"Whiteness burning": UCT Students are throwing “colonial” art on the pyre. Forgot College education
442 replies, posted
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49787495]Do you even understand the basics of multiculturalism?
Like, even fucking remotely?[/QUOTE]
Yes and I am of the view it does not work and leads to tension and issues as mentioned in the OPs article.
No, that statement you quoted is an observation. As long there are differences, people will discriminate each other.
[QUOTE]This would create racism. "Hmm.. That doctor/engineer is black.. probably not a good idea...", not to mention the resentment harder working and more qualified people will have.[/QUOTE]
The point is my idea relies on government interference. The current left requires governmental interference.
[QUOTE]If people want to marry only within their own race or ethnicity, that's fine. That doesn't mean your an evil racist, that means you value your heritage. You can not force people to intermarry with other races.[/QUOTE]
My goal is to end conflict. Differences lead to conflict. I do not see a way around that. Do you?
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787586]Yes and I am of the view it does not work and leads to tension and issues as mentioned in the OPs article.
No, that statement you quoted is an observation. As long there are differences, people will discriminate each other.
The point is my idea relies on government interference. The current left requires governmental interference.
My goal is to end conflict. Differences lead to conflict. I do not see a way around that. Do you?[/QUOTE]
then why is my home city so fine with 0 racial tensions?
Is it because you don't actually understand it?
[editline]21st February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787586]Yes and I am of the view it does not work and leads to tension and issues as mentioned in the OPs article.
No, that statement you quoted is an observation. As long there are differences, people will discriminate each other.
The point is my idea relies on government interference. The current left requires governmental interference.
My goal is to end conflict. Differences lead to conflict. I do not see a way around that. Do you?[/QUOTE]
You will never remove conflict by making people "similar". Similar people still fight.
You know what you can do? Teach that being different isn't a problem. Boom.
OH WAIT WHAT'S THAT? My country has done that for decades and has a huge mixed racialization with no issues? Oh jeeze guy, looks like your idea isn't supported by reality.
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787586]
My goal is to end conflict. Differences lead to conflict. I do not see a way around that. Do you?[/QUOTE]
Your whole idea is based on a false premise. Its not the differences that cause conflict. Its the differences not being respected and the differences being irreconcilable (female circumcision, Arab rape culture in Germany, etc) that causes conflict.
People learning to respect other cultures and not judge people based on race is enough to fix this. You will never make everybody the same without actual genocides happening. Even then, the biggest differences are cultural and ideological.
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787219]Genocide is when entire group is being systemically killed off like the jews were during the Holocaust. That my view what genocide is.
How was my critique of how the left currently obtains goals incorrect? Isnt that how the situation in the op came to where it is at now?[/QUOTE]
Genocide is the systematic removal of any race, religion, or creed through any means. Actively supporting breeding away race is literally genocide by its definition.
[editline]21st February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787586]
My goal is to end conflict. Differences lead to conflict. I do not see a way around that. Do you?[/QUOTE]
Read Harrison Bergeron
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49787604]then why is my home city so fine with 0 racial tensions?
Is it because you don't actually understand it?
[editline]21st February 2016[/editline]
You will never remove conflict by making people "similar". Similar people still fight.
You know what you can do? Teach that being different isn't a problem. Boom.
OH WAIT WHAT'S THAT? My country has done that for decades and has a huge mixed racialization with no issues? Oh jeeze guy, looks like your idea isn't supported by reality.[/QUOTE]
Which is why i asked why your nation is able to do it and not others.
Let take south Africa. Multiple races and culture. Result? The situation in the article.
In Europe, with the immigration crisis, there is a clash of issues right there.
In the middle east, with multiple religions and ethnicities, if left alone to their devices, will cleanse each other.
In america, there is still race riots and issues over race. BLM is a great example. Your location is unique.
So how was your city able to do it with other locations not being able to do so?
Teaching people doesnt work.
[QUOTE]People learning to respect other cultures and not judge people based on race is enough to fix this. You will never make everybody the same without actual genocides happening. Even then, the biggest differences are cultural and ideological.[/QUOTE]
Any ideas should appeal and work with the lowest common denominator in mind.
Genocides are already happening and people desire to become the same regardless or make other be more like their own selves. It will happen no matter what.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Trolling or just REALLY DUMB" - Big Dumb American))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787682]Which is why i asked why your nation is able to do it and not others.
Let take south Africa. Multiple races and culture. Result? The situation in the article.
In Europe, with the immigration crisis, there is a clash of issues right there.
In the middle east, with multiple religions and ethnicities, if left alone to their devices, will cleanse each other.
In america, there is still race riots and issues over race. BLM is a great example. Your location is unique.
So how was you city able to do it with other locations not being able to do so?[/QUOTE]
Not by mass murdering people till only a hive mind was left
[QUOTE=SebiWarrior;49787694]Not by mass murdering people till only a hive mind was left[/QUOTE]
People tend to become hive minds. So what is your point?
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787707]People tend to become hive minds. So what is your point?[/QUOTE]
No they don't? Otherwise there wouldn't really be any differences. But of cours your reply would add variables you didn't care to specify
Man reading this thread im glad some people are not in any way shape or form policy makers.Seeing people completely abandon any sort of values,decency and devalue human freedoms and life in the name of the greater is quite frankly disturbing.
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787707]People tend to become hive minds. So what is your point?[/QUOTE]
Did you read Harrison Bergeron yet? It's very short
[QUOTE=SebiWarrior;49787731]No they don't? Otherwise there wouldn't really be any differences. But of cours your reply would add variables you didn't care to specify[/QUOTE]
I do not think people care to embrace differences. They seek it at any cost to make people more like themselves and eliminate those who do not conform or cannot.
[QUOTE]Did you read Harrison Bergeron yet? It's very short[/QUOTE]
I will look it up. Here is my view in short:
Conflict must be ended and it must be done with how people are and not the way we wish them to be. This must be done with as much encouragement and respect to free will as possible.
If my idea how to deal with it is abhorrent, at least I hope my intent is not abhorrent.
Edit:
I looked up the wiki for Harrison Bergeron. The summary seems to state exactly how I see people. I am not sure if that is good or bad.
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787759]I do not think people care to embrace differences. They seek it at any cost to make people more like themselves and eliminate those who do not conform or cannot.[/QUOTE]
No reason to endorse murdering any heretic (I mean the Greek meaning of the word)
[QUOTE=SebiWarrior;49787769]No reason to endorse murdering any heretic (I mean the Greek meaning of the word)[/QUOTE]
See above. If there was a nicer way, and was doable, I would state it.
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787778]See above. If there was a nicer way, and was doable, I would state it.[/QUOTE]
But there is a way, although it's a hard one: get over them instead of eliminating them
Kinda mind boggling having to debate murder and abuse of human rights is bad.
[QUOTE=SebiWarrior;49787804]But there is a way, although it's a hard one: get over them instead of eliminating them[/QUOTE]
I am done irritating everyone. My view is the current way of achieving or ending conflict is not working. My idea is an attempt to criticize the current way and hopes to stimulate a brain storm. That wasnt achieved. Maybe generate new insights into the problems.
Like Sobonik said, the art burning is or could be a prelude to genocide. I do not like that.
"where books burn,bodies are soon to follow"
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787759]
I will look it up. Here is my view in short:
Conflict must be ended and it must be done with how people are and not the way we wish them to be. This must be done with as much encouragement and respect to free will as possible.
If my idea how to deal with it is abhorrent, at least I hope my intent is not abhorrent.[/QUOTE]
Your intent is not abhorrent but you are incredibly misguided. I don't think you're a bad person, I just think that your view of the solution to the problem isn't really a solution at all. Humans are different, that's what makes us.... us. Racism is not a product of race, it is a product of hatred. Many of my friends and I are very different, and that's okay. Our differences are what we like about each other.
For an example of why your ideals are inaccurate in the real world, I have an example. I have an identical twin. We are literally clones of one another, right? The thing is, she and I REALLY dislike each other, and always have. It's not because we're different. We like most of the same things, look the same, there's no animocity over who looks better because we both look the same... but we still fight. Homogeneity is not the solution.
[QUOTE=phygon;49787882]Your intent is not abhorrent but you are incredibly misguided. I don't think you're a bad person, I just think that your view of the solution to the problem isn't really a solution at all. Humans are different, that's what makes us.... us. Racism is not a product of race, it is a product of hatred. Many of my friends and I are very different, and that's okay. Our differences are what we like about each other.
For an example of why your ideals are inaccurate in the real world, I have an example. I have an identical twin. We are literally clones of one another, right? The thing is, she and I REALLY dislike each other, and always have. It's not because we're different. We like most of the same things, look the same, there's no animocity over who looks better because we both look the same... but we still fight. Homogeneity is not the solution.[/QUOTE]
I am a twin too. However, Harrison Bergeron is descriptive in how I view people. On average I believe this what they want. People do not value differences.
My view is to harness this tendency into something better. If left to its own devices, well we get the situation in the OP.
I am not afraid or shy about the darker side of humanity. My view is to harness for something better. Not try to eliminate it.
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787839]I am done irritating everyone. My view is the current way of achieving or ending conflict is not working. My idea is an attempt to criticize the current way and hopes to stimulate a brain storm. That wasnt achieved. Maybe generate new insights into the problems.
Like Sobonik said, the art burning is or could be a prelude to genocide. I do not like that.[/QUOTE]
i'm pretty sure your insane suggestions wouldn't solve anything
the way things are going, if you want to see the future of south africa - then zimbabwe is that future
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787909]I am a twin too. However, Harrison Bergeron is descriptive in how I view people. On average I believe this what they want. [B]People do not value differences.[/B]
My view is to harness this tendency into something better. If left to its own devices, well we get the situation in the OP.
I am not afraid or shy about the darker side of humanity. My view is to harness for something better. Not try to eliminate it.[/QUOTE]
I'm about to ask an offensive question, but that's because this statement is fucking ridiculous to me.
Do you have any real life friends?
All my best friends, are my best friends because of how different we are, not because of how similar we are. We have similar interests at heart, but differ in every other way. Even the people who are my friends who are very similar to me differ in extreme ways because we're all different people. Now, if people as a general rule, didn't value differences, our friendships would be impossible, but they're not. Because honestly, people [B]DO[/B] value differences. People [B]DO[/B] care about different perspectives, and different people.
The most intriguing people I ever met are the people who share almost nothing in common with me. I worked with a 45 year old iranian immigrant. She was a wonderful and interesting person, but with 45 years of living in Iran we couldn't be much more different. She was old, I was young, she was from a foreign land, I was from here, she had kids, I didn't, we had [B]VASTLY[/B] different life experiences, but she became a friend. An honest to god fucking friend. Why? Because we both appreciated each other and our differences, our different perspectives, and our different ways of approaching problems. We both learnt from each other.
I ask again, because in my life time of experiences, I have found everything in my life tells me "People value differences". How do you come to your conclusions?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49788200]I'm about to ask an offensive question, but that's because this statement is fucking ridiculous to me.
Do you have any real life friends?
All my best friends, are my best friends because of how different we are, not because of how similar we are. We have similar interests at heart, but differ in every other way. Even the people who are my friends who are very similar to me differ in extreme ways because we're all different people. Now, if people as a general rule, didn't value differences, our friendships would be impossible, but they're not. Because honestly, people [B]DO[/B] value differences. People [B]DO[/B] care about different perspectives, and different people.
The most intriguing people I ever met are the people who share almost nothing in common with me. I worked with a 45 year old iranian immigrant. She was a wonderful and interesting person, but with 45 years of living in Iran we couldn't be much more different. She was old, I was young, she was from a foreign land, I was from here, she had kids, I didn't, we had [B]VASTLY[/B] different life experiences, but she became a friend. An honest to god fucking friend. Why? Because we both appreciated each other and our differences, our different perspectives, and our different ways of approaching problems. We both learnt from each other.
I ask again, because in my life time of experiences, I have found everything in my life tells me "People value differences". How do you come to your conclusions?[/QUOTE]
No, only clones can coexist.
Please insert your Feels into my PeoplePort so I can cross reference for similarities.
[QUOTE=spazthemax;49775315]"Fuck White People"
Yeah this isnt racist at all[/QUOTE]
Blacks can't be racist just like women are not capable of rape
Fuck this gay earth
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49779364]I have read your statements and I assume your position is of the left. This denouncement of my idea is hypocritical of you if this is true. How was affirmative action achieved? Through judgement on race by the government. How was equality in south Africa achieved? On race and through the actions of the government.
[/QUOTE]
Get this "left or right" bullshit out of your head. You cant tell someone they're a hypocrite because you assume they are on the left of a vague binary political alignment scale and therefore share all the same views as the half of the population you assume them to be associated with.
[editline]22nd February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787378]I am saying if you want to end racism or any forms of discrimination, you must destroy all differences.[/QUOTE]
what the unholy fuck
are you supposed to be a cartoon fucking supervillan or something. If you "destroy all differences" its no longer divirsity. You just homogenize everyone. The entire idea of not having racism is that its advantageous to have lots of people with lots of different viewpoints and that its both logically and morally wrong to hate people for these differences. [B]The idea is to accept and celeberate differences, not destroy them. [/B]
I need to just get off the internet for a bit because holy shit i didn't think i would see someone seriously advocating for genocide in this thread
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49787627]Your whole idea is based on a false premise. Its not the differences that cause conflict. Its the differences not being respected and the differences being irreconcilable (female circumcision, Arab rape culture in Germany, etc) that causes conflict.
People learning to respect other cultures and not judge people based on race is enough to fix this. You will never make everybody the same without actual genocides happening. Even then, the biggest differences are cultural and ideological.[/QUOTE]
Why are you only comparing this to ISIS and Arabic culture? This is something completely different, this is a group of people expressing their true feelings of entrapment inside of a system that was fucking forced upon them.
[QUOTE=QuinnithXD;49795680]Why are you only comparing this to ISIS and Arabic culture? This is something completely different, this is a group of people expressing their true feelings of entrapment inside of a system that was fucking forced upon them.[/QUOTE]
It's astounding how many people here are actually sympathetic to people destroying historical work.
[QUOTE=Thlis;49795696]It's astounding how many people here are actually sympathetic to people destroying historical work.[/QUOTE]
Fuck the fact that somethings historical, what you fail to see is that this IS history.
[editline]22nd February 2016[/editline]
I think Rauschenberg would frown upon your materialistic reasoning.
[QUOTE=QuinnithXD;49795700]Fuck the fact that somethings historical, what you fail to see is that this IS history.
[editline]22nd February 2016[/editline]
I think Rauschenberg would frown upon your materialistic reasoning.[/QUOTE]
well if rauschenberg disagrees with me, I guess the conversation is over and I'll have to admit my humiliating defeat
well argued good sir!
[QUOTE=QuinnithXD;49795680]Why are you only comparing this to ISIS and Arabic culture? This is something completely different, this is a group of people expressing their true feelings of entrapment inside of a system that was fucking forced upon them.[/QUOTE]
Apartheid ended before these kids could walk. Try again, this time with a little less rhetoric and emotion.
[QUOTE=Daysofwinter;49787909]I am a twin too. However, Harrison Bergeron is descriptive in how I view people. On average I believe this what they want. People do not value differences.
My view is to harness this tendency into something better. If left to its own devices, well we get the situation in the OP.
I am not afraid or shy about the darker side of humanity. My view is to harness for something better. Not try to eliminate it.[/QUOTE]
Either you're trolling or you may genuinely be a bit wrong in the head dude. You're seriously detached from the real world and how humans behave. This isn't some unique train of thought that the rest of us are just too ignorant to understand, you have a fundamentally flawed understanding of how humans in society operate.
[QUOTE=srobins;49795726]Apartheid ended before these kids could walk. Try again, this time with a little less rhetoric and emotion.
[/QUOTE]
According to the article that is exactly what they are upset about.
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