• Stephen Fry hits back at accusations of Islamophobia
    344 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Gatsby;42047870]Not true, agnosticism is when you simply believe that there is not enough evidence to fully believe in an god but there is still a possibility that the universe was created by some sort of being. Us humans is almost at a level(or maybe we already are?) where we can created life out of scratch. Why cant some other smart being created life? Whether we were an accident or not. But we can all agree that god is most likely not some dude who wants us killing eachother over a desert.[/QUOTE] Even Dawkins doesn't entirely discount the possibility of God; but you can not believe in something while still being open to it. Shit, most Atheists are open to the idea, but they have thus far rejected it due to convincing arguments/evidence.
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;42047874]when a group of people willingly adhere to a certain philosophy or belief system you can generally infer what those people are like judged on the system or philosophy[/QUOTE] that is a very ignorant and close minded way of thinking of people
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;42047894]that is a very ignorant and close minded way of thinking of people[/QUOTE] If a group of people all claim to really like oysters, to the point of creating a group for all oyster lovers; it's ignorant to assume they like oysters?
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;42047894]that is a very ignorant and close minded way of thinking of people[/QUOTE] i don't think so. whats ignorant about assuming a christian will believe in the general christian dogma? or a muslim in the muslim dogma?
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;42047875]Yes but if you don't hold a belief in a deity you still are by definition an atheist. This includes not caring and not having an opinion.[/QUOTE] as a technicality, yes. but areligion is still a societal stance that is recognized. you think i'm either a deist or a theist, but i don't. i just don't care about it and you can infer what you want from that
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;42047920]as a technicality, yes. but areligion is still a societal stance that is recognized. you think i'm either a deist or a theist, but i don't. i just don't care about it and you can infer what you want from that[/QUOTE] Then you're an atheist.
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;42047919]i don't think so. whats ignorant about assuming a christian will believe in the general christian dogma? or a muslim in the muslim dogma?[/QUOTE] it's ignorant to think any deist you meet follows their church to the same degree as others just because [editline]2nd September 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;42047925]Then you're an atheist.[/QUOTE] have i said i reject the existance of religious deities anywhere you can say i'm an agnostic if you want but it's less a state of thinking it's binary but just not caring. you can think what you want of me, i just don't want to be involved at all
He said some stuff about the church too [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6sz8D411kE[/media] Believe what you want but the institutionalisation and killing in the name of religion only leads to bad things
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;42047928] have i said i reject the existance of religious deities anywhere[/QUOTE] Answer this question; with a simple yes or no. Do you believe in a god/several gods? if Yes [sp]you're a theist/deist[/sp] if No [sp]you're an atheist[/sp]
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;42047928]it's ignorant to think any deist you meet follows their church to the same degree as others just because [editline]2nd September 2013[/editline] have i said i reject the existance of religious deities anywhere you can say i'm an agnostic if you want but it's less a state of thinking it's binary but just not caring. you can think what you want of me, i just don't want to be involved at all[/QUOTE] well i mean i guess you have to take into account all the different sects and all that shit but as a rule i think you can safely assume people who are members of a religion believe in/adhere to that religions beliefs/rules etc. i guess alot of the time you can't because very few people actually do and are just members of that religion because their parents were
[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;42047836]it is very much possible to not be concerned at all. agnosticism is the belief that there could or could not be, alreigion is for the most part being indifferent to matters i believe irreligion is a synonym. i just never hear people use it[/QUOTE] i'v heard this called "apatheism". it's basically the idea that whether god exists or not is completely irrelevant to a person's life, so apatheists don't concern themselves with either belief or denial of any supernatural entity.
Stephen Fry is my lord and saviour.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;42047977]i'v heard this called "apatheism". it's basically the idea that whether god exists or not is completely irrelevant to a person's life, so apatheists don't concern themselves with either belief or denial of any supernatural entity.[/QUOTE] i can get behind this because really i doesn't matter, but the problem i have isn't with peoples beliefs, it's with organized religion and the cycle of ignorance is causes. if someones religion isn't going to affect my life or the lives of others (and i'm including the children of the religious here) then i have no problem with it
[QUOTE=Gatsby;42047870]Not true, agnosticism is when you simply believe that there is not enough evidence to fully believe in an god but there is still a possibility that the universe was created by some sort of being.[/QUOTE] no that's agnostic atheism
[QUOTE=Gatsby;42047707]It's 2013 guys, being an atheist is pretty over rated now. Agnostic masterrace[/QUOTE] You do realize being an Atheist isn't "L0L FUCK YOU GUYS GOD ISN'T REAL. What a fucking moron you are!" right?
[QUOTE=nehkz;42048081]You do realize being an Atheist isn't "L0L FUCK YOU GUYS GOD ISN'T REAL. What a fucking moron you are!" right?[/QUOTE] It was a joke, there is nothing wrong with atheism or theism.
I can see Stephen Fry not being an Islamophobe, but Richard Dawkins most definitely is. Which perhaps is why people seeing Stephen Fry defend Dawkins for his focus upon Islam would level the same accusations at him
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;42048046]i can get behind this because really i doesn't matter, but the problem i have isn't with peoples beliefs, it's with organized religion and the cycle of ignorance is causes. if someones religion isn't going to affect my life or the lives of others (and i'm including the children of the religious here) then i have no problem with it[/QUOTE] yea pretty much the same. i dont care much if there is a god but i fucking hate the organized religions(christianity, islam, hinduism, etc.) and the dogma that they teach.
[QUOTE=supersnail11;42048055]no that's agnostic atheism[/QUOTE] There is no agnostic atheism or agnostic theism. Those are outdated terms from years ago. It doesnt matter how far you lean, you are just an agnostic. An agnostic is a person who believes that the existence of a greater power, such as a god, cannot be proven or disproved; therefore an agnostic wallows in the complexity of the existence of higher beings. Agnostics on religion (Christianity, Islam, Buddhists, etc): Religious zealots are often viewed as ignorant by agnostics’ because of their blind following of a supreme being which may or may not exist. Agnostics will often question the existence of a supreme power because a lot of modern religious beliefs have no basis in modern logic; therefore blind following of popular religions is viewed as an easy out for people who chose not to think for themselves. Agnostics on atheism: On the other end of the spectrum, unlike atheists, an agnostic uses a more scientific approach to their belief system. An agnostic knows that just because there is no physical proof of the existence of a higher being, it dose not automatically mean that one does not exist. An agnostic views an atheist on the same plane as a religious zealot; often because the belief that human beings are the pinnacle of intelligence and there are few things that we do not or have the potential to understand. The realization of knowing that “we cannot know everything” is the backbone of the agnostic belief.
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;42047734]I have respect for other people's cultures but when it impacts society in a way that is violent or misogynistic and holds back scientific development and research, fuck their culture and their religion.[/QUOTE] Hey now, the cultures at hand are relevant to society and scientific development in research [sp]in the 1300s[/sp]
[QUOTE=Gatsby;42048169] Agnostics on atheism: On the other end of the spectrum, unlike atheists, an agnostic uses a more scientific approach to their belief system. An agnostic knows that just because there is no physical proof of the existence of a higher being, it dose not automatically mean that one does not exist. An agnostic views an atheist on the same plane as a religious zealot; often because the belief that human beings are the pinnacle of intelligence and there are few things that we do not or have the potential to understand. [/QUOTE] lol any agnostic who thinks this needs to retake their middle school science class because this is not how science works.
[QUOTE=Lonestriper;42048144]I can see Stephen Fry not being an Islamophobe, but Richard Dawkins most definitely is. Which perhaps is why people seeing Stephen Fry defend Dawkins for his focus upon Islam would level the same accusations at him[/QUOTE] Dawkins simply isn't afraid to throw the same shit at Islam that he throws at Christianity. He's no more an Islamophobe than he is a Christianophobe.
The middle east would have been as westernized as Morocco is right now if it wasnt for all that shit that went up a few decades ago and that whole war on terror which caused more harm than good. [editline]2nd September 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=yawmwen;42048207]lol any agnostic who thinks this needs to retake their middle school science class because this is not how science works.[/QUOTE] Maybe you should? In science you cant prove ANYTHING 100%. Thats the first thing they teach you in 6th grade.
[QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;42048218]Dawkins simply isn't afraid to throw the same shit at Islam that he throws at Christianity. He's no more an Islamophobe than he is a Christianophobe.[/QUOTE] Ah yes, he hates both of them equally. Except when he doesn't [quote="http://old.richarddawkins.net/discussions/624093-support-christian-missions-in-africa-no-but"]Given that Islam is such an unmitigated evil, and looking at the map supplied by this Christian site, should we be supporting Christian missions in Africa? My answer is still no, but I thought it was worth raising the question. Given that atheism hasn't any chance in Africa for the foreseeable future, could our enemy's enemy be our friend? Richard [img]http://i.imgur.com/oIkcL92.jpg[/img][/quote]
[QUOTE=Lonestriper;42048271]Ah yes, he hates both of them equally. Except when he doesn't[/QUOTE] Wow what an huge hypocrite. Criticizes religion for it's violence and yet says this.
'my answer is still no'
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;42048371]'my answer is still no'[/QUOTE] certainly this qualification doesn't reveal any latent preference for Christianity nor greater dislike for Islam in the rest of the article!
[QUOTE=Gatsby;42048228]Maybe you should? In science you cant prove ANYTHING 100%. Thats the first thing they teach you in 6th grade.[/QUOTE] so you don't believe that the earth revolves around the sun?
[QUOTE=Gatsby;42048228]The middle east would have been as westernized as Morocco is right now if it wasnt for all that shit that went up a few decades ago and that whole war on terror which caused more harm than good. [editline]2nd September 2013[/editline] Maybe you should? In science you cant prove ANYTHING 100%. Thats the first thing they teach you in 6th grade.[/QUOTE] What's with all the christians recently who post that science itself tells you you can't really be certain you're right So what? All that tells me is you don't understand what that means. What science means. Yes, we can't be sure of an idea, so we test it, and test it and test it, and that never really stops because an idea invalidated once is no longer as close to a fact as we think it can be so it's not best to follow that. This doesn't mean science is as you put it. Please don't try and twist that shit for your own benefit when it has nothing to do with it.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;42048422]What's with all the christians recently who post that science itself tells you you can't really be certain you're right So what? All that tells me is you don't understand what that means. What science means. Yes, we can't be sure of an idea, so we test it, and test it and test it, and that never really stops because an idea invalidated once is no longer as close to a fact as we think it can be so it's not best to follow that. This doesn't mean science is as you put it. Please don't try and twist that shit for your own benefit when it has nothing to do with it.[/QUOTE] in life you make assumptions. it is logical to assume that which is backed up by evidence, and illogical to assume that which is not.
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