Canadian Court strikes down "White, straight, single male" scholarship and "White, straight, single
114 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Antlerp;49799162]so are you saying there aren't any grade requirements to go to uni in the USA already? Wat the hell man. I am pretty sure people need GRADES & MONEY to go to uni there, whereas with free education all you need is the GRADES, so it eliminates the problem of smart poor people not getting the education to maximise their potential.
And surely, if a student is doing badly during his studies, he is held back and/or is not able to continue?
I don't like quotas for the same reason I don't like expensive, paid-for education. Young people who don't have the benefit of wealthy parents are left out.[/QUOTE]
Re-read my post.
There are already existing grade requirements (i.e. GPA, ACT, SAT) to even be accepted by a Uni in the US, of course the threshold for each of these three varies from college to college. What I was saying is using said grading thresholds (albeit maybe a few ticks higher on the scale) as filters for people to get full ride scholarships funded by the govt. (i.e. "free" education).
I used the example of TN's HOPE scholarship as a basis for how this (free education) could be achieved by expanding an already existing system to pay in full, not just a quarter or third of the total cost. With the limitation that if you want free education, you still need to keep your grades up, and it be limited to just four years.
Has anyone done any research into this at all? In Canada there's no discrimination of straight white males via lack of scholarships, in fact millions of dollars of scholarships go unclaimed every year, with the overwhelming majority having no prerequisites. The doctor who wanted to create this one in particular was obviously a bigot, there's no need to create such a specific scholarship that excludes minority's when there are so many available already
[quote]Studentawards has $82 million in financial awards available to students across the country per year, and those are almost exclusively non-institution-based scholarships, bursaries that sit outside of educational system, which are already earmarked,” Henderson says. “No official study has been done on how much goes unrewarded, but … we estimate more than $15 million goes unclaimed each year. That number is probably low.[/quote]
[quote]There’s also a misconception about eligibility.
“A lot of people don’t understand that over 50 per cent [of available scholarships] aren’t merit-based,” Henderson notes. “A lot of students don’t even look because they think ‘I’m not an athlete,’ or ‘I’m not an A-plus-plus student,’ so they say ‘Why bother?’ But the reality is there’s money out there for them for school."[/quote]
[url]https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/blogs/pay-day-/millions-canadian-scholarship-dollars-going-unclaimed-193114435.html[/url]
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
Americans pls stop filling this thread up with your anecdotal evidence it has no place here
[QUOTE=June;49799653]Americans pls stop filling this thread up with your anecdotal evidence it has no place here[/QUOTE]
Sure thing bud. Us lowly Americans will just keep quiet so that you can enjoy the brave new world your government is creating that sets a legal double-standard against white people.
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=person11;49799348]my point is that i did not need a specific white male scholarship in order to get my education subsidized because i was given an advantage due to my skin, gender, and upbringing, etc[/QUOTE]
That's very good for you, but what about the "trailer trash" white guys who don't want to be confined to blue collar wage slavery for the rest of their lives? Guess they're just out of luck, aren't they?
Plus, how do you figure your gender gave you an academic advantage? Don't women tend to do better in school anyway? Not to mention the fact that when you enter the workforce, depending on the industry, women will receive preferential treatment when hiring. You sure lucked out there!
[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;49798973]lol because education grows on trees right?[/QUOTE]
don't you like, uhm, pay taxes?
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;49799496]As I've learned searching for scholarships, being a straight christian Caucasian male with little military or police family history and in good health means I don't get [I]jack shit[/I] in scholarships.
Change [I]any one of those variables[/I] and they rain them on you.[/QUOTE]
Actually not true.
I'm Jewish and disabled (aspergers)
Aspergers has a grand total of 1 viable scholarship and being Jewish gives me 2 viable scholarships.
[QUOTE=June;49799653]Has anyone done any research into this at all? In Canada there's no discrimination of straight white males via lack of scholarships, in fact millions of dollars of scholarships go unclaimed every year, with the overwhelming majority having no prerequisites. The doctor who wanted to create this one in particular was obviously a bigot, there's no need to create such a specific scholarship that excludes minority's when there are so many available already
[url]https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/blogs/pay-day-/millions-canadian-scholarship-dollars-going-unclaimed-193114435.html[/url]
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
Americans pls stop filling this thread up with your anecdotal evidence it has no place here[/QUOTE]
You guys stop commenting on our domestic policies, maybe we'll oblige.
[QUOTE=Swilly;49799381]You should re-read your data.
Native and Island Americans get the most. Their own conclusion goes against their own data.
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
Also the data points out that the amount of scholarship privately is equal to the population size in proportion.[/QUOTE]
They don't receive the largest amount of scholarships, the percentage of Native and Island Americans who receive scholarships is higher than the percentages for other groups. Overall, Native and Island Americans receive 1.6% of scholarships while being 0.8% of the population, compared to white students receiving 69% of scholarships while being 61% of the population.
Also:
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/eYEb3EX.png[/IMG]
[QUOTE=srobins;49799093]It's probably because of racism and not a variety of other factors right. I'm sure the people going over scholarship applications are just sitting at their desk and waiting with baited breath for a minority student to apply so they can righteously turn them down. Notice that white students get about 10% more than their "fair share" of [I]merit-based[/i] scholarships, not scholarships in general. Could it be possible white students study more for those scholarships?[/QUOTE]
White students are still more likely to receive scholarships if you only look at students with a high GPA.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/eZ0iBk4.png[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Wowza!;49799756]They don't receive the largest amount of scholarships, the percentage of Native and Island Americans who receive scholarships is higher than the percentages for other groups. Overall, Native and Island Americans receive 1.6% of scholarships while being 0.8% of the population, compared to white students receiving 69% of scholarships while being 61% of the population.
Also:
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/eYEb3EX.png[/IMG]
White students are still more likely to receive scholarships if you only look at students with a high GPA.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/eZ0iBk4.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]
You're basically confirming what I said; the data shows that the majority of students who attend college get the largest share of scholarships.
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
This isn't some, 'white people hate other races'. Its literally 0.# off from the actual percentage of students.
That's how it should be.
[QUOTE=person11;49799348]i should probably clarify that I am including merit/incentive scholarships with need based ones
if you include scholarships schools give to students to incentivize them to attend that school, white people end up more than making up for the lack of scholarships that target them
I could not find a scholarship for me (i did look) when I applied to grad school since I am also a straight white male, but I did end up getting scholarship offers from schools anyway
my point is that i did not need a specific white male scholarship in order to get my education subsidized because i was given an advantage due to my skin, gender, and upbringing, etc
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
true, and its pretty similar in the united states: people less likely to be able to afford schooling or who have other structural disadvantages borne out of discrimination are the ones who have scholarships made for them
everything balances out if you look at the amount of money awarded to people rather than looking only at number of scholarships targeted towards [B]different kinds of people[/B][/QUOTE]
Why discriminate by race when you can look at income, etc?
Whats with this "fuck poor white" thing you got going?
[QUOTE=Wowza!;49799756]They don't receive the largest amount of scholarships, the percentage of Native and Island Americans who receive scholarships is higher than the percentages for other groups. Overall, Native and Island Americans receive 1.6% of scholarships while being 0.8% of the population, compared to white students receiving 69% of scholarships while being 61% of the population.
Also:
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/eYEb3EX.png[/IMG]
White students are still more likely to receive scholarships if you only look at students with a high GPA.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/eZ0iBk4.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]
So you're looking at a 4% discrepancy between statistical perfection and reality.. Meanwhile on average, minority students receive 20% funding than white students. I'm not seeing the injustice against minorities here.
[QUOTE=srobins;49799710]Sure thing bud. Us lowly Americans will just keep quiet so that you can enjoy the brave new world your government is creating that sets a legal double-standard against white people.
[/QUOTE]
lmao did you even read the article? this isn't the first time this has happened
[quote]In another case dating back to 1990, the Ontario Court of Appeal found that a trust creating a scholarship exclusively for white Christians of British nationality or parentage was “premised on notions of racism and religious superiority that contravened contemporary public policy.”[/quote]
This is all of course ignoring the fact that statistics mean fuck all to me, an individual student who just wants to go to school. Me printing out these statistics and pushing them against my monitor as I'm denied for scholarships and even actively prevented and discouraged from applying for them in the first place doesn't change anything for me or anyone else.
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=June;49799817]lmao did you even read the article? this isn't the first time this has happened[/QUOTE]
Oh, so this is just a continuation of a long history of Canadian legislation enforcing a double-standard against white people. Neat! You really made me the fool on that one.
Why not have scholarships based purely on wealth status? You're poor? You qualify for a chance. Why even bring skin color or gender into this? It's not like rich minorities need scholarships while poor anyone does. Strange how we're so liberal and anti discrimination and yet shit like this is 100% okay and no one bats an eye.
[QUOTE=Swilly;49799782]You're basically confirming what I said; the data shows that the majority of students who attend college get the largest share of scholarships.
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
This isn't some, 'white people hate other races'. Its literally 0.# off from the actual percentage of students.
That's how it should be.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=srobins;49799814]So you're looking at a 4% discrepancy between statistical perfection and reality.. Meanwhile on average, minority students receive 20% funding than white students. I'm not seeing the injustice against minorities here.[/QUOTE]
I think you guys are looking at the wrong statistics.
[IMG]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6909475/chart.PNG[/IMG]
White students receive 69% of scholarships, but make up 62% of the population. Minorities receive 30% of scholarships, and make up 38% of the population. This doesn't necessarily mean the organizations granting the scholarships are intentionally preferring one race over the other, it could be the result of unconscious biases or criteria that minorities are less likely to meet (e.g. horseback riding). If you didn't get a scholarship, it's more likely due to only 5.5% of students receive scholarships, rather than the amount of scholarships targeted to minorities (<10%).
[QUOTE=Wowza!;49800048]White students receive 69% of scholarships, but make up 62% of the population. Minorities receive 30% of scholarships, and make up 38% of the population. This doesn't necessarily mean the organizations granting the scholarships are intentionally preferring one race over the other, it could be the result of unconscious biases or criteria that minorities are less likely to meet (e.g. horseback riding). If you didn't get a scholarship, it's more likely due to only 5.5% of students receive scholarships, rather than the amount of scholarships targeted to minorities (<10%).[/QUOTE]
There are tons of possible explanations, but here are the two most likely in my opinion:
1) White people are more likely to apply.
2) White people are more likely to have higher academic records, SAT scores, ACT scores, etc. that makes them more likely to get scholarships.
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
A much more useful number would be the number of scholarship applicants who meet all requirements that get or don't get the scholarship.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;49800071]lol this is such a poor perception. Scholarships shouldn't be need-based they should be MERIT based. You should earn it, not be given a handout just because you don't make as much money as the next person.[/QUOTE]
This still doesn't explain affirmative action as it's not merit based. Unless being certain race is a merit to achieve.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;49800071]lol this is such a poor perception. Scholarships shouldn't be need-based they should be MERIT based. You should earn it, not be given a handout just because you don't make as much money as the next person.[/QUOTE]
According to wikipedia there's also "need-based" and "student-based" and a bunch of other ones which may or may not be merit based.
Makes me wonder though, isn't it kind of counterproductive to help those who do well, on the basis that they do well to begin with?
And so many alternative scholarships, when simply making education free is verifiably beneficial to the whole country.
[QUOTE=Wowza!;49800048]I think you guys are looking at the wrong statistics.
[IMG]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6909475/chart.PNG[/IMG]
White students receive 69% of scholarships, but make up 62% of the population. Minorities receive 30% of scholarships, and make up 38% of the population. This doesn't necessarily mean the organizations granting the scholarships are intentionally preferring one race over the other, it could be the result of unconscious biases or criteria that minorities are less likely to meet (e.g. horseback riding). If you didn't get a scholarship, it's more likely due to only 5.5% of students receive scholarships, rather than the amount of scholarships targeted to minorities (<10%).[/QUOTE]
Um nope. My 4% disparity was based on the previous graph you posted. You can check my math yourself. 4% disparity and minorities STILL get 20% more money.
[QUOTE=download;49798042]So, they going to ban other scholarships that discriminate or does it only apply to white straight people?[/QUOTE]
According to our Canadian Charter of Human Rights, yes. Discrimination of any form (age, race, gender, etc) is clearly stated as a right that you shouldn't be discriminated against.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;49800071]lol this is such a poor perception. Scholarships shouldn't be need-based they should be MERIT based. You should earn it, not be given a handout just because you don't make as much money as the next person.[/QUOTE]
They actually should, if you grew up in a poor area with a shitty school system you should be given a leg up in opportunities than someone who grew up in an affluent area with a nationally distinguished school that gave their students all the resources to be successful.
It just shouldn't be based on skin color.
How on earth did things turn out like this?
Even in shitty little Estonia the only relevant scholarships either require you to have a high GPA (and/or actively contribute to university life) or be relatively poor (this is a state-sponsored scholarship even)
there are a few that are only for the disabled, but that's it
The "can't be a feminist or a homosexual" stipulation to the scholarship is stupid and wrong and I wouldn't be surprised if it was canned on that wording alone.
But no it's all because the institution hates white people, right?
[QUOTE=Jim Morrison;49800506]The "can't be a feminist or a homosexual" stipulation to the scholarship is stupid and wrong and I wouldn't be surprised if it was canned on that wording alone.
But no it's all because the institution hates white people, right?[/QUOTE]
"Can't be a white person" is already a stipulation on plenty of scholarships.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;49800071]lol this is such a poor perception. Scholarships shouldn't be need-based they should be MERIT based. You should earn it, not be given a handout just because you don't make as much money as the next person.[/QUOTE]
If you wanna talk about poor perception a meritocracy is the dumbest fucking idea there is. But I expect nothing less from a neoconservative.
[QUOTE=srobins;49800353]Um nope. My 4% disparity was based on the previous graph you posted. You can check my math yourself. 4% disparity and minorities STILL get 20% more money.[/QUOTE]
[IMG]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6909475/chart2.PNG[/IMG]
White students make up 69% of high GPA students, but receive 77% of scholarships. Minorities make up 30% of high GPA students, but receive 22% of scholarships. Minorities receive a higher average scholarship amount, but receive disproportionately fewer scholarships overall.
[QUOTE=Jim Morrison;49800506]The "can't be a feminist or a homosexual" stipulation to the scholarship is stupid and wrong and I wouldn't be surprised if it was canned on that wording alone.
But no it's all because the institution hates white people, right?[/QUOTE]
Yeah I don't think the people up in arms about this have quite thought it through. This isn't the court banning scholarships, this is the court ruling in the case of one trust based on the will of the deceased being racist and misogynistic, which is possible but I haven't seen the entire will myself so I can't say for sure. Since the universities in question come under the purview of the government, I can see why they wouldn't want to legitimize a scholarship granted by someone with these views. Even forgetting the racial and feminist component, them being meant for heterosexuals only is probably grounds for it not being acceptable.
[QUOTE=dark-vivec;49800544]"Can't be a white person" is already a stipulation on plenty of scholarships.[/QUOTE]
I did some searches to find applicable scholarships to the two universities mentioned in the article and none of them said that. There were indeed a few (a very few, out of dozens, possibly hundreds I perused) that granted financial aid to pepole of a certain ethnicity but it wasn't just "not white" people, it was anything but a specific ethnicity. The most common I saw were aboriginal and African, but again these were greatly outnumbered by general scholarships who's stipulations did not take into account race or any other personal aspect besides academic performance and field of study.
Related: I see a lot of people complain about the lack of scholarships for white students but few solutions. Most scholarships are private ventures. What stops a group of concerned citizens from starting their own trust?
[QUOTE=Ragekipz;49798276]It's really a Marxist way of thinking. Put people in boxes. The individual cases don't matter.[/QUOTE]
you don't really know much about marxism do you
[editline]23rd February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Raidyr;49800853]Related: I see a lot of people complain about the lack of scholarships for white students but few solutions. Most scholarships are private ventures. What stops a group of concerned citizens from starting their own trust?[/QUOTE]
the canadian government, apparently
[QUOTE=Lord of Ears;49800976]
the canadian government, apparently[/QUOTE]
The Canadian government stops a guy with a lot of money from giving away some of his money to prospective college students? News to me.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49798054]Its an extreme double standard. Minority groups can "help their own" but whites cannot.
[url]http://abcnews.go.com/US/confusion-white-high-schooler-returns-scholarship-intended-black/story?id=16544544[/url]
A low income white guy earns a scholarship but has to give it up because of his skin tone. How is that not racism and how is that not spitting in the face of creating a "color-blind" society?[/QUOTE]
This is probably the best post in the thread about this issue considering that many other people who are being babies about this issue are generally spewing uneducated nonsense that would not apply to Canada.
In 2016, when the economy is terrible in Canada, scholarships should only be based on financial status and not race. But even though I'm taking university courses, I don't think it's a huge issue because in Canada, there are quite a few scholarships (that are government funded, I believe) aimed at people who don't make that much money that ANYONE could apply for one, you just need to ask. I don't know the situation in United States, so I'm not commenting on it because it would be dumb to do. Much like it's dumb to comment on Canadian Scholarships without knowing much about it.
I think that uneducated people (on the issue of canadian scholarships and aboriginals in canada) like snowmew need to realise that getting mad at the fact that there isn't a straight white male ect ect scholarship is just fucking appalling because you're asking for a race-based scholarship when you're complaining that other race-based scholarships exist like jesus christ. Get mad at the actual issues.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;49800996]The Canadian government stops a guy with a lot of money from giving away some of his money to prospective college students? News to me.[/QUOTE]
It shouldn't be news to you. That's what this very thread is about.
You say "most scholarships are private ventures", as in there can be no interference by the government ie scholarships can go to whatever demographic the donor wants them to. But then a scholarship aimed solely at straight, white people is taken down because the will is "racist and misogynistic". Of fucking course it is, it discriminates against people that are not of a specific race or sexual orientation. But then again so are every scholarship that are limited to certain races, yet those aren't taken down.
Your argument about the will being racist is nil, because so do every other race-based scholarship, and those are left alone. It is obvious that the government operates under a double standard here, most likely to appeal to the "power+privilege" braindeads.
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