• Holland accepted 12.000 refugees without papers despite promises not to do so
    57 replies, posted
Yeah we kinda fell on our asses regarding immigration policies. It used to take 4 years before you could be a Dutch citizen, before that you had to remain in a immigration center. So far they are only complaining about the low quantity of food they get and that there is no wifi.
[QUOTE=CB-COMINatCHA;49135307]Ha ha ha. So what was the solution again? Let them chill in a war zone?[/QUOTE] First and foremost, urge the neighbouring islamic nations take care of them, for example Saudi Arabia. Then, if things are still out of hand, make an [I]actual international effort[/I] to organize and find shelter for the refugees. Ensure that organizational failure like the one displayed in this news article doesn't happen, among many many other examples (and definitely more to come). And of course, don't demand tiny poor european countries, with massive poverty rates among the native population, to take care of outsiders :) EDIT: No organizational failure also implies you tell economic (illegal) immigrants to fuck off and make a massive effort not to let terrorists in.
[QUOTE=Gwoodman;49135225]You don't blame the refugees, you blame the terrorists.[/QUOTE] You blame the terrorists and the policy makers. Lax immigration allows this to happen.
[QUOTE=CB-COMINatCHA;49135307]Ha ha ha. So what was the solution again? Let them chill in a war zone? It wouldn't matter if even all of the Paris shooters came in as refugees because that is still a number in the double digits at max amongst THOUSANDS.[/QUOTE] It [b]WOULD[/b] matter because they would be more than happy to commit mass murder against the people of Holland, just as they did with France.
[QUOTE=darth-veger;49135380]Yeah we kinda fell on our asses regarding immigration policies. It used to take 4 years before you could be a Dutch citizen, before that you had to remain in a immigration center. So far they are only complaining about the low quantity of food they get and that there is no wifi.[/QUOTE] yep every single refugee out there is complaining not just the few refugees that got on sensationalist news because they said something like that and even then why wouldnt they complain? its not like they came out of kenya. the average refugee was used to internet communication and no food problems.
[QUOTE=Atlascore;49135420]Of course.. if Earth was a utopia united under a single government, but sadly we're not even close to that yet, for now all nations have a native populace with their own issues that take precedence over everything else.[/QUOTE] I strongly agree with this In the face of the refugee crisis our own government has completely forgotten its purpose and prioritizes dancing to the tune of the EU instead of listening to its people
If they do stay despite not having papers they should not be granted the same freedoms. Not having papers is seriously problematic. Those that truly fear death from ISIS would probably accept jail like circumstances and those that do not wish to live under sub optimal conditions due to bad circumstances are free to go back. Anything is better then assuming that everything will turn out okay despite taking no safety measures. [QUOTE=CB-COMINatCHA;49135307]Ha ha ha. So what was the solution again? Let them chill in a war zone? It wouldn't matter if even all of the Paris shooters came in as refugees because that is still a number in the double digits at max amongst THOUSANDS.[/QUOTE] And how much damage did those double digits cause? Certainly not an acceptable amount. Not only is there human loss in these tragedies but also political and economical backlash within france (especially paris). At a certain point you reach an amount in damages where you have to say its better that X amount of people die then risk another preventable terrorist attack from happening.
I think the real problem a lot of Dutch people have, is transparency of our gov. This honestly doesn't surprise me at all, the same thing has been happening in my town a while ago. Plans are to build an asylum here in one of the poorest neighborhoods even though people voted against, yet our town council voted for placement of refugees in that poor neighborhood. Lots of people suggested to place refugees on our nearby decommissioned airport, but according to them that wasn't a solution because there were pieces of land to be sold to rich people nearby. But in the end they got fucked as well once all land was sold and now they are gonna place refugees there as well. This kind of practice happens all across the country, town councils forcing placement of refugees against peoples wills without informing them. I'm sure people wouldn't be as much against it if things were actually discussed and if there was proper communication.
[QUOTE=NotMeh;49135438]I strongly agree with this In the face of the refugee crisis our own government has completely forgotten its purpose and prioritizes dancing to the tune of the EU instead of listening to its people[/QUOTE] I agree with that too. However, I'm opposed to claims that arab lives are inherently less valuable than Western lives. Please word it like that the Dutch government should focus on the interests of the people they got their politican mandate from. Then I agree fully. [editline]18th November 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Cructo;49135460]Either way they are homeless. At least in Holland there is a lesser risk to die from a war. They do need to fear some xenophobes like we see around FP though.[/QUOTE] Well if we keep blindly letting everyone in, they'd also have to fear being killed on Dutch soil as well. Again, if you use the word xenophobe where it is not right, then you are hollowing out it's meaning and are therefor actively sabotaging a real discussion. Stop being so dishonest.
ISIS has enough money to fly their bloody terrorists over instead of making them walk across the border. The only evidence linking ISIS coming with refugees as far as I've read was a immigration passport from greek or whatever it was called. There is no reason to carry one with you if you are going to a suicide bombing unless you want it to be found to cause paranoia against refugees.
[QUOTE=Rumbler;49135478]I agree with that too. However, I'm opposed to claims that arab lives are inherently less valuable than Western lives. Please word it like that the Dutch government should focus on the interests of the people they got their politican mandate from. Then I agree fully.[/QUOTE] We should have some more direct democracy instead of electing these clowns.
[QUOTE=Satansick;49135634]We should have some more direct democracy instead of electing these clowns.[/QUOTE] Absolutely. A lot of people are voting for Wilders PVV, out of pure despair. There is not a single different political force, that has the voice of reason. They all act like the only option are binairy. Either we help every single refugee, or we are racist towards every single one. And they seated government currently is afraid as hell for the elections in a year and a few months since they know they'll be booted from power no matter what happens. People are fed up with their shit. I just wish we had an option to call a veto, or to force elections early. Seriously something that should be in the grondwet.
[QUOTE=BuffaloBill;49135110]For FUCKS sake. Swear we've got a gaggle of retards as government.[/QUOTE] Smile at you and stab you in the back when you turn.
[QUOTE=Surplus;49135599]ISIS has enough money to fly their bloody terrorists over instead of making them walk across the border. The only evidence linking ISIS coming with refugees as far as I've read was a immigration passport from greek or whatever it was called. There is no reason to carry one with you if you are going to a suicide bombing unless you want it to be found to cause paranoia against refugees.[/QUOTE] No they don't. It would be too obvious to fly ISIS in. They would still have to go through Airport security. Also there's this thing called Radar and sending military planes if an Unidentified flying aircraft is spotted and needs to be checked. Overall going in by plane is ridiculous and would result in them being blasted out of the sky.
I'm of a Dutch family and I care for the country greatly. Be careful <3
I was initially confused because I thought it was 12 refugees from the title (which wouldn't be too bad) but then I read the article and found out it was nearly 11,700, which is very surprising to say the least.
For the non-dutch ones let me rephrase shortly what the 1 minute video says in the second source link. Refugees are brought initially to temporary refugee centres where they then get sent to a central refugee facility from which they get distributed to asylums spread out over Netherlands. However only if they get approved of asylum will they get to stay, and how they decide that i do not know since you apparently don't even need a passport to pass it. And after they get approved they are eligible for dutch citizenship. so its sort of like normal immigration but with a special treatment for them that can fuck some of us over and where we don't get to have a say in
[QUOTE=Pvt. Martin;49135794]No they don't. It would be too obvious to fly ISIS in. They would still have to go through Airport security. Also there's this thing called Radar and sending military planes if an Unidentified flying aircraft is spotted and needs to be checked. Overall going in by plane is ridiculous and would result in them being blasted out of the sky.[/QUOTE] They'd probably fly commercial, not private. ISIS is not that stupid.
[QUOTE=Rumbler;49135104][url=http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/24756355/__12.000_asielzoekers_zonder_papieren__.html]Telegraaf.nl source[/url] [url=http://www.nu.nl/bootvluchtelingen/4166975/bijna-12000-asielzoekers-zonder-papieren-in-nederland.html]Nu.nl source[/url][/QUOTE] Where does it say that they accepted them? They only said that 12.000 refugees of the total did not have papers. Not that they have gotten a permit to stay.
[QUOTE=taipan;49138890]Where does it say that they accepted them? They only said that 12.000 refugees of the total did not have papers. Not that they have gotten a permit to stay.[/QUOTE] [quote]Title is nearly 12.000 refugees in Netherlands without papers. Dat staat in antwoorden van het ministerie van Veiligheid en Justitie op vragen uit de Tweede Kamer.[/quote]
[QUOTE=Code3Response;49136108]They'd probably fly commercial, not private. ISIS is not that stupid.[/QUOTE] Wouldn't they need at least a passport though to get through airport security still? [editline]18th November 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=CB-COMINatCHA;49135131]i swear the entirety of SH has polarised with their opinions. didn't we have a moral responsibility to take the refugees? i remind you, there were only 8 (9?) attackers in paris and not all of them are confirmed to be refugees.[/QUOTE] Do nations not have a moral responsibility to put their own people first and foremost? Do governments not have a moral responsibility to follow the will of the people who they represent? [quote]you xenophobic nobs.[/quote] If calling someone xenophobic or racist or sexist or whatever is your argument, then you have no argument.
Why would ISIS spend money and resources to fly people over when they can just disguise as refugees? Not only is it easier, it's also a lot less suspicious and harder to screen for.
[QUOTE=CB-COMINatCHA;49135307]Ha ha ha. So what was the solution again? Let them chill in a war zone? It wouldn't matter if even all of the Paris shooters came in as refugees because that is still a number in the double digits at max amongst THOUSANDS.[/QUOTE] People like you should be the ones taking refugees in their care instead of forcing governments to act.
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