Sorry, not one dude, the fucking CEO.
[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;46882170]Yeah they should have spent that time on HL3.[/QUOTE]
Except this was designed by a bunch of hardware engineers, it's not like they can't do multiple things at once.
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;46881194]It's an xbox controller you wont be able to return to gamestop[/QUOTE]
Just like everything else at Valve!
[sp]Why do we even give them more money?[/sp]
They should have thrown a trackball on it. You can get as good as a mouse on that shit. Trackpad not so much.
[QUOTE=Saber15;46881420]There's a reason it looks like an Xbox controller; because xbox controllers are very well designed (ergonomics wise) and comfortable to use.
There's only so many ways you can design a controller that makes sense with a person's hands, and the initial design of the Steam controller was completely idiotic; your thumbs would hurt after thirty minutes of playing.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/p5WmUUv.jpg[/t][/QUOTE]
also it only really works for shooters. like, try using that to play a fighting game or racing game. yo u'd die. you would literally die, your life would end.
[QUOTE=AntonioR;46881041]Steam Machines dead, two more bad ideas to go.[/QUOTE]
Dead? Where? They are going to be shown off at GDC.
I want to point out that this article is according to the [I]CEO of Origin,[/I] Valve's direct competitor.
I'll be hugging my grain of salt over here.
Oh, and from the last line of the article,
[quote]
Origin has a new, high-end living room PC of its own in the works called Omega. Check back later in the week for more on this new device.
[/quote]
What. I couldn't imagine a more suspicious looking hit piece.
[QUOTE=Antimuffin;46882310]Dead? Where? They are going to be shown off at GDC.[/QUOTE]
[quote]"I think that's kind of pretty much dead," he said of the term Steam Machine. "It's like a living room PC--is now the new term. Living room PCs have been around forever. That's not anything new either. But it seems like there's a legitimate demand and push for living room PCs."[/quote]
Presumably that's where the notion of steam machines being "dead".
Origin PC should probably change their name, everyone confuses it with EA's Origin. Poor guys.
[QUOTE=Starlight 456;46880990]Valve, April 2015 - "[I]We've redesigned the Steam controller to be even more like a 360 pad![/I]"[/QUOTE]
If that's where their experiments have led them to, then that's just the result. No point in forcing a gimmick if it makes the controller a piece of trash once the novelty has worn off.
I don't think the reason they're sinking so many resources into a new controller design is because they want to stick out, but because they realized they'd need something that can support a wider variety of games that demand more precision and buttons that existing console controller designs. If their experiments had (somehow, in some parallel dimension) led them to the result that existing controllers are already perfectly fine for that, they probably just would have scrapped this projects. Right now it seems like they've come to the conclusion that existing controller designs are already mostly fine for their purpose if they sprinkle them with some haptic feedback magic and some extra buttons.
[QUOTE=Nemisis116;46881340]I still don't even know the purpose for this thing, PC gamers are just going to keep playing their PC and console gamers are just going to stick with ps4/xbone
Who even wants this[/QUOTE]
Seems to me the idea is to combine console gaming comfort (easy-to-setup all-in-one package, playing it from a couch in the living room, easy local co-op) with the variety of features and games usually exclusive to PC (games that require very complex or precise controls like like RTS or non-aim-assist-FPS, lots of customization options from your initial hardware setup to installing software that complements your OS' functions to mods and rebindable keys).
It's more or less just much a perpetuation of the current trend of consoles becoming more like PCs/gaining PC-like features like web browsers, media players, streaming capabilities.
[QUOTE=nintenman1;46881534]I think one of valve's biggest challenges in promoting the steam machine platform with Linux especially is the simple fact that the game library for Linux isn't 1/3 of what the windows library is. If they want it to not be DOA they either make a valve supported wine wrapper of some sort to allow more devs to package a zero-effort Linux compatible version, or cede the reality that hardware partners would need to have windows as a base OS under steam big picture in order to get the full "steam experience".[/QUOTE]
During their initial Steam Universe announcement they've both talked about AAA devs being in on the project and in-home streaming, meaning you should - in theory - be able to look forward to more Linux-compatible releases in the future and until then you should be able to carry over your existing Windows library.
And I don't have any stats for this whatsoever, but I feel like there's been more big games with Linux compatibility recently. idk, could be wrong on this one.
This is just another "valve is working on shit" article, I'll actually bother forming an opinion when I can see the final controller design. Speculating on this crap is like speculating on half life 3.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;46882289]also it only really works for shooters. like, try using that to play a fighting game or racing game. yo u'd die. you would literally die, your life would end.[/QUOTE]
But it wasn't ever intended for use in fighting games or racing games, it was very specifically an alternative to mouse and keyboard for games that normally play better with those.
[QUOTE=Marlamin;46882352]Origin PC should probably change their name, everyone confuses it with EA's Origin. Poor guys.[/QUOTE]
k
[img]http://5crat.ch/a/b1hv[/img]
I was really interested in all this, but Valve missed all the marks. They should stick to software/digital distribution.
[QUOTE=Elstumpo;46882913]I was really interested in all this, but Valve missed all the marks. They should stick to software/digital distribution.[/QUOTE]
Fixing Steam's massive array of flaws and getting the catalog straight so it's no longer a laughing stock would be a nice start.
[QUOTE=No_Excuses;46881082]The touch pad idea still seems like nonsense. Someone would have done it by now if it didn't suck.[/QUOTE]
It must suck because nobody else does it.
It sucks because everybody else does it.
Its not like they are making circular laptop pads either, they understand that there needs to be reasonable physical feedback, so they added the rings and the vibrations.
[editline]8th January 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=Primigenes;46881678]I knew the track pads would be shit when Valve made a video of a guy playing Portal, Papers Please, Civilization V, and him awkwardly playing Counter Strike.[/QUOTE]
I thought it was pretty impressive, compared to a joystick, not to a mouse.
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;46881099]The Steam Controller's been a complete joke since they've decided to drop the interesting features just because a bunch of dumb playtesters couldn't deal with a different button layout.
If you're going to spend a lot of money on a controller you may as well get yourself a Xbox One controller now that the pilots are available for it.[/QUOTE]
I lost all the interest in it ever since they changed the owl like synaptics control thingies into physical keys.
Actually no, i mean the touchpad
[QUOTE=No_Excuses;46881082]The touch pad idea still seems like nonsense. Someone would have done it by now if it didn't suck.[/QUOTE]
This kind of thinking inhibits innovation.
[QUOTE=Scratch.;46882911]k
[img]http://5crat.ch/a/b1hv[/img][/QUOTE]
Good work, you just proved his point.
Look, this is all you need to use a gamepad with a computer:
[img]http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51oFscITN5L._SY300_.jpg[/img]
Use the left stick for moving the mouse, L2 = RightClick, R2 = Left Click
Done.
Those track pad things better be amazing. D-Pad thing looks awful though
valve utterly blew it because in the race with the next gen consoles, they were suddenly struck by the fact that they can't do the classic valve "oh when it's done it'll be done" and then delay it for 6 months, because when they did the steam machine suppliers told them to get fucked
Does Valve realize that September of this year will mark 10 years since Day of Defeat Source was released? I feel like shit thinking about how that still feels like a "new cool release" from Valve. Seriously Valve, make some games again. It's killing me.
I hope the final design ditches the thumbstick and goes back to this:
[t]http://media.steampowered.com/img/steamuniverse/DOG_controller_MED.jpg[/t]
I'd love to get one, not sure why people hate the touchpads so much
[QUOTE=ThePanther;46883621]Look, this is all you need to use a gamepad with a computer:
[img]http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51oFscITN5L._SY300_.jpg[/img]
Use the left stick for moving the mouse, L2 = RightClick, R2 = Left Click
Done.[/QUOTE]
You can just use the trackpad like a laptop mouse, even clicking with it works.
[QUOTE=ThePanther;46883621]Look, this is all you need to use a gamepad with a computer:
[img]http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51oFscITN5L._SY300_.jpg[/img]
Use the left stick for moving the mouse, L2 = RightClick, R2 = Left Click
Done.[/QUOTE]
Try playing mouse based games with that though. It won't be good.
[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;46883667]valve utterly blew it because in the race with the next gen consoles, they were suddenly struck by the fact that they can't do the classic valve "oh when it's done it'll be done" and then delay it for 6 months, because when they did the steam machine suppliers told them to get fucked[/QUOTE]
Steam Machines was a doomed project from the start. I'm amazed that a company with so many resources behind it can fuck up so badly in the research department. Nobody wants a Steam console. There is no market for it.
[QUOTE=Pelf;46883739]I hope the final design ditches the thumbstick and goes back to this:
[t]http://media.steampowered.com/img/steamuniverse/DOG_controller_MED.jpg[/t]
I'd love to get one, [b]not sure why people hate the touchpads so much[/b][/QUOTE]
-Ridges would fucking hurt if gaming for long periods of time
-Complete lack of tactile feedback, aside from aforementioned pain ridges
-If your thumb leaves a joystick you know what'll happen - it'll snap back towards the center
-If you leave a touchpad what happens? Because you won't want to have your thumb pressed into a touchpad hard (especially with pain ridges) your fairly light grip will result in momentary non-contacts, which either means valve has to have a "safety timer" where it waits to make sure you really let go, introducing extra lag, or it means the controller will momentarily report a 0 position. Alternatively they could make the touchpads always report the last position you pressed, but that would be hideous for people used to controllers that return to 0 when you let go.
Basically touchpads are fun to play with but fucking christ they're out of place in the gaming scene, and the person who added the pain ridges especially needs a good slap
Oh and honestly a gamepad for a living-room PC not being designed to at least have a detachable keyboard is fucked up, you'd be better off with a wireless 360 controller in that regard because a tonne of games on steam expect you to just get up and grab a keyboard whenever you need to type things
[QUOTE=Elspin;46883949]-Ridges would fucking hurt if gaming for long periods of time
-Complete lack of tactile feedback, aside from aforementioned pain ridges
-If your thumb leaves a joystick you know what'll happen - it'll snap back towards the center
-If you leave a touchpad what happens? Because you won't want to have your thumb pressed into a touchpad hard (especially with pain ridges) your fairly light grip will result in momentary non-contacts, which either means valve has to have a "safety timer" where it waits to make sure you really let go, introducing extra lag, or it means the controller will momentarily report a 0 position. Alternatively they could make the touchpads always report the last position you pressed, but that would be hideous for people used to controllers that return to 0 when you let go.
Basically touchpads are fun to play with but fucking christ they're out of place in the gaming scene, and the person who added the pain ridges especially needs a good slap
Oh and honestly a gamepad for a living-room PC not being designed to at least have a detachable keyboard is fucked up, you'd be better off with a wireless 360 controller in that regard because a tonne of games on steam expect you to just get up and grab a keyboard whenever you need to type things[/QUOTE]
- They use those precise vibrator things to provide tactile feedback
- If you let your finger off a thumbstick you know what'll happen - it'll snap back towards the center
- what touchpad do you use that you have to constantly press hard?
- Valve made that character wheel thing so it's not impossible. Not ideal, but it works well enough for "Input character name" [url]http://netdna.walyou.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads//2013/09/SteamOS-Steam-Machines-Steam-Controller-9.jpg[/url]
[QUOTE]Haptics
Trackpads, by their nature, are less physical than thumbsticks. By themselves, they are “light touch” devices and don’t offer the kind of visceral feedback that players get from pushing joysticks around. As we investigated trackpad-based input devices, it became clear through testing that we had to find ways to add more physicality to the experience. It also became clear that “rumble”, as it has been traditionally implemented (a lopsided weight spun around a single axis), was not going to be enough. Not even close.
The Steam Controller is built around a new generation of super-precise haptic feedback, employing dual linear resonant actuators. These small, strong, weighted electro-magnets are attached to each of the dual trackpads. They are capable of delivering a wide range of force and vibration, allowing precise control over frequency, amplitude, and direction of movement.
This haptic capability provides a vital channel of information to the player - delivering in-game information about speed, boundaries, thresholds, textures, action confirmations, or any other events about which game designers want players to be aware. It is a higher-bandwidth haptic information channel than exists in any other consumer product that we know of. As a parlour trick they can even play audio waveforms and function as speakers.[/QUOTE]
unless valve pull some magic i can picture this whole thing being a complete failure and it'll be so embarrassing for them
[editline]8th January 2015[/editline]
left 4 dead 2, portal 2, dota 2, cs:go
valve's latest products were never really asked for by anyone but they turned out to be successful but i'm not sure about how their console will go
[QUOTE=Pelf;46884021]- They use those precise vibrator things to provide tactile feedback[/QUOTE]
I have a hard time believing that the motors won't crap out or the constant vibrating of your fingers won't be uncomfortable long term.
[QUOTE]- If you let your finger off a thumbstick you know what'll happen - it'll snap back towards the center[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I said if you leave a [i]touchpad[/i] what happens, not a thumbstick. Read it again, I gave an answer for every possible scenario and why each have their own annoying problems.
[QUOTE]- what touchpad do you use that you have to constantly press hard?[/QUOTE]
None - but in most touchpads pressing on things lightly results in occasionally the touchpad reading non-contact (you might not notice this, but it definitely can happen, and I'd especially think it would happen here in something with ridges), so what happens during those momentary non-contacts?
[QUOTE]- Didn't valve design that character wheel thing?[/QUOTE]
Not sure how that works (does one of the controller buttons bring it up?) but if developers have to implement it themselves they likely just won't for the same reason they didn't implement an on-screen keyboard
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