• Monster gets 422 years for 19-hour rape and torture of Columbia student
    1,020 replies, posted
[QUOTE=RBM11;22693310] Yet you believe the government should give him free medical care, food, and shelter for the rest of his life while depriving him of human contact, which is something a psychopath cares little about, for this torture? And it's not murder. [/QUOTE] This person isn't entering solitary confinement, by the way. [QUOTE=RBM11;22693310] See above where he said he agreed with me about the death penalty in that it should only be used in overwhelming evidence of crimes such as this or mass murder. The version I proposed would have fewer appeals with this kind of overwhelming evidence and if the evidence isn't overwhelming, it's life without parole. The death penalty in its current state is inefficient and used in far more crimes than it should be. Not to mention that forensic science and DNA testing, while not perfect, lower the number of wrongful imprisonment and execution dramatically.[/QUOTE] Evidence is never overwhelming enough. Huge numbers of people have been executed where the cases had "overwhelming evidence", yet new evidence surfaced proving their innocence. [editline]01:04AM[/editline] [QUOTE=RBM11;22693402]I agree with you that an innocent death is absolutely unacceptable but there can be absolute proof. The criminals gave up their right to life by murdering and/or torturing another, by depriving them of their lives except for no reason at all. Some people are literally so fucked up they will never rehabilitate. If we found some magic way to rehabilitate psychopaths to the point of being normal, then abolish the death penalty.[/QUOTE] No. You have failed to understand all the different reasons why people murder - including mental health reasons, upbringing and drug addiction etc. You cannot remove the right to rehabilitation when you don't know if they can or cannot be rehabilitated. And you can never remove the right to life.
[QUOTE=A.C.I.D;22682529]I don't understand the American sentencing system- if it goes over a certain amount of time why not just say life sentence instead of 100+ years?[/QUOTE] Because there's absolutely no way a sleazy lawyer could get around his client being in prison that long, as compared to life.
Although this sick man deserves it, I don't understand how the law could support giving him 400+ years in prison :S In Denmark he probably wouldn't even have gotten 50 years :/ "Rape - 10 years. Torturing - 20 years. Blinding - 5 years. Being an 'extraordinary evil' - 50 years. Resisting arrest - 337 years."
[QUOTE=JDK721;22693370]nope blood thirsty people like you who decide that there is logic in murdering murderers[/QUOTE] Here we go again. Instead of explaining your logic you call me bloodthirsty. [quote]no, it's not[/quote]I've explained my reasons for saying it is, you say why it isn't. [quote]yes and yep, it's murder. downplay it all you want just because you lack empathy or any sense of what human rights is, but it's still murder[/quote]"Murder the killing of another human being under conditions specifically covered in law" Murder is a legal term. Killing is the word you're looking for but you're going to continue using insults and associating two completely different things as murder because it makes your opponent look like the criminals who actually lack empathy and do not care about others. They are not the same. Your arguments are filled with insults and put downs which are not necessary but go ahead and associate me with the guy in the article if it makes you feel good. When you commit a felony you lose most of your rights for a certain period of time and lose some rights, such as the right to bear arms and vote, for as long as you live. When you commit a horrible enough crime you should lose the right to live because you deprived others of their rights for no reason. [editline]08:02PM[/editline] [quote]unfortunately many of the US states are still in the medieval times[/quote]More negative hyperboles not founded in reality that lack any substance.
[QUOTE=RBM11;22693598]Here we go again. Instead of explaining your logic you call me bloodthirsty.[/QUOTE] yep, you are you want people executed [QUOTE=RBM11;22693598]Murder is a legal term.[/QUOTE] kill/homicide then [QUOTE=RBM11;22693598]When you commit a felony you lose most of your rights for a certain period of time and lose some rights, such as the right to bear arms and vote, for as long as you live. When you commit a horrible enough crime you should lose the right to live because you deprived others of their rights for no reason.[/QUOTE] losing voting/gun rights etc. aren't comparable to losing your life [QUOTE=RBM11;22693598]When you commit a horrible enough crime you should lose the right to live because you deprived others of their rights for no reason.[/QUOTE] only according to blood thirsty idiots like you. that's nothing but your opinion that you want people killed just because they have done something bad. you fail to look at the logic, costs, innocent people being executed, other problems with allowing the government to execute its own people etc. no one in their right mind would support the death penalty. executing someone is vengeful, and that's not what the justice system is about. [QUOTE=RBM11;22693598]More negative hyperboles not founded in reality that lack any substance.[/QUOTE] yep, executing people, state sponsored discrimination, etc. are all fictional
[QUOTE=Perfumly;22693209]Why should the government have the right to imprison their own people man... it's denying them of their right to freedom...[/QUOTE] Come on Perfumly, you're smart enough to see the difference between death and jail. In jail, you can appeal and/or later be proven innocent. Capital punishment is the government saying "I'm infallible" and you know damn well this isn't true. The person you were responding to said nothing wrong.
[QUOTE=Docc;22682297]Man I thought it was an actual monster when I read the thread title. :frown:[/QUOTE] it is an actual monster
Hey would you guys goto this guys funeral? If so, would you cry? You sure as fuck talk like you would, with your high morals and all. I can't believe you crazy dudes that side with these murderers. They lose their rights when they take a human life. Would you let a murderer walk in and kill your family because you don't want to infringe his rights as a human being by taking his life in your own defense? A little extreme I know, but If the girl would have shot this guy in the face, you wouldn't be crying around would you. She would be a hero, am I right? I don't get what you're arguing about. Get off your high horses. Sincerely, your bloodthirsty barbarian from the medieval times, that supports murdering murderers.
Just execute the fool in the most painful way possible. Cut him until he bleeds to death.
[QUOTE=mr_fj;22693512]Although this sick man deserves it, I don't understand how the law could support giving him 400+ years in prison :S In Denmark he probably wouldn't even have gotten 50 years :/ "Rape - 10 years. Torturing - 20 years. Blinding - 5 years. Being an 'extraordinary evil' - 50 years. Resisting arrest - 337 years."[/QUOTE] You commit two crimes, you get punished for two crimes. In this case he was charged for multiple counts of everything, and all the charges add up.
[QUOTE=Sharp;22693944]Hey would you guys goto this guys funeral? If so, would you cry? You sure as fuck talk like you would, with your high morals and all. I can't believe you crazy dudes that side with these murderers. They lose their rights when they take a human life. Would you let a murderer walk in and kill your family because you don't want to infringe his rights as a human being by taking his life in your own defense? A little extreme I know, but If the girl would have shot this guy in the face, you wouldn't be crying around would you. She would be a hero, am I right? I don't get what you're arguing about. Get off your high horses. Sincerely, your bloodthirsty barbarian from the medieval times, that supports murdering murderers.[/QUOTE] You wouldn't feel the same way if you were on death row for a crime you didn't commit
[QUOTE=JDK721;22693782]yep, you are you want people executed kill/homicide then losing voting/gun rights etc. aren't comparable to losing your life only according to blood thirsty idiots like you. that's nothing but your opinion that you want people killed just because they have done something bad. you fail to look at the logic, costs, innocent people being executed, other problems with allowing the government to execute its own people etc. no one in their right mind would support the death penalty. executing someone is vengeful, and that's not what the justice system is about. yep, executing people, state sponsored discrimination, etc. are all fictional[/QUOTE] So you'll sleep better at night if an innocent man wastes away in prison for his whole night rather than if he died?
That guy should get killed and get thrown in the ocean.
[QUOTE=johanz;22689898]Actually you can't. Since your conscious brain is unconscious, it can't react to pain. If you wake up you will feel pain, but while passed out, no, not the pain we know atleast. [editline]10:13PM[/editline] We need death penalty only if we want to return to dark ages like most countries ruled by islam[/QUOTE] dumb [editline]08:45PM[/editline] goddamnit kasper why do i agree with 90% of what you say we should mate
[QUOTE=JDK721;22693782]yep, you are you want people executed[/QUOTE] I want it to be an option in the case of person committing an atrocity. Saying I am bloodthirsty and want people executed is the same as saying someone who is pro-choice wants to have babies aborted. [quote]losing voting/gun rights etc. aren't comparable to losing your life[/quote]I never said they were. I said those kinds of rights are taken depending on the severity of the crime. The biggest right someone can lose is their life, and if they did a crime so horrible, they deserve to lose that right. [quote]only according to blood thirsty idiots like you. that's nothing but your opinion that you want people killed just because they have done something bad. you fail to look at the logic, costs, innocent people being executed, other problems with allowing the government to execute its own people etc. no one in their right mind would support the death penalty. executing someone is vengeful, and that's not what the justice system is about.[/quote]The insults are getting old and "something bad" is an understatement. I gave my logic on how to address most of the problems in the best way and whether or not the person is executed is up to a judge elected by the people who was given the power to give that kind of sentence based on the severity of the crime and whether or not he was found guilty of a crime by a jury of the people. The insults coming from you sound like the hyperbole and insults coming out of the mouths of the teabaggers. Just because you disagree with someone doesn't mean you can say they are insane or, in the case of the teabaggers, illegally president. I really don't want to have to tell you what justice is and what vengeance is so I'll let the dictionary do the talking: Justice: the administering of deserved punishment or reward Vengeance: infliction of injury, harm, humiliation, or the like, on a person by another who has been harmed by that person; violent revenge The difference between us is that you draw the line at life without parole as being just and I at execution. It's not that much of a difference and it doesn't make me insane. In my case I believe that mass murderers such as the Dnepropetrovsk maniacs and people like the monster in this story deserve this kind of punishment. [quote]yep, executing people, state sponsored discrimination, etc. are all fictional[/quote]The huge difference between discrimination between criminals and discrimination of innocent people is that the innocents did nothing to deserve the discrimination. I am open to whatever your arguments are but what you've done is simply gone into insult mode. If your next response is the same thing you've been saying this entire time which is basically that I want people to be murdered, that I am bloodthirsty, and I am insane then I'm done wasting my time.
deserved it.
[QUOTE=StreetFight;22682476]Just kill the damn bastard, I mean why should the state pay for his ass for another 60 or so years?[/QUOTE] Death is too easy for his type.
[QUOTE=Ickylevel;22684125]I have seen worst. You guys should come to Ukraine one day ![/QUOTE] :tinfoil:
[QUOTE=reedbo;22682459]Just kill him, this man deserves less than prison. To him prison is like staying in a 3 star hotel.[/QUOTE] hahahahahahaha truly said like a teenager who never been to prison.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;22694015]You wouldn't feel the same way if you were on death row for a crime you didn't commit[/QUOTE] What does that have to do with anything? Is that supposed to make me change my beliefs or something? This guy isn't innocent.
Oh god. She lost her eyes? He deserves the punishment. Ah well.. He will see how its too get raped. By a biker named Billy.
[QUOTE=RBM11;22694084]I want it to be an option in the case of person committing an atrocity. Saying I am bloodthirsty and want people executed is the same as saying someone who is pro-choice wants to have babies aborted. [/QUOTE] yeah, because we should totally give the government the power of who gets to live and who gets to die. and yes, you are blood thirsty if you believe in an eye for an eye [QUOTE=RBM11;22694084]is the same as saying someone who is pro-choice wants to have babies aborted. [/QUOTE] terrible analogy let me guess, you're pro-death penalty but anti-abortion lol the rest of your argument is fluff so I'm just going to let it be answer these questions. WHY should the government be allowed to execute its own people? what logic is there in executing murderers besides revenge? what is wrong with life in prison without parole? why has every other advanced nation in the world abolished the death penalty besides the US? the justice system is not about revenge.
All I'm going to say is... we are making a big deal over a man who's only crime was the rape, torture, and near-murder of one girl, and yet we let monstrosities who are responsible for the agonizing deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocent people walk free? What is America coming to?! [b]TL;DR: George W. Bush must die.[/b]
[QUOTE=Logidru;22693323]1. Under Article 3 of the United Nations Declaration of Human Rights * Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person. 2. How do you know he cannot be rehabilitated? You have no knowledge of his past or psychological situation.[/QUOTE] According to your first point, prison itself is a violation of human rights. The idea behind confinement is that the person forfeited their rights by doing something illegal. Life is one of those rights that can be taken away. The second point is valid. I am not a psychology expert. Although, it does sound to me as if he has Antisocial Personality Disorder. There is no treatment for this.
[QUOTE=Psychokitten;22694539][b]TL;DR: George W. Bush must die.[/b][/QUOTE] he should be brought to justice for the things he did
What a sick fuck.
[QUOTE=JDK721;22694550]he should be brought to justice for the things he did[/QUOTE] [b]Dick Cheney too.[/b]
[QUOTE=JDK721;22694409]yeah, because we should totally give the government the power of who gets to live and who gets to die. and yes, you are blood thirsty if you believe in an eye for an eye[/QUOTE] I never said eye for an eye. I repeatedly stated that only in very extreme cases like the one in the article and mass murderers such as the Dnepropetrovsk maniacs should be executed if there is overwhelming evidence of their crime. [quote]terrible analogy let me guess, you're pro-death penalty but anti-abortion[/quote]Nope. Fetuses are not human beings. People are defined by their actions and if their actions include torture and/or mass murder they don't deserve to live. [quote]answer these questions. WHY should the government be allowed to execute its own people? what logic is there in executing murderers besides revenge? what is wrong with life in prison without parole? why has every other advanced nation in the world abolished the death penalty besides the US? the justice system is not about revenge.[/quote]1. Because those people were determined by a jury of the people and a judge elected by the people to deserve to die. It's not some faceless shadowy group that rounds up people and kill them. 2. Justice and revenge are very closely related concepts. I'll use this quote to explain what I mean as there is no better way for me to say it: [quote]Whereas justice generally implies actions undertaken and supported by a legitimate judicial system, by a system of ethics, or on behalf of an ethical majority, revenge generally implies actions undertaken by an individual or narrowly defined group outside the boundaries of judicial or ethical conduct.[/quote]3. I have stated several times that life without parole should be used for anything that is not a crime like mass murder or the case in this article. Something that is so horrifying and just plain evil should be punished with death. A man who premeditates the murder of his wife: life without parole. The torture, rape, and attempted murder over the course of a 19 hour period or a murder of 21 people: death penalty. 4.Argumentum ad populum fallacy. Just because these other countries have done it, doesn't mean everyone should. But they've probably done it because they have a different system of values or a much lower violent crime rate. Also because the European Union abolished it a few years ago. In the UK there is more support for reinstating it: [quote]A November 2009 television survey showed that 70% favoured reinstating the death penalty for at least one of the following crimes: armed robbery, rape, paedophilia, terrorism, adult murder, child murder, child rape, treason, child abuse, or kidnapping. However, respondents only favoured capital punishment for adult murder, the polling question asked by other organizations such as Gallup by small majorities or pluralities: overall, 51% favoured the death penalty for adult murder, while 56% in Wales did, 55% in Scotland, and only 49% in England[/quote]I've also seen you post in favor of the civilian firearms which is also banned in most of "the advanced nations in the world" should we just start doing what everyone else does. Please keep in mind that I really only support it, as I've said over and over again, for very extreme cases. It's just strange that a man who premeditates the murder of one person is given the same exact punishment as someone who kills 20.
Rape and torture him for 20 hours
[QUOTE=dogmachines;22694542]According to your first point, prison itself is a violation of human rights. The idea behind confinement is that the person forfeited their rights by doing something illegal. Life is one of those rights that can be taken away. The second point is valid. I am not a psychology expert. Although, it does sound to me as if he has Antisocial Personality Disorder. There is no treatment for this.[/QUOTE] This Prison is basically slavery because you have few rights while in it and can be forced into labor. The 13th amendment bans slavery except as in punishment for a crime. Most mass murderers do. If it was schizophrenia or some dissociative identity disorder or something like that, it would be different. If you have antisocial personality disorder, you feel no empathy and have the urge to harm others. If you act on the urge, you deserve to be punished in the same way that if pedophiles act on their urges, they are punished. Pedophilia is a psychiatric disorder as well but what separates ASPD and pedophilia and worse mental disorders is that you have control over your body. [editline]09:50PM[/editline] [QUOTE=ProboardslolV2;22695082]Rape and torture him for 20 hours[/QUOTE] See JDK, I'm not saying this yet you act like I am. This would be revenge and an eye for an eye.
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