Anything more than that is just fucken weird.[/QUOTE] Really? That often, I don't even think we did it once a year here in Sweden. So that's weird to me but still not pledge weird.
[QUOTE=Firetornado;50937338]I am not juding your decison, but I am just curious as to why people do not like the pledge? Is it the god line?[/QUOTE] Because that much patriotism is really weird and intrusive on everyday life? We never did anything like that here. At the most, we heard (no one could be bothered singing) the national anthem once per week, after the school anthem, during weekly assembly. But saying that, patriotism is sort of frowned upon here. If you have Australian flags displayed on your home, or an Australian flag bumper sticker on your car, that's just a way of telling the rest of us that you're a damn bogan (equivalent of redneck, without the guns).
Reciting the pledge day after day seems really pointless to me. Most of the people in my high school, myself included, only did it because we had to. We just said the words in the most monotone voices possible, then sat back at our desks like nothing happened. Forcing people to say the pledge doesn't accomplish anything. It's not like I've forfeited my right to criticize or dislike America just because I was required to say the pledge a few hundred times over the course of my life. I'd prefer it if schools just didn't dedicate time to saying the pledge at all. Not because I think it's some creepy indoctrination tactic, but because it's a complete waste of everybody's time. I know it only takes about thirty seconds, but I'd still prefer it if that time was dedicated to learning.
[QUOTE=Tsyolin;50937476]You say that as if us reciting it actually means that we swore allegiance like die hard patriots. Saying the pledge before class every day is not some major form of societal manipulation, especially when most of said people are too young to make any serious decisions for themselves let alone political discourse. The pledge isn't hurting anybody, if people don't want to recite it than that's fine, but don't go saying it turns people into fanatic nationalists.[/QUOTE] I should introduce you to the people I went to high school with if you really think the pledge doesn't manipulate people. They treated every word in the pledge like it's gospel and physically hurt people who didn't recite it. You can say it's doesn't turn people into nationalists, but psychologists and centuries of history would disagree with you.
[QUOTE=l337k1ll4;50937601]I should introduce you to the people I went to high school with if you really think the pledge doesn't manipulate people. They treated every word in the pledge like it's gospel and physically hurt people who didn't recite it. You can say it's doesn't turn people into nationalists, but psychologists and centuries of history would disagree with you.[/QUOTE] Claiming the pledge is the main factor in a select few people turning into uber patriots just sounds silly to me when in my experience the parents and the teachers involved have more influence than anything. If your parents try and raise you as a die hard patriot than that's gonna contribute a hell of a lot more than some fuckin pledge people say once a day. Society has changed so much since the 50s, people care less and less about religion and nationalism today than ever before.
[QUOTE=Firetornado;50937338]I am not juding your decison, but I am just curious as to why people do not like the pledge? Is it the god line?[/QUOTE] Maybe they think its useless? Kind of like how people swear not to lie in court, but most likely will, even if they know they can get caught.
[QUOTE=Omali;50937388]The pledge is always a favorite topic of mine. I got sent down to the vice-principal's office for not reciting the pledge, who basically asked why I hated America and why he shouldn't give me a week's detention. As soon as I said ACLU I got sent back to the classroom, this was back in '05 when the ACLU was suing a bunch of school districts.[/QUOTE] This is a good reason, for example. Because apparently not reciting the pledge means you hate America for some people. Because you have to participate in a corny "cultish" ordeal to show that you like your country.
[QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;50937662]Maybe they think its useless? [B]Kind of like how people swear not to lie in court, but most likely will, even if they know they can get caught.[/B][/QUOTE] That's an actual issue of legality though. You can't be punished in the court of law for not saying the pledge. However, if you go on record taking an oath to tell the truth in court you can be held accountable for perjury, and you have to take the oath in order to give a testimony.
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